What is happening to young people in the UK?

Doc Ruby · 28-11-2011 10:19AM

Foxhound38 wrote: »

That attitude, while understandible, doesn't really answer the question about why it is happening to the extent it is though. Clearly, there is some kind of systemic problem in the UK to see a this extent of a rise in youth crime in the short time it has taken?

The problem as usual is social in nature, in my opinion. You have a culture in some parts where the police are viewed as a rival gang rather than the duly authorised enforcers of the laws we all agree to follow.

So it builds up into a culture where if you call the police for help, everyone around you turns on you, which puts whole communities at the mercy of vicious thugs and gangsters, a woeful state of affairs entirely of their own making and stupidity. Obviously children growing up there are going to feel they can do what they like, without parental supervision or fear of consequence.

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face in the name of puffed up schoolyard bravado.

Ellis Dee · 28-11-2011 10:24AM

As the veteran Portlaoise politician Joe "the Hesh" McCormack once famously said: "It's not the parents I blame. It's the mothers and fathers.";);)

Oranage2 · 28-11-2011 10:31AM

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Yup, it's all the fault of the blacks mate. Well done. :rolleyes:

It was sarcasm now run along you'll be late for school.

W.Shakes-Beer · 28-11-2011 10:31AM

That story is dreadfully sad, and unfortunately becoming the norm almost.

Scum like that don't deserve the petty few years in prison and then released back into society.

Bringing back the death penalty might make scum think twice about their actions.

Dionysus · 28-11-2011 10:39AM

LordSutch wrote: »

Very true, the UK with a population of approximately sixty million people is bound to have proportionately more crime than a small country like Ireland with a population of 4.2 million people!

Proportionately more? I'm surprised you'd admit that.

biko · 28-11-2011 10:42AM

chucken1 wrote: »

May I say? the Dubs come in here with similar stories,so its not just in the uk?

Or is it?.........

Ellian · 28-11-2011 10:47AM

jayteecork wrote: »

I presume you're joking or did you just get off a time machine from Victorian times?

I was waiting for the punchline that this was an excerpt from a newspaper op-ed from the 1850's..

Rookster · 28-11-2011 10:49AM

The big problem in the UK is the number of families without a father figure. Added to this is the high separation/divorce rate there.

bobbysands81 · 28-11-2011 10:52AM

Oranage2 wrote: »

It was sarcasm now run along you'll be late for school.

Apologies are due so, it went completely over my head.

ejmaztec · 28-11-2011 10:53AM

Most of the little sh1ts in the UK have enough knowledge to qualify as lawyers specialising in criminal law and human rights. The only thing holding them back is illiteracy.

MrThrifty · 28-11-2011 10:56AM

Put it down to a combo of society and parenting issues myself... Am connected with the childcare sector here and all I can say is that there are huge problems coming down the road for us. People (not men obviously) are generally popping out babies these days like there's no tomorrow - I suspect they'd often spend longer considering whether to buy a pet dog than to have a child. I see many couples with blatant relationship issues having a child without batting an eyelid or in some cases in the hope that it will fix things. And while some reading this might like to assume I'm referring to lower class folk, it applies across the board and to a relatively large percentage of couples out there (i.e. many boardsies users). Some other issues relate to poor parenting whereby couples adopt the attitude 'sure we'll pick it up as we go along' or 'sure there aren't books on this kind of thing' (quoted by an expectant mother on that RTE maternity series aired in the last year)! Anyway, this is all only half the problem but it ties in with the societal ones.

Oranage2 · 28-11-2011 10:57AM

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Apologies are due so, it went completely over my head.

I apologise too, my post was a little condesending and my original post wasnt that clear.

44leto · 28-11-2011 10:58AM

Some seem to have a dislocation from the wider society. They don't feel part of it. It's what happens in a place with a stark division of wealth. Its one of the legacies of the Thatcher era. The wealth division has grown in the UK and for that matter it is widening in the world.

I don't know what you can do about that, the reality is globalisation, you can't have the state sponsored industry, protectionism or trade barriers anymore. The reality is some young people are growing up and knowing that a lot of them are not going to have careers, so they owe society nothing.

I am originally from a tough area and OP, there I see a bunch of teens with similar attitudes.

spoofilyj · 28-11-2011 11:03AM

The-Rigger wrote: »

The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.

Is that a quote from the 1800's?

I think every generation thinks that the younger generation growing up is worse and less well mannered than the one that went before.

While there seems to be a lot of scumbag young people out there, I think that because we now hear every but of bad news from all over the world almost immeadiately and that the media love to spin things up into a frenzy, when statistics show that we have never had such a low crime rate I dont think that the moral fiber of society is about to collapse...

desertcircus · 28-11-2011 11:06AM

W.Shakes-Beer wrote: »

That story is dreadfully sad, and unfortunately becoming the norm almost.

Bringing back the death penalty might make scum think twice about their actions.

Except violent crime is far less prevalent than when the death penalty was in place, and there's no evidence that such a penalty actually works as a deterrent. But by all means go ahead and demand that a fourteen-year-old child be killed by the state.

pickarooney · 28-11-2011 11:16AM

There's no fear of God in these youngsters any more. There's your problem.

ejmaztec · 28-11-2011 11:24AM

Giving them a severe talking to obviously doesn't work, so the authorities are going to have to allow the teachers and parents to give them a good kicking once a week. If they still persist, it's lobotomy time.

ICANN · 28-11-2011 11:36AM

Well I teach in secondary schools in the UK at the moment and I swear I never want to raise a child in this country!!! It's true what someone said a while ago- they have no fear whatsoever of anyone or anything. There's on-site police men in loads of schools and the students don't give a toss about them. They have everything given to them too- one boy who has anger issues goes for anger management and goes to snow-boarding classes (missing subjects like english and maths) as part of his anger management therapy.

The wannabe gangsta thing is big here too and they aaaallllll talk like 'swear down fam', 'truss blad' 'blad blad blad'. It really gets on my nerves. Their education system really panders to students- teachers can't restrain fighting students for fear of being accused of assault. If you watch educating essex- that's the attitude they have and that's one the better public schools over here!!

Lollipops23 · 28-11-2011 12:02PM

ICANN wrote: »

Well I teach in secondary schools in the UK at the moment and I swear I never want to raise a child in this country!!! It's true what someone said a while ago- they have no fear whatsoever of anyone or anything.

That's a good insight from the teaching perspective- I take it your Irish? So they are worse in the UK than here? It's something I was wondering when the riots were breaking out in England, if similar could happen here.

Lollipops23 · 28-11-2011 12:07PM

Rookster wrote: »

The big problem in the UK is the number of families without a father figure. Added to this is the high separation/divorce rate there.

woah, that's a crock of shíte. I'm from a so-called "broken home" and never had the urge to mug a granny.
Piss poor parenting and single parenting are very different things.

BO-JANGLES · 28-11-2011 12:17PM

chucken1 wrote: »

May I say? the Dubs come in here with similar stories,so its not just in the uk?

So it it only Dublin or does crime happen in other parts of Ireland outside Dublin?

Fratton Fred · 28-11-2011 12:20PM

Lollipops23 wrote: »

That's a good insight from the teaching perspective- I take it your Irish? So they are worse in the UK than here? It's something I was wondering when the riots were breaking out in England, if similar could happen here.

Of course it could, christ they happen pretty regularly in Dublin, every 17th March and 31st October.

Add in that Dublin has the highest level of gun crime per capita in europe and I'm not sure Ireland is that much better.

If you grow up in Ballybackfart and end up teaching in Ballyfermot high, how much of a culture shock is that?

Christ, if you want to see what this country is really like, try getting the Luas Red line from Hueston to Tallaght of an evening.

ICANN · 28-11-2011 12:21PM

Lollipops23 wrote: »

That's a good insight from the teaching perspective- I take it your Irish? So they are worse in the UK than here? It's something I was wondering when the riots were breaking out in England, if similar could happen here.

Yeah I was shocked when I first moved over. The worst classes in Irish schools are an average class here. It's rare for students to be expelled from schools- last week one of the (female) teachers was punched in the face by a 16 year old and the schools response was sign him up for gardening therapy (yeah they have horticultural therapy in my school....) and a year seven (11 years old) told the dinner lady to 'hurry the **** up and give me my lunch cos I'm starving'- he got a detention that he never turned up to!

Yahew · 28-11-2011 12:21PM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Yep.

If you're really interested watch this video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ramBFRt1Uzk

There has been a clear uptick in violence since the 60's, that reversed in the US ( largely due to incarceration) but not in Ireland, or the UK.

Since that is within what people remember, Pinker's arguments - whilst true for the long term - are not useful here.

hooradiation · 28-11-2011 12:29PM

The-Rigger wrote: »

The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.

I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on the frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words.
When I was a boy, we were taught to be discrete and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise and impatient of restraint.

28-11-2011 12:32PM

spoofilyj wrote: »

Is that a quote from the 1800's?

About 400 BC
socrates

Duckworth_Luas · 28-11-2011 12:33PM

hooradiation wrote: »

I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on the frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words.
When I was a boy, we were taught to be discrete and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise and impatient of restraint.

I never knew ancient Greece had such a knacker problem!

hooradiation · 28-11-2011 12:36PM

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

I never knew ancient Greece had such a knacker problem!

People getting older and complaining is a predictable and stupid phenomenon as old as the human race, it would seem.

pickarooney · 28-11-2011 12:37PM

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

I never knew ancient Greece had such a knacker problem!

It was a regular problem to walk down the streets of Rhodes and be confronted by a low-browed gaggle of youths who would address you with "Are you Spartan?"

RichieC · 28-11-2011 12:38PM

It amazes me that people think this stuff is new... It is'nt.

Blame the immigrants sure. They make a grand scapegoat...

What is happening to young people in the UK?

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