Should Irish be an optional subject not a cumpulsory one

deise go deo wrote: »

I think Irish should remain compulsory for the time being because I believe that the first change that needs to be made is a thorough reform of the curriculum. I see making it optional as a quick fix solution that will solve nothing.

Why should it be kept compulsory, what is so important about it?

I spoke English growing up, so did my parents...the language of my grandparents was English, the language of my great grandparents was English, etc....

It is the same story for 95% of the population. Irish is not our language and has not been for god knows how many generations. Irish is a relic, something our ancestors spoke long ago. It is absolutely ridiculous that this language is still being forced on the population in this day and age when we are losing ground economically. Irish and religion taking up 30% of primary school education time, mother of god, typical joke of a set up we have going on thanks to decades of useless politicians.

What is the point of the getting the whole country to speak Irish? What is the point in getting us all to speak in a language that our ancestors spoke 150+ years ago? Can someone tell me what is so great about that? We all grew up speaking English as did the last 'insert number here' generations of our families, English is our language and has been for a long long time. Irish has no relevance to us other than as a cultural artifact.

If we had any politicians with balls this ridiculous situation would have been righted years ago.

Can one of the pro-Irish brigade tell me what significance the Irish language has for me considering I spoke English growing up, and so did my parents, and so did their parents, and so did their parents.....etc....? What has the Irish language got to do with me? So guys with names like Cathal ó Súilleabháin or Sean ó Briain, etc...who were around 150+ years ago spoke Irish as their first language...good on them, but why does that mean Irish students should be forced to learn this language now?

It should be completely optional, and let the people who appreciate it's cultural value study it, it's crazy forcing everyone to study this language.

Steven81 wrote: »

From the census that was out recently there are a lot of foreigners in the country but we didnt need the census to prove that, learning Irish for them is a waste of time or should be changed. I would plan doing an Irish History and culture so that at least people have learned something as part of the Irish class.

Irish has to be continued to be taught in schools both primary and secondary, people talk about not using it but how many of us learned probability, x and y, sin, tan in maths and used them after?.

Good point why should kids who parents moved to Ireland be forced to learn it? Not part of they culture/history or whatever term the pro-Irish like to throw out.
I would like to say how many people use basic maths daily vs. the number that use Irish so that point is kinda moot. Also nobody said that Irish not be taught in schools. We just what the option to learn it or not.

Irish should be kept compulsory in the same way I think English and Maths and one of the sciences should be.

No subject should be compulsory. It is unfair that you need to get an exception from the subject if you have a proper reason. If it was made optional school will keep it as a subject you have to do like maths or english but if you have a proper reason that you can't do the subject then you and your parents don't have to deal with a lot of paper work to get out of the subject. Do you not think this is a fair request?

lividduck wrote: »

Declan it is clear that there is no Irish for compromise, or if there is then it has been overtaken by the Irish for intranigance.

Comhghéill.

I'm drawing a blank on "intranigance" though...

deise go deo wrote: »

Whats so important about the language? Its the first national language of the country, as for the vast majority of the population not comming from an Irish speaking background, thats true, but dont presume to speak on their behalf when you say that it has no relevance to them because of that.
Any research that has been done into peoples attuide to the Irish Language has time and again shown massive support for its preservation and promotion.
You don't like it, fine, Couldent give a monkeys tbh.

If you have a problem with Irish being compulsory, stop whining on a discussion forum about it and do something about it, seriously, are you waiting for someone else to do it for you?

We're not discussing the langauge here, we're discussing its place in the education system. Also, people don't like it and you obviously DO give a monkeys.

Again - do you feel that the language is more important than the students studying it?

Let me ask you though, If Irish is 'being forced on the population' against their will as you seem to think, why has there never been a public campaign to make it optional, seems odd dosen't it?

Because the people who are effected by it most don't vote and therefore don't matter.

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

Irish should be kept compulsory in the same way I think English and Maths and one of the sciences should be.

Why so?

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

Because I like our broad education system.

Two languages minimum. (English and Irish)
Maths.
Usually a Science subject.
Usually another language like French, German or Spanish.
Usually one/two of History, Geography or Woodwork/Construction or other.

It broadens the education and leaves College or the rest of your life to focus in on what you want to do or love to do or what you work at daily.

That doesn't answer my question - we can still have a broad subject range without any compuslory subjects. If anything, the range is better off beign entirely optional because the student can pick more relevant subjects to that they want to do.

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Why so?

Because I like our broad education system.

Two languages minimum. (English and Irish)
Maths.
Usually a Science subject.
Usually another language like French, German or Spanish.
Usually one/two of History, Geography, Woodwork/Construction, a Business subject or others.

It broadens the education and leaves College or the rest of your life to focus in on what you want to do or love to do or what you work at daily.

A better system would be
English and a europen language would be better, computer/arts subject, a science subject and a maths subject. The other spots can be filled with subjects you what to.
Any way a bit of topic.
So you can't think of a better reason then you like it?
Is that not a bit selfish?

It is like college you get a choice in some aspects and not in others. If it was 100% choice then most students would all rush the easier subjects to get higher points and would not get a wide education.

On the other point - students can pick a european language and a computer and/or arts subject in the current system. Compulsory Irish does not disallow them from this.

I did not like Irish in school nor did I like Maths or French. So that is not the reason I argue for it's continued compulsion.

lividduck wrote: »

And the whole thing costs about a Billion euro a year, thats one expensive hobby!

Do you have a source for how much it costs? I've heard so many different figures.

Again, not making any sense and not answering the question.

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

It is like college you get a choice in some aspects and not in others. If it was 100% choice then most students would all rush the easier subjects to get higher points and would not get a wide education.

Eh... wha?

You KNOW they'd do the easier subjects...?
The easier subjects give higher points...?

On the other point - students can pick a european language and a computer and/or arts subject in the current system. Compulsory Irish does not disallow them from this.

Not relevant.

I did not like Irish in school nor did I like Maths or French. So that is not the reason I argue for it's continued compulsion.

Still waiting for you to tell me what ARE the reasons.

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

After having a broad education for 13 years.



It is our national language. (whether you like it or not, whether the majority speak it or not)
It has cultural and historical benefits.
I like multi-lingualism, hence me saying several times English and other language should be taught along with Irish.

The main reason though is it has been compulsory for 84-90 years and not once has a majority had a problem with it being compulsory.

I don't think you actually read the posts you're responding to.

You stated you think compulsory subjects is a good thing. I asked why. After many badly thought out arguments and condtractions, you are now telling me that the reason compulsory subjects is a good thing is that they're part of our national language, have good historical benefits and because you like multi-lingualism.

You, like others, also seem to think that Irish is massively important to everyone. It isn't.

You seen to think culture and heritage are beautiful wonferful things that are beyond question. They aren't.

You're going to have to accept that people think differently to you. Some of them are 15. Some of them know what they want in life, and it's not hertiage and culture. Why the **** is this so hard to understand?