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new speeding measures

13567…11

Comments

  • #62
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,828 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nino Brown wrote: »
    If anyone can see it, then show us. Because any figures I've seen point to it losing considerable amounts of money,


    When the Government went to tender for an operator, a report from consultants and an expert working group estimated that the annual revenue from speeding fines could be between €70 million and €40 million per annum.
    This was subsequently revised down to €27 million. However, last year Go Safe generated just €4.6 million in receipts from speeding fines. The cost of operating the system is €15.6 million per annum.
    According to the Comptroller and Auditor General, this created a “shortfall” of €11 million which was financed by revenues from fines for road traffic offences identified by gardaí.
    Under the contract, Go Safe is paid a fixed fee per hour of enforcement, meaning it does not matter how many or how few motorists it catches.
    It almost sounds like the system requires speeders to be caught to operate successfully! :rolleyes:


  • #63
    wazky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭wazky


    Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »
    The number of road deaths has been falling steadily in recent years. We had the lowest number on record last year.

    If you look at the drop and compare that with statistics on car ownership, it's hard to argue that enforcement isn't working.

    How many road deaths are actually due to speeding and not just bad driving/conditions on road?

    What percentage of road fatalities occur on motorway?

    Edit: Also the increased enforcement of drink driving and NCT would have a greater impact then speeding fines.


  • #64
    KevR
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,110 ✭✭✭KevR


    Drove to Shannon Airport from Galway and back again today. On the non-motorway section, our average speed was 60-65kmh stuck in a long line of cars. Sweet **** all good (safe) overtaking opportunities. I wasn't in a hurry so I didn't get stressed but it's definitely a section of busy road where people get extremely frustrated and eventually take a risk overtaking. The road surface was also disgraceful in spots - the top layer wearing away, I can't imagine that it helps with breaking distances...

    Loads of other busy roads like it around the country. Leo should focus on improving these, it will do more to reduce accidents than average speed cameras on motorways.


  • #65
    mikeym
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,992 ✭✭✭mikeym


    Speed checks already in place in the Jack Lynch tunnel.

    I always do 100kmph through that tunnel.


  • #66
    Pappa Charlie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 853 ✭✭✭Pappa Charlie


    Days 298 wrote: »
    Are the people involved in the accidents ****?

    Some of them! Yes


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  • #67
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,370 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Days 298 wrote: »
    Are the people involved in the accidents ****?

    They are if the accidents they were in, were a result of their habitual dangerous driving.


  • #68
    Bellview
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,719 ✭✭✭Bellview


    Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »
    One report here:

    Would have been interesting to get the business case behind all the fines ie how many drivers were they planning to take their licenses off and how much more fines they were planning versus what the Gardi were issuing for speed fines. Another example of selling a story on a sand based foundation!

    Agree with black spots enforcement but how often do we see the vans on a wide stretch of road or inside 60k limit in new castle west but never on the bends in barna where there were accidents prior road improvement - unfortunately feels more like a money racket than safety


  • #69
    wildcatares22
    Closed Accounts Posts: 129 ✭✭wildcatares22


    it may be a money racket or it may well be about road safety, but speed limits are speed limits,, END OFF STORY.


  • #70
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,828 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    mikeym wrote: »
    Speed checks already in place in the Jack Lynch tunnel.

    I always do 100kmph through that tunnel.
    I don't know what the limit is there, I never use it, but as far as I understand those cameras currently can't be used for convictions and that is the law that Varadkar is trying to change.


  • #71
    Chips Lovell
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,279 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    wazky wrote: »
    How many road deaths are actually due to speeding and not just bad driving/conditions on road?

    Speed is the biggest contributing factor to road deaths in Ireland, according to the RSA. 29% of road deaths between 1996 and 2004 in Ireland were due to speeding.


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  • #72
    Nino Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,507 ✭✭✭Nino Brown


    Deleted User wrote: »
    It almost sounds like the system requires speeders to be caught to operate successfully! :rolleyes:

    Why? Are you confusing successfully with profitably? The government pay a company by the hour to enforce speed limits which they do, and it works, I would consider that successful.
    Enforcing speed limits has never been profitable for government, so that's not the intention. It is profiable for Go-safe, because they are a business. So I'm not sure what your point is.:rolleyes:


  • #73
    cnocbui
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,007 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    KwackerJack wrote: »
    Great idea......people drive way to fast on motorways.

    Always see Mercs and BMW trying to hit the sound barrier and a big dirty Smokey Passat trying to catch up.

    If you get caught at 1 camera and then again at the second you deserve a fine and a sticker for stupidity.

    And yet there they go in Germany breaking the sound barrier for decades on motorways with no speed limit at all and the statistics show the accident rate is no higher.

    If you look at the statistics from the UK, excessive speed is only about fifth when you rank the principle causes of accidents. Motorways are the safest roads there are. The German data implies accidents on motorways have little to do with speed, so this measure is quite pointless unless it is for revenue raising. There will be no fewer accidents if everyone sticks to the speed limit on Motorways than there currently are.


  • #74
    wazky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭wazky


    Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »
    Speed is the biggest contributing factor to road deaths in Ireland, according to the RSA. 29% of road deaths between 1996 and 2004 in Ireland were due to speeding.

    What percentage of fatalities occur on motorways?


  • #75
    cnocbui
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,007 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »
    Speed is the biggest contributing factor to road deaths in Ireland, according to the RSA. 29% of road deaths between 1996 and 2004 in Ireland were due to speeding.

    I'll believe the UK stats before I believe anything the RSA says. AFAIK they don't even collect proper statistics on accidents here.


  • #76
    Nino Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,507 ✭✭✭Nino Brown


    Bellview wrote: »
    how often do we see the vans on a wide stretch of road or inside 60k limit in new castle west but never on the bends in barna where there were accidents prior road improvement

    Possible because the detectors are line of sight, and cant see around corners, so they will be on straight stretches of road, plus people are forced to slow down for bends, so even of they are inclined to speed, a bendy road is an awful place to try to catch them


  • #77
    Pinch Flat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,779 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    cnocbui wrote: »
    And yet there they go in Germany breaking the sound barrier for decades on motorways with no speed limit at all and the statistics show the accident rate is no higher.

    If you look at the statistics from the UK, excessive speed is only about fifth when you rank the principle causes of accidents. Motorways are the safest roads there are. The German data implies accidents on motorways have little to do with speed, so this measure is quite pointless unless it is for revenue raising. There will be no fewer accidents if everyone sticks to the speed limit on Motorways than there currently are.

    Hard to compare German and Irish driving standards. The standard of driving on motorways there is miles ahead of here.


  • #78
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,828 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nino Brown wrote: »
    Why? Are you confusing successfully with profitably? The government pay a company by the hour to enforce speed limits which they do, and it works, I would consider that successful.
    Enforcing speed limits has never been profitable for government, so that's not the intention. It is profiable for Go-safe, because they are a business. So I'm not sure what your point is.:rolleyes:
    The point is they don't need to spend that money in the first place as speeding isn't really as big a problem as some make out.


  • #79
    Elmer Blooker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,593 ✭✭✭Elmer Blooker


    wildcatares22 wrote: »
    it may be a money racket or it may well be about road safety, but speed limits are speed limits,, END OFF STORY.
    This is Ireland - it's a money making racket.


  • #80
    Sandwlch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,066 ✭✭✭Sandwlch


    Greenmachine wrote: »
    Definetly seems like a revenue generating exercises.
    Elmer Blooker wrote: »
    This is Ireland - it's a money making racket.

    Yes, hopefully it is. Thats the beauty of the system: rather than raise money by taxing everyone, tax those who cant observe the law, reducing what the rest of us have to pay. It has a nice justice to it. And if it raises awareness about the dangers of speeding, adds points to the licences of those who believe rules of the road aren't for them encouraging them to be less cavalier elsewhere, then thats great as well. Its a real win-win step.

    Nice joined up thinking from Leo and hope he gets it implemented as soon as possible. Sometimes governements do really do some good.


  • #81
    flutered
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,766 ✭✭✭flutered


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    You're missing the point. It's about exposure, the more people see the vans, the more conscious they will be about speeding.
    except where the majority of people have died one never sees on, near to me there is a streach of road where four people were killed within 10m of each other, no camera sign there, but a mile down there is a sign on the road leading away from that spot, gay byrne explain that to me please.


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  • #82
    Nino Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,507 ✭✭✭Nino Brown


    cnocbui wrote: »
    Motorways are the safest roads there are. The German data implies accidents on motorways have little to do with speed.
    There will be no fewer accidents if everyone sticks to the speed limit on Motorways than there currently are.

    I happen to agree entirely, but if we are unhappy with a law there are ways to go about getting them changed, many laws are in place for reasons we don't fully understand, so we can't just decide to break them without consequences until they change. If the rule of law is not enforced we would have anarchy.


  • #83
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,828 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nino Brown wrote: »
    Possible because the detectors are line of sight, and cant see around corners, so they will be on straight stretches of road, plus people are forced to slow down for bends, so even of they are inclined to speed, a bendy road is an awful place to try to catch them
    A bendy road is the perfect place, as if they're speeding there then they are most certainly travelling at an inappropriate speed!


  • #84
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,560 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    Driving fast is one thing. Knowing how to drive well at high speed and when its safe to do so, is a totally different thing, and that is the difference.
    Most of the drivers in Ireland cannot handle high speed driving properly they just think its a matter of putting the boot down, add in poor quality roads, weather conditions, worn / cheap tyres and other road users and its a receipe for disaster.
    No matter what the speed limit, speeders will always speed and moan about it when they get caught.


  • #85
    TheCoolWay
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 454 ✭✭TheCoolWay


    mitosis wrote: »
    It has been demonstrated time and again that money collected does not cover costs.

    Looks like that is going to change


  • #86
    Nino Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,507 ✭✭✭Nino Brown


    Deleted User wrote: »
    A bendy road is the perfect place, as if they're speeding there then they are most certainly travelling at an inappropriate speed!

    I know, but the speed limit doesn't usually change for a bend, so if you have bend on a 100kmph road, cars will be taking the bends at well under 100kmh to keep it between the ditches and speed up on the straight stretch, so the stragiht is the obvious place to put the camera.


  • #87
    flutered
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,766 ✭✭✭flutered


    Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »
    Speed is the biggest contributing factor to road deaths in Ireland, according to the RSA. 29% of road deaths between 1996 and 2004 in Ireland were due to speeding.

    and the other 71% ?, he should bring into law a way to have the chineese ditch finders banned from this country, near where i live a car a week is been wrote off, nary a speed check, never a gatso van to be seen, not even an accident black spot sign to warn people, why no leo gay or whoever.


  • #88
    Days 298
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,301 ✭✭✭Days 298


    Nino Brown wrote: »
    I know, but the speed limit doesn't usually change for a bend, so if you have bend on a 100kmph road, cars will be taking the bends at well under 100kmh to keep it between the ditches and speed up on the straight stretch, so the stragiht is the obvious place to put the camera.
    So to catch them out in essence.


  • #89
    Kurtosis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,881 ✭✭✭Kurtosis


    cnocbui wrote: »
    I'll believe the UK stats before I believe anything the RSA says. AFAIK they don't even collect proper statistics on accidents here.

    If you don't believe the only source of Irish road deaths, where do you expect the data to come from? Pulled out of the air like the information you've presented?


  • #90
    Elmer Blooker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,593 ✭✭✭Elmer Blooker


    Sandwlch wrote: »
    Yes, hopefully it is. Thats the beauty of the system: rather than raise money by taxing everyone, tax those who cant observe the law, reducing what the rest of us have to pay. It has a nice justice to it. And if it raises awareness about the dangers of speeding, adds points to the licences of those who believe rules of the road aren't for them encouraging them to be less cavalier elsewhere, then thats great as well. Its a real win-win step.

    Nice joined up thinking from Leo and hope he gets it implemented as soon as possible. Sometimes governements do really do some good.
    Varadkar said the new speeding measures "will focus on accident blackspots"
    That's a lie but I'm not surprised to see such arrogance from the current Government. Expect to get a fine for doing 121kph on a motorway.


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  • #91
    Days 298
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,301 ✭✭✭Days 298


    penguin88 wrote: »
    If you don't believe the only source of Irish road deaths, where do you expect the data to come from? Pulled out of the air like the information you've presented?

    Jaysus is this after hours or a formal debate?


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