Have you ever read the Bible

Yeah I have. Studied it cover to cover in my undergrad.
Its actually quite interesting in parts.
Its come in handy when I'm arguing with Jehovah's witnesses at the door.

I had a pictorial one when I was a kid and to be fair, It was pretty cool.

I remember a lot of the pictures were pretty exciting and OTT for kids: Jehu(?) chasing that other lad in a chariot and firing arrows at him: that King putting the three lads in the furnace but they're unharmed an d have these big pious heads on them; David spying on Bathsheba in the nip and the 10 plagues of Egypt and Jesus beating up the money lenders.

endacl wrote: »

Did he actually beat them up? As I understood it he just let a roar at them and they got a bit of a chase?

I think my one had him kicking over the tables and shouting with some of them falling to the ground. Quite obvious that The Son of God had put the sandal in, off-picture.

nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »

I think so. The King James version is quite beautiful in parts and I think a lack of knowledge of its content hampers in some ways an appreciation of the English Literature that has drawn on it or been influenced by it.

While I am one of those "atheists" who fights for the removal of religious indoctrination in schools, I am also among a smaller group who would happily fight for education of the Bible to be put where it belongs. English Literature class.

I don't think it even belongs in English Literature class tbh nozz. The English language versions are only one translation. English Literature would surely be just that - English Literature. It wouldn't fit in history class, as it could hardly be classified as an unbiased historical record of events.

I also would advocate for secularism in schools, and I'm Roman Catholic myself, so I wouldn't immediately associate secularism with atheism. It's something I pointed out in another thread here recently that Atheist Ireland would gain far more traction in Irish society as "Secular Ireland", though I'm not sure Michael would have me as a member.

I have not seen actual hard figures on the subject really but I have a strong suspicion anecdotally that very few Christians of any denomination really read it.

So you have no real evidence for your belief then that very few Christians of any denomination have really read the Bible? A belief with no foundation? That sounds, well, dodgy, for lack of a better word!

I have given Bibles to Christians on a number of occasions. I have found myself surprised by how many of them not only have not purchased one.... but have not even SEEN one.

The reaction I invariably get every time is surprise at its size. They have been spoon fed the same cherry picked passages in school and church for so long they became convinced they had heard it all. How much MORE there is to it genuinely comes as a surprise to them.

Which genuinely comes as a surprise to me too. If people genuinely believe in Christianity... one would expect reading the bible would not just be an agenda.... but a main priority in life.

It shouldn't come as a surprise to you though really, in the same way as most English speakers have never read the complete works of say Shakespeare, but they got the general gist of it from Ann and Barry, and with guidance from their teacher, they delved into the more complex structures. In fact if we were to be completely pragmatic about it, how were most stories passed down throughout history? It wasn't via the written word anyway, that particular method is only a relatively recent development in human history, and that's even before we delve into things like literacy rates! If one were to take a nosy around social media sites, one might also form the strong suspicion that most adults have difficulty with their own primary language!

I have a deep sneaking suspicion in my life that the number of Christians who actually believe their faith, rather than just profess or claim it out of habit, is a lot smaller than we might suspect. People who claim to be believers in theism often do not act like they are actually operating or functioning under any such belief. They just sign their name to it as a matter of course.

Hunches and suspicions again, and yet again very little in the way of evidence. I advocate for social issues that are in direct conflict with my religious beliefs, I do things that put me in direct conflict with my beliefs, but how I square my behaviour with my beliefs is surely a matter for me as an individual to reconcile with myself, rather than try to live by your standard, based on your interpretation of what I should believe? That's why I don't often inform people I meet of my religious beliefs, because they can be quite negatively judgemental when they see me act in a way that contradicts those beliefs. Most people don't particularly give a shìt, but those that do? Oh boy, they don't be long making you aware that they too are aware of your failure to abide by the Catholic tenets! I often pondered an interesting thought experiment - if I were to commit murder, would these people be more outraged by the fact that I failed to act according to my religious beliefs, or would they be more outraged by the fact I just committed murder?

A feeling indirectly supported by the fact that the majority of the Christians I actually got to read the Bible, who previously had not, came out atheist at the end saying "I was meant to believe THAT?!?!?!?!". A strange feeling given the only way this "atheist" has turned other people atheist was to preach their own religion at them and tell them what it is they are claiming they believe. Seems user Calibos above expressed a similar impression too.

They what? People "come out" as atheist now? I don't mean to sound funny but all I could think reading the above was those "pray away the gay" nut jobs in the way that you're preaching to people as if you have to convert them to atheism. An atheist messiah? That seems a little... odd, does it not? Sounds more like activism than atheism tbh.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yessssss. And oh my yes..... And how. In that order.

I'm glad you do at least, as it shows you have informed yourself, rather than the lazy anti-theist who likes to get up on their soap box just to deride theism and judge themselves above theists both morally and intellectually. Their usual target for derision of course being the closest one to them in this country. By reading the Bible they think it's the only argument they need against religion. It's the only argument they need against THAT particular religion, but I wonder how they'd fare were they to attempt to convert someone whose faith was not based on the Bible? That's why I asked had anyone read any religious texts other than just the Bible, or do they honestly believe their one size argument fits all...