News and views on Greystones harbour and marina [SEE MODERATOR WARNING POST 1187]

pixbyjohn · 05-11-2010 5:13pm

nobby grande wrote: »

I remember the harbour quite clearly before it silted up while it was fully functional for fishing boats. It was perfect for kids as there was a small sandy strip at the side in front of carraig eden, and it was perfect for harbouring boats. The two uses were and are not mutually exclusive.

The area you are mentioning is the Cove, and this area has had no harbour developments carried out at all. As you will see in my photo which was taken on 24-Aug-2010 at 18:06. People still use the Cove to swim in, but it is clearly not the harbour.

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woodsy2 · 06-11-2010 1:13am

posted by d'oracle:
"And before that it was a small working harbour with boats and trawlers."

I recall as a young child (early 90s) being down at the harbour with the mother and seeing a fishing boat unloading at the pier. I'm fairly certain this was greystones harbour as opposed to elsewhere. Having seen a small fishing boat operating close-in to bray head recently, was wondering when was the last time any commercial fishing boats operated from greystones harbour? (or whether they still do/did up till the start of the harbour's rebuilding anyway)

cuddlycavies · 06-11-2010 9:15am

Apparantly it's still a productive lobster and clam fishery. There is at least one commercial fisherman. Dont know him. He's a friend of a work contact. He must be mooring at Wicklow during the works.

pixbyjohn · 06-11-2010 1:37pm

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pixbyjohn · 06-11-2010 1:39pm

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pixbyjohn · 06-11-2010 1:41pm

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pixbyjohn · 06-11-2010 1:44pm

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pixbyjohn · 06-11-2010 1:44pm

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pixbyjohn · 06-11-2010 1:46pm

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Click on photo to go to my Pix.ie page for more photos

nobby grande · 08-11-2010 9:29am

pixbyjohn wrote: »

The area you are mentioning is the Cove, and this area has had no harbour developments carried out at all. As you will see in my photo which was taken on 24-Aug-2010 at 18:06. People still use the Cove to swim in, but it is clearly not the harbour.

Thank you John, but that is not what i was reffering to. I was taking about the sandy side of the harbour in front of where the lobster pots were stored.

pixbyjohn · 08-11-2010 3:28pm

nobby grande wrote: »

Thank you John, but that is not what i was reffering to. I was taking about the sandy side of the harbour in front of where the lobster pots were stored.

OK but that is nowhere near Carrig Eden.

nobby grande · 08-11-2010 4:52pm

Yes, apologies i made a mistake. I confused Carraig eden with another similar building overlooking the harbour. Where do i report for the flogging? :pac:

Annasopra · 17-11-2010 7:51am

Blanchflower wrote: »

Will everyone be provided with a hard hat and high viz vest? This PR stunt could be dangerous.

big fluffy piece in the Wicklow Times about the wonderful open day

Fiachra2 · 19-11-2010 1:00pm

Interesting quote from the chairman of NAMA on the business plans received so far. Not sure how the health centre and clubhouses fit into this.

"He said the business plans submitted showed a number of common features, such as wanting to develop green field sites, have high overheads, and not sell for a number of years.
“Some people believe the market will come back and that if we would leave them alone for five years, they would be alright,” Mr Daly said. However, he said the agency was only accepting plans that set out a target for significant debt reduction over a three to five-year period. “This means submitting a list of assets which will be sold to raise cash and to repay debt.”

Blanchflower · 20-11-2010 12:07am

Fiachra2 wrote: »

Interesting quote from the chairman of NAMA on the business plans received so far. Not sure how the health centre and clubhouses fit into this.

"He said the business plans submitted showed a number of common features, such as wanting to develop green field sites, have high overheads, and not sell for a number of years.
“Some people believe the market will come back and that if we would leave them alone for five years, they would be alright,” Mr Daly said. However, he said the agency was only accepting plans that set out a target for significant debt reduction over a three to five-year period. “This means submitting a list of assets which will be sold to raise cash and to repay debt.”

Indeed. The health centre will only produce a rent which will not give "significant debt reduction". The proposed clubhouses will not even produce a rent. In fact in order to build the health centre the level of debt will have to increase. So logically NAMA by their own rules cannot do anything with the harbour site. I noticed today that the hoarding hiding the site from the public is being reinforced. The country is bankrupt <<<snip>>>. Dick Roche might as well be busking on the harbour as he along with all those in FF who bankrupted the country are surplus to requirements and have no power left and about time too.

And so my friends the developement looks doomed. RIP!!!!

LEIN · 20-11-2010 12:14am

Blanchflower wrote: »

Indeed. The health centre will only produce a rent which will not give "significant debt reduction". The proposed clubhouses will not even produce a rent. In fact in order to build the health centre the level of debt will have to increase. So logically NAMA by their own rules cannot do anything with the harbour site. I noticed today that the hoarding hiding the site from the public is being reinforced. The country is bankrupt <<<snip>>>. Dick Roche might as well be busking on the harbour as he along with all those in FF who bankrupted the country are surplus to requirements and have no power left and about time too.

And so my friends the developement looks doomed. RIP!!!!

Please use fact in your posts or they will be edited or removed.

Mr Posh · 22-11-2010 12:55pm

Its a fact the country is bankrupt, can we judge for our selves on the rest of the sentence?

recedite · 22-11-2010 3:02pm

"The country is bankrupt <<<snip>>>. Dick Roche might as well be busking on the harbour as he along with all those in FF who bankrupted the country are surplus to requirements and have no power left and about time too. "

Looks like events have proved Blanchflower to be right, despite the censorship.

LEIN · 22-11-2010 4:07pm

That post was edited before the IMF help was confirmed. So at the time it was not fact.

If anyone else has a problem with how I moderate please bring it to PM to avoid dragging this thread further off topic.

Mr Posh · 22-11-2010 4:32pm

Hi Damo

To help get the thread back on track I would like to read Blanchflower's uncensored factual thread, can you please unsnip so we can respond to the context which was intended.

Thanks

d'Oracle · 22-11-2010 4:46pm

What will that achieve?

The development will probably now get abandoned and blanchflower can revel in the internet triumph.

darter · 22-11-2010 7:03pm

Mr Posh wrote: »

Hi Damo

To help get the thread back on track I would like to read Blanchflower's uncensored factual thread, can you please unsnip so we can respond to the context which was intended.

Thanks

As the OP of this thread (that does mean for something doesn't it?), I second Mr Posh's request.

Perhaps something was snipped that is of relevance now.

LEIN · 22-11-2010 8:16pm

Blanchflower is more than welcome to re post the statement now that it has been confirmed and is factual.

This is the last warning for off topic posting.

pixbyjohn · 24-11-2010 6:01pm

20101124-Harbour24112010 by pixbyjohn, on Flickr

Dunphus · 24-11-2010 8:52pm

pixbyjohn wrote: »

20101124-Harbour24112010 by pixbyjohn, on Flickr

Wow, don't know what to think about that. Seems particularly desolate

Mr Posh · 25-11-2010 1:07pm

Any update on the hording coming down?

Annasopra · 25-11-2010 11:13pm

Some great pictures here

http://wicklowdailyphoto.blogspot.com/2010/11/progress-revealed.html

Mr Posh · 26-11-2010 8:54am

Its pretty ugly looking at the moment isn’t it

loobylou · 26-11-2010 10:10am

Mr Posh wrote: »

Its pretty ugly looking at the moment isn’t it

You do know that you're not allowed say that on here, don't you?:rolleyes:

Blanchflower · 27-11-2010 9:53pm

Just as the international bondholders have deserted Ireland now the cranes have deserted Greystones Harbour. As the nation waits with baited breath for the conclusion of the IMF bailout for Ireland only the earth movers remain on the once busy harbour development site. As I pointed out in a previously snipped posting on this forum the Irish State is bankrupt and looking down the barrel of very expensive lender of last resort funding from the IMF. Unfortunately for the people of Greystones we are now facing the very real prospect that the once beautiful harbour will remain an unfinished building site for a long time to come.

pixbyjohn · 28-11-2010 12:15am

DSCF2609 by pixbyjohn, on Flickr

darter · 28-11-2010 3:33am

Blanchflower wrote: »

... the once beautiful harbour ...

Blanchflower, I was with you all the way to that statement. Maybe it was once beautiful, back in the 1880s! It's been a wreck for 40 years needing development. Yes, I opposed the SisPar plan as I objected to public beach land being given into private hands - this was the first time in Ireland that happened and I am shocked that it didn't cause the Government to step in. Mind you, Dick Roche was the Environment minister...

Once it started, I moved on and was/am looking forward to the completion. Yes, we won't have a marina and the other planned public facilities for a while, but the harbour is once AGAIN beautiful.

In some ways, we won. We got a renovated harbour without the monstrous real estate development that - to my eyes - would have been (and will be eventually) an eyesore and inappropriate in scale to Greystones's village size.

Now if they's only bring those damn hoardings down... November 2011 was the last I heard.

Mr Posh · 28-11-2010 9:39pm

Well Beauty is subjective I suppose, I do not think its particulary attractive but it will be great to get the hoardings down!!!

Fiachra2 · 08-12-2010 7:25am

Recent statement from Councillor Fortune which may be of interest.

Labour Party Councillor Tom Fortune has expressed disappointment at the response of his fellow Greystones representatives on Wicklow County Council regarding a proposal to increase the number of houses at the Greystones Marina development. He told the meeting of Wicklow County Council on 6th December that there was no need for this proposal to come before the Council at this time. The plan involved increasing the number of houses to 375. An Bord Pleanala in 2006 had ruled that this number of houses was too many. The Board had confirmed this position in early in 2010 when Wicklow County Council had first proposed the increase. “What the Councillors have now done is to ignore the Boards views and vote the increase through anyway” said Fortune. “This is bad planning and bad for Wicklow County Council’s image nationally” he continued. “County councils need to be seen to be upholding high standards when it comes to planning not trying to find ways to circumvent the planning process and bypass an authority such as An Bord Plenanala. It also ignores potential traffic problems in the area”

Councillor Fortune went on to point out that the proposal was completely premature. “In the current housing market it is very probable that the houses won’t be built for 5-10 years. It would have been time enough to consider this plan then. The real issue of concern for the people of Greystones is that they have been looking at a hoarding round their harbour for three years now and see no hope of it being removed in the near future. This is the issue on which we should be focussed.

He concluded that “schemes such as what came before the Council this week are a distraction from the very serious issues facing us. I am very disappointed that all of my fellow councillors from Greystones chose to ignore the very real worries of Greystones residents in order to ensure that this premature proposal was passed”

Alan_P · 08-12-2010 9:30am

Fiachra2 wrote: »

Recent statement from Councillor Fortune which may be of interest.

Labour Party Councillor Tom Fortune has expressed disappointment at the response of his fellow Greystones representatives on Wicklow County Council regarding a proposal to increase the number of houses at the Greystones Marina development. He told the meeting of Wicklow County Council on 6th December that there was no need for this proposal to come before the Council at this time. The plan involved increasing the number of houses to 375. An Bord Pleanala in 2006 had ruled that this number of houses was too many. The Board had confirmed this position in early in 2010 when Wicklow County Council had first proposed the increase. “What the Councillors have now done is to ignore the Boards views and vote the increase through anyway” said Fortune. “This is bad planning and bad for Wicklow County Council’s image nationally” he continued. “County councils need to be seen to be upholding high standards when it comes to planning not trying to find ways to circumvent the planning process and bypass an authority such as An Bord Plenanala. It also ignores potential traffic problems in the area”

Councillor Fortune went on to point out that the proposal was completely premature. “In the current housing market it is very probable that the houses won’t be built for 5-10 years. It would have been time enough to consider this plan then. The real issue of concern for the people of Greystones is that they have been looking at a hoarding round their harbour for three years now and see no hope of it being removed in the near future. This is the issue on which we should be focussed.

He concluded that “schemes such as what came before the Council this week are a distraction from the very serious issues facing us. I am very disappointed that all of my fellow councillors from Greystones chose to ignore the very real worries of Greystones residents in order to ensure that this premature proposal was passed”

Related story from Tuesday's Irish Times :-

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/1207/1224284926812.html

One would have to assume that when An Bord Pleanála come "to adjudicate on whether the use of part eight by the council was appropriate", it will take them about 3 nanoseconds to decide it wasn't, and that they will subsequently reject the additional housing out of hand.

So the whole proposal to increase the amount of housing may well be a complete waste of time and money anyway. I can't help wondering if it wasn't entirely conceived for the same of NAMA optics anyway.

d'Oracle · 08-12-2010 2:16pm

darter wrote: »

In some ways, we won. We got a renovated harbour without the monstrous real estate development that - to my eyes - would have been (and will be eventually) an eyesore and inappropriate in scale to Greystones's village size.

Good to know I'm not the only one who can see the potential awesomeness in it all.

However, Greystones hasn't been a village since the 80s.

Blanchflower · 08-12-2010 9:25pm

Alan_P wrote: »

Related story from Tuesday's Irish Times :-

So the whole proposal to increase the amount of housing may well be a complete waste of time and money anyway. I can't help wondering if it wasn't entirely conceived for the same of NAMA optics anyway.

Just wait and see the FF/FG cabal try and shift blame on the stalled development onto anyone who dared to register their democratic objection with An Bord Pleanala. Lets face facts. This project will not be completed for a long long time and we might as well resign ourselves to the certain prospect that the eyesore of a building site on the harbour with the hoardings will be there for years to come. The politicians in Dail Eireann bankrupted the country and the politicians of Wicklow County Council have ruined Greystones Harbour.

loyatemu · 08-12-2010 10:47pm

Blanchflower wrote: »

Just wait and see the FF/FG cabal try and shift blame on the stalled development onto anyone who dared to register their democratic objection with An Bord Pleanala. Lets face facts. This project will not be completed for a long long time and we might as well resign ourselves to the certain prospect that the eyesore of a building site on the harbour with the hoardings will be there for years to come. The politicians in Dail Eireann bankrupted the country and the politicians of Wicklow County Council have ruined Greystones Harbour.

whatever about the apartments, medical centre, clubhouses and all the other fol-de-rol, the harbour itself looks largely complete (from the Dart) and they are busy levelling off the surrounding site - on that basis it seems unlikely to me that it will be left as a cordened off building site - the main work has been done already.

Fiachra2 · 09-12-2010 8:12am

The blaming has started already. In rather colourful terms! (See below, 2nd most recent post).

http://www.greystonesguide.com/greystonesharbour.html

It certainly looks like the hoardings could be removed and one would hope that SISK have this possibility in mind in doing all that levelling. However to date neither they not the Council officials have been prepared to discuss any option other that the one requiring NAMA funding

Sparks115 · 09-12-2010 9:35am

In reference to the Greystones Guide link...

http://www.greystonesguide.com/home.html

Look at most of the articles from Ciaran Hayden .....What a Nit Wit!! Does he think anyone other than the other Fianna Fail cronies and politicians support hi views - I think not!!

Lets be honest here - anyone in Fianna Fail is a nit wit!!
Arrest me ban me lock me up shoot me - at this stage I dont care. The country has gone to pot and Greystones Council/ Wicklow Co council is a micro example of how bad and dare I say it.... useless/self serving/immoral!!!. :eek:

I sometimes feel so upset and angered at how these people can get away with the crap they get away with. Do they think we are stupid!!!

a prime example if a Fianna Fail nit wit is COUNCILLER CIARAN HAYDEN -who the hell does he think he is. He does not speak for me I did not vote for him. If there was one politicain in all of Greystones that I think needs to be taken out of office it is him!!

He stands for everything that is bad an wrong with Irish politics!! Everytime I read an article by himor a quote it makes my stomach turn that my tax payers money is paying for this guy!!

By the way I use the word Nit Wit because I cant call him what I really would like to call him but you can be damn sure if he or any of his Fianna Fail Nit wits come knocking on my door they will get the proper term for what they are. They have ruined my childrens future and I say shame on them and Karma is a wonderful thing - as Mr Justin Timberlake once said and I say it now Mr Ciaran Hayden and the rest of the Fianna Fail / Wicklow County
Council heads - " What goes around comes around".

I assume I am now in trouble for venting my anger on this forum and for specifically having a go at Mr Hayden

Langerland · 09-12-2010 10:28am

Well that is a bit of a rant and off the topic, but I understand your anger. However, the people of Greystones did vote for Ciaran Hayden and you are part of that collective (whether your actual vote was for him or not). Perhaps you should run yourself in the next council election or maybe propose a better alternative. Cllnr Hayden is no nit wit....believe me

. However, if he was and there are plenty....nit wits get into office because the majority of the electorate vote for nit wits....unfortunately.....only nit wits vote for nit wits I suppose....

Huntthe · 09-12-2010 10:33am

He does a very good impersonation of a nit-wit.

Sparks115 · 09-12-2010 10:40am

Point taken. He may not be a Nit Wit he in fact is probably a very clever man - but I still dont like his attitude or his views, he is entitled to have them and I am entitled to voice my opinion against him and would have no hesitation in voicing them to him directly but I fear I am so angry at all politicians at the moment I would just loose the run of myself.:o

Sorry about going off topic and ranting everyone!! I shall go now and calm myself down by taking a run naked in the snow!!!LOL:D

Langerland · 09-12-2010 10:56am

Sparks115 wrote: »

Sorry about going off topic and ranting everyone!! I shall go now and calm myself down by taking a run naked in the snow!!!LOL:D

That would probably get you a few votes if you decide to run in the next council election!!! :P

grace143 · 09-12-2010 12:54pm

Has anyone ever checked out the revenue site and noticed Mr Haydens status regarding directorship http://www.cro.ie/search/DisqualifiedSearch [/URL]
HE IS RESTRICTED UNDER SECTION 150 OF THE COMPANIES ACT, 1990.

And this man is the Mayor of Greystones???:

Now, that is just appalling and just goes to prove the fact that anyone can hold office in this country without their affairs in order and that is a complete disgrace.

Sparks115 · 09-12-2010 1:08pm

from the man who had an issue with people protesting outside the house of one the biggest contributing Nit Wits to our countries demise Mr Sean Fitzpatrick. He actually had the gall to write this again proving the point these people look after each other no matter what!! I say Shame on you Mr Hayden Shame on you!!!

http://ciaranhayden.com/media/?p=576

LEIN · 09-12-2010 1:28pm

This is starting to read like the political forum again.

If it cant be kept on topic, it will be closed.

Langerland · 09-12-2010 1:48pm

grace143 wrote: »

Has anyone ever checked out the revenue site and noticed Mr Haydens status regarding directorship http://www.cro.ie/search/DisqualifiedSearch [/URL]
HE IS RESTRICTED UNDER SECTION 150 OF THE COMPANIES ACT, 1990.

And this man is the Mayor of Greystones???:

Now, that is just appalling and just goes to prove the fact that anyone can hold office in this country without their affairs in order and that is a complete disgrace.

Strange that this is the only post this person has even made.....

....in a country where entrepreneurial businesses are going bust all over the place, are you saying anybody who has been director of a company that subsequently became insolvent should be barred from public office indefintely?

This thread has gone way off the intended topic....apologies on my behalf.

danjo · 09-12-2010 2:04pm

Will an Bord Pleanala have any further say in the development expansion? I note one poster refers to "adjudication" but I thought the process used was to avoid further referrals to the Bord.

Mr Posh · 09-12-2010 2:12pm

Back on topic:

I thought this was a dam good response which some what exposes the Mayor’s smoke and mirrors act

Let’s not forget the mayor of Greystones is no more democratically elected by the people than the other 8 individuals on the council

http://www.greystonesguide.com/articles/article/6961207/150150.htm

News and views on Greystones harbour and marina [SEE MODERATOR WARNING POST 1187]

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