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anyone here going to vote sinn féin?

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Comments

  • #2552
    lugha
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,235 ✭✭✭lugha


    FUNKY LOVER wrote: »
    you hate the paira for saying they represent the Irish but not for murder?
    My dislike for PIRA and by association SF is for using political violence and claiming to do so on behalf of the Irish people when they demonstrably has no such mandate from the Irish people. Thankfully that is in the past, but it is still relevant because you absolutely can not claim to be a democrat and defend such an attitude.
    And I cannot recall a single republican ever posting here that they have any reservations about whole heartedly endorsing this view. It would be like Cameron apologizing for bloody Sunday but qualifying it in some way by saying you had to understand the mood of the time, or all deaths were regrettable or some such.

    And if SF supporters truly see nothing wrong with this, then that begs the question as to what exactly the understand by democracy. It is to be ourselves alone to shape the future of Ireland, or a tiny minority of ourselves alone who know what is best for us?


  • #2553
    yayamark
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,013 ✭✭✭yayamark


    Murderers of Det Gda Gerry Mcabe?

    Never will i vote for them


  • #2554
    The Brigadier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,549 ✭✭✭The Brigadier


    darraghdoc wrote: »
    Bertie Amern should b reelected

    Nah, Gerry Adams told him to get out of politics when he nicked his "boom just got boomier" line.

    ;)


  • #2555
    The Brigadier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,549 ✭✭✭The Brigadier


    caseyann wrote: »
    Its because they dont want to move on but do want to move on with the other sceanrio ,and expect people to move on with what happened to our own country women and men and children.They have Stockholm Syndrome or something along them lines.

    As I have already said on this thread the minute Gerry Adams holds up his hands over his actions in Northern Ireland he can be taken more seriously. When he talks about honesty and accountability at the moment nobody can take him seriously and move on.


  • #2556
    KIERAN1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 246 ✭✭KIERAN1


    The Brigadier wrote: »
    Not at all. Both target the economically vulnerable and prey on their fears. Both are great for getting involved in 'local issues'. Both jump on populist bandwagons. Both are completely clueless when it comes to policy.

    Sinn Fein does not target the vulnerable and does not prey on the fears, and Sinn Fein is not clueless when comes to policy. Explain this further your opinion. I agree with the rest of your post.


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  • #2557
    FUNKY LOVER
    Closed Accounts Posts: 905 ✭✭✭FUNKY LOVER


    yayamark wrote: »
    Murderers of Det Gda Gerry Mcabe?

    Never will i vote for them

    But if he didn't die you would?nothin about the other victims.


  • #2558
    The Brigadier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,549 ✭✭✭The Brigadier


    KIERAN1 wrote: »
    Sinn Fein does not target the vulnerable and does not prey on the fears, and Sinn Fein is not clueless when comes to policy. Explain this further your opinion. I agree with the rest of your post.

    I said the economically vulnerable. They foster an 'us and them' mentality between the haves and the have nots.

    If Sinn Fein were not clueless over policy they would have a lot more than their current share of the vote.


  • #2559
    red sean
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,917 ✭✭✭red sean


    The Brigadier wrote: »
    As I have already said on this thread the minute Gerry Adams holds up his hands over his actions in Northern Ireland he can be taken more seriously. When he talks about honesty and accountability at the moment nobody can take him seriously and move on.

    Not to mention his friendship with Gaddafi, who is really showing his love of democracy today!


  • #2560
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    The Brigadier wrote: »
    Again, it is hard to resist this but that is the same thing that let the national socialists into power in Germany.
    Oh Jesus he didn't.:rolleyes:
    If you knew anything about history, I think you'll find FG would be far more likely candidates for the auld goosestepping TBH.


  • #2561
    The Brigadier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,549 ✭✭✭The Brigadier


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Oh Jesus he didn't.:rolleyes:
    If you knew anything about history, I think you'll find FG would be far more likely candidates for the auld goosestepping TBH.

    That was covered in Inter Cert history.
    :)


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  • #2562
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    red sean wrote: »
    Not to mention his friendship with Gaddafi, who is really showing his love of democracy today!
    FF were good mates with the US bomb crews based at Shannon.


  • #2563
    celtictiger32
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,488 ✭✭✭celtictiger32


    The Brigadier wrote: »
    As I have already said on this thread the minute Gerry Adams holds up his hands over his actions in Northern Ireland he can be taken more seriously. When he talks about honesty and accountability at the moment nobody can take him seriously and move on.

    your problem with SF still seems to lye with gerry adams and what his past entails, what about the good work many of their members do in the PRESENT. the old history argument is getting a bit tiresome now really flog your dead horse if you will but the reality is their vote is ever increasing especially with the younger voters so hold on to your hats because you WILL see SF in power before too long, i wonder will all the anti mob be democratic then or will we see you on the emigration train


  • #2564
    caseyann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,938 ✭✭✭caseyann


    The Brigadier wrote: »
    As I have already said on this thread the minute Gerry Adams holds up his hands over his actions in Northern Ireland he can be taken more seriously. When he talks about honesty and accountability at the moment nobody can take him seriously and move on.

    You need to move on for yourself.Even the IRA have even loyalists have voted for SF.
    His actions in northern Ireland,what actions,You are basing what you are going on about through media and assumptions and possibilities.
    They have no proof not a shred of evidence not even a piece of paper to tie him with anything ever accept knowing and having friends who were IRA members.He is from there so wow guess what and being political and Irish he is going to know them and if he didnt know them they wouldn't have joined the peace treaty in the first place.
    Conspiracy theories is where all of these slanderous insinuations belong.And i reckon he should sue Bertie and any others who throw them out there.
    As they still havent shown the so called solid proof they have he had anything to do with anything.And if they had it they would have brought it out in public but they havent.


  • #2565
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    The Brigadier wrote: »
    That was covered in Inter Cert history.
    :)
    But you choose to ignore it...
    OK...


  • #2566
    SEVERA
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 138 ✭✭SEVERA


    The Brigadier wrote: »
    Not at all. Both target the economically vulnerable and prey on their fears. Both are great for getting involved in 'local issues'. Both jump on populist bandwagons. Both are completely clueless when it comes to policy.
    i am sorry when you try and categorise sf supporters as economically vulnerable it makes me feel a little bit sad for you, but also angry that you could be so ignorant.
    i also feel that i know you a little bit better now,and doubt if you would have any actual knowledge of the word.
    just for your information i would not be considered to be "economically vulnerable" and many sf supporters that i would know would be quiet wealthy, the difference is people with true life experience see things a little more clearly than the cushioned classes. sf have Ireland's best interests at heart not there own nests.


  • #2567
    lugha
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,235 ✭✭✭lugha


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Oh Jesus he didn't.:rolleyes:
    If you knew anything about history, I think you'll find FG would be far more likely candidates for the auld goosestepping TBH.
    How they march or what facial hair the sport isn't terribly important. It is about their political philosophy. And I am still waiting for the first SF supporter to criticize (or even stop pretending that they question isn't there) a small group of individuals with strong nationalist tendencies who sought to violently impose their socialist vision for Ireland on a people who did not approve of their means.
    Now, is that not even a little bit like those German lads of the 1930s? (Not exactly the same of course, the nazis did have a mandate! :))


  • #2568
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    SEVERA wrote: »
    i am sorry when you try and categorise sf supporters as economically vulnerable it makes me feel a little bit sad for you, but also angry that you could be so ignorant.
    Yes, that'd be like saying FF and FG supporters are rich types like bankers and developers...
    Oh wait...


  • #2569
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    lugha wrote: »
    I would include the dissidents as well (Sands might well be in their ranks now if he lived). Of course, you want to be careful pointing out to people that its not very logical to hold polar opposite views of Pearse and PIRA. You might convince them, and they would end up viewing things as I do! :D

    Oh of course, but talk about dissidents is pretty much a no no on this forum.


    I highly doubt that tbh, you are a rarity.


  • #2570
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 95,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Wolfe Tone wrote: »
    The funny thing is that most people who condemn the IRA etc, will the first out with the aul tricolors in 2016.
    The IRA don't own the tricolour.

    And you can't claim that people using the tricolour down here are supporting the IRA :rolleyes:


  • #2571
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    Capt'n Midnight wrote: »
    The IRA don't own the tricolour.

    And you can't claim that people using the tricolour down here are supporting the IRA :rolleyes:
    Well done on missing the point, they will be out celebrating what Pearse did, yet will condemn the IRA, hypocritical.


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  • #2572
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 95,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Wolfe Tone wrote: »
    If Adams says he was in the IRA and did stuff he would get arrested.
    Wasn't there some stuff in the GFA about situations like that ?

    Anyway he on our side of the boarder now :p


  • #2573
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    Capt'n Midnight wrote: »
    Wasn't there some stuff in the GFA about situations like that ?

    Anyway he on our side of the boarder now :p
    Gerry McGeogh got two years the other day for attempted murder in the 80s, shot a UDR man in the chest.


  • #2574
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    lugha wrote: »
    a small group of individuals with strong nationalist tendencies who sought to violently impose their socialist vision for Ireland on a people who did not approve of their means.
    When did this happen in the 26 counties?
    Oh right, it didn't.


  • #2575
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    lugha wrote: »
    Now, is that not even a little bit like those German lads of the 1930s? (Not exactly the same of course, the nazis did have a mandate! :))
    SF do have a mandate in the North and they've never had a campaign to overthrow the Irish Republic.
    i.e. you're talking nonsense.


  • #2576
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 95,758 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Wolfe Tone wrote: »
    Well done on missing the point, they will be out celebrating what Pearse did, yet will condemn the IRA, hypocritical.
    Most of us don't equate what Pearse did with what was done after the war of independence. In case you hadn't noticed times have changed and most of the leaders of 1916 are safely dead. ( One has to wonder what would have happened had they executed Dev too )

    And I'm still very uneasy with the idea of a blood sacrifice.

    And I'm very uneasy with the idea that modern republicans claim to be the one true descendant of 1916 after all that's happened since, especially the splits with the movement.


  • #2577
    lugha
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,235 ✭✭✭lugha


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    SF do have a mandate in the North and they've never had a campaign to overthrow the Irish Republic.
    SF do not have a mandate from the majority in the North. Until well after the ceasefire they did not even have a mandate from the majority of nationalists in the North. And never from more than a tiny minority in the South.
    And until the 1980s, PIRA, endorsed by SF, declared themselves to be the legitimate army and government of Ireland.
    Remember Danny Morrisson? We will take power in Ireland with a ballot paper in one hand and an armelite in the other.
    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    i.e. you're talking nonsense.
    Alas, no.


  • #2578
    maccored
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,789 ✭✭✭✭maccored


    The Brigadier wrote: »
    If Sinn Fein were not clueless over policy they would have a lot more than their current share of the vote.

    I applaud your optimistic faith in the irish voter, but more votes doesnt translate to that party having a ****ing clue. Look how many times FF get reelected - we as voters, collectively are pretty thick.

    Too many vote because of the TV soundbites and newspaper spam rather than for the party with the most realistic views. The targeting of SF and their apparent 'clueless' economic policy is a case in point. ]

    I'd much prefer to see issues addressed - as sinn fein propose to do - rather than end up defaulting on our sovereign debt - which is what is going to happen. People though, in their sheer stupidity, will buy in to the crap like SF being 'clueless over policy' (they've explained it plenty at this stage) and vote like good irish voters are meant to - without thinking.


  • #2579
    Sundy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭Sundy


    Wolfe Tone wrote: »
    Well done on missing the point, they will be out celebrating what Pearse did, yet will condemn the IRA, hypocritical.
    Pearse and co made a stand and fought like heroes. The IRA planted bombs that targeted innocent people. Cowards.


  • #2580
    caseyann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,938 ✭✭✭caseyann


    maccored wrote: »
    I applaud your optimistic faith in the irish voter, but more votes doesnt translate to that party having a ****ing clue. Look how many times FF get reelected - we as voters, collectively are pretty thick.

    Too many vote because of the TV soundbites and newspaper spam rather than for the party with the most realistic views. The targeting of SF and their apparent 'clueless' economic policy is a case in point. ]

    I'd much prefer to see issues addressed - as sinn fein propose to do - rather than end up defaulting on our sovereign debt - which is what is going to happen. People though, in their sheer stupidity, will buy in to the crap like SF being 'clueless over policy' (they've explained it plenty at this stage) and vote like good irish voters are meant to - without thinking.

    The old(rulers have to “dumb down” the masses for some pathological need to project the image of “being right” and, hence, in charge.)
    Bravo1.gif

    Hundred percent agree with you.I am afraid it falls on deaf ears.


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  • #2581
    maccored
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,789 ✭✭✭✭maccored


    Sundy wrote: »
    Pearse and co made a stand and fought like heroes. The IRA planted bombs that targeted innocent people. Cowards.

    I wouldnt wish to spoil the surprise, but if you read up on the IRA from yesteryear you'd find they were just as ruthless as the provos.


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