Social Welfare Measures Could Be Rejected

Einhard · 09-12-2010 02:18AM

tudlytops wrote: »

I just think that it is very unfair on the disable and those caring for them.

Why should you be condemned to a life of poverty just because you are ill, disabled or looking after someone who is???

Their benefit went down, they are losing the heating (not sure of the name) allowance, in favour of a €40 one of payment (how many bags of coal is that), they will surely keep worm all winter with that.

What this says is that if you are ill or disabled, you are really good for nothing and this so called caring society doesn't give a damn, because you can not pay taxes.

Irish welfare payments, across the board, are amongst the most generous in Europe, and cutting them in a time of fiscal crisis is not a sign of an uncaring society. People can no doubt make similarly emotive arguments about why every cut announced yesterday should be rescinded, but the fact is we cannot afford to maintain spending at current levels. If anything, it's those on the minimum wage, who will lose over €2100 pa in wages alone who have most to gripe about.

turbobaby · 09-12-2010 02:22AM

chucken1 wrote: »

I totally agree with you and my hubby, my son and I are "living' (it up according to some).on 290e a week.

Ive never seen us as "vulnerable'..we can move around,we get by..but those cuts are taking the proverbial..

This has to stop!,they've no grip on reality.

Get a job then you family of useless saps... mod note, user was banned for this comment

Can you honestly say there's nothing out there?

sandmanporto · 09-12-2010 02:24AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

social welfare is too high for our economy to support
public service wages are too high for our economy to support

your points to children and esb are sadly second, the country cannot afford to fund people to the level they have been, cost of living will drop and will hopefully make things manageable... this christmas is hard for everyone

In that case, major scraps should be in place and because the economy is more important people should have to sleep rough. we all need to take cuts!
Is that the solution? I know that if that happened there would be so much violence on the streets, we wouldnt be alive!
So before you defend the economy(which is a man made theory funded by mans actions), you should consider the individual blocks of society( who exist and need to live) first!
Without harmony, there is no ECONOMY or COUNTRY!

It's a hard christmas for everyone, but some people wont get presents this christmas, and i can guarantee you that! i see people spending christmas in hotels, while some people wont have heating or turkey or even a cake for christmas! thats reality! more cuts necessary to those? or more to the ones in hotels? you decide what you believe!!!

High energy · 09-12-2010 02:25AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

your points to children and esb are sadly second, the country cannot afford to fund people to the level they have been

They could easily justify cutting social welfare if the energy regulator lowered the price of electricity.. something everyone in the country pays (social welfare/public sector/private sector/etc), but then we wouldn't have ceos getting their much needed €750,000/year and 8000 staff with an average salary of €70,000.

chucken1 · 09-12-2010 02:26AM

turbobaby wrote: »

Get a job then you family of useless saps...

Can you honestly say there's nothing out there?

Thats lovely! You should be very proud of that post.
Do you know our circumstances?

sandmanporto · 09-12-2010 02:26AM

Cheaper drugs now!! ---Frank Gallagher, Shameless hahah

tudlytops · 09-12-2010 02:30AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

do you believe that they are all condemned to a life of poverty as a result of this budget?

As a result of many budgets....

Why do this people have to live, many their whole life's on so very little???

its not as if anyone is even trying to help them to work, if you go to the so called services for the disabled, how many disabled people do you see working in there?

If even the government won't employ them, how can we expect the privet sector to do so.

And if they can't work, why should they live on as little as €188 a week, and have to be on as little as that since the day they got sick or disabled?

If you are unemployed you will have the chance to go to work eventually, if you are disabled, you are just that, disabled and poor.

melekalikimaka · 09-12-2010 02:30AM

sandmanporto wrote: »

In that case, major scraps should be in place and because the economy is more important people should have to sleep rough. we all need to take cuts!
Is that the solution? I know that if that happened there would be so much violence on the streets, we wouldnt be alive!
So before you defend the economy(which is a man made theory funded by mans actions), you should consider the individual blocks of society( who exist and need to live) first!
Without harmony, there is no ECONOMY or COUNTRY!

It's a hard christmas for everyone, but some people wont get presents this christmas, and i can guarantee you that! i see people spending christmas in hotels, while some people wont have heating or turkey or even a cake for christmas! thats reality! more cuts necessary to those? or more to the ones in hotels? you decide what you believe!!!

i believe if fair cuts, i feel everyone should pay take the same cut, the rich and the poor. it may not have worked out this way in the budget, but i sure as hell know 6 billion has now been saved, something we promised we would do to secure our loan from europe, and i sure as hell know people who dodged it this year will get hit next year, or the year after.

High energy · 09-12-2010 02:32AM

I think the dole should actually be increased every year you are on it, like €188 the first year, then €208 the second year, then €218 the third year up to a maximum of €267.90

Make it more of a lucrative career option than it currently is ya know

chucken1 · 09-12-2010 02:32AM

turbobaby wrote: »

Get a job then you family of useless saps...

Can you honestly say there's nothing out there?

And if you were smart enough to read the whole thread,you'll see I was'nt saying anything about our income...I was commenting on the OP.
Which is..KNOWING THERE IS ALWAYS SOMEONE WORSE OFF!

turbobaby · 09-12-2010 02:33AM

chucken1 wrote: »

Thats lovely! You should be very proud of that post.
Do you know our circumstances?

Well you are on the internet at half one on a Thursday night.

Cancel your internet connection, sell your computer, for a start.

People need to dig in.

melekalikimaka · 09-12-2010 02:34AM

tudlytops wrote: »

As a result of many budgets....

Why do this people have to live, many their whole life's on so very little???

its not as if anyone is even trying to help them to work, if you go to the so called services for the disabled, how many disabled people do you see working in there?

If even the government won't employ them, how can we expect the privet sector to do so.

And if they can't work, why should they live on as little as €188 a week, and have to be on as little as that since the day they got sick or disabled?

If you are unemployed you will have the chance to go to work eventually, if you are disabled, you are just that, disabled and poor.

they get more than 188 via benefits of other kinds. many on minimum wage after rent or mortgage would be on similar levels, 188 might not seem alot now, but i blame that partly on the celtic tiger. look at other countries welfare. i agree if you are disabled you should not have to suffer the indignity of poverty, no one should have that forced upon them, but i dont think it would be feasible to place them above others in our economic climate, we cant give what we dont have.

tudlytops · 09-12-2010 02:35AM

High energy wrote: »

I think the dole should actually be increased every year you are on it, like €188 the first year, then €208 the second year, then €218 the third year up to a maximum of €267.90

Make it more of a lucrative career option than it currently is ya know

But its not about the dole, its about those that can't work, sick, disabled or looking after them.

th3 s1aught3r · 09-12-2010 02:35AM

Its pretty surreal listening to FF telling us our benefits are among the highest in Europe and need trimming.... didnt they give us most of them ?

I feel most sorry for those with mortgages. Wont be long until the banks (ones getting bailed out) are raising interest rates to get back to profitability. Along with all these cuts and taxes, the interest rate increases will send a lot of people over the financial cliff

God help you all

High energy · 09-12-2010 02:36AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

they get more than 188 via benefits of other kinds. many on minimum wage after rent or mortgage would be on similar levels, 188 might not seem alot now, but i blame that partly on the celtic tiger. look at other countries welfare. i agree if you are disabled you should not have to suffer the indignity of poverty, no one should have that forced upon them, but i dont think it would be feasible to place them above others in our economic climate, we cant give what we dont have.

I disagree, they're being robbed blind

turbobaby · 09-12-2010 02:38AM

Ah sure they're blind, let's give them more money on top of the extras they've got over the last few years...

Duffy the Vampire Slayer · 09-12-2010 02:41AM

filthymcnasty wrote: »

Its not going to be rejected he voted for the budget.. it will pass every year as always despite whining on mayo FM or wherever, these cnuts always go with the party line ff of fg

Hes found of whining on Mid West Radio alright. Hes always 'Calling upon the Minister'. I dont understand why he doesnt call upon the minister to do something when hes sitting opposite him in the Dail.

I think someone got a sly dig in at Ring there after Lenihan read out the budget. Im almost certain I heard some Fiann Failer reply to Rings shouting by saying 'Why dont you go to the local papers about it?'

tudlytops · 09-12-2010 02:41AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

they get more than 188 via benefits of other kinds. many on minimum wage after rent or mortgage would be on similar levels, 188 might not seem alot now, but i blame that partly on the celtic tiger. look at other countries welfare. i agree if you are disabled you should not have to suffer the indignity of poverty, no one should have that forced upon them, but i dont think it would be feasible to place them above others in our economic climate, we cant give what we dont have.

I agree we can't give what we don't have, but surely they could stop being hit in every budget and more services should be provided to help them, those who can, to get a job, even if it were for just a few hours a week.

There was no help before this crisis and now they say there isn't because of the crisis.

There are plenty out there that are unemployed through choice and the baby making machine, hit them and not the disabled and ill.

And before someone gets going on my comment of the baby making machine, its for the unemployed that have one baby and another and another while unemployed, them i count as the ones who are unemployed by choice.

melekalikimaka · 09-12-2010 02:41AM

High energy wrote: »

I disagree, they're being robbed blind

they are getting money for nothing... they are unable to work, the government is supporting them as it is ethically the right thing to do, the government id broke, so it is cutting the amount they give them so it can afford to payback a debt which regardless of how incurred, needs to be paid and you believe they are being robbed? serious entitlement issues here

tudlytops · 09-12-2010 02:44AM

turbobaby wrote: »

Ah sure they're blind, let's give them more money on top of the extras they've got over the last few years...

its not just the blind and its not about giving them more when there isn't any to give, it about living them alone.

After all the pensioners did not suffer any cuts and many of the pensioners today were the unemployed of yesterday.

There are certain people in society that should be helped not push futher down into a hole.

melekalikimaka · 09-12-2010 02:44AM

tudlytops wrote: »

I agree we can't give what we don't have, but surely they could stop being hit in every budget and more services should be provided to help them, those who can, to get a job, even if it were for just a few hours a week.
.

i'm not for once second saying i think any of this is a good thing for these people, i think its horrible the least off are suffering. but i just get annoyed when people dont look outside their own little world about what this budget needs to do and how its madness to think anyone is going to get away unaffected by this.

chucken1 · 09-12-2010 02:45AM

turbobaby wrote: »

Well you are on the internet at half one on a Thursday night.

Cancel your internet connection, sell your computer, for a start.

People need to dig in.

OK..cop on right now! Show me please some reason for this attack.

tudlytops · 09-12-2010 02:49AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

i'm not for once second saying i think any of this is a good thing for these people, i think its horrible the least off are suffering. but i just get annoyed when people dont look outside their own little world about what this budget needs to do and how its madness to think anyone is going to get away unaffected by this.

I agree, but they are hit every budget and even when things were good, they were given the some as unemplyed people + the ESB and phone allowences, really do we think it is OK for people that really can't work to be poor all their life's?

Yes they can't work and not paying taxes, but that can happen to anyone any day, an accident, an illness, etc... is it fair to have them counting penny from that day on.

And when the weather is getting worse we take the "heating allowance" away!!!!

how are you? · 09-12-2010 02:54AM

michael noonan tore lenihan a new one on prime time last night...

he called lenihan an illusionist and id have to agree...

hes barrrister-highky skilled at talking ****e,and he has got the sympathy of a large section of the irish public for at least a year.he has made incredibly misjudged decions for too long

the country needs a change,we as a people are far to sinical and lazy to create real change....

we all know deep inside that we can make this country into something special and unique that every country can be proud.we need to lead the way..

I think this because we are IRISH,we are a unique race that is already loved already around the world because of our culture, hard work and most importantly our sense of GOOD

brianthebard · 09-12-2010 03:13AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

i believe if fair cuts, i feel everyone should pay take the same cut, the rich and the poor. it may not have worked out this way in the budget, but i sure as hell know 6 billion has now been saved, something we promised we would do to secure our loan from europe, and i sure as hell know people who dodged it this year will get hit next year, or the year after.

- this has been a party broadcast paid for by the FF party.

sandmanporto · 09-12-2010 03:14AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

i believe if fair cuts, i feel everyone should pay take the same cut, the rich and the poor. it may not have worked out this way in the budget, but i sure as hell know 6 billion has now been saved, something we promised we would do to secure our loan from europe, and i sure as hell know people who dodged it this year will get hit next year, or the year after.

wait a minute here!
we are not a successful nation now ok!
what you're saying is, that the rich who can afford to give more than the poor, should pay the same as the poor! quite frankly in my book thats not equality!
Do you know why the French Revolution took place?
Are you from a well to do family or just have a good job?
Personally I had a good job and am now umemployed. Believe me, I know how hard it is! Lets get our stories straight! Equality in proportion!

Einhard · 09-12-2010 03:16AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

i believe if fair cuts, i feel everyone should pay take the same cut,

That's not fair though.

sandmanporto · 09-12-2010 03:21AM

turbobaby wrote: »

Ah sure they're blind, let's give them more money on top of the extras they've got over the last few years...

Do you anything about medicine? did you know type 2 diabetes if more hereditary than type 1.. im sure, given the statistics of Ireland that you may have a relative with type 2 diabetes. type 2 diabetes can cause blindness!
You may develop this condition in later life. Lets see your view then!

Your attitude is quite frankly disgusting! its almost like Hitlers view(when i say that, I mean your total contempt for the blind)! I dont think you'd be too popular in your local if your IP un masked your identity for that comment!
Blind people cant be left rot to die alone, the benefits they got WERE TO MAKE THEIR LIFE BEARABLE! remember, you may go blind!

chucken1 · 09-12-2010 03:30AM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

i'm not for once second saying i think any of this is a good thing for these people, i think its horrible the least off are suffering. but i just get annoyed when people dont look outside their own little world about what this budget needs to do and how its madness to think anyone is going to get away unaffected by this.

And if you were any use As a MOD,you'd have seen what the THREAD was! This thread turned into a social welfare bashing..yet again.

elspecia · 09-12-2010 03:32AM

social welfare cuts not enough in my opinion, the unemployment benefit(dole) was only cut by €8 how about cutting it by €20, because i think alot of ppl who will be getting minimum wage from Friday will not be getting as much as the boys on the dole

Social Welfare Measures Could Be Rejected

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