Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

08-04-2014 11:18AM

bangkok wrote: »

I don't get the buttner love, yes he was good in the first leg against Bayern, but so was the whole team, he came on for evra Saturday and his first cross he ballooned it 50 yards over the bar. evra is much more composed on the ball as well and better going forward

I think it's his defensive attributes that I prefer as Evra has been prone to so many mistakes at the back this season. Attacking wise I still believe Evra provides a threat it's just not what we need against Munich.

bangkok · 08-04-2014 11:21AM

united to line up tomorrow night........

De Gea

Jones

Ferdinand

Vidic

Evra

Fellaini

Carrick

Kagawa

Valenica

Rooney

Welbeck

Cantona's Collars · 08-04-2014 11:22AM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Aye, I think Evans is underrated. He is prone to the odd lapse which can be costly, but is generally a very solid CB.

Which one of our CB's isn't prone to lapses? Evans only played for the U21's yesterday to try & get match fit,too soon to be putting him in against Bayern.

Love this form him at Carrick,3 seasons on & Carrick is still doing it.

beno619 · 08-04-2014 11:24AM

bangkok wrote: »

I don't get the buttner love, yes he was good in the first leg against Bayern, but so was the whole team, he came on for evra Saturday and his first cross he ballooned it 50 yards over the bar. evra is much more composed on the ball as well and better going forward

Yeah Evra never balloons a cross, we need someone solid who will work hard nor Evra's crossing the Buttner love comes mostly from Evra being passed it.

bangkok · 08-04-2014 11:26AM

Bayern Team to line up tomorrow night.....

Neuer

Rafinha

Botaeng

Dante

Alaba

Kroos

Lahm

Robben

Gotze

Ribery

Manduzkic

Pro. F · 08-04-2014 11:27AM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Yes the expectancy was there, I expected to at least finish in the top 4 because we are so used to success but it's not happened, people need to get over the fact that Moyes is not going anywhere soon and this is the situation the club is in. I also accept that it's going through a transitional period and even if things go tits up I will still be there supporting the team and watching / attending the matches.

If you all so opposed to the situation at hand them stop watching the games, stop attending the games and stand outside Old Trafford with a sign in your hand saying you want Moyes out. Fly a plane over Old Trafford.
that's just something I cannot provide.

State to me where I once said you were not supporting the club?
All supporters can kick up a fuss but it won't ever stop them going to the games.
I have seen grown men cry when a club gets relegated but you see them at the very first match of the next season.

Nobody is putting there heads in the sand either, Moyes has made plenty of mistakes and I have been critical for it. But nothing I can do is going to change what the next 12 months holds for the club. I am going to stay optimistic and hope he rectifies the situation with an excellent transfer window and gives us every opportunity to compete as we should next season. And I believe the board members know as a business that Man Utd need to be successful and they won't let this happen for long even if it doesn't happen to work out for Moyes.

Are you able to provide your own opinion on whether Moyes should be kept on as manager yet? Or are you going to continue to pretend that you don't have an opinion on that question?

Backstreet Moyes · 08-04-2014 11:32AM

bangkok wrote: »

I don't get the buttner love, yes he was good in the first leg against Bayern, but so was the whole team, he came on for evra Saturday and his first cross he ballooned it 50 yards over the bar. evra is much more composed on the ball as well and better going forward

How is Evra good at going forward his crossing is average. He bombs forward which looks good until he crosses along the ground hits the defender and walks back while they attack on the counter. Tomorrow against Robben we don't need somebody bombing forward we need somebody being disciplined not attacking and sticking to Robben. Buttner showed he could do this in the first leg i don't think Evra is capable of doing that.

bangkok · 08-04-2014 11:35AM

Büttner was good enough against Bayern but his performance shouldn't be overrated. All of his good moments were pure defensive actions like clearances, but he lacked any real quality in possession which is key in a game where possession and time on the ball will be minimal.... and evra is a threat from set pieces which buttner is not. Evra for me all day

08-04-2014 11:39AM

Pro. F wrote: »

Are you able to provide your own opinion on whether Moyes should be kept on as manager yet? Or are you going to continue to pretend that you don't have an opinion on that question?

Not that I need to prove it to anyone (especially to you :pac:) but sure look I will give you the satisfaction you crave :P

I will put this in bold so that you understand and you wont need to ask me again.

IN MY OPINION HE NEEDS MORE TIME BEFORE HE IS JUDGED, IT WILL EITHER ALLOW HIM TO PROGRESS TO BECOME AN EXCEPTIONAL MANAGER OR IT WILL BE HIS DOWNFALL.
HE DESERVED TO HAVE A CHANCE BECAUSE OF THE QUALITIES FERGIE SAW IN HIM (WHO WE HAVE ALL TRUSTED FOR SO MANY YEARS) AND EVERYTHING HE DEVOTED TO EVERTON FOOTBALL CLUB.
FERGIE HAS DISTINGUISHED MAN UTD BEING TOO IMPORTANT TO HAVE SOME 1 OR 2 SEASON MANAGER TO COME IN AND SPEND SILLY MONEY FOR QUICK SUCCESS, HE WANTS LONG TERM STABILITY AND I AGREE.

Now you never have to ask me again about Moyes. Happy?

lordgoat · 08-04-2014 11:45AM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Not that I need to prove it to anyone (especially to you :pac:) but sure look I will give you the satisfaction you crave :P

I will put this in bold so that you understand and you wont need to ask me again.

IN MY OPINION HE NEEDS MORE TIME BEFORE HE IS JUDGED, IT WILL EITHER ALLOW HIM TO PROGRESS TO BECOME AN EXCEPTIONAL MANAGER OR IT WILL BE HIS DOWNFALL.
HE DESERVED TO HAVE A CHANCE BECAUSE OF THE QUALITIES FERGIE SAW IN HIM (WHO WE HAVE ALL TRUSTED FOR SO MANY YEARS) AND EVERYTHING HE DEVOTED TO EVERTON FOOTBALL CLUB.
FERGIE HAS DISTINGUISHED MAN UTD BEING TOO IMPORTANT TO HAVE SOME 1 OR 2 SEASON MANAGER TO COME IN AND SPEND SILLY MONEY FOR QUICK SUCCESS, HE WANTS LONG TERM STABILITY AND I AGREE.

Now you never have to ask me again about Moyes. Happy?

So if SAF came out and sad he wanted Moyes gone you'd row in behind him too?

Got it.

Simply do, what SAF says at all times. Easy.

08-04-2014 11:49AM

lordgoat wrote: »

So if SAF came out and sad he wanted Moyes gone you'd row in behind him too?

Got it.

Simply do, what SAF says at all times. Easy.

Don't be so patronizing.

We all know Fergie made mistakes too but the good always outweighed the bad and that's why we have been so successful.
I'm hoping this one is a good choice as with my own opinions that Moyes has been an excellent manager for Everton.

Cantona's Collars · 08-04-2014 11:52AM

There was a good interview with Miguel Delaney on Newstalk last night,he spoke of the time he did a piece with Martinez about Everton.He revolutionised the set up at Wigan despite having to be an economic genius as well as a manager.Now at Everton he's brought the same principles,players train in the evening for pre-season,this ensured that they got plenty of rest rather than spending an afternoon once training was over playing golf or whatever.
A point was made that Moyes did have Everton playing some decent stuff but due to the small squad,they ended up knackered by this time of the season,we'll have to take it as a given that Moyes won't be sacked in the Summer,judgement will have to be reserved until Xmas I reckon.
The team needs a major overhaul as we all know and new players might just buy into what Moyes wants them to do unlike a few already here who seem to be coasting through the season.Look at how Everton dismantled Arsenal by doubling up on the wings using Baines & Coleman,that was a tactic Moyes used a lot,problem with us atm is that our wingers (Val & Young) are rubbish and we have one full back who tries to get carded every game & another who's already thinking of the beaches in France.

The one major thing Moyes needs to do is to forget that he's been at Everton and get that mindset gone of overachieving with the team,what counts as overachieving at Everton is the bare minimum expected at United.

xtal191 · 08-04-2014 11:53AM

Would the people supporting Moyes be saying the same if Mourinho had got the job and had us in this position?

lordgoat · 08-04-2014 11:53AM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Don't be so patronizing.

We all know Fergie made mistakes too but the good always outweighed the bad and that's why we have been so successful.
I'm hoping this one is a good choice as with my own opinions that Moyes has been an excellent manager for Everton.

Not patronising at all, just trying to understand your post.

You said SAF picked him (and you claim) we all trusted him for years and therefore should give the person he picked time. Am I incorrect?

IMO a manger earns his own time by doing a good job. A manger is chosen by his track record or potential ability. A manager lives and dies by how their team performs or doesn't perform. Agree/Disagree?

08-04-2014 11:55AM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'm hoping this one is a good choice as with my own opinions that Moyes has been an excellent manager for Everton.

lordgoat wrote: »

Not patronising at all, just trying to understand your post.

You said SAF picked him (and you claim) we all trusted him for years and therefore should give the person he picked time. Am I incorrect?

IMO a manger earns his own time by doing a good job. A manger is chosen by his track record or potential ability. A manager lives and dies by how their team performs or doesn't perform. Agree/Disagree?

Are you failing to read the end of my post? Here it is in bold.

Cantona's Collars · 08-04-2014 11:56AM

bangkok wrote: »

Büttner was good enough against Bayern but his performance shouldn't be overrated. All of his good moments were pure defensive actions like clearances, but he lacked any real quality in possession which is key in a game where possession and time on the ball will be minimal.... and evra is a threat from set pieces which buttner is not. Evra for me all day

Buttner did what he was told to do against Bayern,you can't trust Evra to do that.Running forward then sauntering back has cost us so many goals this season.
How many times did Vidic get dragged out of position in the Bayern game at OT?
I for one can't remember any because Buttner stayed honest & did his job.
It'll be the same tomorrow night,no need for charging 70 yards upfield then leaving most of the pitch open for Robben to run into.

08-04-2014 11:57AM

zerks wrote: »

Buttner did what he was told to do against Bayern,you can't trust Evra to do that.Running forward then sauntering back has cost us so many goals this season.
How many times did Vidic get dragged out of position in the Bayern game at OT?
I for one can't remember any because Buttner stayed honest & did his job.
It'll be the same tomorrow night,no need for charging 70 yards upfield then leaving most of the pitch open for Robben to run into.

Spot on

bucketybuck · 08-04-2014 11:59AM

Your Airbag wrote: »

personally I can't see how anyone could lay 100% of the blame at Moyes feet.

Why do people keep repeating rubbish like this? Who has even said this?

Very few people lay 100% of the blame at Moyes feet, thats simply not true.

We are rational adults, we can assess many different issues and factors at the same time. Using this ability, we can judge that there are serious problems with the playing squad, and at the same time also assess that the manager is doing a piss poor job with what he has. Thats allowed you know.

lordgoat · 08-04-2014 12:00PM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Are you failing to read the end of my post? Here it is in bold.

Well at least you figured out what bold is. (for the record that wasn't in the post I quoted, you know the post about you putting your opinion about Moyes in CAPS LOCK for the world to see - maybe you should edit it to include the parts you forgot - just a suggestion)

So your reason for wanting Moues is you think he was an excellent manager for Everton and that for you is enough to make the step up? Fair enough.

Some people set the bar a lot lower it seems.

Nice of you to ignore the other question in my post though but hey, maybe SAF told you to not answer it too.

redbaron_99 · 08-04-2014 12:07PM

Simple thing is that David moyes will be the united manager next season no matter how much you debate it.
And an awful lot of you will look rather stupid if he gets it right.
I for one think he will get it right, and being the type of person I am, I will be reminding you constantly of what you said this season.

Mitch Connor · 08-04-2014 12:16PM

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Simple thing is that David moyes will be the united manager next season no matter how much you debate it.
And an awful lot of you will look rather stupid if he gets it right.
I for one think he will get it right, and being the type of person I am, I will be reminding you constantly of what you said this season.

With the money United are apparently going to spend in the summer, he'd want to be improving a lot over this season

redbaron_99 · 08-04-2014 12:20PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

With the money United are apparently going to spend in the summer, he'd want to be improving a lot over this season

I think we'll come back with a bang. Backing us to win it next year.

redbaron_99 · 08-04-2014 12:24PM

The quality of play has been rather dull this season, but it very similar last season.
One thing that has cost us dearly this season is individual defensive mistakes late in games.

Do people actually think this is a tactic of Moyes? "right lads, I want slow zombie passing today, don't press high up the pitch, everybody take their time on the ball, no fast forward passing, and above all I want you to make horrendous mistakes at the back - especially in the final moments of the game. Good luck, lads!"

Your Airbag · 08-04-2014 12:26PM

zerks wrote: »

A point was made that Moyes did have Everton playing some decent stuff but due to the small squad,they ended up knackered by this time of the season

Didn't Everton usually start poorly and finish strongly under Moyes in recent times?

bucketybuck wrote: »

Why do people keep repeating rubbish like this? Who has even said this?

Very few people lay 100% of the blame at Moyes feet, thats simply not true.

We are rational adults, we can assess many different issues and factors at the same time. Using this ability, we can judge that there are serious problems with the playing squad, and at the same time also assess that the manager is doing a piss poor job with what he has. Thats allowed you know.

Because its not Rubbish. "The problem is not the players its Moyes" etc has been said many times on here. If you are ignoring that your talking rubbish and have the blinkers on.

Harvey Low Fat Milk · 08-04-2014 12:26PM

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Simple thing is that David moyes will be the united manager next season no matter how much you debate it.
And an awful lot of you will look rather stupid if he gets it right.
I for one think he will get it right, and being the type of person I am, I will be reminding you constantly of what you said this season.

I think the majority in here know he'll be manager next season. However as for being proven right I'd be more than happy to be snacking on humble pie every weekend next season.

The problem is it is now out of hope than expectation that he will succeed and that is based on a season of under-performing and looking tactically inept. I think the anxiety is understandable but I don't think anyone doesn't want him to succeed because if he succeeds then United do.

Mitch Connor · 08-04-2014 12:27PM

redbaron_99 wrote: »

I think we'll come back with a bang. Backing us to win it next year.

I'd be shocked. I do expect us to be back in the top 4 though.

I have been very critical of Moyes (but fairly, imo....) but I have continually said I do think he will go for the right type of player in the summer - so I do hope for a better season next season.

My big issue is that I don't think Moyes is capable of getting the best out of whatever players he will have at his disposal - unless there is a massive change in attitude and coaching. As it stands, Moyes doesn't have it in his make up to be right for United, or any top team. Too defensive, too conservative, too fearful. He doesn't have the attitude to set up, or coach, United to be the aggressors in a match - that is why needs to change, or all the money in the world will still see him a failure.

redbaron_99 · 08-04-2014 12:31PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I'd be shocked. I do expect us to be back in the top 4 though.

I have been very critical of Moyes (but fairly, imo....) but I have continually said I do think he will go for the right type of player in the summer - so I do hope for a better season next season.

My big issue is that I don't think Moyes is capable of getting the best out of whatever players he will have at his disposal - unless there is a massive change in attitude and coaching. As it stands, Moyes doesn't have it in his make up to be right for United, or any top team. Too defensive, too conservative, too fearful. He doesn't have the attitude to set up, or coach, United to be the aggressors in a match - that is why needs to change, or all the money in the world will still see him a failure.

Moyes has built his career on getting the best out of a group of players.
He builds his teams to be solid, not as attacking as SAF, but certainly not fearful.
If he can pick a consistent back four for a few months, and has at least one decent CM, you will see a dramatic turnaround.

He hasn't the luxury of either this season.

Backstreet Moyes · 08-04-2014 12:31PM

Martinez has done a fantastic job at Everton but he really was lucky with the way Moyes left them defensively. Howard and Jagielka are very good, Stones looks a very good buy by Moyes and Baines and Coleman are probably the two best full backs in the league. I think if Martinez didn't have such a good defence then for all their great football they would not be flying so high.

I had no doubt he would have them playing better attacking football and he must be praised for his signings. Barry and Lukaku on loan is brilliant, Traore is a good player, McCarthy is a big talent i would have liked him, than Barkley who i think Moyes managed very well to have him ready for this season. He had two horrific injuries already and Moyes managed him perfectly.

Backstreet Moyes · 08-04-2014 12:34PM

If Moyes is given a warchest then simply getting top four is not enough winning the league is the aim. I think we need two cm signings if we could sign midfielders who can create from deep allowing Kagawa and Mata to operate higher up the pitch we will be in great shape.

bucketybuck · 08-04-2014 12:35PM

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Do people actually think this is a tactic of Moyes? "right lads, I want slow zombie passing today, don't press high up the pitch, everybody take their time on the ball, no fast forward passing, and above all I want you to make horrendous mistakes at the back - especially in the final moments of the game. Good luck, lads!"

If we wanted a manager who wasn't able to get the players to do things his way then I was available for half the price.

Manchester United Superthread 2014 Mod warning Post #1880 #2613

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