Why arent babies gagged/sedated in public?

MarkR · 30-12-2010 06:53PM

Just because you don't remember it, doesn't mean it didn't happen. You cried as a child. I cried as a child. Chuck Norris didn't, but we can't all be chuck.

You were just as annoying as every other child out there now, screaming their little cotton socks off.

You can't be self righteous if you did the same thing yourselves.

DeVore · 30-12-2010 06:54PM

Kids arent looking for something. They are looking for someONE usually.

DeV.

macquarie · 30-12-2010 06:56PM

I'm flying to california in february, transferring through new york so it will be about 14 hours on the plane altogether - I can select the seats on the website, do you think there's any place you can strategically select to avoid the possibility of a f**king screaming baby being near me ? (like edge of row, back of plane, front of plane, middle away from toilet entrances, etc)

amdublin · 30-12-2010 06:57PM

MarkR wrote: »

Just because you don't remember it, doesn't mean it didn't happen. You cried as a child. I cried as a child. Chuck Norris didn't, but we can't all be chuck.

You were just as annoying as every other child out there now, screaming their little cotton socks off.

You can't be self righteous if you did the same thing yourselves.

Did you miss the part about my parents being good parents?

Tordelback · 30-12-2010 06:59PM

Copper23 wrote: »

Every parent thinks their baby is an angel, never causes trouble, never cries, is well behaved and if they ever do feel their parenting methods are just perfect.

Who are these people? Every parent I know personally, myself included, feels they are completely inadequate to the task and daily tries and fails to stop their kids annoying everyone around them. Show me the parent that thinks they do a perfect job.

What you're talking about are the kind of people who don't give a crap about anyone else in any aspect of their lives - that they are parents too is just an unhappy coincidence. No doubt they also drop litter, drive after a few bevvies, skip queues and talk loudly on their mobiles for hours. Letting their kids piss everyone else off is just one more thing on the list. Don't correlate self-absorbed gob****es with the accident of parenthood.

AckwelFoley · 30-12-2010 07:03PM

almostnever wrote: »

I really do understand the practical concerns but it genuinely seems flimsy to me to describe going to the cinema or for a coffee and taking the kids along with you as "me time."

might seem flimsy - it did to me too, but its the reality, you dont have any time to yourself when you have children - the younger they are the less time you have - when you have a baby - its a 24 hour feeding time job - that means getting up every few hours to feed

almostnever wrote: »

IBalance just seems to be of crucial importance, and obviously sacrifices have to be made on both sides (sides being the best word I can think of, not trying to turn it into a "them against us" situation at all.)

There is no balance - toddlers dont make compramises when you are trying to find some one to look after them for a few hours, its the adults that make the sacrafices - who minds them who doesnt

almostnever wrote: »

For example, holidays. It just seems appalling to me that people think it's perfectly okay to take their babies to Spain for a sun holiday or whatever. It's unfair on the child, and everyone who is travelling. Surely it's not unreasonable to expect that someone would sacrifice a foreign holiday with their children until they're old enough to be able to behave in that environment?

If you are in a household that has maxed out on parents - that been 2 - do you suggest mam stay while dad goes on his own to spain or vice versa?

Look, i was a single man for long enough, and i had all these great preconceived notions on how parenting works, and yea their a responsibility - however the depths of how much time thats involved and the commitment is something i didnt realise - its all fine and well talking theory - reality and practicality however tend to be different

almostnever · 30-12-2010 07:05PM

Tordelback wrote: »

I loved the irony of the student (almostnever) complaining about kids making noise on public transport! Is there anything on earth louder than a gaggle of studes OMGing their way through a bus journey?

That wrecks my buzz too, when people are chatting loudly on the bus. If you'd bothered to read the thread and my contributions, you'd see I also complained about people listening to loud music on buses. The lack of consideration displayed by people in general pisses me off, and because this thread is specifically about babies and, by extension, children, that was the focus of most of my posts. But you have fun there pigeon holing me and dismissing my points, great craic altogether.

MarkR · 30-12-2010 07:09PM

amdublin wrote: »

Did you miss the part about my parents being good parents?

Good parents or not, kids cry.

30-12-2010 07:11PM

Thaedydal wrote: »

Don't bother I hear there is a zero troll tolerance policy over there and that one of the mods is a right wagon who'll permabam anyone who posts for the lulz. :pac:

LOL

amdublin · 30-12-2010 07:12PM

MarkR wrote: »

Good parents or not, kids cry.

And good parents remove said crying child.

Tordelback · 30-12-2010 07:16PM

almostnever wrote: »

But you have fun there pigeon holing me and dismissing my points, great craic altogether.

Easy now lad, as it happens I did read the whole thread - I've been enjoying it greatly (this being AH) and just found the idea of a student complaining about noisy people on buses compellingly funny (having myself been, like some latter day triple goddess, baby, student and parent). You'll note the rest of my post had nothing whatsoever to do with any of your points, and my last paragraph concludes much as you do.

If you want me to discuss some of your observations I will: babies on planes to Spain are far less annoying than sweating drunk passengers throwing up and arguing with their husbands, and far less annoying than people in the next door apartment that start dancing on the furniture at 4am - neither of which activity seems to be subject to any sanction. One might conclude that bringing your babies, like getting jarred and partying and talking loudly and slowly in accented English to every local you meet, are aspects of the package holiday as valid as any other. Not everyone wants to do it, and pretty much everyone else wishes that you wouldn't, but until someone gives us affordable carbon-neutral Jetsons-style flying cars, that's going on holiday to Spain for you. Hell is other people.

MarkR · 30-12-2010 07:19PM

amdublin wrote: »

And good parents remove said crying child.

But you'll already have annoyed someone at that stage. Kids don't have an off switch, so even if they did remove you, you were then crying on the way out the door. Then in the street. Then in the lift going up to the car park.

You were what you hate. Deal with it.

stovelid · 30-12-2010 07:19PM

The best behaved toddlers have wobblers sometimes. Even though it's hard to listen to, I just feel for the parent(s) as time to get out is at such a premium that walking out the minute a kid acts up seem unfair. There is plenty of other background noise that is very annoying in restaurants: people taking calls or baying about their lives at the top of their voices - it's just a part of going out.

amdublin · 30-12-2010 07:25PM

MarkR wrote: »

But you'll already have annoyed someone at that stage. Kids don't have an off switch, so even if they did remove you, you were then crying on the way out the door. Then in the street. Then in the lift going up to the car park.

You were what you hate. Deal with it.

Jebus relax willya. Hate is a very strong word.

Peared · 30-12-2010 07:29PM

People need to focus on the parents, not the babies.

Babies cry because it is the only way they can communicate their needs.

There is a massive difference between a little baby crying because it is hungry/has a dirty nappy/tired and parents taking steps to sort out whatever needs doing and being aware of those around them and a 1 year old (still classed as a baby) roaring because they are bored while mum or dad ignore them.

Babies aren't a different species, they are just small humans who can't yet say what they want or do something about it.

In terms of noise and annoyance on planes or in cafes, at least babies have an excuse. All of the loud obnoxious conversations, rows and noises I have had to endure have come from adults who actively don't give a crap about those around them.

Forest Master · 30-12-2010 07:29PM

Nevore wrote: »

I know little Jenny is probably a dote but if she starts crying while I'm enjoying my brekkie stand the fúck up and do something rather than carrying on as if you can't hear it.
All seriousness aside, how do you deal with someone who won't make even a token effort? Babies cry, that's fine, but they can also be calmed down with a little bit of effort.

Pity you don't have the balls to say anything to the parents though. Internet tough guy after the fact. Nice...

Oh, and I'm not a parent of a crying kid/baby, BTW.

Tordelback · 30-12-2010 07:33PM

Esprit d'escalier moment here. Please play along pretend I cleverly thought of this when I was writing about babies on planes to Spain.

In flying to Spain, you're going to a country where rugrats infest every (non-tourist) restaurant. You're expected to bring your kids out with you for a meal, as they are part of your family and meals are family affairs, and they're expected to run about and play and be noisy. So banning them from planes isn't going to save you from the horror of Unwanted Child Noise.

Tonyandthewhale · 30-12-2010 07:41PM

Starla_o0 wrote: »

If a child is upset, ok it can be hard to calm it down, but a parent will try, but the parents who just let their little brat go mental and misbehave need a slap just as much as the child does.

Woah, I know this was a few pages back but I saw it while reading through the thread. Since when does any child deserve a slap? Getting annoyed when you have to listen to someone else's child go mental is one think but suggesting that anyone, least of all the child deserves a slap is something else entirely.

PhysiologyRocks · 30-12-2010 07:50PM

Where possible, I believe people - parents, minders, teenagers, senior citizens, students, etc. - should try to make things as pleasant as possible for others. If that involves taking a child outside to calm down, then so be it. I speak as someone who has often eaten in restaurants with kids. This also involves not playing loud music on public transport, not being violent and not having parties at stupid o'clock.

However, I also appreciate that this is not always possible. For example, someone in the middle of grocery shopping alone with three children may not be able to coordinate this without having his/her shopping trolley tidied away in his/her absence. It's also not particularly feasible on public transport to just up and leave. Particularly if a child is crying because he/she can't have more biscuits, getting a child to stop crying may not be so easy without giving in. And giving in just makes things harder on the child, the parents and the public in the long term.

On the other hand, it is always possible not to have loud parties and play loud music

(I'm not a parent, btw.)

I repeat - where possible, we should all try to be considerate.

MarkR · 30-12-2010 07:51PM

amdublin wrote: »

Jebus relax willya. Hate is a very strong word.

Fair enough. I only used it for dramatic effect from my high horse. That, coupled with my imaginary flowing hair was a impressive effect in my head.

Tordelback · 30-12-2010 07:59PM

PhysiologyRocks wrote: »

I repeat - where possible, we should all try to be considerate.

What sort of a sentiment is that at Christmas?

minidazzler · 30-12-2010 08:13PM

MarkR wrote: »

But you'll already have annoyed someone at that stage. Kids don't have an off switch, so even if they did remove you, you were then crying on the way out the door. Then in the street. Then in the lift going up to the car park.

You were what you hate. Deal with it.

So your logic dictates than since someone was already annoyed it's OK to keep annoying everyone else?

Shut your kid up, they are monsters when they kick off, A clip round the ear usually does the trick, worked for me. I probably did cry as a kid, but after an extremely stressful trainride with 6 screaming kids and no parenting done despite there being 4 parents present, all related I might add, I asked my mother if I was ever so bad as a kid, she reckons none of us were because if we kicked off when out she would take us home or shut us up. She never appeased us by giving into demands, she just got us to STFU.

Why as a parent don't you just shut your kid up. It's not fair on the people around to have to listen to a wailing kid for hours because a parent has no clue what they are doing. I was never so twitchy as I was getting off that train, I would likely have laughed in triumph if one of those kids had fallen under it. That's how horribly annoying kids are.

But since it's your kid you don't see it like that, because you will be selfish and assume people give a sh1t about the brat, most of us don't.

Tordelback · 30-12-2010 08:17PM

minidazzler wrote: »

A clip round the ear usually does the trick

Awesome. My experience would suggest that being hit by someone ten times your mass tends to make you cry a hell of a lot louder. Also, illegal in most contexts.

Copper23 · 30-12-2010 08:20PM

Tordelback wrote: »

Who are these people? Every parent I know personally, myself included, feels they are completely inadequate to the task and daily tries and fails to stop their kids annoying everyone around them. Show me the parent that thinks they do a perfect job.

What you're talking about are the kind of people who don't give a crap about anyone else in any aspect of their lives - that they are parents too is just an unhappy coincidence. No doubt they also drop litter, drive after a few bevvies, skip queues and talk loudly on their mobiles for hours. Letting their kids piss everyone else off is just one more thing on the list. Don't correlate self-absorbed gob****es with the accident of parenthood.

If you want a few examples, If you look back in this thread you'll see some examples of people who have already said....

"Well MY child would never do that..."

I mean it's just silly, at least you seem like someone who has a bit of sense to say that while I'm sure you do you're best with your children, they are still children and there are times where it i difficult. I can accept that as I'm sure it means that if your kids were to be difficult you'd try to do your best in the situation.

But going back to your question then YES, from listening to anyone I know most parents inside that THEIR child is a little darling and would never do anything like that, it's just silly. Kids are kids, they will make noise, cry, be bold, whatever... parents need to deal with it, some do, but some don't and that is not really on in certain situations.

Coriolanus · 30-12-2010 08:23PM

Tordelback wrote: »

Awesome. My experience would suggest that being hit by someone ten times your mass tends to make you cry a hell of a lot louder. Also, illegal.

Not if you're concussed.

Anyway, loving how the first breeder took the complete wrong end of the stick and the rest of them are using it as a relay baton.

MarkR · 30-12-2010 08:34PM

minidazzler wrote: »

So your logic dictates than since someone was already annoyed it's OK to keep annoying everyone else?

Shut your kid up, they are monsters when they kick off, A clip round the ear usually does the trick, worked for me. I probably did cry as a kid, but after an extremely stressful trainride with 6 screaming kids and no parenting done despite there being 4 parents present, all related I might add, I asked my mother if I was ever so bad as a kid, she reckons none of us were because if we kicked off when out she would take us home or shut us up. She never appeased us by giving into demands, she just got us to STFU.

Why as a parent don't you just shut your kid up. It's not fair on the people around to have to listen to a wailing kid for hours because a parent has no clue what they are doing. I was never so twitchy as I was getting off that train, I would likely have laughed in triumph if one of those kids had fallen under it. That's how horribly annoying kids are.

But since it's your kid you don't see it like that, because you will be selfish and assume people give a sh1t about the brat, most of us don't.

No, my logic was that it nonsensical to complain about something that you yourself have done. Pot calling kettle black and all that.

You're making a lot of sweeping generalisations, and to be honest, after the train comment, I think I'll have no more to do with you or this thread.

minidazzler · 30-12-2010 08:55PM

MarkR wrote: »

No, my logic was that it nonsensical to complain about something that you yourself have done. Pot calling kettle black and all that.

You're making a lot of sweeping generalisations, and to be honest, after the train comment, I think I'll have no more to do with you or this thread.

TBH, my biggest gripe is with the parents.

strobe · 30-12-2010 09:21PM

Bill2673 wrote: »

Ok....this thread is now becoming quite offensive. Strobe I don't need you or anyone else to tell me how normal, considerate, non-selfish, intelligent, human beings behave....the catholic church did that for years and look where that got us.

If you want to compare a baby to a mobile phone then good luck to you, but i live on planet earth where babies are considered (by some people) to be humans.

look at it this way, if you saw a grown adult screaming in distress in a restaurant, would your first thought be "that pr*ck is ruining my meal"? Maybe it would.....it wouldn't be my first thought if an adult was crying and its not my first thought if a baby is crying.

I stand firmly behind my expletive laden rant.

If I was in a restaurant and an adult started screaming in distress and the people with them sat there finishing their dinner while it happened, I would ring an ambulance for the screamer and St. Lomans mental hospital and the Gardai for the people that were with him. They are clearly either sadists or lunatics.

FreudianSlippers · 30-12-2010 09:22PM

Bill2673 wrote: »

look at it this way, if you saw a grown adult screaming in distress in a restaurant, would your first thought be "that pr*ck is ruining my meal"?

Yep. It certainly would.

stovelid · 30-12-2010 09:43PM

Nevore wrote: »

the first breeder.

wtf?

Why arent babies gagged/sedated in public?

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