Garda Sergeant can't afford food

jonsnow · 19-02-2013 11:27PM

Great letter in todays times which sums up how I feel:

http://www.irishtimes.com/letters/

Sir, – It is galling to listen to the constant moaning and groaning from members of An Garda Síochána and their representatives about changes in pay and conditions.The gardaí are in very safe, select permanent pensionable employment, with great benefits and conditions.

They can retire at age 55, with full pension at 30 years service. They have allowances to beat the band. They never have to worry about redundancies, short time working, sick leave, or pay.

Surely it’s the duty of An Garda Síochána to serve the state and citizens, without the constant moaning about minor irritations.

Every section of this country has been affected by the austerity inflicted on us. The Army, judiciary, nurses, carers, lone parents, widowed, pensioners and so many more. All have been severely hurt, and many have no other income except State assistance. Yet we have the Garda continually seeking special exemption for themselves as a special case.

The gardaí ought to realise that in these very challenging times they are in a very comfortable position. It doesn’t do their image any good to be constantly playing the poor-mouth victim. – Yours, etc,

THOMAS J CLARKE,
Foxhill Park,
Dublin 13.

Boombastic · 19-02-2013 11:34PM

They receive €15,000 if they opt to take a career break
They have a pension worth 1.1 million, golden handshake
Early retirement option
Allowances for being appointed a 9-5 role, cos they'd miss out on other allowances

Boo Hoo, my heart bleeds for them

jonsnow · 19-02-2013 11:36PM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Christ, i guarantee i'm one of the few who even know how to manage an internet forum. But aside from other members not knowing what a forum is, or even having basic typing skills (it's getting better)

Seriously your saying that most gardai can't negotiate an internet forum or don't have basic typing skills despite writing up reports being a major component of the job???.How is putting that statement out there supposed to garner sympathy when it is in fact a disgraceful state of affairs for a police force in the 21st century which recruited 60% its members in the last 10 years.Not much chance of getting to the bottom of Anglo or any other complicated white collar crime scenario so I suppose.

Potential-Monke · 19-02-2013 11:49PM

Boombastic wrote: »

They receive €15,000 if they opt to take a career break

Link please, because i've certainly never heard of this.

Boombastic wrote: »

They have a pension worth 1.1 million, golden handshake

I explained that it's not worth that way back in this thread. Go look for it.

Boombastic wrote: »

Early retirement option

If you meet the criteria, which is hitting the retirement age before the 30 year service, and you buy your way out.

Boombastic wrote: »

Allowances for being appointed a 9-5 role, cos they'd miss out on other allowances

I agree with cutting this.

Boombastic wrote: »

Boo Hoo, my heart bleeds for them

Jealous much? Because that's what it's coming across as.

jonsnow wrote: »

Seriously your saying that most gardai can't negotiate an internet forum or don't have basic typing skills despite writing up reports being a major component of the job???.How is putting that statement out there supposed to garner sympathy when it is in fact a disgraceful state of affairs for a police force in the 21st century which recruited 60% its members in the last 10 years.Not much chance of getting to the bottom of Anglo or any other complicated white collar crime scenario so I suppose.

Well i'd imagine the figure might be less now (for the people who can't navigate a forum), but yes, the majority of older members would have trouble if it came to anything more than navigating Pulse or Word.

Granted, with the now figure of 60% of the force having been recruited in the last 10 years (that figure skewed by the massive increase in retirements in the last few years), they would be more used to it, and getting better every day. But keeping in mind that AGS was (and still is to an extent) a very techno phobic organisation. Pulse was only introduced in 1999. Most members would have got a very basic course on it. E-mail still isn't been used as effectively as it should. A lot of members still write their files or statements because they're quicker at it than the 2 finger typing.

Just because they can't type doesn't mean they can't investigate. You don't need to type to be the best at investigation, and it's ridiculous to think otherwise.

kerry4sam · 20-02-2013 12:48AM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

...But aside from other members not knowing what a forum is, or even having basic typing skills (it's getting better)....

Potential-Monke wrote: »

...

Well i'd imagine the figure might be less now (for the people who can't navigate a forum), but yes, the majority of older members would have trouble if it came to anything more than navigating Pulse or Word.

Granted, with the now figure of 60% of the force having been recruited in the last 10 years (that figure skewed by the massive increase in retirements in the last few years), they would be more used to it, and getting better every day. But keeping in mind that AGS was (and still is to an extent) a very techno phobic organisation. Pulse was only introduced in 1999. Most members would have got a very basic course on it. E-mail still isn't been used as effectively as it should. A lot of members still write their files or statements because they're quicker at it than the 2 finger typing.

Just because they can't type doesn't mean they can't investigate. You don't need to type to be the best at investigation, and it's ridiculous to think otherwise.

I am curious about some issues you raise:

Can you tell me what full-timer members are doing about rectifying their lack of IT skills? Are they taking typing courses, like other members of the public do, so they are not wasting valuable time trying to 2-finger type when time is so precious on-the-job?
In these techie-times I think it shameful that members can barely type or not know their way around online forums; and online sources where even the youth of today spend their time. How can they understand what the youth of today are going through, if they are not able to follow and understand what is happening online?
What are full-time members doing to change these matters in their own time? People, outside of the guards, do undertake courses in their spare time to help them, do you are those people who you refer to here, are they doing the same or are just going to continue being in the dark about typing and their lack of online knowledge?

Thanks,

HondaSami · 20-02-2013 12:58AM

kerry4sam wrote: »

I am curious about some issues you raise:

Can you tell me what full-timer members are doing about rectifying their lack of IT skills? Are they taking typing courses, like other members of the public do, so they are not wasting valuable time trying to 2-finger type when time is so precious on-the-job?

Thanks,

Are you serious here? you think typing should be a requirement for members of AGS?

kerry4sam · 20-02-2013 01:08AM

HondaSami wrote: »

Are you serious here? you think typing should be a requirement for members of AGS?

That was not directed at you HondaSami. However, Yes I do think anyone in uniform should have typing skills in this hi-tech age yes. If they are having difficulties with technology, I think they should do something about it like others do.

Unless they are waiting for courses to drop on their lap before doing anything about it.

HondaSami · 20-02-2013 01:13AM

kerry4sam wrote: »

That was not directed at you HondaSami. However, Yes I do think anyone in uniform should have typing skills in this hi-tech age yes. If they are having difficulties with technology, I think they should do something about it like others do.

Unless they are waiting for courses to drop on their lap before doing anything about it.

I know it was not directed at me K4sam.

Typing skills yes but not touch typing, could you imagine some of them trying to learn this, lots of people are slow at typing.
I don't think it's necessary for them to learn typing as it adds nothing to the job, majority of the younger ones are on facebook and are computer savvy.

kerry4sam · 20-02-2013 01:15AM

HondaSami wrote: »

I know it was not directed at me K4sam.

Typing skills yes but not touch typing, could you imagine some of them trying to learn this, lots of people are slow at typing.
I don't think it's necessary for them to learn typing as it adds nothing to the job, majority of the younger ones are on facebook and are computer savvy.

Okay, That is your opinion and you're entitled to that.

Back @ Potential-Monke : Care to answer my questions or feel you've said too much?

Electric Sheep · 20-02-2013 01:18AM

HondaSami wrote: »

Are you serious here? you think typing should be a requirement for members of AGS?

Typing is a life skill that everyone should have, not just members of AGS.

April O Neill · 20-02-2013 01:19AM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Jealous much? Because that's what it's coming across as.

Oh come on, seriously?

HondaSami · 20-02-2013 01:22AM

Electric Sheep wrote: »

Typing is a life skill that everyone should have, not just members of AGS.

Anyone that uses a computer types, just not as fast as a touch typist who has trained at it.

How many words a minute can you type?

Boombastic · 20-02-2013 01:24AM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Link please, because i've certainly never heard of this.
..........

You should know all about this offer. I should have said €30,000 for a 3 year break, but ye got up from the table of negotiations and are staging a blue flu. Do ye not talk about what's been offered?

As for the jealous comment. What's to be jealous of? If is so crap, why do you think I have any reason to be jealous?

HondaSami · 20-02-2013 01:27AM

Boombastic wrote: »

You should know all about this offer. I should have said €30,000 for a 3 year break, but ye got up from the table of negotiations and are staging a blue flu. Do ye not talk about what's been offered?

As for the jealous comment. What's to be jealous of? If is so crap, why do you think I have any reason to be jealous?

Was the career break offered to anyone yet or is this just a suggestion thrown about?
Work to rule is not blue flu.

123 LC · 20-02-2013 01:29AM

by my calculations he's getting around €875 a month after mortgage? i think it'd be pretty hard to pay for college fees/accommodation (they could live really far away from a college) for your child while feeding the rest of your family on this wage. and because of the gross wage of the father this teen was probably overlooked for any sort of a grant....the grant system should be means tested...(that's another rant)

Potential-Monke · 20-02-2013 02:59AM

Before i start, i just want to say that this is my opinion, and should not be taken as a standard view. Everything i say is my opinion, and not representative of any organisation, including AGS. I am potential-monke on here, someone who is not reflecting the organisation as a whole, just someone (hopefully to stay anon) who is giving their opinion, and nothing more.

kerry4sam wrote: »

I am curious about some issues you raise:

Can you tell me what full-timer members are doing about rectifying their lack of IT skills? Are they taking typing courses, like other members of the public do, so they are not wasting valuable time trying to 2-finger type when time is so precious on-the-job?

Those who don't want promotion probably aren't doing anything. Those with a few years service left probably aren't doing anything. Those who want promotion probably are taking courses. The more junior the member, the more likely they're already typing savvy, but not everyone, even in the private sector, is tech/typing savvy. It is unfortunate that IT still isn't been taught in primary schools, and it's necessity is still not a must in every job. That is changing, yes, but it's not there yet. AGS, as i stated, only started using a computerised crime system in 1999. The old adage of "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" comes to mind.

kerry4sam wrote: »

In these techie-times I think it shameful that members can barely type or not know their way around online forums; and online sources where even the youth of today spend their time. How can they understand what the youth of today are going through, if they are not able to follow and understand what is happening online?

You don't need to be tech savvy to understand what youths are going through, and from experience, the majority of the clientele we deal with are not going to the the medium to heavy IT users. As it stands, imo, regular crime and IT don't really go hand in hand. Granted, yes, white collar crime is IT heavy, but those who investigate that have qualifications, be it before or after joining, in order to investigate those matters. It should be obvious that someone with little to no IT skills will be investigating computer crime, or anything that revolves around IT.

kerry4sam wrote: »

What are full-time members doing to change these matters in their own time? People, outside of the guards, do undertake courses in their spare time to help them, do you are those people who you refer to here, are they doing the same or are just going to continue being in the dark about typing and their lack of online knowledge?

Thanks,

It's the same in AGS, those who want to go into those areas will do the courses. Those who don't have an interest won't, and subsequently won't be offered those positions as they don't have the qualifications required. Part of my dissertation involved me doing a survey of students and members in my station as to the basic IT skills of members. 60% of members could type, but very few were touch typists. That went up to 72% of students then currently in the college. Significantly less could use Outlook, in both categories.

Online crime and computer based crime is, thankfully, fairly low in Ireland at the moment, and the majority of crime is not IT based. This will change, and so will AGS (slowly). Understandably, AGS may be slow to include IT in a more prevalent way. Those with the know how and determination can crack systems easily. It is very sensitive information which can be very damaging in the wrong hands.

Again, this is all just my own opinion. I was lucky enough to have an interest in IT prior to secondary school, and most of what i have is self taught (i knew the majority of the ECDL before completing it in college). ECDL was not a requirement to join, but i believe it now is.

And again, just to clarify, typing is not necessary in the job.

Re: my comment about the jealousy, i only said it as it comes across, to me, as that. People give out about the benefits, allowances, pension, etc, and it just smacks of jealousy to me that those people can't find the same in the private sector. Just like it smacks of jealousy when people (including me) give out about the wages of politicians. Yes, that is a generalisation, but that's what it comes across as to me, and yes, i know i am probably wrong.

I'm just trying to give my opinion, and i'm far from trained in the political ways of responding. I'm just a regular guy, trying to get my side of the story. I will always make mistakes, and i will not always be able to get my points across the ways others do. I can't help that, but i'm trying my best. Ask me to quote law for the majority of the main types of crime, i'll do it near verbatim, but putting feelings and opinions into words that don't offend someone, or are politically correct (i'm using politically, because i can't think of the proper word for what i'm trying to say!) is harder for me.

Boombastic · 20-02-2013 03:06AM

Sure we'd all be on here complaining if they were offering all Gardai free IT courses.

wonderfullife · 20-02-2013 04:43AM

Life is about choices, i survive on a very basic diet but that's down to making the choice to keep my broadband and sky digital. That said, while i have no sympathy for anybody on 65k a year moaning about putting food on the table, i do believe that nurses, doctors and AGS deserve every penny they get. And probably more. They are a credit to their profession.

The whole public v private sector debate always descends into mud-slinging; all i do know is i've a tremendous admiration for the medical profession and AGS. No problem with either of their pay levels, just no need for the 65k a year merchants having a moan. Doesn't help their cause.

kerry4sam · 20-02-2013 02:12PM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Before i start, i just want to say that this is my opinion, and should not be taken as a standard view. Everything i say is my opinion, and not representative of any organisation, including AGS. I am potential-monke on here, someone who is not reflecting the organisation as a whole, just someone (hopefully to stay anon) who is giving their opinion, and nothing more.

Those who don't want promotion probably aren't doing anything. Those with a few years service left probably aren't doing anything. Those who want promotion probably are taking courses. The more junior the member, the more likely they're already typing savvy, but not everyone, even in the private sector, is tech/typing savvy. It is unfortunate that IT still isn't been taught in primary schools, and it's necessity is still not a must in every job. That is changing, yes, but it's not there yet. AGS, as i stated, only started using a computerised crime system in 1999. The old adage of "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" comes to mind.

You don't need to be tech savvy to understand what youths are going through, and from experience, the majority of the clientele we deal with are not going to the the medium to heavy IT users. As it stands, imo, regular crime and IT don't really go hand in hand. Granted, yes, white collar crime is IT heavy, but those who investigate that have qualifications, be it before or after joining, in order to investigate those matters. It should be obvious that someone with little to no IT skills will be investigating computer crime, or anything that revolves around IT.

It's the same in AGS, those who want to go into those areas will do the courses. Those who don't have an interest won't, and subsequently won't be offered those positions as they don't have the qualifications required. Part of my dissertation involved me doing a survey of students and members in my station as to the basic IT skills of members. 60% of members could type, but very few were touch typists. That went up to 72% of students then currently in the college. Significantly less could use Outlook, in both categories.

Online crime and computer based crime is, thankfully, fairly low in Ireland at the moment, and the majority of crime is not IT based. This will change, and so will AGS (slowly). Understandably, AGS may be slow to include IT in a more prevalent way. Those with the know how and determination can crack systems easily. It is very sensitive information which can be very damaging in the wrong hands.

Again, this is all just my own opinion. I was lucky enough to have an interest in IT prior to secondary school, and most of what i have is self taught (i knew the majority of the ECDL before completing it in college). ECDL was not a requirement to join, but i believe it now is.

And again, just to clarify, typing is not necessary in the job.

Re: my comment about the jealousy, i only said it as it comes across, to me, as that. People give out about the benefits, allowances, pension, etc, and it just smacks of jealousy to me that those people can't find the same in the private sector. Just like it smacks of jealousy when people (including me) give out about the wages of politicians. Yes, that is a generalisation, but that's what it comes across as to me, and yes, i know i am probably wrong.

I'm just trying to give my opinion, and i'm far from trained in the political ways of responding. I'm just a regular guy, trying to get my side of the story. I will always make mistakes, and i will not always be able to get my points across the ways others do. I can't help that, but i'm trying my best. Ask me to quote law for the majority of the main types of crime, i'll do it near verbatim, but putting feelings and opinions into words that don't offend someone, or are politically correct (i'm using politically, because i can't think of the proper word for what i'm trying to say!) is harder for me.

I think your post here is one fantastic valid reason for the existence of the Press and Public Relations department within An Garda Síochána.

HondaSami · 20-02-2013 02:18PM

kerry4sam wrote: »

I think your post here is one fantastic valid reason for the existence of the Press and Public Relations department within An Garda Síochána.

What do you mean by that?

jonsnow · 20-02-2013 06:27PM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Before i start, i just want to say that this is my opinion, and should not be taken as a standard view. Everything i say is my opinion, and not representative of any organisation, including AGS. I am potential-monke on here, someone who is not reflecting the organisation as a whole, just someone (hopefully to stay anon) who is giving their opinion, and nothing more.

Those who don't want promotion probably aren't doing anything. Those with a few years service left probably aren't doing anything. Those who want promotion probably are taking courses. The more junior the member, the more likely they're already typing savvy, but not everyone, even in the private sector, is tech/typing savvy. It is unfortunate that IT still isn't been taught in primary schools, and it's necessity is still not a must in every job. That is changing, yes, but it's not there yet. AGS, as i stated, only started using a computerised crime system in 1999. The old adage of "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" comes to mind.

You don't need to be tech savvy to understand what youths are going through, and from experience, the majority of the clientele we deal with are not going to the the medium to heavy IT users. As it stands, imo, regular crime and IT don't really go hand in hand. Granted, yes, white collar crime is IT heavy, but those who investigate that have qualifications, be it before or after joining, in order to investigate those matters. It should be obvious that someone with little to no IT skills will be investigating computer crime, or anything that revolves around IT.

It's the same in AGS, those who want to go into those areas will do the courses. Those who don't have an interest won't, and subsequently won't be offered those positions as they don't have the qualifications required. Part of my dissertation involved me doing a survey of students and members in my station as to the basic IT skills of members. 60% of members could type, but very few were touch typists. That went up to 72% of students then currently in the college. Significantly less could use Outlook, in both categories.

Online crime and computer based crime is, thankfully, fairly low in Ireland at the moment, and the majority of crime is not IT based. This will change, and so will AGS (slowly). Understandably, AGS may be slow to include IT in a more prevalent way. Those with the know how and determination can crack systems easily. It is very sensitive information which can be very damaging in the wrong hands.

Again, this is all just my own opinion. I was lucky enough to have an interest in IT prior to secondary school, and most of what i have is self taught (i knew the majority of the ECDL before completing it in college). ECDL was not a requirement to join, but i believe it now is.

And again, just to clarify, typing is not necessary in the job.

Re: my comment about the jealousy, i only said it as it comes across, to me, as that. People give out about the benefits, allowances, pension, etc, and it just smacks of jealousy to me that those people can't find the same in the private sector. Just like it smacks of jealousy when people (including me) give out about the wages of politicians. Yes, that is a generalisation, but that's what it comes across as to me, and yes, i know i am probably wrong.

I'm just trying to give my opinion, and i'm far from trained in the political ways of responding. I'm just a regular guy, trying to get my side of the story. I will always make mistakes, and i will not always be able to get my points across the ways others do. I can't help that, but i'm trying my best. Ask me to quote law for the majority of the main types of crime, i'll do it near verbatim, but putting feelings and opinions into words that don't offend someone, or are politically correct (i'm using politically, because i can't think of the proper word for what i'm trying to say!) is harder for me.

Potential-Monke obviously I don't agree with a lot of what you say but I think that you have been incredibly honest and open in all of your posts.I think that you are not afraid to admit to certain weaknesses in An GS such as an inherent conservatism and a lack of forward looking IT skillsets (which is certainly true as I know a guy who was in charge of implementing an IT project for the Gardai and he said that dealing with the Gardai had been the worst project in a 40 year career and that they basically had refused to move from their traditional pen and paper approach).I think such openness is to be welcomed and I think you have done more to get your viewpoint across than all the PR I,ve ever seen spew out of the GRA or the Garda Press Office.

Boombastic · 20-02-2013 06:31PM

jonsnow wrote: »

Potential-Monke obviously I don't agree with a lot of what you say but I think that you have been incredibly honest and open in all of your posts.I think that you are not afraid to admit to certain weaknesses in An GS such as an inherent conservatism and a lack of forward looking IT skillsets (which is certainly true as I know a guy who was in charge of implementing an IT project for the Gardai and he said that dealing with the Gardai had been the worst project in a 40 year career and that they basically had refused to move from their traditional pen and paper approach).I think such openness is to be welcomed and I think you have done more to get your viewpoint across than all the PR I,ve ever seen spew out of the GRA or the Garda Press Office.

I actually found PM's post quite refreshing. No point in putting a PR spin on everything and it is good that problems are identified and acknowledged by those in the force. The media have not being doing the Gardai any favours by spinning these stories about people not being able to live on €65,000 while spending €24,000 on school fees.

DublinWriter · 20-02-2013 09:19PM

I would seriously ask all the haters in here still living with mammy to please STFU and do the maths on this one.

I consider it just borderline to bringing up a family in Ireland with a total gross household income of 65K.

Firstly, because married couples can't be jointly assessed anymore, the net monthly income on 65K would be about €3,200.

Factor in the mortgage payment (€1,400 would be slightly above average for most) then that leaves roughly €1,800 a month spending money.

Off the top of my head that would have to cover:

- ESB
- Gas
- Annual school fees (yes, public schools do tap parents for up to €400 a year)
- School books
- School uniforms
- School trips
- Clothes
- Food
- Car Repayments
- Car Insurance
- Car Tax
- Health Insurance
- GP bills
- Dentist Bills
- Household waste charges
- Household maintenance charges (plumming, electric)
- Birthday presents
- Christmas presents

...and we're not even in the land of property tax and water rates yet.

Really really really do work this out before opening your gobs.

Boombastic · 20-02-2013 09:21PM

DublinWriter wrote: »

.........................
- Annual school fees (yes, public schools do tap parents for up to €400 a year)
.........................

And private schools cost €24,000
You do the maths

Kat1170 · 20-02-2013 09:34PM

DublinWriter wrote: »

I would seriously ask all the haters in here still living with mammy to please STFU and do the maths on this one.

I reckon you just excluded 91.73% of AH

noodler · 20-02-2013 10:29PM

DublinWriter wrote: »

I would seriously ask all the haters in here still living with mammy to please STFU and do the maths on this one.

I consider it just borderline to bringing up a family in Ireland with a total gross household income of 65K.

Firstly, because married couples can't be jointly assessed anymore, the net monthly income on 65K would be about €3,200.

Factor in the mortgage payment (€1,400 would be slightly above average for most) then that leaves roughly €1,800 a month spending money.

Off the top of my head that would have to cover:

- ESB
- Gas
- Annual school fees (yes, public schools do tap parents for up to €400 a year)
- School books
- School uniforms
- School trips
- Clothes
- Food
- Car Repayments
- Car Insurance
- Car Tax
- Health Insurance
- GP bills
- Dentist Bills
- Household waste charges
- Household maintenance charges (plumming, electric)
- Birthday presents
- Christmas presents

...and we're not even in the land of property tax and water rates yet.

Really really really do work this out before opening your gobs.

What a load of absolute tripe.

I am sorry, are Gardai the only people who have to pay bills?

There is no need for you to list your household budget like it was the ten commandments thank you very much - quite familar with them.

Boombastic · 20-02-2013 10:33PM

noodler wrote: »

What a load of absolute tripe.

I am sorry, are Gardai the only people who have to pay bills?

There is no need for you to list your household budget like it was the ten commandments thank you very much - quite familar with them.

Yep, every one else is a hater who lives with their mammy:pac:

I'm beignning to realise why detection rates are so low

Potential-Monke · 21-02-2013 02:45AM

I appreciate the comments, and i do honestly believe that we do need some very well versed PR to speak for us. One that is not afraid to tell it how it is, but at the same time keeping stories like the original one in this under the radar. It is hard to tell it how it is in AGS, again quoting myself with the Garda Code and Official Secrets Act being the biggest obstacles we have to overcome when trying to tell our side. One wrong comment could result in an increase in crime in a certain area, reprimand for the member, loss of employment for the member, criminal/civil convictions for the member, or worse yet, decreased public appreciation.

I type my posts, and nearly have to proof read them 2 or 3 times before hitting the post button. AGS have smart techies with them, and can trace someone online to their true identity fairly quickly, when it warrants it. If i end up victim to this, well, AH will be the first to know!

But, back to point, i really do think we need a good PR person, one that not only tells it how it is within the confines of the Code and Act, but one who also puts the positive stories into the main media without over saturating it with pointless positive stories. Stories like the Garda saving the 3 month olds' life will invariably make it into mainstream media anyway, but you rarely hear of the other great things members do - it just doesn't make good media. It'll be a very fine line to thread, and i don't envy who gets the job if the decision is made to get a PR rep.

And i know that my available cash is partly (if not mostly) my fault. If i could go back in time, i would have got less loans and no mortgage, but hindsight is great. Alas, i am where i am, and i will fight for no more cuts, when there are numerous other obvious avenues within AGS to make savings. There are allowances which i believe should be cut, or that are unnecessary, wages of the higher ranks could be reduced to something more in line with the type of work they do (basically, management of numbers is what it boils down to imo), court could be sorted so as not to incur overtime, legal aid should be reduced to 1 payment regardless of number of appearances (savings of millions on it's own, and a highly abused system), less paper and more electronic correspondence, better bargaining on recurring costs (ie: paper, prisoner meals, servicing, outsourced maintenance), bloody energy saving bulbs!!!

If all them, and potentially other actions, were taken and didn't make the savings needed, maybe then i would concede that cuts are necessary, but there is millions in savings in the above few ideas alone. I'm not looking for a raise, i'm just looking for what i currently have.

snubbleste · 09-02-2014 06:37PM

Another sympathetic Garda piece in the Indo missing some details
Note the difference between 'home' and 'house'
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/i-had-hundreds-of-sleepless-nights-29992744.html

John, a detective, who is in his 30s,and his partner, also a public sector worker, bought a house 10 years ago in a Dublin suburb for €250k. In a decision they now regret, they bought their dream house in the West before John's transfer application had been submitted, believing it to be a "bargain". They borrowed €360k and rented out the house while John considered a transfer.
"It was never meant to be an investment house. It was the family home that we planned to move to," John told the Sunday Independent. "We had no trouble getting finance," he said. "We borrowed from two Garda credit unions for the deposit on the (second) house."
The West of Ireland property is being sold for €135k. The EBS will pocket the proceeds but John and his partner will still have to shoulder the €200k lump of negative equity debt...

BeerWolf · 09-02-2014 06:51PM

Melion wrote: »

65k a year and can't survive, kindly **** off.

Was just thinking this when I saw the income, and lo and behold you were the very first response! :pac:

Garda Sergeant can't afford food

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