The Dark Knight Rises - seen thread SPOILERS WITHIN See Mod Warning in first post

Chazz Michael Michaels · 24-07-2012 06:29AM

I have no issue with so called 'plot holes', as mentioned above. I was just so very bored by the whole thing. When compared to TDK, the dialogue just seemed very dumbed down and uninteresting, nothing to make really you think. Nothing that would require a second viewing to fully appreciate. I mean, I watched the first two films this week in anticipation and I was still surprised by some elements of the dialogue that I missed the first time. That's a sign of quality writing. TDKR had nothing like that, just in your face, popcorn munching rubbish... maybe rubbish is harsh, but it was just such a big let down. I came to expect more from the Nolans, something with more layers. More class.

I suppose I could put it like this, if you sat me down with this movie, with no knowledge of who directed or wrote it, I never would have said the Nolans. I would have assumed that the franchise was passed on to one of these directors who handles these generic knock offs for the popcorn munching masses.

The whole thing just stinks of Avatar, to me. So overrhyped, that "it just gotta be the greatest film ever, it just gotta be!"

PS: I thought this was a good read:

The Dark Knight Rises: 10 Ways It Didn’t Live Up To The Hype

Skinfull · 24-07-2012 08:00AM

val_jester wrote: »

There isn't lazy scriptwriting, that is one thing you can't accuse the writers of. Everything that happens in the film has an explanation.

Actually I can. That scene where Catwoman is talking to the gangster guy who promised her the clean slate, she has him on the ground and is asking him where he is, and he proceeded to ask if it was the clean slate she wanted? And then explained what it would do, how it would work, and what she would need it for.

Yes this information was needed by us, the audience, we needed to know her motivation, yadda yadda yadda, but this conversation shouldn't have been between two characters who knew what the object was. That scene was all a little monty python. Maybe catwoman could have explained it to that little blond pickpocket chick she was hanging out with.

That scene really took me out of the moment. There was another instance like that I cant recall now though.

splashthecash · 24-07-2012 08:02AM

Chazz Michael Michaels wrote: »

I have no issue with so called 'plot holes', as mentioned above. I was just so very bored by the whole thing. When compared to TDK, the dialogue just seemed very dumbed down and uninteresting, nothing to make really you think. Nothing that would require a second viewing to fully appreciate. I mean, I watched the first two films this week in anticipation and I was still surprised by some elements of the dialogue that I missed the first time. That's a sign of quality writing. TDKR had nothing like that, just in your face, popcorn munching rubbish... maybe rubbish is harsh, but it was just such a big let down. I came to expect more from the Nolans, something with more layers. More class.

I suppose I could put it like this, if you sat me down with this movie, with no knowledge of who directed or wrote it, I never would have said the Nolans. I would have assumed that the franchise was passed on to one of these directors who handles these generic knock offs for the popcorn munching masses.

The whole thing just stinks of Avatar, to me. So overrhyped, that "it just gotta be the greatest film ever, it just gotta be!"

PS: I thought this was a good read:

The Dark Knight Rises: 10 Ways It Didn’t Live Up To The Hype

You say that when you watched the TDK you found new bits of dialogue that you missed the first time - maybe you require a second viewing for TDKR?

SantryRed · 24-07-2012 08:13AM

Great movie. The nit picking is ridiculous on this thread though.

Kinski · 24-07-2012 08:14AM

Chazz Michael Michaels wrote: »

I came to expect more from the Nolans, something with more layers. More class.

I suppose I could put it like this, if you sat me down with this movie, with no knowledge of who directed or wrote it, I never would have said the Nolans.

Their best work is certainly more complex and multifaceted than anything the masses will ever appreciate.

Ellian · 24-07-2012 08:22AM

Sad Professor wrote: »

As Handsome Bob suggested earlier, I think the sheer fact that Bruce escaped from the prison shattered Bane's confidence. Bane wasn't able escape himself and didn't believe that a man like Bruce could either. In addition, after seeing what Bane had done to his city, Bruce was more motivated than ever to defeat him. Where as previously he probably wasn't taking Bane seriously enough.

There's a line in The Dark Knight Returns where Batman gets his arse handed to him by a foe first time around and then manages to defeat in the second clash - there was a line that something like "my mistake was to try and fight him like I am a young man" - I think Bane said something similar in the sewer fight mocking him - I couldn't really make it out, but that's what I assumed was the difference the second time around - that and the fact that Batman was focussing an awful lot of his energy on the pain controlling mask..

Kinski · 24-07-2012 08:29AM

Chazz Michael Michaels wrote: »

PS: I thought this was a good read:

The Dark Knight Rises: 10 Ways It Didn’t Live Up To The Hype

#2, his points about the ending, are excellent. I do not understand why people have gone nuts for it.

One of the flaws of TDK was its dual-climax structure, which saw Batman confront the Joker, and then Dent...just incredibly drawn out. But I loved the final sequence, where Batman flees while Gordon explains why to his son.

TDKR, on the other hand, left me fairly cold.

krudler · 24-07-2012 09:05AM

Kinski wrote: »

#2, his points about the ending, are excellent. I do not understand why people have gone nuts for it.

One of the flaws of TDK was its dual-climax structure, which saw Batman confront the Joker, and then Dent...just incredibly drawn out. But I loved the final sequence, where Batman flees while Gordon explains why to his son.

TDKR, on the other hand, left me fairly cold.

Agreed, as cool a moment as the shot of Blake's "rising" was, he's a rookie cop with no martial arts training (that we know of, he can handle himself in a fight though) whereas Bruce was a physically fit, trained by ninjas for years guy. Blake's first outing as Batman would probably be the same as Kick-Ass :pac: Batman makes fun of the imposters in TDK, isnt that just exactly what Blake has become? putting on the suit don't make you Batman son.

spankmaster2000 · 24-07-2012 09:09AM

During the Bane / Miranda Tata reveal at the end, all I could think of was this:

And once again, Bane was reduced to "assistant" status; rather than the criminal genius that was promised...

krudler · 24-07-2012 09:21AM

Yeah that pissed me off too, Bane isn't a criminal mastermind, he's a lovesick lackie at the end of it all.

Chazz Michael Michaels · 24-07-2012 09:46AM

splashthecash wrote: »

Chazz Michael Michaels wrote: »

I have no issue with so called 'plot holes', as mentioned above. I was just so very bored by the whole thing. When compared to TDK, the dialogue just seemed very dumbed down and uninteresting, nothing to make really you think. Nothing that would require a second viewing to fully appreciate. I mean, I watched the first two films this week in anticipation and I was still surprised by some elements of the dialogue that I missed the first time. That's a sign of quality writing. TDKR had nothing like that, just in your face, popcorn munching rubbish... maybe rubbish is harsh, but it was just such a big let down. I came to expect more from the Nolans, something with more layers. More class.

I suppose I could put it like this, if you sat me down with this movie, with no knowledge of who directed or wrote it, I never would have said the Nolans. I would have assumed that the franchise was passed on to one of these directors who handles these generic knock offs for the popcorn munching masses.

The whole thing just stinks of Avatar, to me. So overrhyped, that "it just gotta be the greatest film ever, it just gotta be!"

PS: I thought this was a good read:

The Dark Knight Rises: 10 Ways It Didn’t Live Up To The Hype

You say that when you watched the TDK you found new bits of dialogue that you missed the first time - maybe you require a second viewing for TDKR?

No, because the first time I watched TDK I loved it and picked up on the clever ideas and philosophies within. TDKR had none of that. Incoherent and lacking any original ideas. About an hour in my inner voice was liike 'Uh, Chazz, is this crap?'. I didn't want it to be ****, but as the film stumbled along I just had the dawning realisation that I was watching a boring film, even though I really wanted it to be good. That's the difference between me and those swept away by the hype machine. I simply accepted the truth. :-)

veXual · 24-07-2012 09:47AM

Maybe I'm looking a bit too much into it but I noticed how the theme of rising was subtly evident through out.

The most obvious one is Bruce's climb from the pit but it was worked in on a much more subliminal level as well.

Almost every time we see the 'Batcave' the platforms rise from the ground a subtle hint towards rising. Also any time Batman attempts to escape he seems to rise above whatever obstacle is in his way. For example when he's been chased on the batpod and is cornered he makes his escape by jumping/rising above the police and again when he's cornered he employs the use of the bat to 'rise' and make his aerial escape.

Prior to his confrontation with Bane he goes underground where aerial escape is not an option thus leading to his demise.

There's a real subterranean theme with Bane as well his worst work is done underground or he is seen climbing from a hole to destroy the stadium and Gotham.

I've only really began to appreciate cinematography in films lately and it was on my second viewing that I really appreciated it in this film.

abouttobebanned · 24-07-2012 09:49AM

Am I the only one who thought bane sounded liked morla?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K311uSEf-3k

krudler · 24-07-2012 10:04AM

by far my favourite moment of the movie was the dozens and dozens of cop cars chasing Batman after the Wall St raid(which happened during daytime as it was trading hours but its night a few mins later during the chase, more nitpicking! :pac: )

al28283 · 24-07-2012 10:08AM

krudler wrote: »

by far my favourite moment of the movie was the dozens and dozens of cop cars chasing Batman after the Wall St raid(which happened during daytime as it was trading hours but its night a few mins later during the chase, more nitpicking! :pac: )

The bit where they drove motorbikes out of the stock exchange building?:D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bed1Vgl-a7k

Sleepy · 24-07-2012 10:09AM

Is all the grandstanding nit-picking of this movie reminding anyone else of Sheldon Cooper?

It seems like there's a significant chunk of the fans who just want to find fault but I don't think I've heard anyone say that it's without fault. The griping seems like pointing out that you don't like cress when it's served to you as the garnish on a perfectly cooked fillet steak.

norrie rugger · 24-07-2012 10:09AM

dorkacle wrote: »

Seriously looks like it doesn't it! Tbh I find it very annoying that these days hollywood can't simply end a movie without leaving some sort of hint or opening for a potential sequel or spin off....
The Joker was done so well and you can't help but feel if Ledger was still alive, maybe there would have been a couple of more movies involving his awesome character.

Ehhhhh. contradict much?

al28283 · 24-07-2012 10:11AM

Sleepy wrote: »

Is all the grandstanding nit-picking of this movie reminding anyone else of Sheldon Cooper?

It seems like there's a significant chunk of the fans who just want to find fault but I don't think I've heard anyone say that it's without fault. The griping seems like pointing out that you don't like cress when it's served to you as the garnish on a perfectly cooked fillet steak.

i don't know who that is but people can point out whatever they want about the movie.

Chazz Michael Michaels · 24-07-2012 10:43AM

Sleepy wrote: »

Is all the grandstanding nit-picking of this movie reminding anyone else of Sheldon Cooper?

It seems like there's a significant chunk of the fans who just want to find fault but I don't think I've heard anyone say that it's without fault. The griping seems like pointing out that you don't like cress when it's served to you as the garnish on a perfectly cooked fillet steak.

Rather more like fresh cress served on a warm turd.

spankmaster2000 · 24-07-2012 10:47AM

Sleepy wrote: »

It seems like there's a significant chunk of the fans who just want to find fault but I don't think I've heard anyone say that it's without fault. The griping seems like pointing out that you don't like cress when it's served to you as the garnish on a perfectly cooked fillet steak.

I'd compare it more to a carefully placed After-Eight on top of that perfectly cooked steak.

Aperitif, starters, etc = delicious.
Steak = delicious.
w.t.f. is that after-eight doing there though?

You'd still recommend the restaurant to your friends, and enjoyed everything you ate; but were just left with a strange taste in your mouth at the end. Satisfied, but not blown away.

(For the record, I enjoyed TDKR more than any other superhero film since TDK!)

gebbel · 24-07-2012 10:48AM

Just thought I'd post my opinion here, having seen the film last night in Odeon Leicester Square in London. I really enjoyed it...not quite as much as TDK but not far off it either. What really frustrated me was Bane's voice. I couldn't make out half of his dialogue. Kept on cocking my ear to one side when he started talking. Disappointed they didn't properly sort out an issue that was flagged months ago.

Mr Freeze · 24-07-2012 10:54AM

Sleepy wrote: »

It seems like there's a significant chunk of the fans who just want to find fault but I don't think I've heard anyone say that it's without fault.

I haven't a bad word to say about the film.

I had low expectations going in, as I did not expect them to match the quality of the TDK.

How wrong was I. I was delighted with the film, and very happy with the way they tied up the end of the trilogy.

splashthecash · 24-07-2012 10:55AM

I enjoyed it - it was a proper summer blockbuster film, sure - it didn't leave me with the awe that TDK did, but still and all a great end to a fantastic trilogy.

I do agree though that humanising Bane at the end didn't work for me - as someone pointed out, it gave him a lovesick assistant kind of angle which didn't suit the violent rough character he was protrayed as.

I love reading reviews on boards, some people are very articulate in terms of why they liked\didn't like it but there is a level of nit-picking which I don't go for myself. Does anyone agree?

"the angle of the ramp that batman used to jump on the batpod would not have been sufficient to reach the elevated road to which he landed..."

"why would batman install a software patch on the flying machine if it wasnt working or he wasn't going to use it"

Keyzer · 24-07-2012 11:00AM

Chazz Michael Michaels wrote: »

No, because the first time I watched TDK I loved it and picked up on the clever ideas and philosophies within. TDKR had none of that. Incoherent and lacking any original ideas. About an hour in my inner voice was liike 'Uh, Chazz, is this crap?'. I didn't want it to be ****, but as the film stumbled along I just had the dawning realisation that I was watching a boring film, even though I really wanted it to be good. That's the difference between me and those swept away by the hype machine. I simply accepted the truth. :-)

Agree 80%...

I wouldn't say it was crap but it certainly wasn't the epic masterpiece its being made out to be.

Certainly a disappointment though...

24-07-2012 11:05AM

This thread should be retitled, "The Dark Knight Rises - need to bitch, moan and whine thread".

This film is in no way a 4 out of 10 film. Honestly, most of Jennifer Anistons movies are better than a 4 out of 10. This is better than a 4 out of 10.

"But wwwwwwhhhhyyyyyy did they make them wait 5 months before exploding the bomb?"

Because this is a film not real life. This is not based on a true story before any one mistakes it for one. I know I nearly did. It was only when I saw Anne Hathaway looking hot did I realise it was a film.

Bane's death really came out of nowhere didn't it? Unlike the epic shootout that was JFK's end, the battle to the death against the French security forces that was Diana's death and of course no-one can forget the drawn out affair of Kurt Cobains death. Fact is. Death happens. It happens quickly and it happens unexpectedly. This is the guy who allegedly "broke the bat" (I would argue that it was Rachel's death many years earlier that really "broke the bat") This guy needed a cannon to the stomach. He was evil.

What else?

Bruce and Selina at the end in the Italian restaurant enjoying a glass of wine. The Bastards. Not like Bruce has done anything to deserve that. The Bastard.

I know I missed some nit-picking points, but I swear these people would have lashed out at the Godfather(1+2), Shawshank, Airplane, The Good, The Bad and The Ugly if they were young enough when they came out.

Second film in this franchise got it right with the line, "Some men just want to watch the world burn"

Oh and by the way, it's nearly 2015 and we don't have hoverboards. I suppose you'll all start hating on Back to the Future 2 now?

Chazz Michael Michaels · 24-07-2012 11:10AM

Pappa Dolla wrote: »

This thread should be retitled, "The Dark Knight Rises - need to bitch, moan and whine thread".

This film is in no way a 4 out of 10 film. Honestly, most of Jennifer Anistons movies are better than a 4 out of 10. This is better than a 4 out of 10.

"But wwwwwwhhhhyyyyyy did they make them wait 5 months before exploding the bomb?"

Because this is a film not real life. This is not based on a true story before any one mistakes it for one. I know I nearly did. It was only when I saw Anne Hathaway looking hot did I realise it was a film.

Bane's death really came out of nowhere didn't it? Unlike the epic shootout that was JFK's end, the battle to the death against the French security forces that was Diana's death and of course no-one can forget the drawn out affair of Kurt Cobains death. Fact is. Death happens. It happens quickly and it happens unexpectedly. This is the guy who allegedly "broke the bat" (I would argue that it was Rachel's death many years earlier that really "broke the bat") This guy needed a cannon to the stomach. He was evil.

What else?

Bruce and Selina at the end in the Italian restaurant enjoying a glass of wine. The Bastards. Not like Bruce has done anything to deserve that. The Bastard.

I know I missed some nit-picking points, but I swear these people would have lashed out at the Godfather(1+2), Shawshank, Airplane, The Good, The Bad and The Ugly if they were young enough when they came out.

Second film in this franchise got it right with the line, "Some men just want to watch the world burn"

Oh and by the way, it's nearly 2015 and we don't have hoverboards. I suppose you'll all start hating on Back to the Future 2 now?

A post as incoherent as TDKR... :-)

Fishooks12 · 24-07-2012 11:14AM

Deleted User wrote: »

This thread should be retitled, "The Dark Knight Rises - need to bitch, moan and whine thread".

This film is in no way a 4 out of 10 film. Honestly, most of Jennifer Anistons movies are better than a 4 out of 10. This is better than a 4 out of 10.

"But wwwwwwhhhhyyyyyy did they make them wait 5 months before exploding the bomb?"

Because this is a film not real life. This is not based on a true story before any one mistakes it for one. I know I nearly did. It was only when I saw Anne Hathaway looking hot did I realise it was a film.

Bane's death really came out of nowhere didn't it? Unlike the epic shootout that was JFK's end, the battle to the death against the French security forces that was Diana's death and of course no-one can forget the drawn out affair of Kurt Cobains death. Fact is. Death happens. It happens quickly and it happens unexpectedly. This is the guy who allegedly "broke the bat" (I would argue that it was Rachel's death many years earlier that really "broke the bat") This guy needed a cannon to the stomach. He was evil.

What else?

Bruce and Selina at the end in the Italian restaurant enjoying a glass of wine. The Bastards. Not like Bruce has done anything to deserve that. The Bastard.

I know I missed some nit-picking points, but I swear these people would have lashed out at the Godfather(1+2), Shawshank, Airplane, The Good, The Bad and The Ugly if they were young enough when they came out.

Second film in this franchise got it right with the line, "Some men just want to watch the world burn"

Oh and by the way, it's nearly 2015 and we don't have hoverboards. I suppose you'll all start hating on Back to the Future 2 now?

Plenty of people who didn't like it aren't doing any of the nitpicking you're alluding too

For me the biggest disappointing element was Zimmer's horribly over the top score, the cop out ending, a pretty lazy plot and some terrible pacing

It's got some good elements too but It's not a patch on TDK or BB

al28283 · 24-07-2012 11:14AM

Deleted User wrote: »

This thread should be retitled, "The Dark Knight Rises - need to bitch, moan and whine thread".

This film is in no way a 4 out of 10 film. Honestly, most of Jennifer Anistons movies are better than a 4 out of 10. This is better than a 4 out of 10.

"But wwwwwwhhhhyyyyyy did they make them wait 5 months before exploding the bomb?"

Because this is a film not real life. This is not based on a true story before any one mistakes it for one. I know I nearly did. It was only when I saw Anne Hathaway looking hot did I realise it was a film.

Bane's death really came out of nowhere didn't it? Unlike the epic shootout that was JFK's end, the battle to the death against the French security forces that was Diana's death and of course no-one can forget the drawn out affair of Kurt Cobains death. Fact is. Death happens. It happens quickly and it happens unexpectedly. This is the guy who allegedly "broke the bat" (I would argue that it was Rachel's death many years earlier that really "broke the bat") This guy needed a cannon to the stomach. He was evil.

What else?

Bruce and Selina at the end in the Italian restaurant enjoying a glass of wine. The Bastards. Not like Bruce has done anything to deserve that. The Bastard.

I know I missed some nit-picking points, but I swear these people would have lashed out at the Godfather(1+2), Shawshank, Airplane, The Good, The Bad and The Ugly if they were young enough when they came out.

Second film in this franchise got it right with the line, "Some men just want to watch the world burn"

Oh and by the way, it's nearly 2015 and we don't have hoverboards. I suppose you'll all start hating on Back to the Future 2 now?

You point out that this is a film and then use real world world examples to justify Banes anti-climactic death. :rolleyes: By that rationale it would have been ok for Bane to keel over half way through the movie as a result of a undiagnosed illness, after all it happens all the time in real life.

Just because you enjoyed the movie doesn't mean others are idiots for not enjoying it.

CL7 · 24-07-2012 11:15AM

Chazz Michael Michaels wrote: »

Rather more like fresh cress served on a warm turd.

The film had some flaws and they bothered some more than others but it's hard to take you seriously after reading the above. I wonder if hold every film you watch to the same ridiculously high standard or are you being disingenuous here?

Squ · 24-07-2012 11:23AM

Pappa Dolla wrote: »

"But wwwwwwhhhhyyyyyy did they make them wait 5 months before exploding the bomb?" Because this is a film not real life.

Bane's death really came out of nowhere didn't it? Fact is. Death happens. It happens quickly and it happens unexpectedly.

So when you want it to just be a film, thats ok, but for Banes quick, no payoff death, thats just what happens in real life?

The Dark Knight Rises - seen thread *SPOILERS WITHIN* See Mod Warning in first post

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The Dark Knight Rises - seen thread SPOILERS WITHIN See Mod Warning in first post