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Irish Gun Control - To Strict?

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Comments

  • #152
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    Blay wrote: »
    You can own them if you have a reason

    There are several AR15 pattern rifles licenced in Ireland at the moment, go talk to Grizzly45 over on the shooting forum he owns a Remington R25 in .243.

    NO I cannot by a barrett, .45 ACP or DE .50 in Ireland.


  • #153
    MadsL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    crazy cabbage wrote: »
    1: Protection of you home
    This is a seemingly logical point. keep you home safe. yea?
    The problem is that guns are mostly just able to be used as a scar tactic of criminals rather than being any good for actula defense.
    It has been said that the sound of a gun owner simply racking the slide on a 12 gauge generally makes intruders disappear. I'd call that a win.
    That is presuming that you could get to your gun.
    Assuming you are asleep, one of these secures both the gun from little fingers and has it accessible and loaded in a second.
    I would seriely dout the you intruder will let you go walk about in you house so you can go get a gun.
    What do/would you take with you if you hear a noise downstairs at night?
    This study links guns kept in homes to much higher homicide rate in children.
    That study shows the rates for states with more guns, not individual gun ownership linked to gun deaths. It is a bit like saying that there are more traffic accidents involving children in Chicago rather than Amish communities. Well, duh.
    What do you say to that. OOOOo well i keep my gun in a gun case. Well it isn't much good if someone breaks in then is it. They are not going to wait around while you open you big padlock box.
    Linked above to instant access gun safe.
    guns creat more problems than they sovle
    In all the examples above you have shown that you may not get to your gun, but in cases where you are able to defend yourself would you rather have that in your hands or not. Be honest with yourself.
    2: Self defence
    Why not learn a marital art if you are so worried about self defence. You can use that anywhere even if the county you happen to be in forbids guns
    Because the physical ability to use a gun is pretty straightforward. My neighbours are in their 80s, keep a small .380 on the nightstand, that gives them some fighting chance if they have to use it. They are not physically able to defend themselves against attack; the gun levels the playing field somewhat.
    Better yet why not have a debate about tasers. (should have put this is point 1 aswell) They will render your opponent useless while you can call the gards. They will be there by the time he come round. if not tase him again
    You are aware just how difficult it is to taze a moving target. Tazers are used mainly for non-lethal use in police situations where the target is surrounded but unwilling to cooperate. Tazers are useless to home-defence.
    3: Criminals
    first very few have guns.
    Err, what? Are you serious?
    the ones that do may have a little more power but that has never stoped them in the past.
    Sorry, what now? Never stopped, when have criminals ever been unarmed???
    In america where the 'good' people have guns too there is still a very high rate of crime.
    Yes, that is generally why people carry or own guns in the US. Have you a solution for making guns or crime diasappear. I'd love to hear it.
    Crime rates are dropping in the US, but gun ownership is on the increase. I might draw a conclusion from that, but statistics can be misleading.
    Guns are bad.
    I'm tempted to say M'kay.
    They are used for killing.
    That is what they are designed to do. They tell me using a handgun as a hammer is dangerous. They are designed for killing what threatens you, that could be the 'bad guy' or for protection in remote areas against snakes or wild animals, or for vermin control. They are also used to put meat in the pot.
    why fight evil with evil and let good people get hurt.
    I once saw a hippy girl trying to stop a knife fight by playing a flute. It was quite funny, but delusional.
    I would rather america takes steps towards a better society rather than reinforce outdated ignorance
    Oddly enough, that is basically what America is striving towards. However, it still has principles or self-reliance and defending your family and neighbours. If you take a good look at it's history you might understand why.
    Guns need to be abolished and peace promoted
    Great, I'll let my local drug cartel know. They'll be thrilled to stop carrying around those heavy guns.


  • #154
    christmas2012
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,827 ✭✭✭christmas2012


    "nature of a gun is to harm an individual" - really? Because guns I use only harm paper targets & the occasional watermelon ;-)

    okay so what about handguns what is their main purpose of design its not long arrow shooting for deer etc..its for shooting people(or self defence if you want to word it that way..)

    thankfully there are genuine gun enthusiasts who only use it for sporting ie clay pigeon shooting or shooting board target practice for skill etc..but if it comes loose and the laws are laxed for everyone in ireland.....we will have big,big problems all it takes is one pissed off or mental person..


  • #155
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    codex1 wrote: »
    NO I cannot by a barrett, .45 ACP or DE .50 in Ireland.

    As I said to you several pages ago: Stay in the US. If your firearms rule your life to the extent they clearly do, then stay where you can own all the firearms you like. Nobody here cares about this issue as much as you do, we don't want desert eagles and if you do then you know what to do.

    Go moan on a British forum they can't own any pistols and aren't allowed CF semi auto rifles.


  • #156
    garv123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,576 ✭✭✭garv123


    codex1 wrote: »
    NO I cannot by a barrett, .45 ACP or DE .50 in Ireland.

    You can buy the barret yes, when you prove your valid reason for owning it and meet the needed house security.

    The other 2 We've all said no you cant.. The current government were meant to look into changing that again after the last governments anti shooting agenda. Pre 2008 you could own CF pistols. You didn't know that when you started your thread either.

    CF pistols may change again in the coming years but the licencing of self defence wont be changing and all owners will have to be members of target shooting clubs.


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  • #157
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    crazy cabbage wrote: »
    http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri-crime
    here is another stastic from the same wedsite as you took yours. Shows america has the highest crime rates by far. doesn't mention guns but i wounder what might have caused america to have twice the crime rate than its nearest 'competator' :confused:




    No. i was saying if people are so worried about there safty then why not learn self defence. Wouldn't work in america becouse ye already have that many guns circulating but in ireland where there is very few i would think that is enough

    Tasers are worse than guns. I dont see why. Why cant they be highly regualated and only given to people who are seriesly worried about there safty and are sane.
    You dont want to get close enough to use a taser but if someone breaks into you house they are not going to be a million miles away. If you can shoot them you will be able to taser them (unless you live in a mansion)

    yes people can hunt and whatever. No objection and under current law that is possible :confused:

    You also ignored some of my points indication the corralation between child homicide/susicide/death with guns lieing around the house

    I respect your opinion, but I don't think hand to hand combat is practical for home defense in any country, there are just to many variables & risks involved.

    Tasers are worse, because you have to get in real close to use them, they are mostly single use & a guy rocking on a meth trip might go down, but he will get right back up again but with major rage - what then? You better hope the taser is out of juice so it won't hurt when it sticks it up your ass ;-)

    Also - how can I use a taser to go hunting or use down at the pistal range?

    The problem here is that you are not required to own a gun safe & that is how kids get access to them, I disagree with this. Guns should never be loaded except when about to be fired & always locked in a safe at home, gun safety 101.


  • #158
    clashburke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 172 ✭✭clashburke


    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055749811

    read the legal links external to boards.ie section. it gives all the Acts and S.I relevant to Irish gun laws.

    Prove that you have a valid reason to own a gun in a court case and you might just get your .50cal.:rolleyes:

    The RKBA is an American right and i hope to never see it in Ireland. Gun ownership is a privilege given to the responsible members of society if they wish to avail of it.

    Finally under the CRIMINAL LAW (DEFENCE AND THE DWELLING) ACT 2011 a person in fear of their safety/family's safety/safety of goods may use reasonable force to prevent this feared danger. This is surely enough with out telling people to shoot intruders on sight as you seem to be implying.


  • #159
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    crazy cabbage wrote: »
    I am glad we are not like america. there is so much wrong with that country. If you want to own weapons designed to kill even more efficently than the ones you can legly get here you can stay in america.

    I for one do not want a same crazy idot with a gun under his pillow in my neighborhood

    Designed to kill - please stop being a drama queen. Opinions like this are bread from ignorance & fear.

    The VAST majority of guns in my local gun store are for sporting purposes, yes they could be used on people, so could just about anything you currently have in your kitchen.


  • #160
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    Blay wrote: »
    As I said to you several pages ago: Stay in the US. If your firearms rule your life to the extent they clearly do, then stay where you can own all the firearms you like. Nobody here cares about this issue as much as you do, we don't want desert eagles and if you do then you know what to do.

    Go moan on a British forum they can't own any pistols and aren't allowed CF semi auto rifles.

    Go troll or sulk somewhere else :D

    You've added nothing to this discussion, crying and whining "stay in america" is not helpful. 11 pages of discussion clearly shows that people do care about this issue.


  • #161
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    codex1 wrote: »
    Go troll or sulk somewhere else :D

    You've added nothing to this discussion, crying and whining "stay in america" is not helpful. 11 pages of discussion clearly shows that people do care about this issue.

    I'm sulking? :pac: You're the one crying because ya can't buy an AR15 over the counter in Ireland:pac: You're afraid the boogey man is gonna jump out from under your bed and you'll need a gun to hand at all times:pac:

    This thread has been 11 pages of you posting sh1te and being corrected by the same people over and over.


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  • #162
    garv123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,576 ✭✭✭garv123


    codex1 wrote: »
    Go troll or sulk somewhere else :D

    You've added nothing to this discussion, crying and whining "stay in america" is not helpful. 11 pages of discussion clearly shows that people do care about this issue.

    11 pages of you talking crap about laws you have no clue about and disagree with people who actually know the laws and own guns in here because they dont agree with you.


  • #163
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    christmas2012 wrote: »
    okay so what about handguns what is their main purpose of design its not long arrow shooting for deer etc..its for shooting people(or self defence if you want to word it that way..)

    thankfully there are genuine gun enthusiasts who only use it for sporting ie clay pigeon shooting or shooting board target practice for skill etc..but if it comes loose and the laws are laxed for everyone in ireland.....we will have big,big problems all it takes is one pissed off or mental person..

    There are hundreds of handguns which are designed specifically for sporting / target use - competition handgun tournaments very are popular here & I enjoy them.


  • #164
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    Blay wrote: »
    I'm sulking? :pac: You're the one crying because ya can't buy an AR15 over the counter in Ireland:pac: You're afraid the boogey man is gonna jump out from under your bed and you'll need a gun to hand at all times:pac:

    This thread has been 11 pages of you posting sh1te and being corrected by the same people over and over.

    Once again, your showing your ignorance and are now restoring to cursing :D

    I put up a post, people respond, then I respond back - this is how an forum works. I know its hard for you to get it & I forgive you :D


  • #165
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    codex1 wrote: »
    Once again, your showing your ignorance and are now restoring to cursing :D

    I put up a post, people respond, then I respond back - this is how an forum works. I know its hard for you to get it & I forgive you :D

    :pac:

    You're just a joke...that's all I'll say on the matter.


  • #166
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    garv123 wrote: »
    You can buy the barret yes, when you prove your valid reason for owning it and meet the needed house security.

    The other 2 We've all said no you cant.. The current government were meant to look into changing that again after the last governments anti shooting agenda. Pre 2008 you could own CF pistols. You didn't know that when you started your thread either.

    CF pistols may change again in the coming years but the licencing of self defence wont be changing and all owners will have to be members of target shooting clubs.

    I don't consider having to go to court & hiring a lawyer an acceptable form of making a purchase in 2012. Go to court.... :D


  • #167
    BillyMitchel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,324 ✭✭✭BillyMitchel


    garv123 wrote: »
    eth0 wrote: »
    Yea i dont think there should be a renewal fee for those at all. Most countries dont require licenses for them anyway. 1 paid license should be able to cover multiple guns. 2 or more gun license + draconian safe requirements means having a couple different guns around or collecting soon becomes a very expensive hobby

    Pellet guns under 1j dont require a licence.

    That used be the system here. One licence and guns added on cheaply.

    But hey presto they decide we'll make more money off the 200,000, guns in Ireland and make it a licence per gun and 80euro for 3 years each. some lads have 12 licences to pay

    There's 200,000 guns in Ireland? What kind usually and is it mostly hunters/farmers etc that keep them?


  • #168
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    Blay wrote: »
    :pac:

    You're just a joke...that's all I'll say on the matter.

    Dam right, because everything you have said so far is just that....a joke...well...there is also the made up facts, lies, slurs and general rudeness :D


  • #169
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    BillyMitchel wrote: »
    There's 200,000 guns in Ireland? What kind usually and is it mostly hunters/farmers etc that keep them?

    There's over 200,000, think it's 220k. It would be mostly farmers and hunters that have them. That figure doesnt mean there are 220k individuals with firearms, some people would have 2 or more, I know people with 6.


  • #170
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    codex1 wrote: »
    Dam right, because everything you have said so far is just that....a joke...well...there is also the made up facts, lies, slurs and general rudeness :D

    Quote one made up fact or lie I've posted..I dare you:pac:


  • #171
    crazy cabbage
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 738 ✭✭✭crazy cabbage


    madsl and codex

    there is clearly a difference in opinions.

    In my arguments i was pulling sastics of the internet that i dont really understand but here is my honest view.

    I have never once come across a gun in the 21ish years of my life. Never even seen a gun outside of a film/movie. I have never been robed or muged or physicly treatned in anyway.
    I then look at the news and see 4 high profile cases in america that involved someone legly geting a gun and killing lots of people (not to mention what they do abroad but that is another discussion) What am i supposed to think? yea lets give everyone in ireland a gun like they do in america (sterotyping i know but you get the point)

    I know people do use for hunting or whatever in ireland. I have never come across people hunting though and i live in the country but i know that if people want to they can. They can leagly own a gun for that purpose or sporting purpose. The provisions are there.

    I dont see why we need to loosen gun control in ireland. I have never come across a gun in my life and would rather keep it that way


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  • #172
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    Blay wrote: »
    There's over 200,000, think it's 220k. It would be mostly farmers and hunters that have them. That figure doesnt mean there are 220k individuals with firearms, some people would have 2 or more, I know people with 6.

    Blay, do you know anyone who owns "exotics" or high caliber riles - did they have any major problems obtaining a licence for them? Just curious, thanks.


  • #173
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    codex1 wrote: »
    Blay, do you know anyone who owns "exotics" or high caliber riles - did they have any major problems obtaining a licence for them? Just curious, thanks.

    Yes I do, I know people with CF pistols.. several people with restricted rifles...a guy with a 9.3 calibre rifle(restricted in Ireland). None of them had a problem with licences..the guys with CF pistols had them before the ban came in. I'm a member of a range so I see firearms that wouldn't be seen outside of that setting in Ireland.

    There's people on this very forum with restricted rifles...Grizzly45 has a CF semi auto rifle.


  • #174
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    Blay wrote: »
    Quote one made up fact or lie I've posted..I dare you:pac:

    HA - Your making this to easy, without having to even scroll I can pick one:

    "You're just a joke...that's all I'll say on the matter.".....really?

    :D


  • #175
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    codex1 wrote: »
    HA - Your making this to easy, without having to even scroll I can pick one:

    "You're just a joke...that's all I'll say on the matter.".....really?

    :D

    Unfortunately for you that's not a lie or a made up fact..it's truth:pac:


  • #176
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    Blay wrote: »
    Unfortunately for you that's not a lie or a made up fact:pac:

    "that's all I'll say on the matter" and then continuing to bang on about nonsense is is not a lie? :D

    also, saying that I can get a 50 cal in Ireland is another lie - show me evidence that anyone (non-military) in Ireland has obtained a licence for a Barrett or DE .50 since the laws where last changed?


  • #177
    BillyMitchel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,324 ✭✭✭BillyMitchel


    Blay wrote: »
    BillyMitchel wrote: »
    There's 200,000 guns in Ireland? What kind usually and is it mostly hunters/farmers etc that keep them?

    There's over 200,000, think it's 220k. It would be mostly farmers and hunters that have them. That figure doesnt mean there are 220k individuals with firearms, some people would have 2 or more, I know people with 6.

    Cheers. No idea about the subject.

    If there's 220k legal guns and never any media coverage or hysteria. Would I be right in saying then that the laws regarding ownership is perfectly good and no need for it to be changed?


  • #178
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    codex1 wrote: »
    "that's all I'll say on the matter" and then continuing to bang on about nonsense is is not a lie? :D

    All I'll say about *you*, the topic is still up for discussion.


  • #179
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    BillyMitchel wrote: »
    Cheers. No idea about the subject.

    If there's 220k legal guns and never any media coverage or hysteria. Would I be right in saying then that the laws regarding ownership is perfectly good and no need for it to be changed?

    I've no problem with the application process here really. I've never encountered a problem with my licences..had them inside 2 weeks. I think that's the complaint most people would have about the system...it can be slow sometimes. There are things within the legislation on what is/isn't restricted that I would like to see changed but apart from that it's ok.


  • #180
    codex1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭codex1


    Blay wrote: »
    All I'll say about *you*, the topic is still up for discussion.

    Proof of your claims that someone, under todays laws can obtain a licence for a DE .50?


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  • #181
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,419 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    codex1 wrote: »
    Proof of your claims that someone, under todays laws can obtain a licence for a DE .50?

    I never said they could..read the last two lines of this post:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=80419222&postcount=113

    I stated several times that you can't have a CF pistol so did Garv. Nobody is saying the system here is perfect but we can have firearms here that are banned 60 miles away in Britain so I'm happy with it.


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