The Gay Megathread (see mod note on post #2212)

Benny_Cake · 21-10-2013 11:20PM

seminarian wrote: »

What exactly is the Putin law? propaganda of nontraditional sexual relations to minors.. Russia has not banned being gay. You can still be gay there if you want. You won't be imprisioned or executed (like in many Muslim Countries)

Yes, you can be gay, but you'd better mention it to anyone. The law contains no definition of propaganda and no definition of "nontraditional sexual relations". It's a cruel piece of legislation which allows the authorities huge latitude to victimise people on a whim.

Just because people aren't being imprisoned or executed doesn’t mean that what is happening isn't a form of persecution.

aloyisious · 21-10-2013 11:55PM

seminarian wrote: »

What exactly is the Putin law? propaganda of nontraditional sexual relations to minors.. Russia has not banned being gay. You can still be gay there if you want. You won't be imprisioned or executed (like in many Muslim Countries)

working on London I saw the Soho parade this year, it was pretty explicit at times. Gay men practically naked in leather thong ass exposed. Thats fine, their life. I would NOT bring a child to watch a gay parade. Extreme fetishes on display, no thanks.

So if you examine the Russian law carefully I see no problem with it.

With ref to the wording of the law's title (propaganda of non-traditional sexual relations to minors) I'm fairly sure you've read press reports in the international media of how that is being "interpreted" at street level and by the police (re arrests of gay people peacefully attending peaceful protests - after they were attacked by street gangs). I certainly hope you see the truth of those reports and not view them as "gay propaganda" invented to harm the image of Russia.

I'm reasonably sure that if you were to take a stroll through the streets of Moscow or St Petersburg holding a rainbow flag or the hand of another man, you would soon know the benefit of the Russian law you see yourself having no problem with, with the Police ensuring your safe custody.

Now if Russia was equally prepared to ensure that the regalia worn by it's last invader was not so freely used by some Russians to trample the rights of other Russians, I might have some trust in the

I agree with you the Soho parade is pretty explicit; it's meant to be, as it's a demonstration of the freedom of expression given to all. If you don't want children to watch it, my advice is not to bring them to Soho on the day of it's well advertised and policed Gay parade.

Journa · 22-10-2013 12:40AM

In fairness you don't see men and women wearing BDSM erotica gear on public beaches, and children should definately not be exposed to that on the public street or otherwise. I don't think it's doing anyone any favours.

Doc Farrell · 22-10-2013 12:43AM

seminarian wrote: »

I would NOT bring a child to watch a gay parade. Extreme fetishes on display, no thanks.

Wait. What?

You mean it's not like Carlows St Patricks Day tractor parade?

(It's fairly safe to say that you're not actually a seminarian, or if you are, which I seriously doubt, then you won't be for long if you continue posting here)

If you don't understand why it's because seminarians are now public reps and they don't talk about atheists having no daddies or gays in leather thongs. :pac:
Sometimes boards is just the Craic.

Sonics2k · 22-10-2013 07:52AM

Journa wrote: »

In fairness you don't see men and women wearing BDSM erotica gear on public beaches, and children should definately not be exposed to that on the public street or otherwise. I don't think it's doing anyone any favours.

Clearly you've never been to New Orleans or Rio. Or apparently even read the news about their parades.

Journa · 22-10-2013 12:03PM

I've been to over 20 countries and hundreds of foreign cites, I've seen lots of different things done, but I don't see that as particularly relevant.

tommy2bad · 22-10-2013 01:16PM

Journa wrote: »

I've been to over 20 countries and hundreds of foreign cites, I've seen lots of different things done, but I don't see that as particularly relevant.

It's drawing a comparison between gay parades and hetro parades.
Not going to post pics (google is your friend) for obvious reasons but if you check it the amount of nudity and exotic costumes is about the same. One celebrates what we consider normal behavior and the other celebrates something that not everyone considers normal. Both do so by exaggeration. It's theater, don't get so annoyed by it.
Of course theirs an argument that just because you can doesn't mean you should but that apply to both sides.

Links234 · 22-10-2013 01:39PM

Journa wrote: »

In fairness you don't see men and women wearing BDSM erotica gear on public beaches, and children should definately not be exposed to that on the public street or otherwise. I don't think it's doing anyone any favours.

This is a pride parade.

Won't somebody please think of the children...

Sonics2k · 22-10-2013 01:49PM

Journa wrote: »

I've been to over 20 countries and hundreds of foreign cites, I've seen lots of different things done, but I don't see that as particularly relevant.

It's a completely fair comparison and you know it.

The only difference is that one features predominately straight people, mainly attractive young women in bikinis, thongs and flashing their breasts for beads.

The other features predominately gay people, of all backgrounds and genders, with some of the men in tight leather.

It's completely relevant.

Journa · 22-10-2013 02:43PM

I was not talking about pride parades, I was talking about the promotion of BDSM in pride parades. I can't see how BDSM gear is appropriate for viewing by children, or what the purpose of promoting BDSM in a public parade is. Why does BDSM, gay or straight, have to be promoted in public parades, what is the purpose of that promotion, and how does it benefit gay pride parades ?

e.g. Gay 'Slaves' from a London Pride parade :

Sonics2k · 22-10-2013 03:05PM

<Snip: visible teat

>
Carnival, Rio.

What's your point buddy?

Turtwig · 22-10-2013 04:10PM

Sonics2k wrote: »

[<SNIP>
Carnival, Rio.

What's your point buddy?

[latex] ax^2 + bx + c = 0[/latex]

[latex]x = \frac{-b \pm\sqrt{b^2-4ac}}{2a}[/latex]

Corkfeen · 22-10-2013 04:47PM

Well the existence of pride festivals is logical.Unlike straight people they have been subjected to intolerance both in the past and present. Effectively it acts as a sign of solidarity towards people who are subjected to persecution and a celebration of the adversity which the community overcame.

Links234 · 22-10-2013 05:07PM

I love the way that people who object to pride parades (because think of the children!) are never outraged about sexually charged Halloween costumes. Nope, it's only nasty when them gayssss do it!

Sonics2k · 22-10-2013 05:29PM

Jernal wrote: »

[latex] ax^2 + bx + c = 0[/latex]

[latex]x = \frac{-b \pm\sqrt{b^2-4ac}}{2a}[/latex]

Dammit Jernal, you know as well as I do its hard to post links from a phone! You tease, you.

seminarian · 22-10-2013 06:35PM

Journa wrote: »

In fairness you don't see men and women wearing BDSM erotica gear on public beaches, and children should definately not be exposed to that on the public street or otherwise. I don't think it's doing anyone any favours.

Where to "gay Rights" start and end? I am all for respecting the person be them gay or straight. However as a Straight person I won't not walk down the street practically naked with a whip spanking my half naked wife and call it "straight pride".. Yet this is what some gay couples do during Gay pride and we are supposed to shut up and let it happen because its part of accepting gay. That said I am sure they are the minority.

My Brother is gay and he knows my views on this particular issue. I think Children should be protected, if a boy thinks he is Gay there is no point added a label to him at a young age. Not every gay attraction at a young age results in a person being gay. Let Children be Children, Sexuality is part of the person, it does no define every action the person takes in life. We don't need gay rights.. We need respect for every person, If a man or woman wants to share their life with a person of the same sex then that is their adult decision. Lets respect it. However the whole Gay pride/Rights movement sometimes seems very in your face. We don't need to respect or accept practically naked people waving rainbow flags marching on the street... Straight people would not be allowed to march displaying hardcore fetish preferences.

tommy2bad · 22-10-2013 06:49PM

seminarian wrote: »

Where to "gay Rights" start and end? I am all for respecting the person be them gay or straight. However as a Straight person I won't not walk down the street practically naked with a whip spanking my half naked wife and call it "straight pride"..

We call it a hen party!
No, nor would I (the wife would kill me) but then again we haven't had to fight for our right to be recognized for what we are.
Yet this is what some gay couples do during Gay pride and we are supposed to shut up and let it happen because its part of accepting gay. That said I am sure they are the minority.

My Brother is gay and he knows my views on this particular issue. I think Children should be protected, if a boy thinks he is Gay there is no point added a label to him at a young age. Not every gay attraction at a young age results in a person being gay. Let Children be Children, Sexuality is part of the person, it does no define every action the person takes in life. We don't need gay rights.. We need respect for every person, If a man or woman wants to share their life with a person of the same sex then that is their adult decision. Lets respect it. However the whole Gay pride/Rights movement sometimes seems very in your face. We don't need to respect or accept practically naked people waving rainbow flags marching on the street... Straight people would not be allowed to march displaying hardcore fetish preferences.

Well the thing is it's in your face for a reason, it's a cerebration of homosexual culture in all it diverse forms. It's a victory parade of sorts as well and an expression of defiance. It's a lot of things all rolled together and it's their not because gay people want to spread gayness but because straight people want to suppress them.
You are right we don't need to respect bdsm being paraded down the street and we don't, we do however respect the achievement that changing a homophobic culture is and we need to support this.
I think you will see less of this in your face type of display as homosexuality becomes mainstream and you'll see less concern about whether a teen is gay or not as well. It will be normal and ignored like sulking and watching too much TV.
For now we just enjoy the party.

pauldla · 22-10-2013 06:58PM

seminarian wrote: »

Where to "gay Rights" start and end? I am all for respecting the person be them gay or straight. However as a Straight person I won't not walk down the street practically naked with a whip spanking my half naked wife and call it "straight pride".. Yet this is what some gay couples do during Gay pride and we are supposed to shut up and let it happen because its part of accepting gay. That said I am sure they are the minority.

My Brother is gay and he knows my views on this particular issue. I think Children should be protected, if a boy thinks he is Gay there is no point added a label to him at a young age. Not every gay attraction at a young age results in a person being gay. Let Children be Children, Sexuality is part of the person, it does no define every action the person takes in life. We don't need gay rights.. We need respect for every person, If a man or woman wants to share their life with a person of the same sex then that is their adult decision. Lets respect it. However the whole Gay pride/Rights movement sometimes seems very in your face. We don't need to respect or accept practically naked people waving rainbow flags marching on the street... Straight people would not be allowed to march displaying hardcore fetish preferences.

Yet, as a Christian, you presumably have no issue with children being shown images, movies, and other public reenactments of a half-naked man being whipped and tortured to death?

seminarian · 22-10-2013 07:01PM

pauldla wrote: »

Yet, as a Christian, you presumably have no issue with children being shown images, movies, and other public reenactments of a half-naked man being whipped and tortured to death?

What a parallel. :rolleyes:

seminarian · 22-10-2013 07:12PM

tommy2bad wrote: »

Well the thing is it's in your face for a reason, it's a cerebration of homosexual culture in all it diverse forms. It's a victory parade of sorts as well and an expression of defiance. It's a lot of things all rolled together and it's their not because gay people want to spread gayness but because straight people want to suppress them.
You are right we don't need to respect bdsm being paraded down the street and we don't, we do however respect the achievement that changing a homophobic culture is and we need to support this.
I think you will see less of this in your face type of display as homosexuality becomes mainstream and you'll see less concern about whether a teen is gay or not as well. It will be normal and ignored like sulking and watching too much TV.
For now we just enjoy the party.

Yeah right. Even my gay brother says its pathetic half of what happens in gay pride. As for Homosexual culture.. what exactly is that? Victory parade.. Don't gay movements want equality... I am no way homophobic, work with gay people all my life. They don't go round forcing their preferences or ideas.. All they want is to be equally accepted as a person. They have every right to be accepted in society as a person or as couples. But lets not kid ourselves thinking that homosexual culture as you put it has brought much positives to the lives of many gay people. Reality is in Ireland the majority of Gay people are men, its 70:30 I am told. STD's especially HIV are on the rise every year among gay men. Homosexual Culture is not about finding a partner and being faithful to that person, gay men have multiple partners before they commit (if they ever commit). The Gay movement does not know what it really wants and when it gets what it wants its not satisfied.

pauldla · 22-10-2013 07:13PM

seminarian wrote: »

What a parallel. :rolleyes:

Explain the difference. It's hard to imagine anything more hardcore than a crucifixion, yet we display it to our kids everywhere, be they Christian or not. Indeed, some go so far as to teach the kids that they have a personal involvement with the act etc etc. As a father, I'd much prefer my kids watch a gay pride parade to a reinactment of the Crucifixion.

22-10-2013 07:29PM

seminarian wrote: »

Where to "gay Rights" start and end? I am all for respecting the person be them gay or straight. However as a Straight person I won't not walk down the street practically naked with a whip spanking my half naked wife and call it "straight pride".. Yet this is what some gay couples do during Gay pride and we are supposed to shut up and let it happen because its part of accepting gay. That said I am sure they are the minority.

Please give a single example of a law that allows gay people to do something that straight people are not allowed do. Please give a single example of a straight person being arrested for something that a gay person was not arrested for.

seminarian wrote: »

Reality is in Ireland the majority of Gay people are men, its 70:30 I am told. STD's especially HIV are on the rise every year among gay men. Homosexual Culture is not about finding a partner and being faithful to that person, gay men have multiple partners before they commit (if they ever commit). The Gay movement does not know what it really wants and when it gets what it wants its not satisfied.

Eh, you realise STIs are rising at a much faster rate among the "straight culture", right?

Are you standing by your support of Putin's Law by the way? Despite the fact you've now been told of the many terrible consequences of it?

Corkfeen · 22-10-2013 08:06PM

seminarian wrote: »

My Brother is gay and he knows my views on this particular issue. I think Children should be protected, if a boy thinks he is Gay there is no point added a label to him at a young age. Not every gay attraction at a young age results in a person being gay. Let Children be Children, Sexuality is part of the person, it does no define every action the person takes in life. We don't need gay rights.. We need respect for every person, If a man or woman wants to share their life with a person of the same sex then that is their adult decision. Lets respect it. However the whole Gay pride/Rights movement sometimes seems very in your face. We don't need to respect or accept practically naked people waving rainbow flags marching on the street... Straight people would not be allowed to march displaying hardcore fetish preferences.

Teenagers do struggle with their sexuality but under Russia's law they cannot be told that there's nothing wrong with them. In fact, Russian society contrasts views them in the same category as paedophiles. Any advice is propaganda under Russian law and it promotes stigmatising a group of people. It's a frightening place to live by all accounts.

seminarian wrote: »

Yeah right. Even my gay brother says its pathetic half of what happens in gay pride. As for Homosexual culture.. what exactly is that? Victory parade.. Don't gay movements want equality... I am no way homophobic, work with gay people all my life. They don't go round forcing their preferences or ideas.. All they want is to be equally accepted as a person. They have every right to be accepted in society as a person or as couples. But lets not kid ourselves thinking that homosexual culture as you put it has brought much positives to the lives of many gay people. Reality is in Ireland the majority of Gay people are men, its 70:30 I am told. STD's especially HIV are on the rise every year among gay men. Homosexual Culture is not about finding a partner and being faithful to that person, gay men have multiple partners before they commit (if they ever commit). The Gay movement does not know what it really wants and when it gets what it wants its not satisfied.

Do you really think so little of your brother? You've done a hell of a lot of generalising about what his existence entails. Plenty of monogamous gay couples around and also plenty of straight people that sleep around. It's really not about sexual orientation and up to the individual to live their lives how they wish. But you can't claim that one orientation is more predisposed to a set of traits when the exact same things could be said to be true of straight people.

tommy2bad · 22-10-2013 08:22PM

pauldla wrote: »

Explain the difference. It's hard to imagine anything more hardcore than a crucifixion, yet we display it to our kids everywhere, be they Christian or not. Indeed, some go so far as to teach the kids that they have a personal involvement with the act etc etc. As a father, I'd much prefer my kids watch a gay pride parade to a reinactment of the Crucifixion.

Well if I had to chose La Cage aux Folles or the Passion of the Christ

!
This is something that's culturally driven not so much by anti gay feelings as anti sex feelings. We are all too comfortable with violence and all too uncomfortable with sex.

OT but anyway, when our parish was doing up the chapel a pagan friend remarked how we decorate the building with images of death and torture and keep the symbols of life outside referring to the holy water font. Fair point I thought.

seminarian · 22-10-2013 09:35PM

Corkfeen wrote: »

Teenagers do struggle with their sexuality but under Russia's law they cannot be told that there's nothing wrong with them. In fact, Russian society contrasts views them in the same category as paedophiles. Any advice is propaganda under Russian law and it promotes stigmatising a group of people. It's a frightening place to live by all accounts.

Have you been to Russia? Because I have and my Gay brother and Partner have been there also on Holidays.

Do you really think so little of your brother? You've done a hell of a lot of generalising about what his existence entails. Plenty of monogamous gay couples around and also plenty of straight people that sleep around. It's really not about sexual orientation and up to the individual to live their lives how they wish. But you can't claim that one orientation is more predisposed to a set of traits when the exact same things could be said to be true of straight people

I respect full well my brother, is many respects he is a better man than I am. He is fully out, lived all his live with the same partner (who is very much part of our family). And he himself will say its better for a child or a young teenager NOT to come out. Its important to have people who understand and help them, but not to start applying labels that only handicap a child or adolescent.

22-10-2013 09:59PM

seminarian wrote: »

Have you been to Russia? Because I have and my Gay brother and Partner have been there also on Holidays.

Once again:

28064212 wrote: »

The LGBT laws in Russia means that:
no support groups can provide support to minors who are gay (which, given the rampant homophobia, is absolutely horrendous)

a judge can rule two men holding hands in sight of minors is "propaganda"

any public event which even acknowledges the existence of gay people must be over 18

you can be fired purely for being gay

you can be refused service purely for being gay

You see no problem with any of that? Your gay brother and partner have no problem with any of that?

seminarian wrote: »

I respect full well my brother, is many respects he is a better man than I am. He is fully out, lived all his live with the same partner (who is very much part of our family). And he himself will say its better for a child or a young teenager NOT to come out. Its important to have people who understand and help them, but not to start applying labels that only handicap a child or adolescent.

Eh, how the hell are they going to have people who understand and help them if they don't come out? Oh, and people who would understand and help them would be breaking the law in Russia

Corkfeen · 22-10-2013 10:26PM

seminarian wrote: »

Have you been to Russia? Because I have and my Gay brother and Partner have been there also on Holidays.

I respect full well my brother, is many respects he is a better man than I am. He is fully out, lived all his live with the same partner (who is very much part of our family). And he himself will say its better for a child or a young teenager NOT to come out. Its important to have people who understand and help them, but not to start applying labels that only handicap a child or adolescent.

I haven't been to Russia but I am perfectly aware of what the current situation is in Russia. Have you seen the numerous deaths as a result of the law for example?

And to be frank, creating a stigma around being gay is of great risker to a teenager who is struggling with their sexuality if the society which they live in, feels the need to hide away gay people or denigrate them. Because that is the current situation in Russia! Even if your gay brother does believe that a gay teenager should be require to hide their sexuality and not be allowed to avail of any guidance(propaganda as you seem to believe), he is wrong. You're creating a situation that is not good for any better and stigma around being gay leads to mental health issues,suicide and homophobia.(eg Russia).

Also, what makes you so much wiser on the situation in Russia when numerous human rights groups are protesting the situation? Why do you ignore all the acts of violence that are perpetrated against the community? Also,to be frank, why should a society pretend that gay people don't exist? The only admittance to their existence is through harassment campaigns and limiting their rights.

Doc Farrell · 22-10-2013 11:23PM

Seminarian please change your name. Unless you are going to a Scientology seminary, in which case, carry on.

Seriously though, if you want to pm me which seminary who are going to and a contact email address I will get your director to explain to you why you need to close your account. ( short answer, you're supposed to be studying and your posts lack charity).

pauldla · 23-10-2013 05:38AM

tommy2bad wrote: »

Well if I had to chose La Cage aux Folles or the Passion of the Christ !
This is something that's culturally driven not so much by anti gay feelings as anti sex feelings. We are all too comfortable with violence and all too uncomfortable with sex.

That's an excellent point, Tommy, and it might be worth asking why that is. And which society would be the better, I wonder, the one without violence or the one without sex?

seminarian · 23-10-2013 05:46PM

Doc Farrell wrote: »

Seminarian please change your name. Unless you are going to a Scientology seminary, in which case, carry on.

Seriously though, if you want to pm me which seminary who are going to and a contact email address I will get your director to explain to you why you need to close your account. ( short answer, you're supposed to be studying and your posts lack charity).

i am not a seminarian, its just a username,

ar u a doc?

The Gay Megathread (see mod note on post #2212)

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