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Dissident turfcutters

12357…11

Comments

  • #122
    M three
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,142 ✭✭✭M three


    MadsL wrote: »
    ^ This.




    http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcb2suvtqd1qagc1ao1_500.gif

    To quote your own words from all of 1 post ago "Got any more irrelevant guff to throw into this thread?"


  • #123
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    M three wrote: »
    The government present or any past couldnt give two hoots about the environment.
    The end game here is to drive landowners out so they can stick up turbines to serve the english energy market. Not the irish energy market. because england dont want the turbines anywhere near them. Go figure.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/opposition-mounts-to-building-of-wind-farms-in-midlands-1.1352942

    "The proposals to build 2,300 wind turbines in the midlands to serve the UK market is already proving to be contentious even before a single one is erected."

    So what do the misinformed who support the ban on turfcutting think of that? How good are 185m high turbines going to be for the habitat ye bleat on about?

    Explain to me how you site multi-ton wind turbines in a bog will ya? More importantly how do you build a road to get to them? Next explain how you get planning permission for such a thing in a Natura 2000 or SAC site which has EU protection.

    And you call us misinformed (mind boggled)

    CT Forum
    >


  • #124
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    Sirfartsalot wrote: »
    The EU directive does set a new precedence in Irish bulls.hitery.

    Preventing people whose families have used this source of fuel for generations is just nonsense.

    The problem is not so much the turf cutting but the method used to exploit the bogs. The heavy machinery used destroys all before it. Bogs also have to be drained in order to be exploited.

    The real people here that are stoking the problems with the bogs are the turf cutting contractors. New exploitation equipment costs hundreds of thousands of euro. The turf cutters generally don't compete with one another but have gentlemens agreements to divide up the bogs into territories that each one cuts. If a bog is closed it will put some cutters out of business because they can't go into another mans patch and cut there.

    The cutters deserve no sympathy though. They knew years ago that this was coming down the line and thought it could be ignored.


  • #125
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    M three wrote: »
    To quote your own words from all of 1 post ago "Got any more irrelevant guff to throw into this thread?"

    You mean like your wind turbine strawman?


  • #126
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    MadsL wrote: »
    Explain to me how you site multi-ton wind turbines in a bog will ya? More importantly how do you build a road to get to them? Next explain how you get planning permission for such a thing in a Natura 2000 or SAC site which has EU protection.

    And you call us misinformed (mind boggled)

    CT Forum
    >

    Wind turbines are not to be sited in the SAC's but the cut away wastelands of BnM bogs in the midlands.


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  • #127
    Precious flower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,812 ✭✭✭Precious flower


    M three wrote: »
    The government present or any past couldnt give two hoots about the environment.
    The end game here is to drive landowners out so they can stick up turbines to serve the english energy market. Not the irish energy market. because england dont want the turbines anywhere near them. Go figure.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/opposition-mounts-to-building-of-wind-farms-in-midlands-1.1352942

    "The proposals to build 2,300 wind turbines in the midlands to serve the UK market is already proving to be contentious even before a single one is erected."

    So what do the misinformed who support the ban on turfcutting think of that? How good are 185m high turbines going to be for the habitat ye bleat on about?
    Interestingly, I don't agree with turbines either. I think I'll ugly and ruin the landscape. I was going to say I support Tidal energy but apparently it can hurt and kill fish with rotating blades and if not maintaining and serviced properly can end up harming fish in the surrounding waters. However, I suppose hopefully the benefits will out way that.


  • #128
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    oppenheimer1 wrote: »
    Wind turbines are not to be sited in the SAC's but the cut away wastelands of BnM bogs in the midlands.

    Which is destroyed habitat anyway and beyond restoration.

    M three wrote: »
    How good are 185m high turbines going to be for the habitat ye bleat on about?
    Do you have a cat?

    Associated bird deaths per year (U.S.)

    Feral and domestic cats = Hundreds of millions [source: AWEA]

    Power lines = 130 million -- 174 million [source: AWEA]

    Windows (residential and commercial) = 100 million -- 1 billion [source: TreeHugger]

    Pesticides = 70 million [source: AWEA]

    Automobiles = 60 million -- 80 million [source: AWEA]

    Lighted communication towers = 40 million -- 50 million [source: AWEA]

    Wind turbines = 10,000 -- 40,000 [source: ABC]


  • #129
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,217 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    If you're under some sort of illusion that you pay for cities sewerage treatment you should put that to bed washman. The cities pay for themselves and furthermore, they subsidise the rural parts of the country. Lets hope the freeloaders take their poxy compo from the taxpayer and stop ripping up the protected bogs for free fuel.

    Newsflash there for ya jack, it's not free.


  • #130
    fasttalkerchat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,652 ✭✭✭fasttalkerchat


    Is there any law about buying or burning turf that was cut and bagged by someone else?


  • #131
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    fasttalkerchat wrote: »
    Is there any law about buying or burning turf that was cut and bagged by someone else?

    No-one can cut turf on protected bogs, it's not just a ban on the landowner or the turbary rights holder.


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  • #132
    flutered
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,724 ✭✭✭flutered


    MadsL wrote: »
    Feelings? Better than 15k compensation? .
    plus free turf, what more do they require only in ireland is there war of half acres.


  • #133
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    flutered wrote: »
    plus free turf, what more do they require only in ireland is there war of half acres.

    How about a special driving licence that lets you drive pissed?


  • #134
    flutered
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,724 ✭✭✭flutered


    Sirfartsalot wrote: »
    The EU directive does set a new precedence in Irish bulls.hitery.

    Preventing people whose families have used this source of fuel for generations is just nonsense.

    what about parts of west limerick and north cork where there was trouble over the harrier hawk, no word about that now.


  • #135
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,448 ✭✭✭✭John_Rambo


    end of the road wrote: »
    why should they? their ancestors faught for 800 years for that land and if they want to rip it up for free fuel then good for them

    Stupid post.
    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    Newsflash there for ya jack, it's not free.

    Michael, anyone I know that has turbary rights on a bog doesn't pay per bag, do you have turbary rights? Who do you pay?
    washman3 wrote: »
    Just like the 'freeloaders' pay for the Boozebus (nitelink) to get you home from the pub.biggrin.png

    Do you think the nitelink is free? Another stupid post.


  • #136
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,080 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    M three wrote: »
    The government present or any past couldnt give two hoots about the environment.
    The end game here is to drive landowners out so they can stick up turbines to serve the english energy market. Not the irish energy market. because england dont want the turbines anywhere near them. Go figure.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/opposition-mounts-to-building-of-wind-farms-in-midlands-1.1352942

    "The proposals to build 2,300 wind turbines in the midlands to serve the UK market is already proving to be contentious even before a single one is erected."

    So what do the misinformed who support the ban on turfcutting think of that? How good are 185m high turbines going to be for the habitat ye bleat on about?


    Must be the same reason all of those swamps and marshes and areas with very particular flora are protected - becasue they're so ridiculously unsuitable for the construction of windfarms that nobody will suspect it when the government takes them to build windfarms on!

    Like was said above, Conspiracy Theory is that way ========>
    although if you're gonna be posting ludicrous comments like that then the sign out button might be a better choice


  • #137
    flutered
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,724 ✭✭✭flutered


    MadsL wrote: »
    How about a special driving licence that lets you drive pissed?

    do you have one, how does one go about getting it, no good to me really as i do not partake in strong liquor.


  • #138
    washman3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    Do you think the nitelink is free? Another stupid post.

    i know its not free, but its a pittance!! subsidised by the every taxpayer, including the 'bleedin culchie roughnecks' that you despise, but who will never use it.


  • #139
    Rad!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27 ✭Rad!


    A lot if people need to realise that bogs which have been economically exhausted are still capable of being beautiful, diverse natural ecosystems.

    Yes the ecosystem won't be as extensive, but that's just where the balance between environmental and local interests us struck.

    I live beside a 'spent' bog... Gorgeous place.


  • #140
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,448 ✭✭✭✭John_Rambo


    washman3 wrote: »
    i know its not free, but its a pittance!! subsidised by the every taxpayer, including the 'bleedin culchie roughnecks' that you despise, but who will never use it.

    You're talking through your hole washman, there is restrictions of EU funded buses running on these services, state subsidies and grants are not and cannot be used to pay for it. Nitelink fuel costs, staffing, mechanical work/servicing etc are logged and paid for from the monies taken on from Nitelink fares.

    Now, before you start again with your taxmoney paying for city services, forget it. The cities pay for themselves, the rest goes to rural areas.

    I don't despise rednecks, or culchies, I don't even use that type of language, I just don't like freeloaders that feel the state owes them a living.


  • #141
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,080 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    Rad! wrote: »
    A lot if people need to realise that bogs which have been economically exhausted are still capable of being beautiful, diverse natural ecosystems.

    Yes the ecosystem won't be as extensive, but that's just where the balance between environmental and local interests us struck.

    I live beside a 'spent' bog... Gorgeous place.


    Still better to try and keep the few pristine bogs we have - the 'spent' bogs can be good ecosystems but they're very different to the habitat that was there before it was exploited.


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  • #142
    washman3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    MadsL wrote: »
    Explain to me how you site multi-ton wind turbines in a bog will ya? More importantly how do you build a road to get to them? Next explain how you get planning permission for such a thing in a Natura 2000 or SAC site which has EU protection.

    And you call us misinformed (mind boggled)

    CT Forum
    >

    They dig away the bog, thousands and thousands of tons of it. Then put in absolutely massive concrete bases reinforced with tons of steel. They bolt the columms to these bases, fit the gearbox and blades on top. Same with the road to reach them, its actually the first thing done, they dig and dig until the 'grey layer' or 'iron pan' is reached. This was the layer that caused the bog to form in the first place as its rock solid and holds water and decayed vegitation. Again many thousand tons of filling rock is used on top of this layer to make the road.
    To the best of my knowledge the huge bogslide near Lemybrien in Galway was caused by carelessness during this process some years ago. Those windmills are built on a bog.
    While driving from Galway one day towards Rossaveal i noticed that there are also windmills built on bogs, near Furbo/Barna i think.
    It definately was a bog as people were stacking turf virtually underneath the blades.
    Most of the windmills that i know of in county Limerick are built on bogs. Hardly a word was said when these bogs were being dug up by Airtricity and Nordex etc.
    The only objection was from a handful of people regarding the plight of the hen-harrier, who is not native to this country anyway. The Red Grouse has long disappeared since their habitat was destroyed by Coillte,Greenbelt etc. Modern hay/silage saving methods spelt the death knell for the beloved corncrake.
    Hope your question is answered, windmills are built on bogs.
    Maybe somebody here can post some pics.

    P.S. dozens of more windmills are planned for county Limerick, mostly on the bogs to the wast of the county, both blanket and raised bogs.


  • #143
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,080 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    washman3 wrote: »
    The only objection was from a handful of people regarding the plight of the hen-harrier, who is not native to this country anyway. The Red Grouse has long disappeared since their habitat was destroyed by Coillte,Greenbelt etc.

    Eh source?!? Not only is it native, but there are other Harriers that are native that were wiped out from Ireland in the not-too-distant past!

    Presume you mean the Red Grouse is locally extinct? Because thanks to some hard work by hunters and conservationists in the recent past their fotunes are slowly changing. But they were never gone from Ireland.


  • #144
    washman3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    You're talking through your hole washman, there is restrictions of EU funded buses running on these services, state subsidies and grants are not and cannot be used to pay for it. Nitelink fuel costs, staffing, mechanical work/servicing etc are logged and paid for from the monies taken on from Nitelink fares.

    Now, before you start again with your taxmoney paying for city services, forget it. The cities pay for themselves, the rest goes to rural areas.

    I don't despise rednecks, or culchies, I don't even use that type of language, I just don't like freeloaders that feel the state owes them a living.

    If you believe for one moment that the Nitelink service is not taxpayer subsidised then you definately have swallowed the entire jar of pills.:(


  • #145
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,080 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    washman3 wrote: »
    If you believe for one moment that the Nitelink service is not taxpayer subsidised then you definately have swallowed the entire jar of pills.:(

    How much do you think each individual pays for the nitelink when they use it?


  • #146
    washman3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    OpenYourEyes wrote: »
    Eh source?!? Not only is it native, but there are other Harriers that are native that were wiped out from Ireland in the not-too-distant past!

    Presume you mean the Red Grouse is locally extinct? Because thanks to some hard work by hunters and conservationists in the recent past their fotunes are slowly changing. But they were never gone from Ireland.

    Hen harrier arguement is for another day, as you well know from other forums, and my feelings about it.
    i last saw a red grouse on a bog 2 years ago, before that it must have been 10. i doubt, but hope, that it will ever return to the numbers witnessed by our fathers/grandfathers.


  • #147
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,080 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    washman3 wrote: »
    Hen harrier arguement is for another day, as you well know from other forums, and my feelings about it.
    i last saw a red grouse on a bog 2 years ago, before that it must have been 10. i doubt, but hope, that it will ever return to the numbers witnessed by our fathers/grandfathers.

    Actually no I've never come across you before on boards that I'm aware of. And I've never, on any website, come across anyone who thinks Hen Harriers are not native to Ireland. It hasn't been mentioned in the many papers I've read about them either. Sounds like an even worse conspiracy theory than the SAC bogs and windfarms one above!

    And Red Grouse have still been around, but much reduced in number and range. I can't say that they will ever return to the numbers they were at in the past, but things have been looking slightly better for them in recent years thankfully.


  • #148
    washman3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    OpenYourEyes wrote: »
    How much do you think each individual pays for the nitelink when they use it?

    Probably 50-75% of what they might pay to take the same route during the day. Enlighten us.!


  • #149
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,080 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    washman3 wrote: »
    Probably 50-75% of what they might pay to take the same route during the day. Enlighten us.!

    So if someone pays €2.40 for their route during the day, you think they pay €1.20-1.80 for the same route on the nitelink?


  • #150
    Capercaille
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,077 ✭✭✭Capercaille


    washman3 wrote: »

    The only objection was from a handful of people regarding the plight of the hen-harrier, who is not native to this country anyway. The Red Grouse has long disappeared since their habitat was destroyed by Coillte,Greenbelt etc. Modern hay/silage saving methods spelt the death knell for the beloved corncrake.
    There are roughly 4200 Irish red grouse in Ireland.
    125-129 calling male Corncrake in 2012.
    150+ pairs of Hen Harrier in Ireland which are native. What your problem with Hen Harrier? You obviously know fvck all about Irish wildlife if you consider Hen Harrier non-native


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  • #151
    washman3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,646 ✭✭✭washman3


    OpenYourEyes wrote: »
    Eh source?!? Not only is it native, but there are other Harriers that are native that were wiped out from Ireland in the not-too-distant past!

    Take it these were the ones introduced and funded by Coillte that were poisoned by farmers in Kerry and Donegal whose sheep were plagued by them during lambing season.?
    The arguement prevails : bird of prey or vermin, to me irs the latter.!


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