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ESB vote to strike over gold plated pensions as winter arrives

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Comments

  • #392
    Skylinehead
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,690 ✭✭✭✭Skylinehead


    end of the road wrote: »
    NO THEIR NOT, THEIR RELEVANT AND NECESSARY

    LOUD NOISES.

    Is that seriously what you're resorting to?


  • #393
    Cienciano
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,164 ✭✭✭✭Cienciano


    TireeTerror wrote: »
    Yeah Im aware they control the network. Im just saying we do not rely upon them for generation of power, they are responsible for the transportation of it.

    The other providers, namely Energia, look after the network in Northern Ireland under the Power NI brand. They could send a few chaps down to assist if ESB actually had the balls to go ahead and strike. Im sure that goodwill would help Energia when they launch into the domestic market in January here in the south. The reality is that ESB almost certainly will not strike, its just putting on an act, puffing up its chest and throwing the toys out of the pram hoping they will get their way. Like any spoilt brat, just send them to the corner without any dinner and they will soon change their ways. Do you really think the employees at ESB want to be without power themselves? If I see ESB employees installing generators in their properties, then I might take all this peacocking seriously!
    The network in Northern Ireland is owned by Northern Ireland Electricity (NIE). Google NIE and see who owns it.


  • #394
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,202 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    Public sector unions are little more than protection rackets at this stage. They're not interested in working people or workers rights, they're about making sure that the small group of very well-paid people they represent can fleece the maximum amount from the taxpayer and the ordinary workers. They've made that clear the way multiple unions have sold out new entrants - if they really cared about workers, they'd have made sure new entrants were paid the same as existing workers - but no, the unions were delighted to sign up to deals that retained existing wages and they didn't care in the slightest about new employees.


  • #395
    Ace2007
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,040 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    Jett Nervous Pen wrote: »
    The ESB workers have every right to go out on strike, its disgraceful to even suggest attacking their pensions like that. I'd be the first person on the picket line if I worked there.
    You said to an previous poster that they don't have a clue- with your post neither do you

    Where is that attack on the pension that you are talking about?

    I guarantee you if you look at what the unions are fighting about and what the ordinary joe in esb would strike for are worlds aoart


  • #396
    animaal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 815 ✭✭✭animaal


    hmmm wrote: »
    ...They've made that clear the way multiple unions have sold out new entrants - if they really cared about workers, they'd have made sure new entrants were paid the same as existing workers - but no, the unions were delighted to sign up to deals that retained existing wages and they didn't care in the slightest about new employees.

    This. Unions used to be beneficial to society, but now they're just parasitic. Look at how much time and energy they put into issues of narrow self interest - e.g. Eircom ESOT, benchmarking, fighting necessary reforms, etc. Compare that to their lack of action over Irish Ferries, where there was real injustice. Probably not enough money in it though.


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  • #397
    chopper6
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,214 ✭✭✭chopper6


    hmmm wrote: »
    Public sector unions are little more than protection rackets at this stage.


    What about private sector unions?


  • #398
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,202 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    chopper6 wrote: »
    What about private sector unions?
    Private sector unions (in general) do not have the ability to hold the taxpayer to ransom, so are forced to adopt a much more reasonable approach.


  • #399
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,734 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    hmmm wrote: »
    Private sector unions (in general) do not have the ability to hold the taxpayer to ransom, so are forced to adopt a much more reasonable approach.

    So they have no teeth then. Useless so. I'd prefer the ESB union looking after my rights.


  • #400
    grainnewhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 392 ✭✭grainnewhale


    tayto lover wrote: »
    So they have no teeth then. Useless so. I'd prefer the ESB union looking after my rights.

    The only rights they look after are their own and their big fat wages. The only people who will suffer are those on the lowest incomes. This is basically stated funded robbery.


  • #401
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,734 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    grainnewhale wrote: »
    The only rights they look after are their own and their big fat wages. The only people who will suffer are those on the lowest incomes. This is basically stated funded robbery.

    No. They seem to be pretty active for their members in this dispute.


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  • #402
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,202 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    tayto lover wrote: »
    So they have no teeth then. Useless so. I'd prefer the ESB union looking after my rights.
    All unions have teeth because they can go on strike. The difference between the ESB and some other union is that the ESB workers know the government has to give in or the economy is fupped and people will possibly die.

    You say "teeth", but really you mean to say that private sector unions do not have the ability to blackmail the taxpayer. That's what you mean by "teeth". We'll have to disagree as to whether we should allow unions in a monopoly the right to strike in the first place.


  • #403
    neiphin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 414 ✭✭neiphin


    grainnewhale wrote: »
    The only rights they look after are their own
    and their big fat wages. The only people who will suffer are those on the lowest incomes. This is basically stated funded robbery.

    who else would you like them to represent


  • #404
    grainnewhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 392 ✭✭grainnewhale


    neiphin wrote: »
    who else would you like them to represent

    Considering they are already well overpaid. I would like them to **** off really. Failing that I would like the company to make them suffer. In the same way they want people struggling to pay their energy bills to suffer.


  • #405
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,734 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    grainnewhale wrote: »
    Considering they are already well overpaid. I would like them to **** off really. Failing that I would like the company to make them suffer. In the same way they want people struggling to pay their energy bills to suffer.

    What they really want is their pension fund sorted.


  • #406
    grainnewhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 392 ✭✭grainnewhale


    The last time the ESB unions were encouraging their members to go on strike an employee asked how much strike money they would receive, only to be told they had no money in the kitty. Strange considering all the fees paid in.


  • #407
    jack presley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,687 ✭✭✭✭jack presley


    grainnewhale wrote: »
    The last time the ESB unions were encouraging their members to go on strike an employee asked how much strike money they would receive, only to be told they had no money in the kitty. Strange considering all the fees paid in.

    Any link to back up that tale or did you hear it from a mate of a mate?


  • #408
    grainnewhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 392 ✭✭grainnewhale


    In a lot of these cases, the workers don't want to strike, but are bullied into or worse have no say in the matter.


  • #409
    Boombastic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,496 ✭✭✭Boombastic


    tayto lover wrote: »
    What they really want is their pension fund sorted.

    Cut their salaries by 15% and channel the money in to their pensions, job done, pension sorted


  • #410
    grainnewhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 392 ✭✭grainnewhale


    jack presley wrote: »
    Any link to back up that tale or did you hear it from a mate of a mate?

    I worked in the ESB and so did my brother.


  • #411
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,746 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    chopper6 wrote: »
    What about private sector unions?
    oh their perfect being in the perfect private sector after all

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



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  • #412
    jack presley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,687 ✭✭✭✭jack presley


    grainnewhale wrote: »
    I worked in the ESB and so did my brother.

    Still sounds a bit far fetched. Which union was it by the way? There are a few operating in there? And when was it? I don't know when the last time they threatened a strike but the last time there was one was back in 1991.


  • #413
    grainnewhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 392 ✭✭grainnewhale


    tayto lover wrote: »
    What they really want is their pension fund sorted.

    My brother has a pension from the ESB at 50 he gets more for sitting at home than I get for working, the only problem I see with their pension is, its like their wages grossly over inflated.


  • #414
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,746 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    hmmm wrote: »
    All unions have teeth because they can go on strike. The difference between the ESB and some other union is that the ESB workers know the government has to give in or the economy is fupped and people will possibly die.

    You say "teeth", but really you mean to say that private sector unions do not have the ability to blackmail the taxpayer. That's what you mean by "teeth". We'll have to disagree as to whether we should allow unions in a monopoly the right to strike in the first place.
    stopping unions from striking is against the workers human rights and will lead to exploitation

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • #415
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Boombastic wrote: »
    Cut their salaries by 15% and channel the money in to their pensions, job done, pension sorted

    They just took a 20% pay cut following the 2010 agreement. Any other bright ideas?


  • #416
    jack presley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,687 ✭✭✭✭jack presley


    grainnewhale wrote: »
    its like their wages grossly over inflated.

    I bet you weren't complaining when you worked there!


  • #417
    Rabelais
    Site Banned Posts: 263 ✭✭Rabelais


    Some amount of guff being spouted around here about this subject.

    1). The ESB isn't the "public service". It's a commercial semi-state. It raises its own money on the bond markets. It returns a dividend to the majority shareholder - the State, based on profits earned through its many activities.

    2). Yes, the wages seem high. There are also a large number of electrical engineers, solicitors, telecoms engineers, people on call, IT specialists and a large overseas staff who get paid rates consummate with their skills and professions. Quelle surprise, but people do leave the ESB to join other companies.

    3). You are free to use another supplier of electricity, many of whom use independent generators to provide power. There is a large wholesale market where electricity is traded amongst the providers.

    4). British power companies will be able to supply electricity to the market in the next few years (2016). The ESB, and it's customer supply arm - Electric Ireland - will be a very small fish in a very large market.

    I don't even work for the ESB, but work in the electrical industry. There are many things they do badly, but there are plenty they are seen as genuine world-leaders in. Put the shoe on the other foot for a moment - would you feel genuinely aggrieved that you had paid into a pension for upto 40 years, only to told there is nothing for you? A pension you had to join upon starting? Defined Benefit pensions are a joke, but that doesn't mean we can't at least have a smidgen of sympathy for what they must be feeling.

    A wee bit of perspective, instead of mass moral outrage and self-righteousness on the interwebs might be useful.


  • #418
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    grainnewhale wrote: »
    I worked in the ESB and so did my brother.

    You must be in the wrong union then. ESBOA for one has a published fund that is huge - the fact that they bought property pre Celtic tiger and disposed of it before the crash and haven't had a strike in almost 30 years has helped build up quite a fighting fund.


  • #419
    grainnewhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 392 ✭✭grainnewhale


    jack presley wrote: »
    I bet you weren't complaining when you worked there!

    Unfortunately I was on contract and had to travel. was getting better pay working in a factory.


  • #420
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    hmmm wrote: »
    Private sector unions (in general) do not have the ability to hold the taxpayer to ransom, so are forced to adopt a much more reasonable approach.

    For the umpteenth time!!! ESB is Private Sector. You need to look at the definitions some time. ESB are not classed as public sector as they are not funded in any way by the state and never have been since their founding. Doesn't change much but at least cut out the public v private claptrap.


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  • #421
    grainnewhale
    Closed Accounts Posts: 392 ✭✭grainnewhale


    jack presley wrote: »
    Still sounds a bit far fetched. Which union was it by the way? There are a few operating in there? And when was it? I don't know when the last time they threatened a strike but the last time there was one was back in 1991.

    May have been then are even before as far as I know they didn't go on strike at the time. don't know what specific union it was.


This discussion has been closed.
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