If FG policies are so similar to those of FF, why would people vote for FG?

kincsem wrote: »

Wikipedia

Allegations of corruption

This section may be confusing or unclear.

The party, along with its coalition partners, was re-elected in the 2002 general election. It has been hit by numerous scandals. (Founding father Frank Aiken refused to run in the 1973 general election because the party had Haughey as a candidate while first leader Éamon de Valera told a senior minister in 1970 that "Haughey will ruin the party."[citation needed]

Another former minister, Ray Burke, whom Ahern appointed to cabinet for a short time in 1997, was recently explicitly described by retired High Court judge, Fergus Flood in a tribunal of inquiry as "corrupt", and was jailed in January 2005 for tax offences. The privileged treatment accorded to Burke in prison was subsequently widely criticised, especially by Fine Gael.

Former Fianna Fáil Government Press Secretary Frank Dunlop is giving evidence to a tribunal of inquiry in relation to his allegations that long-serving Fianna Fáil senators took bribes to arrange for planning permissions to be granted to particular property developers. Other councillors (past and present) from a number of parties, but predominantly from Fianna Fáil, are expected to be named. The tribunal has yet to judge the credibility or otherwise of Dunlop and his evidence.

Former Fianna Fáil TD, Liam Lawlor was also accused of corrupt practices in relation to planning and development. He was jailed repeatedly for refusal to cooperate with the tribunal. He did not resign his Dublin West seat and continued to attend the Dáil, returning to Mountjoy Prison after the sessions, where he enjoyed most of the same privileges as Mr. Burke.

Another TD, Beverley Cooper-Flynn of Mayo, was forced to resign from the party when it was revealed that she had advised people on how to illegally evade tax while working as a financial adviser for National Irish Bank. She was readmitted when she threatened to run as an Independent candidate, expelled again after she lost a libel action against RTÉ, and readmitted unanimously to the party shortly after Ahern's resignation.

Kerry North TD Denis Foley was found to have held an Ansbacher bank account and subsequently could not seek re-election in 1997. Michael Collins of the Collins family dynasty in Limerick suffered a similar fate in 2002, when he was found to have evaded tax by the Revenue Commissioners.

On 8 December 2005, Ivor Callely TD resigned his junior ministerial post after RTÉ News reported that a building contractor involved in public contracts had painted his house for free in the early 1990s. It was also revealed that Callely had offered to personally buy a new car for one of his civil service advisers, in an attempt to persuade the adviser not to leave their job. Apparently, Callely's department had an unusually high turnover of staff for some time under his stewardship.[13]

Bertie Ahern, in September 2006 admitted having received payments from "friends" in the early 1990s which he termed as a combination of loans and gifts totalling £48,000 while serving as Minister for Finance. Damaged by the controversy initially, which included admissions of appointing friends to state boards and not having a bank account while serving as Minister for Finance, support for the party in opinion polls rose after Ahern described the circumstances of the payments to the public in an interview with RTÉ television.[14] Former Taoiseach Albert Reynolds stated in a radio interview on RTÉ that he would have told Ahern that taking such payments was totally unacceptable. As the then Taoiseach he should have been informed by Ahern and would have been very clear that accepting the payments was wrong. He said that many other options were open to Ahern such as getting a bank loan. [15] After the payments controversy, polling data suggested that Bertie Ahern's increase in popularity due to the payments controversy was primarily a sympathetic reaction.
In September 2007, Ahern testified over a four day period at the Mahon Tribunal about these payments and his explanations under oath varied from day to day, being described by one of the sitting judges as "polar opposite"[16]
In April 2008 Ahern announced his intended resignation as Taoiseach and party leader, naming May 2008 as when he would step down. The announcement came during a period of increased disquiet over his evidence to the Mahon Tribunal, in particular denials of foreign currency lodgements, which were contradicted in evidence given by his former secretary, who accepted that paperwork before the tribunal indicated a sterling lodgement was made by her on his behalf.

AskMyChocolate wrote: »

In what way does Fitzgerald taking backhanders from AIB differ from Bertie taking backhanders from builders? Let's not forget he was the first one to organise a bank bailout. Both parties believe in an inner circle of privilege whose gambling debts should be paid for by the 90% of the population who are not in that circle. He was most definitely a genuine force for social change. FF couldn't possibly have achieved the two parties' common goal of making the rich richer and the poor poorer without FG support.I find his smug, self-indulgent,self-exculpatory articles in the Irish times utterly nauseating and if one didn't know of the man's unbelieveable conceit and lack of selfawareness one would assume they were satirical in the vein of Alan Partridge. But then again what can one expect from a man who has taken €2,000,000 in pension payments from this state while pontificating on our lack of competitiveness and explaining why people on €16,000 a year need to be brought into the tax net. His tacit collusion in helping FF bring the price of an average dwelling from twice the median wage to ten times the median wage, (once him and Bertie's own dirt-cheap houses were long paid for) thus consigning an entire generation to homelessness or slavery,should not be forgotten either.
Although the crowning achievement of both men's careers is probabably best explained by the fact that neither have a problem accepting their well deserved pensions of €140,000 per year while school children have to bring toilet paper to school with themselves. I suppose it would be remiss of me and churlish to sign off without mentioning the glowing terms with which both men were spoken of in the Ryan report.

mossyc123 wrote: »

Fitzgerald doesn't want his ridiculous pension. Recently on Vincent Browne he spoke of the first cabinet (of which his father was a member) who recieved salaries of roughly €70,000 in today's money. Could you link me any evidence of him taking backhanders from AIB.
You mightn't like his column but to suggest he wants to make the rich richer and the poor poorer is nonsense.
He just wants Ireland to be on a sound economic footing and sees the ridiculously low taxes and uncompetitive wages as a genuine barrier to this.
I genuinely believe the man isn't motivated by money or power and never has been, he just wants the best for this country.

The difference between the 2 parties can be viewed throught the activites of their respective ex-taoisigh.

John Bruton: EU ambassador to US. Chairman of IFSC Ireland with responsibility of promoting Ireland as a location for Financial Services.

Albert Reynolds: ????? Wanted to be President.

Garrett Fitzgerald: Columnist and Lecturer on Public Affairs. Contributes to the national debate in a constructive manner.

Bertie Ahern: "Sports Columnist" Wants to be President.