Roscommon GAA Discussion Thread

rossie1977 · 17-10-2012 02:01AM

padd b1975 wrote: »

To sum up, I fail to see exactly where this talent is.
In the 2012 Minor Championship Mayo came within a disgraceful refereeing decision of reaching the final, it leads me to think that the better quality talent is in Mayo, Galway are never too far away at underage.

is this a serious post or a windup

1.roscommon have won the last 2 connacht minor titles (beating mayo and galway both times during those wins) plus the last two connacht minor league titles, for those keeping score roscommons record at minor level last two years in the province is 16 matches, 15 wins 1 draw, last year they blew away mayo and galway at minor level http://www.advertiser.ie/mayo/article/41206/roscommon-see-off-minor-challenge http://www.advertiser.ie/galway/article/41940/roscommon-roll-over-galway-

2. roscommon have won 2 of the last 3 connacht titles at under 21 level, add to this roscommon have beaten mayo at under 21 level the last 3 years

the problem at roscommon is clearly management, the talent is there at underage level

padd b1975 · 17-10-2012 02:02AM

blowitupref wrote: »

Over the last 6-7 years Roscommon have been been successful,consistent at underage level and it can breed success to senior of course no guarrantee however you must be joking if you can't see the talent coming through.

Lets adapt a "wait and see" approach as to the quality of this talent:)

Always_Running · 17-10-2012 02:17AM

Beaten Division 1 League Finalists, woeful championship performances.

Well beaten by Sligo in 2010 by your logic Mayo would be behind them back then?

I disagree, I believe Division 2 to be closer to Division 1, but thats just my opinion.

Closer to Div 1? Armagh,Derry,Galway,Laois,Longford,Louth,Westmeath,Wexford any of those team would stuggle in Div 1 the two best Armagh,Galway found that out.

It is in Mayo.

If Roscommon have a good year in 2013 and get to a semi final or final, will you settle for that or will you be roaring them on to the next levell??

It is Mayo as the above poster said the burden of expectations is too much to carry. Most other teams will look back on a good year.

The current positions of both teams would suggest that its not.

I think it's safe to say not many of those Roscommon underage players from the 2011-12 teams have lined out for seniors yet.

Syferus · 17-10-2012 02:32AM

Ranking Connacht after Mayo is a mess, everyone has given someone a black eye.

One thing I'd point out is that D2 contains Derry, Galway, Armagh, Longford, Westmeath, Laois, Wexford and Louth while D3 features Roscommon, Monaghan, Meath, Sligo, Antrim, Fermanagh, Wicklow and Cavan.

Besides perhaps Cavan (who themselves have a fantastic underage structure that has the potential to feed into much better fortunes at senior in the years to come) and Fermanagh (who are also obviously a team making strides) almost all of the above teams would fancy their chances of beating any of the others. There really isn't a big gap between those sixteen teams and it's fair to say it's next to impossible to be sure who is going to be promoted or relegated in either.

The idea the D3 teams would look at D2 as anything less than an opportunity is foolish.

rossie1977 · 17-10-2012 02:36AM

padd b1975 wrote: »

Lets adapt a "wait and see" approach as to the quality of this talent:)

mark mchugh wasn't picked for nuigs sigerson team which tells you all you need to know about how clueless some managers are, if maughan was manager of donegal they would still be losing first round matches in ulster....

if in a few years the likes of tom corcaran, paddy brogan, donie and enda smith, diarmuid and ciaran murtagh, colin and cathal compton, niall, conor and ronan daly, ronan stack, cian connolly and diarmuid mcgann are not making some sort of waves in connacht there is something seriously wrong, if these players are beating mayo and galway comfortably at under 14, 16, 18 levels and destroying leitrim and sligo at the same levels and not progressing through to senior then clearly somebody is to blame

Syferus · 17-10-2012 02:41AM

Ya forgot Cathal Shine, Niall Kilroy, David Murray, Kevin Finn, John McManus and Conor Hussey

padd b1975 · 17-10-2012 09:43AM

Always_Running wrote: »

Well beaten by Sligo in 2010 by your logic Mayo would be behind them back
then?

After the league semi final, Mayo were shocking.

Closer to Div 1? Armagh,Derry,Galway,Laois,Longford,Louth,Westmeath,Wexford any
of those team would stuggle in Div 1 the two best Armagh,Galway found that out.

I would expect the likes of Armagh,Galway,Derry,Laois and Wexford to cruise through the current Division 3.

It is Mayo as the above poster said the burden of expectations is too much
to carry. Most other teams will look back on a good year.

Most other teams do not have Mayo's record of getting to finals at all age levels but not winning, but I accept the point you make.

I think it's safe to say not many of those Roscommon underage players from the
2011-12 teams have lined out for seniors yet.

And what about the players form the other 7 years of talent?
We are still talking about the 8 years of talent?

padd b1975 · 17-10-2012 09:51AM

rossie1977 wrote: »

if maughan was manager of donegal they would still be losing first round matches in ulster....

If Maughan was manager of Roscommon they would still be losing first round matches.....wait a sec....

Galway 3-15
Roscommon 0-10;)

rossie1977 · 17-10-2012 01:49PM

padd b1975 wrote: »

And what about the players form the other 7 years of talent?
We are still talking about the 8 years of talent?

4 of our top players from the 2008-09 minor sides are now pro rugby players, a team like roscommon with a small pick to begin with cannot afford that kind of loss, most of the minor lads from 2006-07 didn't want to play for the last manager

If Maughan was manager of Roscommon they would still be losing first round matches.....wait a sec....

Galway 3-15
Roscommon 0-10

newton was totally incompetent, i likened him to steve staunton as ireland manager a few times in this thread already, the manager is the most important part of the team imo, harping back to donegal but they hadn't won a single match in ulster for 4 years before mcguinness came in and in two years he has turned them around completely, in 2009 antrim beat donegal up in ulster, the backbone of the side beaten that day started the all ireland this year

i don't expect roscommon to be winning all-irelands but they sure as hell should be competitive in connacht over the next 5-7 years given the talent coming through, if the same roscommon minors who are destroying the likes of leitrim in 2009 and again in 2012 or easily beating sligo at under 21 level are then in 4-5 years losing to leitrim and sligo at senior level, something is seriously wrong

padd b1975 · 17-10-2012 02:24PM

rossie1977 wrote: »

4 of our top players from the 2008-09 minor sides are now pro rugby players, a team like roscommon with a small pick to begin with cannot afford that kind of loss, most of the minor lads from 2006-07 didn't want to play for the last manager

newton was totally incompetent, i likened him to steve staunton as ireland manager a few times in this thread already, the manager is the most important part of the team imo, harping back to donegal but they hadn't won a single match in ulster for 4 years before mcguinness came in and in two years he has turned them around completely, in 2009 antrim beat donegal up in ulster, the backbone of the side beaten that day started the all ireland this year

i don't expect roscommon to be winning all-irelands but they sure as hell should be competitive in connacht over the next 5-7 years given the talent coming through, if the same roscommon minors who are destroying the likes of leitrim in 2009 and again in 2012 or easily beating sligo at under 21 level are then in 4-5 years losing to leitrim and sligo at senior level, something is seriously wrong

Good post, but realistically sucess in the weakest province does not really count for much. Mayo have 44 titles yielding a return of 3 All Irelands, to put that into perspective Donegal have 2 All Irelands form 7 Ulster titles, Tyrone 3 from 13 plus another that got away in '86 and the best by far is Down with 5 from 12.

Are you any nearer to appointing a manager?

Always_Running · 17-10-2012 04:38PM

After the league semi final, Mayo were shocking.

You still didn't answer my question.

I would expect the likes of Armagh,Galway,Derry,Laois and Wexford to cruise through the current Division 3.

I don't know.. Wexford have been down there for a few years and just got promoted, Galway were beaten by Antrim,Sligo this year, Armagh were beaten by Roscommon,Derry are not the team they once were and Laois struggled to beat Leitrim and lost to Longford.

Most other teams do not have Mayo's record of getting to finals at all age levels but not winning, but I accept the point you make.

The not winning bit is bringing Mayo down and no doubt they would love the records of Kerry,Tyrone who have been to as many finals the last few decades.

And what about the players form the other 7 years of talent?
We are still talking about the 8 years of talent?

You said you didn't see the talent coming through? guys in their mid 20s wouldn't be talent coming through however the minors and possibly some of this year U21s would be.

________

QUOTE=padd b1975;81291994]

Are you any nearer to appointing a manager?[/QUOTE]

Two Mayo men Pat Holmes, Noel Connelly have been linked with the job they must see that talent more than you

padd b1975 · 17-10-2012 06:02PM

Always_Running wrote: »

Two Mayo men Pat Holmes, Noel Connelly have been linked with the job they must see that talent more than you

I think its more the Roscommon county board seeing that there is no one of management material within the county;);)

rossie1977 · 17-10-2012 09:56PM

speaking of bringing through underage talent, in 2007 roscommon beat mayo in the minor semi by 1-11 to 1-05 (they lead 1-8 to 0-3 at one stage), in the mayo team that day kevin keane, kevin mcloughlin, jason doherty, alan freeman and aidan o'shea

padd b1975 · 17-10-2012 10:45PM

rossie1977 wrote: »

speaking of bringing through underage talent, in 2007 roscommon beat mayo in the minor semi by 1-11 to 1-05 (they lead 1-8 to 0-3 at one stage), in the mayo team that day kevin keane, kevin mcloughlin, jason doherty, alan freeman and aidan o'shea

Form is temporary, class is permanent:)

seabee · 22-10-2012 01:14PM

You'll be glad to hear that a former roscommon under-age manager has been approached by a candidate for the Senior job (the ulster publican) to be part of his "ticket" with the aim of helping ease the transition/development of the next generation of players.

Jayob10 · 22-10-2012 01:58PM

seabee wrote: »

You'll be glad to hear that a former roscommon under-age manager has been approached by a candidate for the Senior job (the ulster publican) to be part of his "ticket" with the aim of helping ease the transition/development of the next generation of players.

who is the ulster publican? and who is the former underage manager?

Syferus · 22-10-2012 02:28PM

It's a steadfast rule that people only talk in half riddles when speaking of Roscommon managerial appointments.

On face he's talking about the Banty rumour but in the last day alone Jason Ryan and Niall Moyna's names have also came up from 'sources'.

Don't believe anything until the manager is announced.

Comic Book Guy · 08-11-2012 12:39AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

MVdUmX_2uIY

First time i tried to post a youtube video so hope it works!

Funny take on our attempts to fill the senior team manager post

:pac:

Balls that was an epic fail!!

Someone else mite link it but type in roscommon manager job into youtube search and check out hitler scene from the film Downfall

westsidestory · 08-11-2012 12:54AM

Comic Book Guy wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=
MVdUmX_2uIY

First time i tried to post a youtube video so hope it works!

Funny take on our attempts to fill the senior team manager post

:pac:

Balls that was an epic fail!!

Someone else mite link it but type in roscommon manager job into youtube search and check out hitler scene from the film Downfall

T'will be a lucky lady that will take away your virginity

yabadabado · 08-11-2012 01:38AM

County board meeting tomorrow night ,senior manager is supposed to be named then.
John Evans is the latest rumour.

Syferus · 08-11-2012 01:46AM

yabadabado wrote: »

County board meeting tomorrow night ,senior manager is supposed to be named then.
John Evans is the latest rumour.

The lad we helped put out of a job in February in Kiltoom. We're kind souls.

Banty's been doing the rumour rounds more heavily today but there seems to be a sinking feeling it's looking likely we'll end up with a 'name' manager, and I'm not talking about from the Gilroy, Jacko school of name managers.

Don't know what to think of Evans. Before it all went pear-shaped in the last 12 months in Tipp he had done a very lauded job at all tiers in Tipp football, particularly underage. Certainly his CV suits what we need better than Banty's does.

Fr Tod Umptious · 08-11-2012 03:27PM

Syferus wrote: »

The lad we helped put out of a job in February in Kiltoom. We're kind souls.

Banty's been doing the rumour rounds more heavily today but there seems to be a sinking feeling it's looking likely we'll end up with a 'name' manager, and I'm not talking about from the Gilroy, Jacko school of name managers.

Don't know what to think of Evans. Before it all went pear-shaped in the last 12 months in Tipp he had done a very lauded job at all tiers in Tipp football, particularly underage. Certainly his CV suits what we need better than Banty's does.

Well it looks like Evans will be the man

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/football/2012/1108/344776-evans-on-verge-of-roscommon-role/

I recall a discussion here a few months ago about now Evans was not all he was cracked up to be in Tipp, and that the credit for under-age development should not be going to him.

Maybe someone can enlighten us.

keane2097 · 08-11-2012 03:29PM

Premierstone doesn't rate Evans' stint in Tipp as the success it was heralded as for sure. He also wouldn't be held in very high esteem in Kerry as a manager.

I do know that some senior members of the Meath panel were very impressed with him as a coach when he came in during last year though, fwiw.

Strongbow10 · 08-11-2012 03:32PM

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Well it looks like Evans will be the man

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/football/2012/1108/344776-evans-on-verge-of-roscommon-role/

I recall a discussion here a few months ago about now Evans was not all he was cracked up to be in Tipp, and that the credit for under-age development should not be going to him.

Maybe someone can enlighten us.

He was unable to successfully integrate the decent younger players into the senior set up in Tipp what makes the county board think he is going to be able to do it in Ros?

He also took a hell of alot of credit for developing younger players in tipp but to say he was the main man there is certainly not the case. Mind you, to say he had no impact would also do him a disservice.

Overall, its an underwhelming appointment but its to be expected on the budget available.

2 other negative factors for me are his age profile and his location.

Sad to see Noel O'Brien (former Brigids manager who got them to All Ireland Final) didn't get a look in, if there was anyone in the county qualified to do it, he was the man.

Always_Running · 08-11-2012 07:54PM

keane2097 wrote: »

Premierstone doesn't rate Evans' stint in Tipp as the success it was heralded as for sure. He also wouldn't be held in very high esteem in Kerry as a manager.

I do know that some senior members of the Meath panel were very impressed with him as a coach when he came in during last year though, fwiw.

He the last Kerry manager to win the senior club All Ireland and was Tipp U21 manager that beat Kerry in 2010 Munster final so Kerry fans would have respected that however all went pear shaped for him this year though and i can't imagine he was high on anyone's list.

Why Roscommon chose outsider manager when they have many capable guys insides the county remains a mystery.

yabadabado · 08-11-2012 07:58PM

Always_Running wrote: »

He the last Kerry manager to win the senior club All Ireland and was Tipp U21 manager that beat Kerry in 2010 Munster final so Kerry fans would have respected that however all went pear shaped for him this year though and i can't imagine he was high on anyone's list.

Why Roscommon chose outsider manager when they have many capable guys insides the county remains a mystery.

Who would you have choose from within the county?

Strongbow10 · 08-11-2012 07:59PM

yabadabado wrote: »

Who would you have choose from within the county?

Noel O'Brien

Syferus · 08-11-2012 08:23PM

Strongbow10 wrote: »

Noel O'Brien

I'd prefer the upside of Mark Dowd over O'Brien, especially as we're talking about someone growing a young panel long term.

Anyways, Evans isn't a bad choice and does have the right background to do good work here. Anyone who doesn't recognise he did a huge amount of work in Tipp football is blinkered, but the degree to which it went pear-shaped this year in Tipp does raise questions. He clearly played a huge role in steadying the ship in Meath so it's not like there's much question that he's good at what he does. Hopefully he drove a hard bargain with the The Muppet Show and the senior set-up isn't woefully under-supported again next year.

His age is no issue, in fact him being retired means he can really focus on the job and that's a boon given how much work needs to be done.

Jayob10 · 08-11-2012 08:51PM

Syferus wrote: »

I'd prefer the upside of Mark Dowd over O'Brien, especially as we're talking about someone growing a young panel long term.

Anyways, Evans isn't a bad choice and does have the right background to do good work here. Anyone who doesn't recognise he did a huge amount of work in Tipp football is blinkered, but the degree to which it went pear-shaped this year in Tipp does raise questions. He clearly played a huge role in steadying the ship in Meath so it's not like there's much question that he's good at what he does. Hopefully he drove a hard bargain with the The Muppet Show and the senior set-up isn't woefully under-supported again next year.

His age is no issue, in fact him being retired means he can really focus on the job and that's a boon given how much work needs to be done.

Mark Dowd is a good shout, id personally been happy with either O'Dowd or O'Brien.

Both have good football brains and I suspect they would like to do their own thing without pandering to the County Boards demands. Maybe therein lies the reason they didn't get the job.

O'Brien has managed Roscommon minors before I believe and had success in Longford Senior football. Also think he doesn't get as much credit as deserves for harnessing the talent Brigids had into 2 run's at the All Ireland.

If anything he managed to piece together a team consisting of numerous winning County u-21 players. Players from different age groups aswell that had been threading water until he arrived, by threading water I mean playing senior but not to the level they did under him. Brigids is a notoriously hard club to manage but part of the reason he took them on was because he insisted on doing things his own way, being more professional in preparation etc...

O'Dowd is another coach that would be an asset, and hopefully he will be in the future. I'm not sure he would have upped sticks until Ballaghaderreen exit the championship.

Syferus · 08-11-2012 10:00PM

Jayob10 wrote: »

Mark Dowd is a good shout, id personally been happy with either O'Dowd or O'Brien.

Both have good football brains and I suspect they would like to do their own thing without pandering to the County Boards demands. Maybe therein lies the reason they didn't get the job.

O'Brien has managed Roscommon minors before I believe and had success in Longford Senior football. Also think he doesn't get as much credit as deserves for harnessing the talent Brigids had into 2 run's at the All Ireland.

If anything he managed to piece together a team consisting of numerous winning County u-21 players. Players from different age groups aswell that had been threading water until he arrived, by threading water I mean playing senior but not to the level they did under him. Brigids is a notoriously hard club to manage but part of the reason he took them on was because he insisted on doing things his own way, being more professional in preparation etc...

O'Dowd is another coach that would be an asset, and hopefully he will be in the future. I'm not sure he would have upped sticks until Ballaghaderreen exit the championship.

I've a sinking feeling the board didn't even consider him. Evans is a good manager but it does look as if the board was forced into desperation mode given how long this circus dragged on for and they wanted someone with name cache so they portray the process as anything but the disaster it was. There better be an frank and open review of this 'selection process' and people properly reprimanded because the old boys network stuff got old a long time ago.

Anyways, I bet if Mark had been offered the post he would have found it hard to turn down and he could have done an Anthony Cunningham and stayed club manager until the season was over.

Himself or O'Brien would still be very good choices for selectors if Evans is looking for some county men to enlist.

Roscommon GAA Discussion Thread

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