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New Dublin Bus GT Class

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24567…13

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    #32
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,594 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    monument wrote: »
    But still: NTA buses with the final say down to the NTA.

    I'm not sure what your point is?

    Someone is suggesting purchasing buses that have no track record.

    I'm saying that post the Bombardier era that is not what has been done and I can't see it happening again.


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    #33
    joegriffinjnr
    Registered Users Posts: 686 ✭✭✭joegriffinjnr


    Routes to benifit from new buses are:

    7, 151, 4, 102, 33, 104, 1 and new route 29.


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    #34
    TouchingVirus
    Registered Users Posts: 8,584 ✭✭✭TouchingVirus


    joegriffinjnr wrote: »
    Routes to benifit from new buses are:

    7, 151, 4, 102, 33, 104, 1 and new route 29.

    The 1, really? It's far less frequent than other routes with older, crappier buses like the 16 with the buses from the 90s. Wasted opportunity if you ask me.


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    #35
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,594 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Bear in mind there will be buses cascading onto other routes as a result of these buses arriving into the fleet.

    The older RV class will all be withdrawn.


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    #36
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,071 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    lxflyer wrote: »
    The only dual staired double deck bus in operation is the limited number "borismaster". DB, rightly in my view, tend to stick with proven designs.

    Only one in operation in the UK - you may want to look at little beyond there.... its extremely common in most other countries that use double deckers.

    Adding a second stairs to an existing design is unlikely to be critically difficult.


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    #37
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,594 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    MYOB wrote: »
    Only one in operation in the UK - you may want to look at little beyond there.... its extremely common in most other countries that use double deckers.

    Adding a second stairs to an existing design is unlikely to be critically difficult.

    But the bus is no different in size to a VG bus - it is a standard size double deck. It is not a tri-axle.

    All fitting a second staircase would do is unecessarily reduce seating capacity even further given there are now centre doors fitted.

    It is frankly totally unnecesary.


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    #38
    honru
    Registered Users Posts: 4,585 ✭✭✭honru


    Sounds good, now I just hope those middle doors are used.


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    #39
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,601 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Is that an RTPI display at the front of the upper deck or not?


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    #40
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,071 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    lxflyer wrote: »
    But the bus is no different in size to a VG bus - it is a standard size double deck. It is not a tri-axle.

    All fitting a second staircase would do is unecessarily reduce seating capacity even further given there are now centre doors fitted.

    It is frankly totally unnecesary.

    A second stairs allows for much quicker egress regardless of the size - a triaxle isn't *that* much bigger.

    If DB want to seriously reduce dwell times, second stairs (and a flat fare....) are fairly important.


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    #41
    n97 mini
    Registered Users Posts: 8,295 ✭✭✭n97 mini


    SIPTU design committee? Presumably they designed the stations on the Maynooth line where staff get central heating, toilets, colour TV, broadband, tea and coffee making facilities, whereas customers get one or two bus shelters per platform?


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    #42
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,481 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    joegriffinjnr wrote: »
    Routes to benifit from new buses are:

    7, 151, 4, 102, 33, 104, 1 and new route 29.

    :eek::eek::eek:

    7 to get new buses first rather than be one of the last routes to keep the oldest ones in the fleet. How about that!


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    #43
    miller50841
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,525 ✭✭✭miller50841


    honru wrote: »
    Anyone know how many are being assigned to Donnybrook?

    Ment to be 21 as far as I know


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    #44
    miller50841
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,525 ✭✭✭miller50841


    Having the centre doors is a great idea but 1 huge problem is space to pull in along side the path safely while leaving no gap that people will trip and fall.

    Can see claims rising with these

    The centre doors on the older ones use to lock the bus out of gear and because they weren't maintained this nearly always ment the bus had to be turned off and back on to get it back into gear.
    This won't be a problem as there are door brakes now which doesn't kick out the gears like before back in the day.

    If the company wants to protect its revenue it will have to deploy a hell of a lot more ticket checkers when these buses come in.


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    #45
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,481 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    miller50841 wrote: »
    Having the centre doors is a great idea but 1 huge problem is space to pull in along side the path safely while leaving no gap that people will trip and fall.

    They need a little sign that say
    "we are not responsible for your inability to operate as a person, should you fall it's your problem, not ours"

    but I won't hold my breath...


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    #46
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,596 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Yes, who says a bus has to pull right up to the footpath?

    I often see buses stop one to two meters from the footpath, due to obstructions and people have to step on the road to get to and from the bus, even with single door buses. I really don't see how a second door is any different.


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    #47
    CIE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭CIE


    bk wrote: »
    Yes, who says a bus has to pull right up to the footpath?
    It's usually the ones with memories of the old trams, which couldn't do that. Trolleybus proponents also would tout the "pulls right up to the footpath" thing.
    bk wrote: »
    I often see buses stop one to two meters from the footpath, due to obstructions and people have to step on the road to get to and from the bus, even with single door buses. I really don't see how a second door is any different.
    Used to have that happen all the time. Just something that's commonplace. I don't even give it a second thought. Before the new N4 opened through Palmerstown, I used to catch the 66 at the corner of Lucan Road (now Old Lucan Road) and Kennelsfort Road, with the buses at least two metres out from the path. (This is when one used to have to walk to the Kennelsfort Road bus loop near Woodfarm Drive to catch the 18.)


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    #48
    dfx-
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 15,665 Mod ✭✭✭✭dfx-


    TouchingVirus wrote: »
    The 1, really? It's far less frequent than other routes with older, crappier buses like the 16 with the buses from the 90s. Wasted opportunity if you ask me.

    Safest place for Ringsend to put them. Like when they got new EVs in 2007, which surprisingly didn't drift from the 2 or 3 until recently and still not on the Crumlin corridor or even the 15s. Ringsend doesn't operate the 16.
    lxflyer wrote: »
    Bear in mind there will be buses cascading onto other routes as a result of these buses arriving into the fleet.

    The older RV class will all be withdrawn.

    The cascading buses will draw my interest much more so than these I think. Where do Ringsend's EVs go, Conyngham Rd's AXs (and hopefully they keep AV98-103), what AVs go to Ringsend to make up for the loss of all their RVs and which AVs depart completely. I was hoping that maybe some of the Donnybrook original VTs may finally move around too, but that's unlikely if the 7 gets the new buses.


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    #49
    Davidth88
    Registered Users Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭Davidth88


    I was stuck that it's obvious that the staff have been asked for input to these new buses ( via their union ). However the passengers seem to have no input.

    However they seem nice enough.

    I would like to have seen LED signs to tell you the next stop

    I didn't spot if these buses ' kneel down ' , but I assume they do.


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    #50
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,601 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    There looks to be an RTPI display on the front of the top deck, but nobody has confirmed if it is or not.


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    #51
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,685 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    bk wrote: »
    Yes, who says a bus has to pull right up to the footpath?

    I often see buses stop one to two meters from the footpath, due to obstructions and people have to step on the road to get to and from the bus, even with single door buses. I really don't see how a second door is any different.


    Hopefully there's been no compromise on accessibility in the design of these busses so


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    #52
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,596 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    AngryLips wrote: »
    Hopefully there's been no compromise on accessibility in the design of these busses so

    As long as the front door can get at the footpath, there shouldn't be an issue. The odd wheel chair or buggy can exit via the front door if the side door hasn't quite reached the footpath, everyone else can get off the side door like normal.

    It really isn't rocket science. It is done every day around Europem, where the vast majority of buses have minimum of 2 doors and up to 6!!

    And don't give me this rubbish about them having better stops, while generally true, I've often seen and used multidoor buses that didn't pull up to the footpath in other European countries, quiet frequently actually.

    Only in Ireland does this seem to be an issue.


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    #53
    The_Wrecker
    Registered Users Posts: 471 ✭✭The_Wrecker


    Too true, i was in Tallinn last year and the buses (some bendy) had more doors than windows! Loading and unloading regardless of kerb distance. Another difference was that no one parked in the bus stop area. Tight locations like Dun laoghaire station didnt exist either.


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    #54
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,594 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    bk wrote: »
    As long as the front door can get at the footpath, there shouldn't be an issue. The odd wheel chair or buggy can exit via the front door if the side door hasn't quite reached the footpath, everyone else can get off the side door like normal.

    It really isn't rocket science. It is done every day around Europem, where the vast majority of buses have minimum of 2 doors and up to 6!!

    And don't give me this rubbish about them having better stops, while generally true, I've often seen and used multidoor buses that didn't pull up to the footpath in other European countries, quiet frequently actually.

    Only in Ireland does this seem to be an issue.

    That does not mean however that many bus stops do not need to be brought up to standard. Westmoreland Street where city bus routes and intercity/airport/port services share a stop springs to mind. It frankly is an accident waiting to happen. I happen to think a city bus with dual doors being open a traffic lane outside a parked coach is an unacceptable risk.


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    #55
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    How strong are those centre doors and how are they secured? is there much chance of people being lost through the doors on roundabouts or other tight corners when the bus is packed and people are resting against the doors?


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    #56
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,596 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    lxflyer wrote: »
    That does not mean however that many bus stops do not need to be brought up to standard. Westmoreland Street where city bus routes and intercity/airport/port services share a stop springs to mind. It frankly is an accident waiting to happen. I happen to think a city bus with dual doors being open a traffic lane outside a parked coach is an unacceptable risk.

    Oh I agree completely about the issues at Westmoreland St and other stops and with Taxi drivers blocking stops, etc.

    However I'm just making the point that it is a separate issue from multi-door operation and that this talk of insurance issues is just a red herring.


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    #57
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,596 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    How strong are those centre doors and how are they secured? is there much chance of people being lost through the doors on roundabouts or other tight corners when the bus is packed and people are resting against the doors?

    I'd imagine zero risk, as there design indicate they slide out and to the side, thus no possibility of being forced open.

    Again most countries operate multi-door buses with up to 6 double doors without people falling out, really not an issue :rolleyes:


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    #58
    Captain Chaos
    Registered Users Posts: 11,174 ✭✭✭✭Captain Chaos


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    How strong are those centre doors and how are they secured? is there much chance of people being lost through the doors on roundabouts or other tight corners when the bus is packed and people are resting against the doors?

    Ever been on a Luas or a rush hour DART in 2001-2005. Being squashed against a door is a regular every day thing on the way to and from where you want to get to.

    It's a non issue really that has been dealt with in this and other countries for many years.


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    #59
    Andrew33
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭Andrew33


    CIE wrote: »
    More small-diametre wheels (rims and tyres)? Those scared me on the KD-class (especially when I was once on a route 86 bus that skidded across the intersection of Johnstown Road and Bray Road in Cabinteely). I would feel safer with a bigger foot print.

    I reckon the advances in tyre technology combined with ASR (or whatever the latest acronym for skid control is) make the modern small rimmed, low pro tyred buses much much safer than the KD's eveer were.


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    #60
    The_Wrecker
    Registered Users Posts: 471 ✭✭The_Wrecker


    I drove the KD's with their 'Wheel of fortune' brake pedal, will it skid, will it stop... Late 70's technology. The new stock has an ECU monitoring everything.


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    #61
    miller50841
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,525 ✭✭✭miller50841


    bk wrote: »
    Yes, who says a bus has to pull right up to the footpath?

    I often see buses stop one to two meters from the footpath, due to obstructions and people have to step on the road to get to and from the bus, even with single door buses. I really don't see how a second door is any different.

    The company has a view on this if there is a vehicle in the bus stop or whatever obstruction the bus is to continue to the next stop.

    Now this has to be done sometimes but for the driver its only going to turn into a fight against them from passengers wanting off or passengers waiting on the bus its crazy the bus stops just need to be enforced properly as they are bus only 24hours a day not for taxi parking or pulling in for a second to collect something out of the shop.


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