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https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2055940817/signature-rules

learner driver changes and new rule for test passers

2

Comments

  • #32
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    loobylou wrote: »
    Nobody here (to my knowledge) suggested you did.
    That said I'm sure you did not always drive at the speed limit which is what you are suggesting other learners should be doing.
    I know exactly what Booksale meant.
    Sometimes I am driving a car with L plates. It seems to enrage some people who (weirdly) seem to think that if they drive very close behind me it will make me go faster.
    If I do that journey in a car without L plates, (same driving manner/same speed), people do not tailgate me.
    Go figure:confused:
    I did. I am suggesting learners should be driving at the speed limit. It is dangerous to be on the road if you are below the spped limit. You are causing an obstruction; even in the test you are marked if you do not drive at the limit.


  • #33
    loobylou
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,418 ✭✭✭loobylou


    I agree with you only to the extent that, if conditions allow, drivers should drive at the speed limit.
    What you must allow is that this is not always feasable for a learner.
    Would you expect a learner on maybe his 2nd or 3rd lesson, probably working on proper steering, to be driving at 60 or 80 kph? Did you?
    Thats why they have L plates, so other road users can make allowances for their inexperience.
    You especially, as a recently qualified driver, should understand this.


  • #34
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    loobylou wrote: »
    I agree with you only to the extent that, if conditions allow, drivers should drive at the speed limit.
    What you must allow is that this is not always feasable for a learner.
    Would you expect a learner on maybe his 2nd or 3rd lesson, probably working on proper steering, to be driving at 60 or 80 kph? Did you?
    Thats why they have L plates, so other road users can make allowances for their inexperience.
    You especially, as a recently qualified driver, should understand this.
    I never went onto a public road until I felt confident and able to keep to the speed of following traffic.

    My first 1 or2 times driving was in an industrial estate at the weekend!


  • #35
    challengemaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,930 ✭✭✭✭challengemaster


    Idd, - The L means you're learning, it doesn't give you a free pass to be an obstruction.

    Same mentality that hazard warning lights mean you can park wherever the hell you want.


  • #36
    loobylou
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,418 ✭✭✭loobylou


    Perhaps some people have more of an aptitude for driving than others.
    Maybe it came easily to you.
    Back in the real world though its not so easy. Thats why these restrictions are put on learners. You cannot expect learners to drive to the same standard as experienced drivers, if that were the case we would'nt need a driving test.

    Anyway, this is all off topic:(


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  • #37
    bedrock#1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 514 ✭✭✭bedrock#1


    To all those discussing the speed LIMIT..... it is just that..... the LIMIT..... NOT the speed you must drive at.... the clue is in the title.... :rolleyes:


  • #38
    loobylou
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,418 ✭✭✭loobylou


    bedrock#1 wrote: »
    To all those discussing the speed LIMIT..... it is just that..... the LIMIT..... NOT the speed you must drive at.... the clue is in the title.... :rolleyes:

    Please no.... we've already been here .. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056012969


  • #39
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    bedrock#1 wrote: »
    To all those discussing the speed LIMIT..... it is just that..... the LIMIT..... NOT the speed you must drive at.... the clue is in the title.... :rolleyes:
    Tell that to the RSA then.

    You will fail your test if you drive consistently below the speed limit (ie do 30 kmh in a 50 zone).

    Heres a rolleyes back at you, does it make my post worthwhile too?
    :rolleyes::rolleyes:


  • #40
    booksale
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 436 ✭✭booksale


    I am reading a book called 'Steer Clear - Driver Education Manual. The key to safer driving on Irish roads'. It said in the book that the speed limit is not a target you have to meet. 'The purpose of a speed limit is to inform you of the maximum safe speed that has been determined for the road in optimum conditions'. It also said 'Because you wont always drive in ideal circumstances, you need to accout for road conditions, the weather, unusal traffic, vulerable road users, your alertness, how far you can see and anything else that may pose a harzard or hamper your ability to detect one - and then reduce your speed as appropriate.'

    Learners and newly passed drivers are having less alertness, road experiences and capacity, I dont think it's unreasonable for them to drive a bit slower than the speed limit.

    My driving experience so far (in city or on country road) is that even I am doing the speed limit (may it be 50km/h, 60km/h, 80km/h, 100km/h etc), a lot of cars behind me would still overtake me.

    Of course I have done under the speed limit, but as I said, I was not unbearable slow, not 30km/h on a 50km/h road anyway.


  • #41
    challengemaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,930 ✭✭✭✭challengemaster


    Most people dont exactly stick to the limits because either the council picked them out of a hat, or 'optimum conditions' was deemed during a flood in the middle of winter

    I've driven on plenty of roads around the country, and I don't honestly believe there's one correctly assigned speed limit. You could find roads with as good a roads surface as the m4/m6 yet 80km/h, and random drops to 50km/h in places where there's no change in road conditions. And everyone knows about the local 1 car width road that has a speed limit of 80km/h as well...


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  • #42
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    challengemaster wrote: »
    Most people dont exactly stick to the limits because either the council picked them out of a hat, or 'optimum conditions' was deemed during a flood in the middle of winter

    I've driven on plenty of roads around the country, and I don't honestly believe there's one correctly assigned speed limit. You could find roads with as good a roads surface as the m4/m6 yet 80km/h, and random drops to 50km/h in places where there's no change in road conditions. And everyone knows about the local 1 car width road that has a speed limit of 80km/h as well...
    Not to mention how roads automatically get moved from 100 kmh to 80 kmh when there is a toll road opened!


  • #43
    face1990
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,039 ✭✭✭face1990


    I'm learning to drive at the moment, and I have found that even when I'm driving at the speed limit, progressing steadily, other drivers tailgate and make ridiculous & dangerous maneuvers to get past me.
    Even in the instructors car, with the pyramid of Ls on the roof, they do the same.

    I'd be worried an R plate could lead to the same responses from other motorists, which I don't think would make it any safer for inexperienced drivers. My L plate doesn't make me feel safer or more confident on the road and I look forward to being rid of it.


  • #44
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


  • #45
    ihateclowns11
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭ihateclowns11


    So i have applied for my bike test and should be doing it in about 8 weeks or so,if i pass will that mean i dont have to wear a retard sticker (r sticker),because i passed before december when rules come into effect.Or have these retard plates come into effect now?


  • #46
    MascotDec85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    ihateclowns11 wrote: »
    So i have applied for my bike test and should be doing it in about 8 weeks or so,if i pass will that mean i dont have to wear a retard sticker (r sticker),because i passed before december when rules come into effect.Or have these retard plates come into effect now?

    Nice phrasing :rolleyes: But no, a "R" plate will not apply to you


  • #47
    XDivaX
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 171 ✭✭XDivaX


    Hi

    Wondering what those new rules mean for newly qualified drivers- I passed test at end of March but only got around to sending away for full licence. Read something about 6points or something?? :confused:


  • #48
    mle1324
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭mle1324


    XDivaX wrote: »
    Hi

    Wondering what those new rules mean for newly qualified drivers- I passed test at end of March but only got around to sending away for full licence. Read something about 6points or something?? :confused:

    New rules don't affect you as you already had your permit before April.


  • #49
    elbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 240 ✭✭elbee


    While displaying L plates, I've been beeped at, harrassed and tailgated for doing such awfully dangerous things as reducing speed when going into a sharp bend on to a residential road with lots of children on it. Can't wait to be rid of them and I'm hoping the R plates won't apply to me.

    We do need a better driving training system, but it's hard to have faith in any new measures when the old ones aren't enforced. I don't drive unaccompanied, ever, and I am the only learner I know who doesn't. I'm actually doing it now as an experiment to prove it's possible, because every learner I know has bought their own car and drives unaccompanied without a second thought. I'm not saying driving unaccompanied is dangerous, but it is illegal and people just don't care. Until they're given a reason to care, people will just keep doing it, and other things that are illegal, because they feel they can.


  • #50
    3hn2givr7mx1sc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,838 ✭✭✭✭3hn2givr7mx1sc


    I'm going to book me theory test this week for next month some time. Do I have to have the 12 hours done before I take the theory test or can I do them after it?

    It's all a bit confusing.


  • #51
    elbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 240 ✭✭elbee


    baz2009 wrote: »
    I'm going to book me theory test this week for next month some time. Do I have to have the 12 hours done before I take the theory test or can I do them after it?

    It's all a bit confusing.

    Your theory test is just to get you a learner's permit, so it goes like this:

    Step 1: Do your theory test
    Step 2: Send off all the necessary stuff for getting the permit (photos, eyesight report, theory test cert, application form etc, full list is here: http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/driver_licensing/learner_driving_permits_for_cars_and_work_vehicles.html)

    Step 3: Take your 12 mandatory lessons
    Step 4: Apply for test.

    (hopefully followed by Step 5: pass test!) :)

    Best of luck with the theory test!


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  • #52
    3hn2givr7mx1sc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,838 ✭✭✭✭3hn2givr7mx1sc


    Cheers elbee.:)

    So is the test you take after the 12 lessons for a full licence, or is there another separate test for that?


  • #53
    matt70iu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 415 ✭✭matt70iu


    baz2009 wrote: »
    Cheers elbee.:)

    So is the test you take after the 12 lessons for a full licence, or is there another separate test for that?


    Hi

    Yes that is the test for your full cat B licence. The only thing that's changed is the need to do the 12 lessons as well as a mentor with a licence for over 2 years to fill in your log book.

    best of luck!


  • #54
    **Timbuk2**
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 7,396 Mod ✭✭✭✭**Timbuk2**


    baz2009 wrote: »
    So is the test you take after the 12 lessons for a full licence, or is there another separate test for that?

    It's the same test as before, no more difficult, but with the requirement to have done 12 lessons. I'd expect pass rates to rise in the future as a result of the 12 mandatory lessons also.

    Once you pass it, then you have a full licence until you're 70 (in which case, you'll need to submit medical reports to continue getting the licence!). A full licence lasts 10 years before it needs to be renewed.


  • #55
    Reloc8
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,857 ✭✭✭Reloc8


    Max Power1 wrote: »
    If you are incapable of driving at the speed limit you should not be on the road.

    Slow moving drivers (whether gaybo and the RSA care to admit it or not) are as much of a hazard on the roads as people who speed.

    Ah here.

    He/she is a learner driver.

    You can't say that all learners should be capable at all speed limits from day one or 'they should not be on the road'. His/her skill will develop given time and in the meantime he/she is 100% correct to drive at the speed they are confident/competent at and no faster.

    Max Power1 wrote: »
    I only passed my test in june, and only started driving last november. i was never a danger to other road users because I went too slow


    You are wonderful.

    In any event there's no suggestion of the other poster being a danger to other road user's for driving too slow.


  • #56
    matt70iu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 415 ✭✭matt70iu


    Reloc8 wrote: »
    Ah here.

    He/she is a learner driver.

    You can't say that all learners should be capable at all speed limits from day one or 'they should not be on the road'. His/her skill will develop given time and in the meantime he/she is 100% correct to drive at the speed they are confident/competent at and no faster.





    You are wonderful.

    In any event there's no suggestion of the other poster being a danger to other road user's for driving too slow.


    Have to agree.. When I got into the car on a public road for the first time I was shaking in my boots! We all have to start somewhere. My instructor told me to go slowly and a speed I'm safe at until I build my confidence. Yeah I know it's annoying being stuck behind a learner when you're late for work.

    I know that when I start getting, shall we say a bit impatient, I think, come on Matt, you were a learner once too:)


  • #57
    Wolflikeme
    Closed Accounts Posts: 827 ✭✭✭Wolflikeme


    jos22 wrote: »
    love they way they always punish the learner drivers. while ignoring all the bad drivers on full licences. I see far more of them speeding, overtaking dangerously, not bother singling and running red lights at pedestrian crossings etc but no they not a problem on the road it just the 18-24 year old group that are.


    But who's to say they're not newly qualified? You don't know. So the 'R' plates thing might be good in that respect.


  • #58
    Foxhole Norman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,875 ✭✭✭Foxhole Norman


    Will "R" Plates apply to those who got their 1st Learner Permit before 4th April or to everyone who passes the test?


  • #59
    wayne0308
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 428 ✭✭wayne0308


    This law (regarding the R plate) seems a bit strange and very tricky to implement. I think this is implemented over in the UK and must be working for them.

    I have a learner permit (my 1st) which I received back in July almost 2 years ago. I understand that these laws wont apply to me as they stand. That is, I wont have to display R plates when I get my full license.

    As I understand it, even if I have to go onto my 2nd permit (hopefully not) and then pass the test I still do not have to display R plates, is this correct?

    The reason I am thinking this will be a nightmare to enforce for the Gardai is that lets say I pass my driving test next week, and get my License, and I get pulled over for a check or get stopped at a checkpoint, how does the gardai know when I got my first learners permit?

    They'll know I'm newly qualified but he won't know if I'm subject to the new law without getting in contact with someone with that information (the tax office?).

    There must be a marking on licenses that show if the law if applicable to a certain person or not? This will be handy to know if there is, just in case it's applied to me in error.


  • #60
    Sparkie93
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 101 ✭✭Sparkie93


    they'll probably put something on peoples licenses after the rule comes in i hope i get my license before then people can be so rude when they see L plates


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  • #61
    Robxxx7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Robxxx7


    wayne0308 wrote: »
    This law (regarding the R plate) seems a bit strange and very tricky to implement. I think this is implemented over in the UK and must be working for them.

    I have a learner permit (my 1st) which I received back in July almost 2 years ago. I understand that these laws wont apply to me as they stand. That is, I wont have to display R plates when I get my full license.

    As I understand it, even if I have to go onto my 2nd permit (hopefully not) and then pass the test I still do not have to display R plates, is this correct?

    The reason I am thinking this will be a nightmare to enforce for the Gardai is that lets say I pass my driving test next week, and get my License, and I get pulled over for a check or get stopped at a checkpoint, how does the gardai know when I got my first learners permit?

    They'll know I'm newly qualified but he won't know if I'm subject to the new law without getting in contact with someone with that information (the tax office?).

    There must be a marking on licenses that show if the law if applicable to a certain person or not? This will be handy to know if there is, just in case it's applied to me in error.

    Therein lies the problem ..... The gards don't enforce anything ..aslong as you have tax and insurance they don't care what licence you have .. its a sad fact and until such time that the enforcement agency actually does what its paid for and enforce the law ..then nothing will change


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