B&I Lions v Wallabies, Test 2 Match Thread, Sat June 29, 1105am

neilmulvey · 29-06-2013 6:26pm

Hagz wrote: »

I disagree. I sense we're only going to go in roundabouts talking about the specific way in which the human body can move:p. Perhaps I've been brainwashed by my childhood diet of WWF, but I think you can definitely do a ddt if momentum is with you (which in the case of Folau it was, as North was already going to ground).

What's french for facepalm?

WWF? Are you for fooking real? North picks up a guy, who is also about 17st. Runs about 5 yards carrying this guy on his shoulder before two other guys weighing about 16st make a tackle and they all end up on the ground. Folau has done absolutely nothing wrong (so will probably get banned) and trying to use the WWF as a backup to your argument is absolute nonsense

Lelantos · 29-06-2013 6:39pm

Knicked this from YLYL as it made me laugh

subfreq · 29-06-2013 6:49pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

well we wont agree on it i think is a non issue anyway.... id be as much surprised by a citing on folau as i would be with to a citing on north....

The clamour for citings seems out of place to me as well.

29-06-2013 6:52pm

Start : quick scan.
Read : Genia Overrated
Response : Return to other duties before head explodes

Hagz · 29-06-2013 6:53pm

It would appear that a lot people on this forum interpret comments on this forum in whatever way they see fit. According to some, the summary of my recent posts would read like this.

I think Folau intentionally tried to break North's neck, and if North were to have injured himself, Folau is 100% to blame. I formed this argument based on my sound source of 1990's WWF. What Folau did was underhanded and he deserves to be cited and banned.

:pac:

toomevara · 29-06-2013 6:54pm

Le vieux renard wrote: »

Hopefully, the Lions can manufacture a try or tries next week, because they didn't remotely look like doing so today, in fact I'd be surprised if they spent more than 1 or 2 minutes in the Aussie 22.

Couldn't agree more. This was the most disturbing aspect of today's game for me, the complete lack of any creativity/spontaneity on the Lions' part. The Australians played the vast majority of the attacking rugby and had they been a bit more clinical and fluid and perhaps had a full-time as opposed to a part time pivot they would have won that game comfortably. The Lions were lucky to win the 1st Test and they were exceptionally lucky to be in the 2nd test to the end. I reckon the Aussies have the measure of this lot and I'm predicting a wallaby win next weekend. i even reckon it could be quite comfortable.

Swiwi. · 29-06-2013 6:55pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Start : quick scan.
Read : Genia Overrated
Response : Return to other duties before head explodes

Yip. You can write the most detailed brilliant analytical post this forum has ever seen, but if you slip in that Genia is over-rated, you've completely undone your good work.

I assume the poor fellow didn't watch the first test...

SlickRic · 29-06-2013 6:56pm

don't be surprised to see Phillips back next week, rightlyor wrongly.

sydthebeat · 29-06-2013 6:58pm

SlickRic wrote: »

don't be surprised to see Phillips back next week, rightlyor wrongly.

id be very surprised

rockbeast · 29-06-2013 7:00pm

Hagz wrote: »

It would appear that a lot people on this forum interpret comments on this forum in whatever way they see fit. According to some, the summary of my recent posts would read like this.

I think Folau intentionally tried to break North's neck, and if North were to have injured himself, Folau is 100% to blame. I formed this argument based on my sound source of 1990's WWF. What Folau did was underhanded and he deserves to be cited and banned.

:pac:

Folau's got nothing on Jake The Snake. What time is is? Damien's Dinner Time!

Swiwi. · 29-06-2013 7:03pm

toomevara wrote: »

Couldn't agree more. This was the most disturbing aspect of today's game for me, the complete lack of any creativity/spontaneity on the Lions' part. The Australians played the vast majority of the attacking rugby and had they been a bit more clinical and fluid and perhaps had a full-time as opposed to a part time pivot they would have won that game comfortably. The Lions were lucky to win the 1st Test and they were exceptionally lucky to be in the 2nd test to the end. I reckon the Aussies have the measure of this lot and I'm predicting a wallaby win next weekend. i even reckon it could be quite comfortable.

I agree, with the proviso that Horwill will be a big loss. Not too many people rate the Aussie forwards on this forum, but Horwill is just as good as AWJ & Parling. Maybe only POC is better.

I've been a bit underwhelmed by Michael Hooper. I can't emphasise enough how well George Smith was playing pre his injury, and it's a no-brainer for me that he should slot straight into the starting line-up.

It will be another close game, we will never know what difference Quade Cooper would have made. The Lions having Corbisiero and Roberts back should help.

jamiedav2011 · 29-06-2013 7:04pm

Le vieux renard wrote: »

I agree, with the proviso that Horwill will be a big loss. Not too many people rate the Aussie forwards on this forum, but Horwill is just as good as AWJ & Parling. Maybe only POC is better.

I've been a bit underwhelmed by Michael Hooper. I can't emphasise enough how well George Smith was playing pre his injury, and it's a no-brainer for me that he should slot straight into the starting line-up.

It will be another close game, we will never know what difference Quade Cooper would have made. The Lions having Corbisiero and Roberts back should help.

Jaysus Hooper was quality today.

Horwill is one of the best locks in the world for me, probably top 3.

Have to laugh at this stuff about the Ozzies being a mediocre side. Don't think any of Horwill, Moore, Genia, JOC, Beale, Folau, AAC could be called mediocre, and when you think they're missing Cooper, Digby, Pocock, Barnes etc and recognise their results against the NH and in the Rugby Championship last year you'd realise just how 'mediocre' they are.

.ak · 29-06-2013 7:05pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

id be very surprised

Philips will start if fit, no doubt. Gatland has a soft spot for him and neither SH imposed themselves today.. Altho I thought Murray was brilliant in parts.

.ak · 29-06-2013 7:05pm

subfreq · 29-06-2013 7:06pm

Isn't it he case that even if found guilty (Almost certain) that Horwill can appeal and be available next weekend?

Swiwi. · 29-06-2013 7:07pm

jamiedav2011 wrote: »

Jaysus Hooper was quality today.

Horwill is one of the best locks in the world for me, probably top 3.

His effort was quality. Didn't dominate the breakdown as much I would have expected these last 2 tests, though.

Yeah, I seriously rate Horwill, the Wallabies dismal recent record against the ABs has a lot to do with his injury-plagued 2012 season.

.ak · 29-06-2013 7:07pm

Le vieux renard wrote: »

I agree, with the proviso that Horwill will be a big loss. Not too many people rate the Aussie forwards on this forum, but Horwill is just as good as AWJ & Parling. Maybe only POC is better.

I've been a bit underwhelmed by Michael Hooper. I can't emphasise enough how well George Smith was playing pre his injury, and it's a no-brainer for me that he should slot straight into the starting line-up.

It will be another close game, we will never know what difference Quade Cooper would have made. The Lions having Corbisiero and Roberts back should help.

As I said earlier to you, I thought Hooper shows flashes of real class. He's no where near the level of Smith, but I think Hooper's been the stand out openside of the tour from both sides.

Lelantos · 29-06-2013 7:07pm

^^ I suppose for once Genia is glad it's not him being the sack of spuds

.ak · 29-06-2013 7:08pm

subfreq wrote: »

Isn't it he case that even if found guilty (Almost certain) that Horwill can appeal and be available next weekend?

The ban stands until an appeal over turns it. If he appeals BEFORE the next game and somehow overturns it then yes, but I don't see that happening in the time line available.

Swiwi. · 29-06-2013 7:09pm

subfreq wrote: »

Isn't it he case that even if found guilty (Almost certain) that Horwill can appeal and be available next weekend?

Not if the IRB has any say in the matter. I can't possibly see how he will get a fair hearing, given the IRB's comments on the first decision. He's a goner.

Swiwi. · 29-06-2013 7:10pm

.ak wrote: »

Disclaimer: can cause neck injury if used incorrectly.

.ak · 29-06-2013 7:12pm

Also, I know we're only two tests into this, but I'm completely unconvinced that Gatland is a top coach. Not taking anything away from the Aussies, but game plan today was clearly two dimensional and reliant on players that weren't even on the pitch, i.e: Roberts. I think Gatland is a one trick pony and he'll need to either switch things up, or hope his current plan works next week.

Kiwi_knock · 29-06-2013 7:13pm

Horwill is top quality, not just for his style of play but also for his leadership skills. Australia and the Reds have looked lost without him leading the team.

While Hooper carried well, he did not dominate the breakdown. You would imagine he is the likely player to lose out in the backrow with the return of Smith. He could drop out of the 23 all together with Gill being retained on the bench.

Swiwi. · 29-06-2013 7:15pm

.ak wrote: »

Also, I know we're only two tests into this, but I'm completely unconvinced that Gatland is a top coach. Not taking anything away from the Aussies, but game plan today was clearly two dimensional and reliant on players that weren't even on the pitch, i.e: Roberts. I think Gatland is a one trick pony and he'll need to either switch things up, or hope his current plan works next week.

This has been his big moment to shine - no excuses about lack of resources etc, but the gameplan today in particular was awful - OK, if he'd won that would have been a series victory, but by 6 penalties? It's the kind of victory that NZers would mock England for, rightly or wrongly.

He seems to have retreated into his shell, with absolute conservatism.

Swiwi. · 29-06-2013 7:18pm

Kiwi_knock wrote: »

Horwill is top quality, not just for his style of play but also for his leadership skills. Australia and the Reds have looked lost without him leading the team.

While Hooper carried well, he did not dominate the breakdown. You would imagine he is the likely player to lose out in the backrow with the return of Smith. He could drop out of the 23 all together with Gill being retained on the bench.

Yeah, quite possibly. I've been somewhat amazed by Mowen - OK he seemed decent enough for the Brumbies, but I thought Higginbothan was a major loss - not so, he's been the best 6 on display so far.

.ak · 29-06-2013 7:23pm

Le vieux renard wrote: »

This has been his big moment to shine - no excuses about lack of resources etc, but the gameplan today in particular was awful - OK, if he'd won that would have been a series victory, but by 6 penalties? It's the kind of victory that NZers would mock England for, rightly or wrongly.

He seems to have retreated into his shell, with absolute conservatism.

Yep, trying to play error-free rugby. Ironically, the unforced errors today were rife and awful to watch.

Buer · 29-06-2013 7:26pm

.ak wrote: »

Also, I know we're only two tests into this, but I'm completely unconvinced that Gatland is a top coach.

I'll go out on a limb and say his HEC, 3 consecutive Premiership titles, NPC win and 3 6N titles suggest that he already is a top coach!

In fairness, he has proven himself consistently in multiple sides over a decade. The result next week will do nothing to change that.

Kiwi_knock · 29-06-2013 7:26pm

Le vieux renard wrote: »

Yeah, quite possibly. I've been somewhat amazed by Mowen - OK he seemed decent enough for the Brumbies, but I thought Higginbothan was a major loss - not so, he's been the best 6 on display so far.

He has been excellent; Mowen, Smith and Higginbotham would have been a serious backrow if all were fit. Was impressed by Palu today as well, not his biggest fan but he carried well.

bilston · 29-06-2013 7:32pm

Halfpenny - kicked pretty well although will regret the first miss even if it was unlucky. The second one was beyond his range and any talk if lack of bottle is crazy. Positionally superb.

Bowe - Put in a terrific shift, his kick chases were excellent but wasn't utilised in attack at all

O'Driscoll - one or two uncharacteristically panicky moments in the last quarter with a pass to no one and kicking away turnover ball, however defensively was a rock as always. Did nothing in attack

Davies - A victim of having to play 12 I guess. The BOD pass to Folau may have been the result of BOD wanting Davies to cut a short line but Davies natural instinct was to arc out. This isn't a centre partnership that is going anywhere. He made errors too. I'm not sure about the try. I'd need to see it again. Obviously AAC was his man but he ran a decent hard line and the momentum maybe meant the try was a certainty. Maybe could have done better I guess.

North - Moment of the series was him lifting Folau up, other than that I felt he came of second best to the Qantas No. 14. We need to get him into space.

Sexton - His garryowens are perfect but whatever the gameplan is it doesn't suit him. The lack of ball carriers up front for the Lions seems to be restricting the space the backs get and that may be an argument for bringing O'Brien in next week.

Youngs B - Lacked control at the breakdown which meant the runners coming of him were getting rubbish ball. Box kicked pretty well.

Vunipola - What to say about his performance? The scrum really struggled early on but then out of nowhere it picked up. Not sure what to make of the AAC incident I think Barnes reaction was OTT but the citing commissioner may have a second look. He didn't really offer much in the loose which should be his strength.

Youngs T - Can he actually throw to the tail? Not the presence he was last week but the Lions may well rue the fact he wasn't on the pitch in the 78th minute

Jones A - Don't think he is the force he was and I think Cole strengthened the scrum when he came on.

Jones AW - Did he pick up an injury in the first 10 mins. Defensively a rock and led the lineout well

Parling - I only remember a couple of carries, but the lineout went fine for the most part. We definitely missed O'Connell today but that's not meant to be a reflection on Parling

Lydiate - Tackled all day but is nothing else

Warburton - Hopefuly he shut the doubters up and more importantly I hope he is fit next week. If he lasted 80 minutes today I fancy the Lions would have won.

Heaslip - I had hoped the presence of Lydiate would have opened the game up a bit more for Heaslip but it wasn't to be. His tight work was good. Unless he was injured I suspect his subbing could be ominous for next week. Don't be surprised to see Faletau start.

Bench - Murray was very good and I would start him next week, who would have said that 9 months ago! Cole will be happy with the first scrum when he came of the bench. Hibbard will be remembered for the lost lineout at the end, I didn't notice Croft too much, don't think anyone else got on.

Next week I hope Corbisiero is fit. I would promote Best and Evans to the bench, start SOB somewhere in the back row. I wouldn't have a problem with Faletau starting, I would definitely start Murray and I would bring a 12 in to play 12. Be that Roberts, Twelvetrees or Barritt.

We should also hope that Warburton is fit.

Swiwi. · 29-06-2013 7:32pm

Buer wrote: »

I'll go out on a limb and say his HEC, 3 consecutive Premiership titles, NPC win and 3 6N titles suggests that he already is a top coach!

In fairness, he has proven himself consistently in multiple sides over a decade. The result next week will do nothing to change that.

Unfortunately for him, if he does want to coach the ABs (?does he, don't know TBH), his record to the NZ public will look like the above, so a Lions series victory would be important against one of NZ's fiercest rivals.

B&I Lions v Wallabies, Test 2 Match Thread, Sat June 29, 1105am

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