Council vote on new Westside Tesco

factual lies · 30-01-2012 7:01am

Just on the naming of the area, there is actual nowhere officially called "Westside". This was just a name given to the land which lays westof the corrib. Going on the old land markings the new Tesco site is in Shantalla, the opposite side of the seamus quirke road is Newcastle and Highfield is actually part of rahoon. I have no links to these maps, just really old maps that my father has that date back to 1900's.

fishy fishy · 30-01-2012 12:21pm

Maverick Kind Teapot wrote: »

No problem Fishy Fish-I'll explain it to you. A disadvantaged area is classified under the following headings:
Dependency and unemployment,
Social Class and education
Vulnerable Groups
Resources

Under all of these categories, Galway City Council has named Westside and 4 other areas of Galway City as "disadvantaged". One such report identifying Westside as a disadvantaged area is Galway City Council's Rapid Strategic Plan. There are many other City Council and DoCHLG (and former DoEHLG) reports also naming Westside as a disadvantaged area. Almost all documents are in the public domain if you want verification on this.

I thought I had already stated the reasons that bringing commercial business to an area can be advantageous. Take Sandyford, Dublin 18 for example. It is the only area of Dublin where property has not dramatically decreased in value. This was on the RTE news last week.....it was said that the large amount of commercial and industrial units in the area (90% of which were built in latter years) ensured that Sandyford properties have not decreased on the same scale as any other area of Dublin. There is also a report from Daft.ie stating this from 2011.

So, in essence, bringing a large commercial
retailer to an area will bring money into the area, employment etc.

People, by their nature, tend to like living close to amenities. Hence you always see auctioneers' adverts for properties stating such things as "located within close proximity to x,y,z.....". It is likely that having a decent supermarket in close proximity would increase desire to buy/rent in the area, thus pushing up rents and house prices in the long term.

Obviously civil infrastructure would have to be in place before any such development could be considered (or at least should be conditional on planning).

But all in all, I think it could improve the area greatly and perhaps even shake up Dunnes in Westside to give the place there a face lift too!

Hope that helped clear it up for you Fishy Fish.

I'm sorry Girlee, but your posts are very confusing - you either don't know anything about the "Westside" or else you don't know anything about where they want to put the Tesco.

Can I ask - what are do you refer to when you speak of the "Westside". How can you say that it is a disadvantaged area? Do you know that the Westside of the town is anything one the West side of the bridge, and The East side would be anything on the other side of the bridge.

If you are talking about specific pockets on the West side of town, (every area has them, not exclusive to the West Side might I add) it doesn't bode with your opinion on the Tesco. Do you actually know the plans for the tesco and where it is built - are you saying the people of Maunsells, Highfield, Shantalla, are the "disadvantaged" areas of the Westside.

I think maybe you should find out about the "westside" or find out about the plans for tesco before you slate one half of the town. Don't you? - hope that clarifies that for you girlee.

fishy fishy · 30-01-2012 12:41pm

Maverick Kind Teapot wrote: »

It is proposed to have access onto BIshop O'Donnell Road, the section of which is in Westside.

And no Highfield Pk is not a disadvantaged estate. But Westside IS a disadvantaged area. Highfield would not technically (I think, don't have a townland map to hand) be in Westside. I am referring to the Westside area as being categorised as disadvantaged. That said not everyone who lives there is disadvantaged. But Westside is disadvantaged. And the fact that the proposed access and egress is to be onto Bishop O'D Rd will mean that this development will be in Westside!

Edited to add: I have checked out Galway City Council's designated zones. O'Huigin's site is indeed in Westside. Highfield is not. Therefore, under the zoning, the development will be in Westside and is also in the 'disadvantaged' zone, as highlighted in the Strategic plan I mentioned on a previous post (page 33 of this Galway City Co.plan). IMO bringing business to an area like this is beneficial for all reasons previously stated.

as I thought, you don't really understand the plans? Take a walk up to the site and see for yourself exactly where it is located. You might be able to get a picture of what is going on, instead of depending on looking at it on paper.

Doc Ruby · 30-01-2012 1:16pm

I'd like to see a proper mall there instead of another supermarket, there are two of them in very close proximity already, a third is really not needed. Set up a load of small to medium sized retail units there, restaurants, maybe a gym or something. Anything but another supermarket tbh. Offices even.

Oh and the westside may be listed as disadvantaged, but as far as I'm aware they get EU assistance for areas listed as such, so take that any way you like.

Mrs OBumble · 30-01-2012 2:24pm

gordongekko wrote: »

no no what you said as it wont create employment. where is the proof of this? im neither pro nor against this development but i find it hard to believe no jobs will be created by the opening of this retail park. Can you link me the proof that no jobs will be gained.

At very least, there will be jobs building the damn thing. (no matter what gets built).

Mrs OBumble · 30-01-2012 2:30pm

fishy fishy wrote: »

... Do you know that the Westside of the town is anything one the West side of the bridge, and The East side would be anything on the other side of the bridge.

If you are talking about specific pockets on the West side of town, (every area has them, not exclusive to the West Side might I add) it doesn't bode with your opinion on the Tesco. Do you actually know the plans for the tesco and where it is built - are you saying the people of Maunsells, Highfield, Shantalla, are the "disadvantaged" areas of the Westside.

I think maybe you should find out about the "westside" or find out about the plans for tesco before you slate one half of the town. Don't you? - hope that clarifies that for you girlee.

fishy, what area do you believe that Corrib Park, Inishhannagh Park, Gaelcarraig Park, John Coogan Park - and Siobhan McKenna Rd itself - are in?

Hint: maybe you can use google to find some of the older thread explaining the difference between

the west side of the city
Westside
The West

snubbleste · 30-01-2012 2:36pm

Also:
Galway West
Tesco galway(west)
Galway north west central
Galway west central
Galway south west central
western galway
city west
western town
town west
shannieland
the whest
Tesco west

antoobrien · 30-01-2012 2:37pm

ladhrann wrote: »

The point I believe is that large mall-style developments such as this will on average cause a net loss of jobs in a given area. Not only would smaller businesses tend to shut, but all the suppliers and ancillary services such as accountants, cleaners, lawyers etc. that were employed by those businesses will be under threat.

I'd love to see what evidence you have of that since many of the experiences I have seen are to the contrary.

So I'll ask you a question, have you been to the shopping center in Briarhill?

The newsagent is doing a nice business, as is the chemist, cafe & others - all of which are new businesses.

The Coynes (top of Doughisha rd), Centra (middle of Doughisha), Spar in Rosshill/Roscam (just the other side of the Dublin Rd) and Spar (in Ballybrit) shops within a mile of the Dunnes & Lidl are all still open and appear to have a nice trade.

In the GSC, the fruit & veg shop and (Tormeys I think) butchers are doing well despite being right beside a Tesco.

fishy fishy · 30-01-2012 3:14pm

JustMary wrote: »

fishy, what area do you believe that Corrib Park, Inishhannagh Park, Gaelcarraig Park, John Coogan Park - and Siobhan McKenna Rd itself - are in?

Hint: maybe you can use google to find some of the older thread explaining the difference between

the west side of the city
Westside
The West

hi just mary - Im getting used to you haveing a go at any of my posts (I think just for the sake of it mostly). If you read my posts above you will notice that I said there were POCKETS of the west side that could be classed as more disadvantaged, as there are POCKETS of the East side and every other side also. To describe the West Side in general as girlee did is doing a disservice to not only the people living in the wider Westside area, but to the people reading these posts. The thread is about the tesco building so do try to keep on topic instead of having a go for the sake of it. Thanking you.

http://galwaycity.galway-ireland.ie/suburbs.htm

fishy fishy · 30-01-2012 4:41pm

re. the "jobs" excuse for it being a good thing

No matter WHERE this building is built, there will be jobs to go with it. The "jobs" issue is not exclusive to where it is being built. More than likely the "jobs" will be contractors from OUTSIDE the area, so the comment that it is a good thing because it will create "jobs" in the area is a non-runner. The jobs come no matter where the thing is built and the people being hired will not be exclusive to the area in which it will be built.

factual lies · 31-01-2012 2:23am

JustMary wrote: »

fishy, what area do you believe that Corrib Park, Inishhannagh Park, Gaelcarraig Park, John Coogan Park - and Siobhan McKenna Rd itself - are in?

Hint: maybe you can use google to find some of the older thread explaining the difference between

the west side of the city
Westside
The West

all those housing estates are in "NEWCASTLE".

fishy fishy · 31-01-2012 9:56am

JustMary wrote: »

fishy, what area do you believe that Corrib Park, Inishhannagh Park, Gaelcarraig Park, John Coogan Park - and Siobhan McKenna Rd itself - are in?

Hint: maybe you can use google to find some of the older thread explaining the difference between

the west side of the city
Westside
The West

I don't need to google justmary, I know exactly what the various places are called on the Westside. To date, there is no estate called Westside. There is a "Westside" shopping centre who caters for ALL THE ESTATES IN THE WEST SIDE OF THE CITY. Maybe it's you who should "google"

31-01-2012 11:55am

Westside is designated as a Rapid area by the city council - page 31 of the following rather large PDF contains a map of Westside as designated by the city council for the rapid program.http://www.galwaycity.ie/AllServices/CommunityCulture/Publications/FileEnglish,656,en.pdf

Mrs OBumble · 31-01-2012 2:05pm

fishy fishy wrote: »

I don't need to google justmary, I know exactly what the various places are called on the Westside. To date, there is no estate called Westside. There is a "Westside" shopping centre who caters for ALL THE ESTATES IN THE WEST SIDE OF THE CITY. Maybe it's you who should "google"

I have indeed been googling. I spent some of yesterday evening drawing a map of supermarkets in the "metropolitan area". http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=214062428912677824250.0004b7bf2f129eb6aa233&msa=0&ll=53.302569,-9.031792&spn=0.076014,0.182476

It shows quite graphically the relative shortage of 'em west of the river - making me even more in favour of the proposal - provided the truck access off suburban Rahoon Rd can be resolved.

Complain as much as you want, but in my mind there IS any area called Westside, and it's a good deal more disadvantaged than Knocknacarra or Barna or the Claddagh or Taylors Hill or Highfield (all parts of "west side" in your definitions). That doesn't mean that all individuals living there are disadvantaged - just the area as a whole is, because many people are.

antoobrien · 31-01-2012 2:58pm

JustMary wrote: »

I have indeed been googling. I spent some of yesterday evening drawing a map of supermarkets in the "metropolitan area". http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=214062428912677824250.0004b7bf2f129eb6aa233&msa=0&ll=53.302569,-9.031792&spn=0.076014,0.182476

:eek:

I knew the situation was bad but I didn't think it was that unbalanced.

Now to write my submission to the HSE explaining why they should move the hospital lock stock & barrel to merlin park and bulldoze uchg

Robbo · 31-01-2012 3:07pm

Has "Being able to define West Side to within a 100 meter radius" become the new test for "blow ins", replacing the controversial "Trace your lineage over 7 generations to include at least 3 Kings of the Claddagh"?

fishy fishy · 31-01-2012 3:38pm

JustMary wrote: »

I have indeed been googling. I spent some of yesterday evening drawing a map of supermarkets in the "metropolitan area". http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=214062428912677824250.0004b7bf2f129eb6aa233&msa=0&ll=53.302569,-9.031792&spn=0.076014,0.182476

It shows quite graphically the relative shortage of 'em west of the river - making me even more in favour of the proposal - provided the truck access off suburban Rahoon Rd can be resolved.

Complain as much as you want, but in my mind there IS any area called Westside, and it's a good deal more disadvantaged than Knocknacarra or Barna or the Claddagh or Taylors Hill or Highfield (all parts of "west side" in your definitions). That doesn't mean that all individuals living there are disadvantaged - just the area as a whole is, because many people are.

must be true then.

antoobrien · 31-01-2012 4:10pm

fishy fishy wrote: »

must be true then.

Lets not get facts involved in the matter at all then.

Westside is one of the areas in Galway that is part of the RAPID scheme, as outlined by pg633's post.

Deleted User wrote: »

Westside is designated as a Rapid area by the city council - page 31 of the following rather large PDF contains a map of Westside as designated by the city council for the rapid program.http://www.galwaycity.ie/AllServices/CommunityCulture/Publications/FileEnglish,656,en.pdf

Some details:

RAPID stands for Revitalising Areas through Planning Investment and Development.

It is a focused Government initiative to target the 45 most disadvantaged urban areas and provincial towns in the country. The implementation of the RAPID programme is led by the Department of Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs.

Galway City was awarded RAPID status under Strand II (Provincial Towns) of the programme in February 2002 and five areas within the City have been selected.

The Five areas selected within Galway City are:
Westside
Ballinfoile
Bohermore
New Mervue
Ballybane

The map given for Westside is:

Can we now move on please?

fishy fishy · 31-01-2012 4:18pm

looks like a lot of areas to me, that Westside.

Sponge Bob · 31-01-2012 4:22pm

The map includes Shantalla, bet they are simply delighted.

fishy fishy · 31-01-2012 4:45pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

The map includes Shantalla, bet they are simply delighted.

TBH, I wouldn't care what map it is included on if I could have bought a house there when I was buying. But glad to see it proves that westside covers Many areas, only some of which are "disadvantaged" - whatever that means.

factual lies · 01-02-2012 8:05am

thats a mad map considering in certain areas of shantalla, one side of the road is included in it and the other side not (Ashe Road for example). What idiot came up with this.

P.S. Shantalla has never and will never be part of the westside!

Sponge Bob · 01-02-2012 9:10am

Last 2 days to object to this ridiculous plan and to the mess it will make of the congested Séamus Quirke Road.

Mrs OBumble · 01-02-2012 2:52pm

antoobrien wrote: »

I knew the situation was bad but I didn't think it was that unbalanced.

Now to write my submission to the HSE explaining why they should move the hospital lock stock & barrel to merlin park and bulldoze uchg

I used to think that too - until I drew a map of hospitals in Galway, and noticed that moving UHG's services to Merlin would leave no hospital at all on the west side of the river. Wouldn't be too handy if a big flood, for example, wiped out two of the bridges.

_Whimsical_ · 01-02-2012 5:56pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Last 2 days to object to this ridiculous plan and to the mess it will make of the congested Séamus Quirke Road.

Have to echo these sentiments. Its not only an issue for people living beside the site but for everyone who is getting home every night to Knocknacarra who thinks the traffic is ridiculous already. Please if you're against it lodge an objection.

galwaycyclist · 02-02-2012 3:00pm

Robbo wrote: »

Has "Being able to define West Side to within a 100 meter radius" become the new test for "blow ins", replacing the controversial "Trace your lineage over 7 generations to include at least 3 Kings of the Claddagh - Like"?

FYP

antoobrien · 02-02-2012 3:29pm

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

Have to echo these sentiments. Its not only an issue for people living beside the site but for everyone who is getting home every night to Knocknacarra who thinks the traffic is ridiculous already. Please if you're against it lodge an objection.

I see your point but, consider this point.

There's a lot of traffic attempting to get over the QB from the Western half of CO Galway that may use this facility instead.

How do you know that it won't reduce or redistribute the overall level of traffic on the road?

When the motorway opened, the traffic switched from trying to get into town along the Monivea Road to using the motorway & dc instead. Also the opening of Dunnes hasn't (that I can see) increased the levels of traffic in Briarhill, just changed the nature of it and when it builds up.

A quick look at Google earth tells me that Briarhill is about the same size (possibly bigger) that the Tesco proposal in Westside.

The problem with Briarhill is the location of the entrance, not the existence of the shopping center (as you seem to believe). I think that the fact that there are two proper entrances for Tesco will make access better than it is in Briarhill.

galwaycyclist · 02-02-2012 3:43pm

Apparently there were about 30 observations in on this by lunchtime today with more people coming in. The following was logged on behalf of the Cycling Campaign. Looking at the plans it appears the traffic circulation for the car parks could be handled entirely within the site without any need to go out onto Rahoon Rd. I think the closing date is Monday so people still have tomorrow to make observations.

On behalf of the committee I wish to make an observation on the above planning application.
This development backs onto the southern end of the Rahoon Rd. If it proceeds, then in our view no access whatever for motor vehicles should be permitted onto Rahoon Rd.

The Rahoon Rd./Shantalla Rd corridor represents the primary walking and cycling route into the West of the City Centre from the Rahoon/Fort Lorenzo/East Knocknacarra catchment. It is also functions as the main route for schoolchildren from this catchment trying to reach the secondary schools concentrated in the West of the City Centre. These include St Mary's, St. Joseph's Patrician College, Coláiste Iognáid, the Presentation Secondary. Some of these schools also have associated national schools. In addition there is a national school located on Shantalla Road itself. The corridor also serves as a route to the Taylors hill secondary and primary schools from both the catchment named above and the Shantalla district. The above catchments also act as a dormitory area for students attending the language schools concentrated in the city centre. Many of these students hire and use bicycles for the duration of their stay in Galway. In addition the adjacent Dun Arus Student Village and Glean Dara estates house many University students, particularly overseas students, in rented accommodation.

The road itself is quite narrow in parts, with lanes widths that do not permit overtaking of cyclists by motor vehicles when there is oncoming traffic. Provided traffic levels are kept low and of an appropriate mix, it still represents an adequate cycling and walking route. Given its existing function within the transportation infrastructure of the city, it is not suitable as a route for delivery vehicles particularly HGVs or other types of heavy commercial vehicles. The narrowness of the roads also renders it unsuitable as a route for private motor cars accessing the retail services proposed for the development. All such traffic should be directed to the new Seamus Quirke Rd corridor to the North of the site.

Notwithstanding the above observations, suitable foot and cycle access should be provided both to the site from the Rahoon Rd, and through the site to the Seamus Quirke Rd.

Yours faithfully,

fishy fishy · 02-02-2012 4:03pm

galwaycyclist wrote: »

Apparently there were about 30 observations in on this by lunchtime today with more people coming in. The following was logged on behalf of the Cycling Campaign. Looking at the plans it appears the traffic circulation for the car parks could be handled entirely within the site without any need to go out onto Rahoon Rd. I think the closing date is Monday so people still have tomorrow to make observations.

good letter, and it highlights one of the major problems on the shantalla/rahoon road - that of the massive trucks coming on on the tesco site to drop their deliveries early morning (the back of the store will be facing this) it will also have the added "bonus" of ramps being loaded as the proposed shop will be "on a higher level". Add this to what is already a bad area for traffice and it's chaos.

but sure, when it comes to being on th side of a fellow counciillor (ex councillor) the general public can just to a bug*er off.

what is so annoying is that the seller had no qualms about putting objections in to apartments near his private residence. and he's trying to imply that putting in this tesco will be "for the good of the residents". how stupid does he think people are. he got what he wanted, he will take the money and run. He couldn't care less about anything else.

inisboffin · 02-02-2012 5:45pm

The limited motor vehicle access via Rahoon Rd is a very valid point. I assume, however, that even if access for delivery vans is from a different entrance, the 24 hour noise problem for residents will still be there, as the bay doors will still be in the same place and the will still be doing their unloading and *beep beep beeps* there?

Council vote on new Westside Tesco

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