The world's most loved and excuse racist:

FTA69 · 29-07-2013 01:53PM

Jake1 wrote: »

he did? , wow, never heard that before . Was it pre-match or just in general when talking about him?

Ali says it was pre-match hype but it was pretty vehement. He called Frazier a gorilla, the white man's champion etc. When you consider the fact Frazier helped to support him when he was barred from boxing and lobbied for him such comments are pretty f*cking saucy. Frazier hated him, and couldn't be blamed for doing so in my opinion.

longshanks · 29-07-2013 01:53PM

Didn't Ali have a white Irish grandfather?

FTA69 · 29-07-2013 01:54PM

Phill Ewinn wrote: »

All kinds of discrimination going on then and now.

Again what's your point? Is pointing out the fact that blacks have gotten a sh*t deal in the USA wrong or something?

Henlars67 · 29-07-2013 01:57PM

longshanks wrote: »

Didn't Ali have a white Irish grandfather?

NO

FTA69 · 29-07-2013 01:59PM

longshanks wrote: »

Didn't Ali have a white Irish grandfather?

Great grandfather from Clare.

Chucken · 29-07-2013 02:00PM

longshanks wrote: »

Didn't Ali have a white Irish grandfather?

His great grandfather was from Ennis.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1210524/Muhammad-Ali-freeman-ancestral-home-Ireland.html

kneemos · 29-07-2013 02:27PM

catallus wrote: »

Ali subscribed to the notion of Black Supremacism. He did an Irish interview where he came out with the stuff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LaCK_LkEHk

Where was the black supremacism?

--Kaiser-- · 29-07-2013 02:29PM

He's still one of the most talented individuals to have ever put his feet on the canvas. He may have had some reprehensible political notions but that isn't a crime.

I done wrestled with an alligator
I done tussled with a whale
handcuffed lightning, thrown thunder in jail
only last week, I murdered a rock, injured a stone, hospitalised a brick
I'm so mean I make medicine sick

Henlars67 · 29-07-2013 02:31PM

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

He's still one of the most talented individuals to have ever put his feet on the canvas. He may have had some reprehensible political notions but that isn't a crime.

What would be your view of a top sportsman who was a white separatist?

Duckworth_Luas · 29-07-2013 02:35PM

Henlars67 wrote: »

What would be your view of a top sportsman who was a white separatist?

Andy Murray is a top sportsman of sorts and he always keeps his whites separate. Hence his dazzling apparence and performance at Wimbledon.

groovie · 29-07-2013 02:38PM

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

Andy Murray is a top sportsman of sorts and he always keeps his whites separate. Hence his dazzling apparence and performance at Wimbledon.

Made my drum roll.

cletus van damme · 29-07-2013 02:49PM

ali called frazier an uncle tom which I'd consider similair to racist abuse.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-15/sports/0103150316_1_muhammad-ali-apology-verbal-abuse

fishy fishy · 29-07-2013 02:58PM

Henlars67 wrote: »

"No intelligent white person…in his or her right white mind, want black boys and black girls marrying their white sons and daughters, and in return introducing their grandchildren as half-brown, kinky-head black people"

"Integration is wrong. We don't want to live with the white man; that's all."

Those are quotes from Muhammad Ali. Had a white person spoken like that there is no way that they would now have the hero status that Ali has.

Yet Ali is seen as a hero by the masses, loved by many and his racism ignored by the media and the public at large.

Added to his racism his treatment of Joe Frazier was disgusting, one wouldn't treat a dog in such a manner, particularly given that Frazier lobbied extensively for Ali to be allowed fight again after he was stripped of his title for refusing to go to Vietnam, Frazier had also helped Ali financially during this time.

In my opinion Ali is a horrible disgusting human being and it is disgraceful that he is almost universally hailed as a hero.

get the backstory :rolleyes:

kupus · 29-07-2013 02:59PM

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Being famous and well liked does not automatically make someone a nice person, and vice versa.

If you were in a room with Florence Nightingale and Genghis Khan, having never heard of either, you might have trouble deciding who was the better person.

And imagine if they had hoodies on!!

suicide_circus · 29-07-2013 03:06PM

Henlars67 wrote: »

What would be your view of a top sportsman who was a white separatist?

he would be roundly pilloried and denounced. his sporting achievements would be overshadowed by the infamy of his vile opinions.

--Kaiser-- · 29-07-2013 03:07PM

Henlars67 wrote: »

What would be your view of a top sportsman who was a white separatist?

What's your opinion of Gandhi? He was an awful racist (not to mention he possibly had a fetish for young girls). Still managed to do a lot for his country

wolfpawnat · 29-07-2013 03:08PM

Mohammad Ali lived in a time where being African American made you subhuman. where the colour of his skin meant he was no entitled to eat in the same restaurants as others, where he had to give up his seat etc all just because others thought themselves better than him and you think it disgusting HE had some racist views????

As for Vietnam, that war, as he stated was with a nation that never wronged hom and that was a slaugter of American men for no good reason. He was too intelligent to go over and be another death.

floggg · 29-07-2013 03:14PM

Chucken wrote: »

His fiancée Lorna, a nurse, and he were both 20 when she died in an air raid on London in 1943, three years after they met.
Sir Patrick, who served with the RAF during the war, has previously told how he was so deeply in love that he entered into a life of bachelorhood after the tragedy as ‘there was no question of anyone else’.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2137652/Patrick-Moore-says-hates-Germans-70-years-Nazi-bomb-killed-fianc-e.html

I can kind of understand where he was coming from but to carry that hatred all his life must have been terrible.

Then surely you could kinda understand a black guy in the 60s not liking white people.

And the black separatist movement wasnt entirely a hatred of white people. It's was also built largely in the idea of developing black self sustainability (building on the teachings of Marcus Garvey in the 20s) and on the idea that white people would never let blacks be equal in a white dominated society.

Mr Whirly · 29-07-2013 03:17PM

wolfpawnat wrote: »

Mohammad Ali lived in a time where being African American made you subhuman. where the colour of his skin meant he was no entitled to eat in the same restaurants as others, where he had to give up his seat etc all just because others thought themselves better than him and you think it disgusting HE had some racist views????

As for Vietnam, that war, as he stated was with a nation that never wronged hom and that was a slaugter of American men for no good reason. He was too intelligent to go over and be another death.

He did get involved in some crazy **** though. He met with the Ku Klux Klan to discuss their similar separatist beliefs in the run up to the Frazier fight and completely lost the run of himself around that time.

I agree with him about the war draft though as did Frazier and lots of other high profile people.

crockholm · 29-07-2013 03:44PM

I can't say much about his political opinions,because they truely were different times,if it were said today it would be foolish,to say the least.

My gripe is with the lore of Ali, all those quotes,snappy and rythmic-pretty much all Herbert Muhammad,Elijah Muhammad's son,just drip fed to Ali,those who knew him best know he wasn't that smart.

And the title of "Greatest"? He pretty much copied Sugar Ray Robinson, who was his idol,and no doubt a feat for a heavyweight to do,but please......contender for greatest heavyweight surely,but not greatest ever.

Now,I will admit bias,Smokin Joe is/was my favourite heavyweight,and the shameful way he was treated by Ali,and his supporters and the way the media glossed over it all was sickening.It was painful to see poor old Joe,even in his last years hold onto so much bitterness.He could not let go what had befallen him,and died holding onto it,a broken man,whilst the man he floored,and had (IMO) the better of their 3 bouts becomes an icon and beloved by all.

crockholm · 29-07-2013 03:48PM

Forgot to add,his stance on Vietnam was again dictated to him by the FoI, from what we know Ali was scared sh1tless of being sent over,the whole noble stand thingy was just bs made up by his controllers in the nation,and his sycophants in the press,namely Plimpton and Mailer.

Two Tone from Limehouse · 29-07-2013 03:53PM

wolfpawnat wrote: »

Mohammad Ali lived in a time where being African American made you subhuman. where the colour of his skin meant he was no entitled to eat in the same restaurants as others, where he had to give up his seat etc all just because others thought themselves better than him and you think it disgusting HE had some racist views????

As for Vietnam, that war, as he stated was with a nation that never wronged hom and that was a slaugter of American men for no good reason. He was too intelligent to go over and be another death.

Racist views are racist views. He can't tar all white people with the same brush

Stojkovic · 29-07-2013 04:14PM

Met Ali in Dublin in 72.
Lovely man.

Nodin · 29-07-2013 04:17PM

Two Tone from Limehouse wrote: »

Racist views are racist views. He can't tar all white people with the same brush

...he left the nation of Islam many years ago.

Duckworth_Luas · 29-07-2013 04:17PM

longshanks wrote: »

Didn't Ali have a white Irish grandfather?

FTA69 wrote: »

Great grandfather from Clare.

Didn't Clay (his momma name him Clay, I'm gonna call him Clay) claim that his lighter colour compared to his contemporaries Frazier, Foreman etc was due to his great-grandmother being raped. He may even have said this in his RTÉ interview with Cathal O'Shannon. It only recently came to light that they were actually man and wife

29-07-2013 04:19PM

Henlars67 wrote: »

What would be your view of a top sportsman who was a white separatist?

I can only speak for myself but I don't like Luis Suarez very much.

krudler · 29-07-2013 04:23PM

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

Didn't Clay (his momma name him Clay, I'm gonna call him Clay) claim that his lighter colour compared to his contemporaries Frazier, Foreman etc was due to his great-grandmother being raped. He may even have said this in his RTÉ interview with Cathal O'Shannon. It only recently came to light that they were actually man and wife

I'm thanking this just for working a Trading Places line into a discussion on racism :pac:

Henlars67 · 29-07-2013 04:28PM

wolfpawnat wrote: »

Mohammad Ali lived in a time where being African American made you subhuman. where the colour of his skin meant he was no entitled to eat in the same restaurants as others, where he had to give up his seat etc all just because others thought themselves better than him and you think it disgusting HE had some racist views????

Yes, I find all racist views disgusting, not just those that white people have.

wolfpawnat · 29-07-2013 05:00PM

Mr Whirly wrote: »

He did get involved in some crazy **** though. He met with the Ku Klux Klan to discuss their similar separatist beliefs in the run up to the Frazier fight and completely lost the run of himself around that time.

I agree with him about the war draft though as did Frazier and lots of other high profile people.

I dont for one second agree with his views, I just can see how he came to them in a time of great civil unrest and inequality.

old hippy · 29-07-2013 05:03PM

Nodin wrote: »

...he left the nation of Islam many years ago.

Even Malcolm admitted his views on white folk were extreme before the end of his life.

People in the spotlight sometimes do/say fabulous things, they sometimes do/say stupid things also. Then people mature, if given the chance.

One of my favourite British actors, Ricky Tomlinson used to be in the National Front. He later realised the sheery stupidity of it and grew up. DJ Mark Radcliffe had a dodgy association with far right group Skrewdriver. He too, wised up...

The world's most loved and excuse racist:

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