North vs South

Jacovs · 21-04-2013 6:44pm #1

Not sure if there is a thread like this, but id be interested to see the combinations.
If you can pick a 22 man team from the northern 6 Nations to play a 22 man team from the southern 4 Nations (SA, NZ, Aus, Argentina), who would make your team?
Can be anyone playing, even if currently on injury list.

Swiwi · 21-04-2013 6:56pm

I'm not sure I have the heart for this...sorry

But anyway, take the Lions team, substitute Parisse at 8, and Fofana at 12, and that would be a decent NH 15.

Hagz · 21-04-2013 6:56pm

1. Cian Healy
2. Richardt Strauss
3. Adam Jones
4. Mamuka Gorgodze
5. Paul O'Connell
6. Thierry Dusatoir
7. Justin Tipuric
8. Sergio Parisse
9. Morgan Parra
10. Jonathan Sexton
11. Simon Zebo
12. Wesley Fofana
13. Brian O'Driscoll
14. Tommy Bowe
15. Leigh Halfpenny

tolosenc · 21-04-2013 6:56pm

Can we have Gorgodze?

TheGoldenAges · 21-04-2013 7:04pm

tolosenc wrote: »

Can we have Gorgodze?

He is from the Northern Hemisphere so why not

Neil3030 · 21-04-2013 7:21pm

tolosenc wrote: »

Can we have Gorgodze?

No. Gorgodze will have us.

Neil3030 · 21-04-2013 9:07pm

Actually the more I think about it the better I like the idea. The Lions is an outmoded idea really, going back to a time when a team of British chaps would go on a jolly old tour of the colonies. North v South could replace the Lions every 4 years, alternating between hemispheres with countries taking turns at hosting the matches. It would be particularly good for the likes of Parisse, Gorgodze and some of the great Argentinian and, in particular, South Sea islanders, who never get to play on an international team with team mates who are on a par with themselves.

tolosenc · 21-04-2013 10:15pm

TheGoldenAges wrote: »

He is from the Northern Hemisphere so why not

He's not in the 6 Nations.

tolosenc · 21-04-2013 10:17pm

Neil3030 wrote: »

Actually the more I think about it the better I like the idea. The Lions is an outmoded idea really, going back to a time when a team of British chaps would go on a jolly old tour of the colonies. North v South could replace the Lions every 4 years, alternating between hemispheres with countries taking turns at hosting the matches. It would be particularly good for the likes of Parisse, Gorgodze and some of the great Argentinian and, in particular, South Sea islanders, who never get to play on an international team with team mates who are on a par with themselves.

I think a 6 Nations All Stars vs Rugby Championship All Stars might happen in the not too distant future. The likes of Gorgodze and the Samoans might have to wait, though.

RoundBox11 · 21-04-2013 10:46pm

North

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Jones
4. Wyn-Jones
5. O'Connell
6. Dusatoir
7. O'Brien
8. Parisse

9. Parra
10. Sexton
11. Cuthbert
12. Fofana
13. BOD
14. Bowe
15. Halfpenny

South My current knowledge of SH players is pretty bad so excuse the bad picks
1. Tonga'uiha
2. du Plessis
3. Franks
4. Whitelock
5. Horwill
6. Lobbe
7. McCaw
8. Reid

9. Genia
10. Carter
11. Habana
12. Steyn
13. Smith
14. O'Connor
15. Dagg

dtpc191991 · 21-04-2013 11:01pm

RoundBox11 wrote: »

North

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Jones
4. Wyn-Jones
5. O'Connell
6. Dusatoir
7. O'Brien
8. Parisse

9. Parra
10. Sexton
11. Cuthbert
12. Fofana
13. BOD
14. Bowe
15. Halfpenny

South My current knowledge of SH players is pretty bad so excuse the bad picks
1. Tonga'uiha
2. du Plessis
3. Franks
4. Whitelock
5. Horwill
6. Lobbe
7. McCaw
8. Reid

9. Genia
10. Carter
11. Habana
12. Steyn
13. Smith
14. O'Connor
15. Dagg

Id play Giteau at 12 then that team would be seriously dangerous.

Jacovs · 08-07-2013 4:05pm

http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/LionsinAustralia/Aussies-demand-IRB-review-20130703

Least some people are thinking about it.

BoarHunter · 09-07-2013 7:36am

that's funny Parra is in all the starting XV when he's not even a certain pick for France. Anyway i would pick Venditti ahead of bowe any day. in backrow i would pick gorgodzilla, parisse, Dusautoir and Picamoles. Nicolas Mas would be in there. A rested castrogiovanni. fofana of course

corny · 09-07-2013 8:23am

1. Healy
2. Ghiraldini
3. Mas
4. Maestri
5. POC
6. Gorgodze (honourable mention to Zanni who is the most underrated player in the NH)
7. Dusatoir (people picking him at 6 but he's a genuine openside. The French and the Saffa's are confused;))
8. Picamoles
9. Parra (how PSA picks Machenaud or Michalak ahead of him is a mystery)
10. Sexton
11. North
12. Fofana
13. Rougerie or BOD
14. Malzieu (haven't seen much of him recently but....)
15. Halfpenny

Not gonna do the whole south team but a backline of

9. Genia
10. Carter
11. Folau
12. Nonu
13. Smith
14. Savea
15. Dagg

would be un-be-liev-able!

Klunk_NZ · 09-07-2013 8:41am

All Blacks vs Rest of world please

.ak · 09-07-2013 8:45am

corny wrote: »

1. Healy
2. Ghiraldini
3. Mas
4. Maestri
5. POC
6. Gorgodze (honourable mention to Zanni who is the most underrated player in the NH)
7. Dusatoir (people picking him at 6 but he's a genuine openside. The French and the Saffa's are confused;))
8. Picamoles
9. Parra (how PSA picks Machenaud or Michalak ahead of him is a mystery)
10. Sexton
11. North
12. Fofana
13. Rougerie or BOD
14. Malzieu (haven't seen much of him recently but....)
15. Halfpenny

Not gonna do the whole south team but a backline of

9. Genia
10. Carter
11. Folau
12. Nonu
13. Smith
14. Savea
15. Dagg

would be un-be-liev-able!

I'm a big fan of Malzieu, but he's not a world class wing. I'd have Bowe, Brown, Fitzgerald, Zebo, Ashton all ahead of him.

Klunk_NZ · 09-07-2013 8:47am

They did it in cricket a few years back the number 1 ranked team vs the rest of the world. Australia dominated, but thought it would be a good concept to roll out every 4 years into rugby.

corny · 09-07-2013 9:07am

.ak wrote: »

I'm a big fan of Malzieu, but he's not a world class wing. I'd have Bowe, Brown, Fitzgerald, Zebo, Ashton all ahead of him.

He's not but Mike Brown (makeshift wing is) is.

Each to their own i suppose.

bilston · 09-07-2013 9:08am

corny wrote: »

1. Healy
2. Ghiraldini
3. Mas
4. Maestri
5. POC
6. Gorgodze (honourable mention to Zanni who is the most underrated player in the NH)
7. Dusatoir (people picking him at 6 but he's a genuine openside. The French and the Saffa's are confused;))
8. Picamoles
9. Parra (how PSA picks Machenaud or Michalak ahead of him is a mystery)
10. Sexton
11. North
12. Fofana
13. Rougerie or BOD
14. Malzieu (haven't seen much of him recently but....)
15. Halfpenny

Not gonna do the whole south team but a backline of

Just the eight members of the worst team in the Six Nations then!

France - 8
Ireland - 3
Wales - 2
Italy - 1
Georgia - 1

Interesting breakdown given how the Six Nations and Lions tour panned out

Klunk_NZ · 09-07-2013 9:12am

1. Crockett
2. du Plessis
3. Franks
4. Whitelock
5. Retallick
6. Lobbe
7. McCaw (C)
8. Reid

9.Genia
10.Carter
11.Savea
12.Nonu
13.Smith
14.Jane
15.Dagg

.ak · 09-07-2013 9:17am

corny wrote: »

He's not but Mike Brown (makeshift wing is) is.

Each to their own i suppose.

Mike Brown is a class back three player. Even on the wing he'd be a better player than Malz, who's dreadfully limited at times.

The biggest issue with Malzieu is he's never utilized correctly. He's not an out n out speedster and doesn't have the x factory, but he's an extremely big lad and is a clever footballer. He needs to be popping up in midfield and used on short ball strikes. His bulk is never utilized because the French team don't play like that. He was a different animal for Clermont though who like to play like 15 panzers at times.

Anyway as the other poster said, 8 French is far too many, surely the majority should be Welsh.

.ak · 09-07-2013 9:30am

Just for the laugh I'd go with these lads

1. Healy
2. Hibbard
3. Jones
4. AWJ
5. POC
6. SOB
7. Warburton
8. Picamoles
9. Parra
10. Sexton
11. North
12. Fofana
13. BOD
14. Bowe
15. Halfpenny

16. Strauss
17. Corbs
18. Castro
19. Maestri
20. Zanni
21. Murray
22. Farrell
23. Zebo

corny · 09-07-2013 9:50am

.ak wrote: »

Mike Brown is a class back three player. Even on the wing he'd be a better player than Malz, who's dreadfully limited at times.

How so? And Mike Brown is a class FB.

.ak wrote: »

Anyway as the other poster said, 8 French is far too many, surely the majority should be Welsh.

Why because they've a good coach? I'd rather pick on who i think is more capable.

French players i picked and their Welsh counterparts
Mas V Jones. Mas can scrummage and he contributes more in open play (just).
Maestri V Wyn Jones. Not much in it. Personal preference.
Dusatoir V Warburton. Dusatoir for me. Warburton has a good game every now and again. Doesn't bother his arse at club level either.
Picamoles V Faletau. I like Faletau but Picamoles was outstanding in NZ.
Parra V Phillips. No contest.
Fofana V Roberts.
Malzieu V Cuthbert. If Malzieu is dreadfully limited i'd like to hear your assessment of Cuthbert.

If you change all the above to Welshmen as a reward for their one good performance against England in the 6 nations you weaken the team. Sure Ireland beat them why not make the majority Irish.

pickarooney · 09-07-2013 9:54am

Who are the best tight heads playing today?

.ak · 09-07-2013 10:10am

pickarooney wrote: »

Who are the best tight heads playing today?

Jones, Cole, Mas, Castro?

.ak · 09-07-2013 10:13am

corny wrote: »

How so? And Mike Brown is a class FB.

Why because they've a good coach? I'd rather pick on who i think is more capable.

French players i picked and their Welsh counterparts
Mas V Jones. Mas can scrummage and he contributes more in open play (just).
Maestri V Wyn Jones. Not much in it. Personal preference.
Dusatoir V Warburton. Dusatoir for me. Warburton has a good game every now and again. Doesn't bother his arse at club level either.
Picamoles V Faletau. I like Faletau but Picamoles was outstanding in NZ.
Parra V Phillips. No contest.
Fofana V Roberts.
Malzieu V Cuthbert. If Malzieu is dreadfully limited i'd like to hear your assessment of Cuthbert.

If you change all the above to Welshmen as a reward for their one good performance against England in the 6 nations you weaken the team. Sure Ireland beat them why not make the majority Irish.

I'm afraid we can't lay all of France's woes at their coaches doorstep. They were truly awful this year and the players need to put their hand up. AWJ is a better lock than Maestri imo. Maestri is athletic, but AWJ has the smarts and is a beast around the pitch.

I'd have Malzieu in my club team over Cuthbert any day, but Cuthbert still has produced the goods in the big stage where Malzieu has not. Malzieu is limited in the sense I've already outlined, he doesn't have top end speed, doesn't have a turn or step to beat defenders, he's a big unit with decent hands that's it.

Regarding Dusatoir vs Warburton, I'd be a bigger fan of Dusatoir also, but there's no changing the fact he's been fairly awful this year whilst Warburton stepped up when required in the 2nd test of the Lions.

BGozIE · 09-07-2013 10:30am

My shout;

1. Healy
2. Hibbard
3. Mas
4. AWJ
5. POC
6. Dusautoir
7. Warburton
8. Picamoles
9. Parra
10. Sexton
11. North
12. Fofana
13. BOD
14. Bowe
15. Halfpenny

16. Youngs
17. Corbs
18. Castro
19. Parling
20. SOB
21. Murray
22. Farrell
23. Zebo

I think Dusautoir at 6 gives that back row a nice balance.

bilston · 09-07-2013 11:01am

Oh ok then

15 Halfpenny
14 Bowe
13 Tuilagi (sorry BOD)
12 Fofana
11 North
10 Sexton
9 Parra
1 Healy
2 Youngs
3 Jones
4 AWJ
5 O'Connell
6 Ferris (well the OP said everyone was fit!)
7 Warburton
8 Parisse (yeah you could go with Picamoles but stick Parisse in this team and he'd be incredible)

corny · 09-07-2013 11:27am

.ak wrote: »

I'd have Malzieu in my club team over Cuthbert any day, but Cuthbert still has produced the goods in the big stage where Malzieu has not. Malzieu is limited in the sense I've already outlined, he doesn't have top end speed, doesn't have a turn or step to beat defenders, he's a big unit with decent hands that's it.

What are you talking about? Malzieu has a super step for a big lad and is an excellent finisher. One on one he's a real threat. Also, you criticise him for not producing it on the big stage yet you're willing to go with Mike Brown, amongst others, instead.

Tell me how many times has Mike played wing or scored a try from the wing?

.ak wrote: »

Regarding Dusatoir vs Warburton, I'd be a bigger fan of Dusatoir also, but there's no changing the fact he's been fairly awful this year whilst Warburton stepped up when required in the 2nd test of the Lions.

I'm not trying to be offensive here but you can use whatever criteria you like. Thats the beauty of these imaginary teams. Like i said I'd rather pick on who i think is more capable. Dusatoir with 38 tackles and a try in the biggest game of them all is capable of stepping up to the mark. He's the better player as far as i'm concerned.

.ak · 09-07-2013 11:30am

Malzieu can't even get onto the French team when fit? Like I said, I'm a big fan, but he's far from World Class. Brown has that x-factor and has looked good anytime he's stepped onto the wing.

corny · 09-07-2013 11:45am

.ak wrote: »

Brown has that x-factor and has looked good anytime he's stepped onto the wing.

Apologies for dragging this out but seriously. He hasn't scored a try at international level. I think you can count on one hand the amount of times he's even played on the wing. The best you can say about him is he suits the English style because he has excellent positional awareness compared to other wings. The English back three crucifying us in the 6N's the best example.

He's a good FB with Quins though.

.ak · 09-07-2013 11:49am

Well that's it isn't it? You're the one talking about tries. Tries don't translate into good wingers. Otherwise you'd have Visser on most teams.

Brown's positional awareness and footballing is outstanding. People thought we'd be able to punish and out of position FB by kicking over his head, and we got punished for it. But let's take Brown out of the equation - what has Malz down recently to warrant being put ahead of Bowe, Ashton or even Zebo?

corny · 09-07-2013 12:08pm

.ak wrote: »

Tries don't translate into good wingers.

No but its a help when can score.;)

Going in circles now.

siltirocker · 09-07-2013 12:17pm

A few have left out Parisse. Each to their own I suppose.

henryporter · 09-07-2013 12:22pm

Haven't seen many calls for the current Irish Captain, not even on the bench:D

BGozIE · 09-07-2013 12:24pm

SH shout;

1. Mtawarira
2. Adrian Strauss
3. Franks
4. Whitelock
5. Horwill
6. Higginbotham / Pocock (If pocock has ever played 6 i'd have him here)
7. McCaw
8. Read
9. Genia
10. Carter
11. Habana
12. Nonu
13. Smith
14. Folau
15. Dagg

Hagz · 09-07-2013 12:41pm

My North

1. Cian Healy
2. Richard Hibbard
3. Adam Jones
4. Alun Wyn Jones
5. Paul O'Connell
6. Thierry Dusatoir
7. Sean O'Brien
8. Toby Faletau
9. Morgan Parra
10. Jonathan Sexton
11. George North
12. Wesley Fofana
13. Manu Tuilagi
14. Tommy Bowe
15. Leigh Halfpenny

My South

1. Tendai Mtawarira
2. Bismark Du Plessis
3. Owen Franks
4. Eben Etzebeth
5. James Horwill
6. Juan Martin Fernandez Lobbe
7. Richie McCaw
8. Kieran Read
9. Will Genia
10. Dan Carter
11. Julien Savea
12. Ma'a Nonu
13. Conrad Smith
14. Cory Jane
15. Israel Dagg

.ak · 09-07-2013 1:30pm

henryporter wrote: »

Haven't seen many calls for the current Irish Captain, not even on the bench:D

It's funny actually, because he outplayed Parisse and Picamoles this year. But you'd imagine that's down to being on a better team.

Picamoles is just a beast tho. For me he's the inform 8 in NH atm.

BoarHunter · 10-07-2013 8:13am

1.Healy
2.Hibbard
3.Mas
4.AWJ
5.POC
6.Dusautoir
7.O'Brien
8.Parisse
9.Philipps
10.Wilkinson
11.North
12.Fofana
13.Tuilagi
14.Venditti
15.Halfpenny

Glass Prison 1214 · 10-07-2013 11:06am

BoarHunter wrote: »

1.Healy
2.Hibbard
3.Mas
4.AWJ
5.POC
6.Dusautoir
7.O'Brien
8.Parisse
9.Philipps
10.Wilkinson
11.North
12.Fofana
13.Tuilagi
14.Venditti
15.Halfpenny

I don't know about Wilkinson, based on what I have seen this year he relies heavily on a dominant pack. I don't think hes a patch on Sexton anymore. There are also several scrum halves I would start before Phillips including your two scrumhalves Parra and Machenaud. Apart from those calls I like the look of your team.

Tox56 · 10-07-2013 11:36am

Glass Prison 1214 wrote: »

I don't know about Wilkinson, based on what I have seen this year he relies heavily on a dominant pack. I don't think hes a patch on Sexton anymore. There are also several scrum halves I would start before Phillips including your two scrumhalves Parra and Machenaud. Apart from those calls I like the look of your team.

I'd go a step further and say having Wilkinson (and to an extent Phillips) in that backline would be an absolute travesty given the talent available, although having said that it isn't a patch on the potential SH backline..

Would love to see a match like this happen but I get the feeling it would turn out like the NFL Pro Bowl, with the players just jogging around to avoid injury. It wouldn't have the history and significance of something like the Lions

.ak · 10-07-2013 11:49am

Funnily enough, I reckon had Wilko toured with the Lions he'd be the number 1 OH. Just because that's the way Gatland played.

Tox56 · 10-07-2013 12:04pm

.ak wrote: »

Funnily enough, I reckon had Wilko toured with the Lions he'd be the number 1 OH. Just because that's the way Gatland played.

I don't think so, you could say the same of Farrell and he barely got a sniff in the tests. Wilkson wouldn't have played the kicking game any better than Sexton did imo, just because he isn't (wasn't

) used like that for Leinster doesn't mean he is bad at it. If he played all season in a team that valued tactical kicking above all else, I'd wager we would be talking about how great he is with the boot. G&GR highlighted his tactical kicking before the tour and although most said they were ignoring his ability with ball in hand, they were spot on if that's how the assumed he would be used on this tour. If you want Sexton to play Wilkinson's game he is excellent at it

.ak · 10-07-2013 1:17pm

Tox56 wrote: »

I don't think so, you could say the same of Farrell and he barely got a sniff in the tests. Wilkson wouldn't have played the kicking game any better than Sexton did imo, just because he isn't (wasn't ) used like that for Leinster doesn't mean he is bad at it. If he played all season in a team that valued tactical kicking above all else, I'd wager we would be talking about how great he is with the boot. G&GR highlighted his tactical kicking before the tour and although most said they were ignoring his ability with ball in hand, they were spot on if that's how the assumed he would be used on this tour. If you want Sexton to play Wilkinson's game he is excellent at it

I don't disagree with any of that, but I reckon that's not how Gatty would've seen it. The fact he was looking to bring Wilko over other OH candidates was in itself a bit of a joke.

10-07-2013 1:17pm

There's actually a fair shout that we'd have a Georgian representative at 3.

10-07-2013 1:18pm

The Lions is over. Anyone referring to Gatland as Gatty is to be distrusted.

twinytwo · 10-07-2013 3:44pm

bilston wrote: »

Just the eight members of the worst team in the Six Nations then!

France - 8
Ireland - 3
Wales - 2
Italy - 1
Georgia - 1

Interesting breakdown given how the Six Nations and Lions tour panned out

Its a NH V SH 15... the who did what in the 6 nations has F all to do with it.

bilston · 10-07-2013 3:58pm

twinytwo wrote: »

Its a NH V SH 15... the who did what in the 6 nations has F all to do with it.

Fair enough I'm not going to waste my energy getting into a debate over a fictitious team.

matthew8 · 10-07-2013 4:04pm

SH:
1. Wyatt Crockett
2. Bismarck Du Plessis
3. Owen Franks
4. Eben Etzebeth
5. James Horwill
6. Juan Martin Fernandez Lobbe
7. Richie McCaw
8. Kieran Read
9. Kahn Fotuali'i
10. Dan Carter
11. Bryan Habana
12. Ma'a Nonu
13. Conrad Smith
14. Ben Smith
15. Israel Dagg

1 Samoan, 1 Australian, 1 Argentinian, 3 South Africans and 9 New Zealanders. Pretty much as I would guess it would go given the state of the teams.

Wings are the hardest to pick, Habana, Smith, Jane, Savea and Folau all very good.

10-07-2013 4:57pm

Genia at 9 surely!?

matthew8 · 10-07-2013 4:59pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Genia at 9 surely!?

He has some bad games. I've never seen Fotuali'i have a bad game.

North vs South

Comments