Garda Sergeant can't afford food

Emeraldy Pebbles · 21-10-2012 01:11PM

Can anyone tell me how much the mortgage would be if the interest-only payment is E1400 per month?

I've not a notion how to work that out.

Emeraldy Pebbles · 21-10-2012 01:16PM

MugMugs wrote: »

II wouldn't blame any public servant into believing that they're wages wouldn't be cut.

But isn't he a new sergeant? So, even with cuts, wouldn't his pay still be higher now than when he bought? How did he work out it was affordable then?

Madam_X · 21-10-2012 01:38PM

MagicSean wrote: »

Well in fairness, it is an article from March 2009. Japer/Gigino/Jimmy has been posting it for many years and ignoring any criticism of it.

Don't forget Ourladyofknock. The anti public sector weirdos are hilarious!

The Indo is laughable too. Recently they published a "scandal" about schools getting retired teachers to do subbing work instead of all those newly qualified teachers (they'll feign concern for wannabe teachers when it suits

) neglecting the fact of course that these are rural schools where there are no trained teachers around to contact at the last minute, apart from local retired ones.

MugMugs · 21-10-2012 01:44PM

Emeraldy Pebbles wrote: »

But isn't he a new sergeant? So, even with cuts, wouldn't his pay still be higher now than when he bought? How did he work out it was affordable then?

One can only assume that incremental increases and indeed, the promotional increase have been far offset by the cut to allowances and increases of obligatory pension payments.

You will note that whilst the Garda pension is generous, it's also obligatory.... they have no choice bt to sign up to it and contribute.

Emeraldy Pebbles · 21-10-2012 02:29PM

MugMugs wrote: »

the promotional increase have been far offset by the cut to allowances and increases of obligatory pension payments.

Offset, yes, but I seriously doubt they'd equate to less pay than when the house was bought. The same, at the very least. So again I ask, how did they decide they could afford it then? I suppose there's the possibility that she was also working when the house was bought.

Japer · 21-10-2012 02:32PM

Emeraldy Pebbles wrote: »

So again I ask, how did they decide they could afford it then? I suppose there's the possibility that she was also working when the house was bought.

they were also probably taking in to account the rent they were receiving from their investment property;)

MugMugs · 21-10-2012 02:39PM

Emeraldy Pebbles wrote: »

Offset, yes, but I seriously doubt they'd equate to less pay than when the house was bought. The same, at the very least. So again I ask, how did they decide they could afford it then? I suppose there's the possibility that she was also working when the house was bought.

You're aware that you're asking me the specifics of an individual I know no better than you and their finances. I can't answer your questions. I can merely comment on what the article has said. I've no reason to believe that the lady in question is in any way lying. Do you??

Emeraldy Pebbles · 21-10-2012 03:03PM

MugMugs wrote: »

You're aware that you're asking me the specifics of an individual I know no better than you and their finances. I can't answer your questions. I can merely comment on what the article has said. I've no reason to believe that the lady in question is in any way lying. Do you??

Actually, I was asking the thread in general when I first asked. And you replied. I know you don't have answers. People are just questioning their story.

Madam_X · 21-10-2012 03:11PM

blahfckingblah wrote: »

the bit about the guard was an aside as i never weighed in with my opinion. I dont hate public sector workers either by the way, i just dont understand why you would use the ****e pay as an example , I worked in the private sector for minimum wage and i didn't mind it. For me its not about the wages its about having enough to do you. And this guard had enough to do but he was unwise and now hes complaining in the aftermath of his idiocy

I used pay because of the claims public sector workers are overpaid. Most of them really aren't. I know they're not on the breadline but that doesn't mean they're "overpaid".

Japer · 21-10-2012 03:25PM

Madam_X wrote: »

I used pay because of the claims public sector workers are overpaid. Most of them really aren't.

So what do you think average public sector pay should be? According to the governments own c.s.o., its 49k a year.
Bear in mind (a) the country is bust and (b) in the countries bailing us out, its less (eg, in the UK its stg £ 21.5k a year ).

tayto lover · 21-10-2012 04:01PM

Japer wrote: »

I have a cousin who works in a multinational I.T. company in the pharmaceutical sector, and they certainly do not get flexi-time. Nor is she paid anything like as much as the Gardai, and she will not have a golden pension pot at all, not like the Garda with his 1.1 million at the age of 49 / 50.

Why people are not out on the streets protesting at the pay pensions and perks of the public servants is beyond me.

I have 7 cousins who work in jobs like that and get loads of perks and twice what that poor Garda earns. Great money altogether.They take loads of foreign holidays and play golf all over the world. I think their pension pots are around 4 million each.

Boombastic · 21-10-2012 04:58PM

golden lane wrote: »

is the dog in negative equity......

no he bought what he could afford, but it seems he had to take in the two lodgers so he wouldn't have to eat cornflakes for dinner, they pay for their lodgings with coffee and snack boxes

21-10-2012 05:49PM

Madam_X wrote: »

Izzy, flexi-time is offered by several private companies, particularly pharmaceuticals and I.T.

I don't deny the perks of the public sector/semi states by the way - it's just the dumb ****ing lies I'm sick of reading.

Yes, everyone in the ESB gets 70 grand, even the cleaning lady... :rolleyes:

I didn't say it wasn't. It's just the sense of entitlement that many public sector workers seem to have, that it's their God given right to have flexi time and days off whenever they want, regardless of the needs of management and the state of the economy.

fits · 21-10-2012 06:12PM

Theo Shapely Thanksgiving wrote: »

I didn't say it wasn't. It's just the sense of entitlement that many public sector workers seem to have, that it's their God given right to have flexi time and days off whenever they want, regardless of the needs of management and the state of the economy.

Maybe you could do with better conditions rather than disimproving theirs no?

I dont think theres anything wrong with flexitime at all as long as people are getting their work done.

That said, when I was in the public sector, we didnt have flexitime in our organisation.

21-10-2012 06:15PM

fits wrote: »

Maybe you could do with better conditions rather than disimproving theirs no?

I dont think theres anything wrong with flexitime at all as long as people are getting their work done.

That said, when I was in the public sector, we didnt have flexitime in our organisation.

Sometimes it's not practical. They're discontinuing it at my mam's place because they really need people in every weekday, not taking Mondays or Fridays off because they've worked up extra leave. My mam's colleagues don't seem to get that work isn't just there to suit them, if you see what I mean.

Potential-Monke · 21-10-2012 06:16PM

Right, i just want to add something here.

The regular Gardai work 6 days x 10 hour shifts, followed by 4 days (3 1/2 really) off. There is no choice in that, it's a 10 week recurring roster and for the majority of frontline Gardai this cannot be changed (unless management want to change it).

If a Garda was to stay a Garda his pension pot would not be €1.1m. It would be around the €750k mark.

They are entitled to 34 days leave a year (more than likely going down to 29 with the new hours). This is the average annual leave quota (21) plus leave for each of the bank holidays in the year as they have no choice but to work them if they are rostered to work them. This is why it is more than the regular, normal private sector worker who probably have those days off.

With numbers cut, it may not be possible for every Garda to avail of those days off as only a certain number can be on leave at any one time.

The job is well paid due to the risks involved (Gardai do not get "danger pay"), and the majority of allowances were given instead of pay increases back when everyone in a job was getting a pay increase.

As a defense force, like the army, the stations used to have places for the members to live in station. With the increase in numbers, rent allowance was given as there was no place for them to stay.

The people who are giving out about the wages that Gardai, Nurses, Teachers etc are on are the same people who could have joined back in the day into secure,well paid jobs, but didn't want to. And now, just because some people who did want to join that profession are on good/better wages with a better pension outcome they are bitter towards them.

There are many reasons why Gardai get paid what they do, not everyone will charge first into a domestic situation, not everyone can deal with a rape victim, not everyone can tell a family that a loved one has died/been killed, not everyone can attend the scene of a horrific traffic accident and pick up the parts. But Gardai are expected to be able to do all this. No training can prepare you for telling a mother that her 16 year old son has been killed in a traffic accident or a vicious assault. And the Government feel that the wages reflect the work. I know not every Garda is fantastic at their job, but show me any industry where everyone is fantastic at their job.

I think Gardai, and most other frontline/low rank public sector employees, are paid in line with their jobs. But i will agree that the higher up members of An Garda Siochana and other Public Service positions are way overpaid, especially politicians.

I've no problem with people attacking the higher paid public sector employees, but i think it's time to remove the frontline/low rank members from the hatred.

bnt · 21-10-2012 06:28PM

Emeraldy Pebbles wrote: »

Can anyone tell me how much the mortgage would be if the interest-only payment is E1400 per month?

I've not a notion how to work that out.

It depends on the interest rate:

at 3%, about €570,000
at 4%, about €428,000
at 5%, about €345,000

AIB is quoting 3.74% for an owner-occupier mortgage of over 80% house value, which translates to a mortgage of about €460,000, interest only.

(A "full" payment on the same mortgage would be €2,347 over 25 years or €2,111 over 30 years. These figure are all calculated using Excel functions, actual figures from the bank would be slightly higher once you factor in their fees etc.)

Japer · 21-10-2012 07:40PM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

If a Garda was to stay a Garda his pension pot would not be €1.1m. It would be around the €750k mark.

Do you mean if no Garda ever became sargents, superintendants etc and retired with their higher pensions? A bit like saying if a boy was to stay a boy his wages would never be 65k or 95k a year.

Do not know where you get your 750k figure from. Different actuaries have calculated the Garda pension to be woth 1.1 million I think. Even if was "only" 750,000, do you know many people inj the private sector who can or do retire after only 30 years work with this size pension pot?
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/garda-pension-worth-11m-1664588.html

tayto lover · 21-10-2012 07:48PM

Japer wrote: »

Do you mean if no Garda ever became sargents, superintendants etc and retired with their higher pensions? A bit like saying if a boy was to stay a boy his wages would never be 65k or 95k a year.

Do not know where you get your 750k figure from. Different actuaries have calculated the Garda pension to be woth 1.1 million I think. Even if was "only" 750,000, do you know many people inj the private sector who can or do retire after only 30 years work with this size pension pot?
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/garda-pension-worth-11m-1664588.html

Were the facts that they retire after 30 years hidden from anyone?
I think anyone looking at jobs in the Public Sector would know the retirement age and if a garda retires after 30 years then it was known when he started. The opportunity was there for anyone who wanted to join the garda. It is hardly a new thing.

Japer · 21-10-2012 07:52PM

tayto lover wrote: »

It is hardly a new thing.

Little did a Garda joining in 1982 with his pass leaving cert think then he would be retiring today with an average pension pot worth €1,100,000.00

The country cannot afford it.

tayto lover · 21-10-2012 07:57PM

Japer wrote: »

Little did a Garda joining in 1982 with his pass leaving cert think then he would be retiring today with an average pension pot worth €1,100,000.00

The country cannot afford it.

I'd say he knew rightly if he read the contract.
Always read the contracts. They explain everything.

Stheno · 21-10-2012 08:02PM

34 days annual leave is very high.

I work in IT, I get 20 days leave, if I work a bank holiday I get a day in lieu, there is no flexitime (and hasn't been in 15 years of working across ten jobs) there is plenty of "you need to be onsite at 9am Monday, so spend the weekend getting there.

I've worked four bank holidays this year so far. Gardai take a 24/7 job expecting it to be 24/7 not nine to five?

MagicSean · 21-10-2012 08:04PM

Japer wrote: »

Little did a Garda joining in 1982 with his pass leaving cert think then he would be retiring today with an average pension pot worth €1,100,000.00

The country cannot afford it.

As has already been explained to you on numerous occasions it's not worth anything near that to him.

fits · 21-10-2012 08:05PM

^ The 34 days include bank holidays because they often have to work bank holidays anyway, no different to a normal week for them.

So its 25 + 9

Stheno · 21-10-2012 08:15PM

fits wrote: »

^ The 34 days include bank holidays because they often have to work bank holidays anyway, no different to a normal week for them.

So its 25 + 9

The minimum holiday here for a full time employee is 20 days

So they get 5 extra days, and 9 more to compensate them for potentially having to work those days?

If they worked bank holidays on a time in lieu basis that might be more economical for the country.

And going by another post they work six days out of ten.
Most people work five days out of seven excluding the nine weeks of the year there is a bank holiday

So on that basis six days out of ten is 219 working days, whereas most people would work 242 days a year and not get an additional 5 days holidays along with the statutory and what appears to be another 23 days off a year.

fits · 21-10-2012 08:20PM

how is 9 extra days instead of bank holidays any different to time in lieu. ITs exactly the same!

*baffled*

fits · 21-10-2012 08:23PM

Stheno wrote: »

So on that basis six days out of ten is 219 working days, whereas most people would work 242 days a year and not get an additional 5 days holidays along with the statutory and what appears to be another 23 days off a year.

Yeah lets make people doing shift work do five days a week as well!

Stheno · 21-10-2012 08:26PM

fits wrote: »

how is 9 extra days instead of bank holidays any different to time in lieu. ITs exactly the same!

*baffled*

fits wrote: »

Yeah lets make people doing shift work do five days a week as well!

The gardai do not to a person all work the bank holidays, so my point is that if they do not work them they should not get the time off in lieu?

If they didn't work eight hour shifts as they do I've no problem with them getting extra days off, but they do, it's 6-14:00, 14:00 - 20:00 and 20:00 - 06:00

Why shouldn't they work the same amount of days as the private sector on that basis?

Are you a guard?

Japer · 21-10-2012 08:28PM

MagicSean wrote: »

As has already been explained to you on numerous occasions it's not worth anything near that to him.

as has been explained to you on many occassions, its worth that to the average retiring Guard. http://www.independent.ie/national-news/garda-pension-worth-11m-1664588.html

It may not be worth that much to this particular guard because he cannot afford food on his 65k a year salary, he sleeps in his car because he cannot afford the petrol to go home, he sleeps in his dog kennel etc.

MagicSean · 21-10-2012 08:28PM

Stheno wrote: »

The minimum holiday here for a full time employee is 20 days

So they get 5 extra days, and 9 more to compensate them for potentially having to work those days?

If they worked bank holidays on a time in lieu basis that might be more economical for the country.

And going by another post they work six days out of ten.
Most people work five days out of seven excluding the nine weeks of the year there is a bank holiday

So on that basis six days out of ten is 219 working days, whereas most people would work 242 days a year and not get an additional 5 days holidays along with the statutory and what appears to be another 23 days off a year.

Did you take into account that Gardaí work 10 hour shifts whereas most people work 8?

Garda Sergeant can't afford food

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