South County GC Closed

link_2007 · 09-05-2012 6:50am #1

Woke up to a text:

The board regret to announce that the golf club will close immediately. A formal statement will be issued to shareholders and creditors in due course. See website for further details.

I have checked the website but it seems to be the same as normal.

ForeRight · 09-05-2012 6:58am

What happens to your GUI etc if s county is your home club ?

scubapro · 09-05-2012 7:19am

ForeRight wrote: »

What happens to your GUI etc if s county is your home club ?

No offence but Gui is the last thing on my mind and I am sure all members minds. Can't believe it. I am only a member since January and there was a great club feel to the place. there are hundreds of guys who are members years who have played there week in week out, and I'm sure it's gonna be like a death in the familly for them.
My thoughts are with all those guys today.
I was getting the clubs ready last night for a practice round this evening:(

Link lucky we got those nine in on Monday

link_2007 · 09-05-2012 7:26am

scubapro wrote: »

No offence but Gui is the last thing on my mind and I am sure all members minds. Can't believe it. I am only a member since January and there was a great club feel to the place. there are hundreds of guys who are members years who have played there week in week out, and I'm sure it's gonna be like a death in the familly for them.
My thoughts are with all those guys today.
I was getting the clubs ready last night for a practice round this evening:(

Link lucky we got those nine in on Monday

If I'd known this was going to happen I would have played on.

It's a great shame - I was thoroughly enjoying it there as well.

one ill cat · 09-05-2012 8:02am

Devastated.

Kevinmarkham · 09-05-2012 8:12am

Terrible shame - I really liked the course. Hopefully, for the members and all golfers, it will have a chance to bounce back.

ForeRight · 09-05-2012 8:23am

scubapro wrote: »

ForeRight wrote: »

What happens to your GUI etc if s county is your home club ?

No offence but Gui is the last thing on my mind and I am sure all members minds. Can't believe it. I am only a member since January and there was a great club feel to the place. there are hundreds of guys who are members years who have played there week in week out, and I'm sure it's gonna be like a death in the familly for them.
My thoughts are with all those guys today.
I was getting the clubs ready last night for a practice round this evening:(

Link lucky we got those nine in on Monday

No offence taken as I am a member too!

I can't change the situation in anyway so I would just like to know what happens in situations like this that's all.

I know for a fact that they still took new memberships off people only a couple of weeks ago and imagine how them lads feel after shelling out when they wake up to a text at 620 am saying club is closed with immediate effect!!!

pinkdoubleeagle · 09-05-2012 8:34am

Really sorry to hear that news. Really liked the place

FANTAPANTS · 09-05-2012 8:39am

thats some kick in the teeth. Was their even a hint it was in trouble???:(:(:(

Dr_Colossus · 09-05-2012 8:40am

What? Find this hard to believe. Played the course a couple of times late 2010 and early 2011 with the views of joining. Good quality greens and very nice practice facilities on hand so it was a serious consideration at the time. A busy and very welcoming club and found the general manager there to be very professional and gave one of the better introductions to a prospective member I've come across. Clubhouse was moderately sized with good food at reasonable prices on hand so everything appeared to be well run.

It's a pretty established club with a largish member base I thought so don't understand why they'd close. Are they in serious financial difficulty or anyone know the reasons why they would close? My sympathies to all concerned and hopefully it's not as bad as it sounds.

brick tamland · 09-05-2012 8:43am

Yikes that shorrible. I had a voucher to use for a round there but thats nothing compared to lads that were members.

Always thought they had a solid membership, must have been run horribly.

How big was the membership lads?

link_2007 · 09-05-2012 8:44am

FANTAPANTS wrote: »

thats some kick in the teeth. Was their even a hint it was in trouble???:(:(:(

I was up there on Sunday and Monday and certainly had no inclination.

A few of the more established/long term members might be able to give a better answer but everything seemed to be going well.

one ill cat · 09-05-2012 8:45am

When I first got the text it did occur to me that it was some sort of a hacking hoax, but I've had it confirmed it's 100% genuine and appears to be as final as it sounds.

ipitydafool · 09-05-2012 8:52am

Yeah i find it hard to fathom how it could just close like this out of the blue. I am not a member but played up there about half a dozen times last year and really liked the place. Granted most of the days i played were a Saturday or bank holiday but the place was always busy and the clubhouse very welcoming. From what little I know of the structure of the club, set up with members as shareholders in a company and then a board of directors you would think there would at least have been an EGM if the financials were that badly in trouble. I mean they were accepting full payment for members a few weeks ago, I'm sure there is society bookings with deposits down for the year etc, something doesn't seem right that it could close like that. I feel really bad for the posters here who are members and I hope you have some recourse.

scubapro · 09-05-2012 8:54am

There was an email sent out a few months back saying that they had met with the banks and had secured finance based on a new business plan and that the club was secure for the foreseeable future. That did make me think at the time if all was well, I've been playing there regularly at least 3 times a week and have spoken to many established members and at no time was there any inkling of what was to come.

Whyner · 09-05-2012 8:55am

one ill cat wrote: »

When I first got the text it did occur to me that it was some sort of a hacking hoax, but I've had it confirmed it's 100% genuine and appears to be as final as it sounds.

There's the last ray of hope gone. Due to play today. Sub was 1689 and paid it a month ago.

Happy 1000th post Whyner

Thing is, don't really like any other course within the same distance and SC was a bit a drive anyway.

Ah we'll sort it out, Open comps here I come

pinkdoubleeagle · 09-05-2012 8:56am

Whyner wrote: »

There's the last ray of hope gone. Due to play today. Sub was 1689 and paid it a month ago.

Happy 1000th post Whyner

Thing is, don't really like any other course within the same distance and SC was a bit a drive anyway.

Ah we'll sort it out, Open comps here I come

Gutted for you Mate

link_2007 · 09-05-2012 9:03am

Whyner wrote: »

There's the last ray of hope gone. Due to play today. Sub was 1689 and paid it a month ago.

Happy 1000th post Whyner

Thing is, don't really like any other course within the same distance and SC was a bit a drive anyway.

Ah we'll sort it out, Open comps here I come

Whyner, that is a pain in the balls.

newport2 · 09-05-2012 9:03am

Whyner wrote: »

There's the last ray of hope gone. Due to play today. Sub was 1689 and paid it a month ago.

Happy 1000th post Whyner

Thing is, don't really like any other course within the same distance and SC was a bit a drive anyway.

Ah we'll sort it out, Open comps here I come

Bummer, sorry to hear that.

They have been actively campaigning for new members up until very recently, they must have been aware well before today that this was a possibility. Bad form getting money out of people so soon before this happening. The management must have had a good idea how much trouble they were in.

ArielAtom · 09-05-2012 9:15am

Heard the news this morning. Called a couple of long time members. No indication this was going to happen. There does not seem to be any indication if its in receivership, administration or liquidation according to them. It does sound very.

Snakey · 09-05-2012 9:17am

Joined a few weeks ago and hadn't even got out for a round yet. I wonder is that some sort of record, 1k for zero holes of golf

Would be grateful to hear from anyone with experience of similar happening whether the GUI handicap will remain valid for the year?

Russman · 09-05-2012 9:22am

Sorry to hear that for any members. Terrible situation.

Is it definitely true then ? I've been googling away trying to find details but it doesn't seem to be anywhere.....

Dr_Colossus · 09-05-2012 9:24am

brick tamland wrote: »

How big was the membership lads?

According to the list of player names on HowDidIDo there are 682 male members and 118 female members. Now granted a certain proportion of those will be full 7 day members with the remainder being 5 day members, junior, juvenile and student members but either way it's a large player base.

The club was founded in 2002 so given the large player base and the fact that the membership subscription is rather expensive I just can't see how it couldn't be a viable ongoing concern. Closing the doors and letting the course grow to ruin is never going to repay any possible debts.

The notification of the immediate closure of the course just doesn't make sense.

SuprSi · 09-05-2012 9:24am

As an ex-member I'm devastated by this news. I loved the course and the club and only left because I was moving abroad. I was hoping to play it later this year when I visited home. Really gutted for the members.

ipitydafool · 09-05-2012 9:29am

Dr_Colossus wrote: »

According to the list of player names on HowDidIDo there are 682 male members and 118 female members. Now granted a certain proportion of those will be full 7 day members with the remainder being 5 day members, junior, juvenile and student members but either way it's a large player base.

The club was founded in 2002 so given the large player base and the fact that the membership subscription is rather expensive I just can't see how it couldn't be a viable ongoing concern. Closing the doors and letting the course grow to ruin is never going to repay any possible debts.

The notification of the immediate closure of the course just doesn't make sense.

Yeah I mean if you average the sub at a 1000 euros across the categories then you have up on 800k a year from subs alone to help in the costs of running the club. If the fact that the longer term members didnt even know anything makes it even more strange.

Russman · 09-05-2012 9:30am

Dr_Colossus wrote: »

The club was founded in 2002 so given the large player base and the fact that the membership subscription is rather expensive I just can't see how it couldn't be a viable ongoing concern..

I think they do have a history of financial trouble though, anecdotally at least, even going back to the time of them opening.
I thought they were back on the straight and narrow in the last few years though. Didn't they have a deal last year where the fee was "fixed" for 7 years or something like that ?

charlieIRL · 09-05-2012 9:32am

Whyner wrote: »

There's the last ray of hope gone. Due to play today. Sub was 1689 and paid it a month ago.

Happy 1000th post Whyner

Thing is, don't really like any other course within the same distance and SC was a bit a drive anyway.

Ah we'll sort it out, Open comps here I come

Snakey wrote: »

Joined a few weeks ago and hadn't even got out for a round yet. I wonder is that some sort of record, 1k for zero holes of golf

Would be grateful to hear from anyone with experience of similar happening whether the GUI handicap will remain valid for the year?

Ahh lads, gutted for ye. That's shocking news.

Posts like this always remind me why I will, and always will, pay my sub monthly no matter what it is.

sodbuster77 · 09-05-2012 9:33am

There has been a lot of issues lately regarding the fees charged to shareholder members and the fees being advertised to new members. A large number of shareholder members have left the club recently including a number of ex-captains. There has been views exspressed by certain members that the board were trying to force out the shareholders, the same shareholders that dipped into their own pockets when the club was in financial difficulty. I am devastated that the club has closed but am lucky that I decided to pay by direct debit at the start of the year. Its a great club with some great golf people in it and I know I have made some friends for life there.

newport2 · 09-05-2012 9:36am

This might be a stupid suggestion, but if you paid with your credit card, would that leave you any comeback? They cover against anything you buy which is not received as described. You paid for 12 months membership and only received 1 month? Might be worth a phonecall. I've made a few claims from VISA over the years and they always lived up to this cover. My laser is VISA too.

Russman · 09-05-2012 9:40am

newport2 wrote: »

This might be a stupid suggestion, but if you paid with your credit card, would that leave you any comeback? They cover against anything you buy which is not received as described. You paid for 12 months membership and only received 1 month? Might be worth a phonecall. I've made a few claims from VISA over the years and they always lived up to this cover. My laser is VISA too.

Good point, I got almost all of my sub from Total Fitness refunded by mastercard when Total Fitness shut down last year as I had paid by cr card.

brick tamland · 09-05-2012 9:41am

Lad if any of you paid by Credit Card or Visa Debit id be getting on to the company quick smart

GreeBo · 09-05-2012 9:41am

Wow.

I know lots of people who joined SC recently and they are all going to be club-less now.
Interestingly just last weekend I had heard that more than a couple SC members had moved to my own club, but I didnt think anything of it...until now.

heebusjeebus · 09-05-2012 9:44am

Russman wrote: »

Good point, I got almost all of my sub from Total Fitness refunded by mastercard when Total Fitness shut down last year as I had paid by cr card.

+1 on this. Credit card is the safest way to pay.

ipitydafool · 09-05-2012 9:47am

sodbuster77 wrote: »

There has been a lot of issues lately regarding the fees charged to shareholder members and the fees being advertised to new members. A large number of shareholder members have left the club recently including a number of ex-captains. There has been views exspressed by certain members that the board were trying to force out the shareholders, the same shareholders that dipped into their own pockets when the club was in financial difficulty. I am devastated that the club has closed but am lucky that I decided to pay by direct debit at the start of the year. Its a great club with some great golf people in it and I know I have made some friends for life there.

Who makes up the board of directors then, were they shareholding members voted onto the board? You would think if they were anyway decent the board and management would have been more open about financial difficulties and a plan to save the place could have been formulated. Id say a fuller picture will emerge over next while

sodbuster77 · 09-05-2012 9:55am

ipitydafool wrote: »

Who makes up the board of directors then, were they shareholding members voted onto the board? You would think if they were anyway decent the board and management would have been more open about financial difficulties and a plan to save the place could have been formulated. Id say a fuller picture will emerge over next while

Id assume your right in that the board must have been voted in by the shareholders. However there has been alot of anger over the way they have behaved recently. I know there was a shareholder meeting arranged for last night but I have not spoken to anyone yet who was at it.

one ill cat · 09-05-2012 10:01am

sodbuster77 wrote: »

Id assume your right in that the board must have been voted in by the shareholders. However there has been alot of anger over the way they have behaved recently. I know there was a shareholder meeting arranged for last night but I have not spoken to anyone yet who was at it.

Yeah the board was elected by the shareholders, know that for a fact.

It's funny how the last email from TF (charmain) said the club was so financially secure. How different things obv were, even when that email was sent.

sodbuster77 · 09-05-2012 10:07am

Anyway...on with the business of looking for a new club!

link_2007 · 09-05-2012 10:08am

sodbuster77 wrote: »

Anyway...on with the business of looking for a new club!

Where to start?

scubapro · 09-05-2012 10:11am

Golfwallahs thread:(

brianodub · 09-05-2012 10:14am

Sad news. Played there many times. Was maturing into a lovely course.

mike12 · 09-05-2012 10:14am

First of all sorry to all involved.
Was it a members club? Or who was it owned by?
Was it like Moyvalley where you just bought a share?
Can't see how a club that has a membership base like that can go belly up the Bar levy should have kept that breaking even. I think there are questions to be asked here.
It's a shame that they did what Turvey did and took in new members right up until they closed the doors.
I'm afraid they will be the first of maybe 5/6 clubs to fold. I'm thinking of the ones with big empty new club houses, seems now a days bars are just a drain on the clubs resourses and i can see a lot of clubs closing them down to survive.
Think it should be the first question u ask now when going for a new membership can i see the books and can i pay by direct debit.

ShriekingSheet · 09-05-2012 10:21am

Shocking news. Desperately sorry situation. The members deserve much, much better.

golfwallah · 09-05-2012 10:23am

I sympathise with members, particularly new ones who have just paid their fees (and also considering their website is still advertising for membership).

This makes you wonder how many more clubs are “on the brink”, now that 2012 membership number positions are known.

I’ve heard of 2 other clubs calling EGMs because membership numbers are down significantly. One of these clubs has also put staff on protective notice.

Judging from the shocked reaction (Turvey in 2011 and now South County), it shows that prospective new members are well advised to check out a club’s finances before joining (or reduce risk by paying monthly). Either ask for a copy of the audited accounts or get a copy for a small fee from cro.ie (if club is a limited company).

The audited accounts won’t predict a sudden fall in membership but give a good indication of last 2 years financial performance. This is better than relying totally on hype from websites, etc.

k.p.h · 09-05-2012 10:24am

Jaysus lads, this is terrible. Sorry to hear it especially since so many of ye were members.

Just one thing though, I can't really get my head around it. I'm not exactly privy to all the financial goings on with golf clubs, but what type of scenario would have to happen for this to happen..? I would have imagined that a golf club would always be better off restructuring and trying to compete and turn a profit rather than closing there doors..

one ill cat · 09-05-2012 10:26am

mike12 wrote: »

First of all sorry to all involved.
Was it a members club? Or who was it owned by?
Was it like Moyvalley where you just bought a share?
Can't see how a club that has a membership base like that can go belly up the Bar levy should have kept that breaking even. I think there are questions to be asked here.
It's a shame that they did what Turvey did and took in new members right up until they closed the doors.
I'm afraid they will be the first of maybe 5/6 clubs to fold. I'm thinking of the ones with big empty new club houses, seems now a days bars are just a drain on the clubs resourses and i can see a lot of clubs closing them down to survive.
Think it should be the first question u ask now when going for a new membership can i see the books and can i pay by direct debit.

The club was/is owned by the shareholders, who also elected the board. The land was leased.

Whyner · 09-05-2012 10:28am

ShriekingSheet wrote: »

Shocking news. Desperately sorry situation. The members deserve much, much better.

Nice move Sheet. I'll be taking this hit on the chin

one ill cat · 09-05-2012 10:28am

k.p.h wrote: »

Jaysus lads, this is terrible. Sorry to hear it especially since so many of ye were members.

Just one thing though, I can't really get my head around it. I'm not exactly privy to all the financial goings on with golf clubs, but what type of scenario would have to happen for this to happen..? I would have imagined that a golf club would always be better off restructuring and trying to compete and turn a profit rather than closing there doors..

You'd think that would be the preferred option going forward alright. Surely it would make sense to try & salvage something instead of writing the hole thing off, but it all seems so final so quickly.

the lawman · 09-05-2012 10:42am

Really sorry to hear this and feel so bad for the members and the guys on here.

Surely there must be a club that can make some form of deal for the current members at least until the end of the year? Win win for both parties if something could be arranged.

I hope all can get as much back as they can.

mike12 · 09-05-2012 10:43am

one ill cat wrote: »

The club was/is owned by the shareholders, who also elected the board. The land was leased.

So its a members club and i presume the board are all members if so its a Crap way to treat other members., Who is the land leased off. Maybe they will do a deal with the creditors and staff and then re open.
Can't see why they didn't let people know they were in diffculty before this and see if the members could come up with a way to save the club rather than just take everyones subs for the year and then shut the club.
Mike

ipitydafool · 09-05-2012 10:46am

one ill cat wrote: »

The club was/is owned by the shareholders, who also elected the board. The land was leased.

If the land was being leased for a considerable yearly sum then the long term viability of the place as a golf course would definitely have to be looked at. I wonder was this well known and in particular to the new members just paying a sub fee. Id agree with other posters a good background check on the financials of a golf course before joining nowadays is required or else pay by direct debit. The funny thing is though some of the courses being run by Nama guarantee to new members coming in that the course will stay open for the year. I know in New Forest GC in Westmeath that is the case. If the closure of South County is a final as the posters are saying i reckon the members looking for a new place, should try and meet and get a bulk membership offer from other local clubs. they might even be prepared to offer a special reduced rate for this year if a large number are joining and given your unfortunate circumstances.

Mr. Larson · 09-05-2012 10:51am

Terrible news, played the Wednesday Open there many times and always enjoyed the course, the facilities and the company of any of the members I ever played with. Sickened for the members. What a waste!

South County GC Closed

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