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Dublin Bus route 145 :(

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,034 ✭✭✭thomasj


    The 37s 39s 70s serve the four courts, and first stop on ormond quay then turn right at capel street bridge


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 686 ✭✭✭joegriffinjnr


    How are The VT,s getting on lads, are they having any problems, are they getting used well? The only problem I can see is the turn from Kilarney Rd to Kilbride Lane heading towards the city. Also The lights from Kilbride Lane to Kilarney Rd heading towards Kilmac are woeful! The 145 should just stay on the Kilarney Rd!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    All fine but I've prepaid for the old 92 route on my annual ticket so it's a bit annoying having to pay twice.
    I don't get the logic of a rail link service that has to come from miles outside the city centre. It's jammers at leeson st, one day I couldn't even get on, and when you do get on, the people all get off from about Stephens green and Aston Quay, and not many - if any - of the originals are still on it all the way to Heuston.

    Genie_us,It`s not all bad....your pre-paid add-on is now valid on the 145,so don`t even think of paying twice.

    You are the first poster,and unsurprisingly a 92 user,to hit this nail on the head.

    One of the prime causes of the awful mess we now find ourselves in was the inability of Mssrs Deloitte`s Accountants to differentiate between a dedicated Railhead Feeder Route (92) and a High Frequency Trunk Route (145)

    The two genre`s of Bus Routing are Chalk N Cheese with totally differing operational requirements and expectations.

    It`s early days yet,but there are indications that somebody within managerial circles has suddenly woken up to the fact that whilst the Farmer and the Cowboy must be friends,the 92 and 145 must remain mere accquaintances....There may be some news on the situation later on in the week.....operating the 92 to Belfield is now starting to appear a more sensible option to some....;)


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    The 145 should just stay on the Kilarney Rd

    Now that is the embodiment of everything that Network Direct stands for !!

    For that suggestion alone,I hereby propose Joegriffinjnr for President ! :D


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 480 ✭✭genie_us


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    Genie_us,It`s not all bad....your pre-paid add-on is now valid on the 145,so don`t even think of paying twice.

    You are the first poster,and unsurprisingly a 92 user,to hit this nail on the head.

    One of the prime causes of the awful mess we now find ourselves in was the inability of Mssrs Deloitte`s Accountants to differentiate between a dedicated Railhead Feeder Route (92) and a High Frequency Trunk Route (145)

    The two genre`s of Bus Routing are Chalk N Cheese with totally differing operational requirements and expectations.

    It`s early days yet,but there are indications that somebody within managerial circles has suddenly woken up to the fact that whilst the Farmer and the Cowboy must be friends,the 92 and 145 must remain mere accquaintances....There may be some news on the situation later on in the week.....operating the 92 to Belfield is now starting to appear a more sensible option to some....;)

    God I hope so!
    The last few mornings the bus from heuston had no number on it and dropped people round to Wilton Terrace. And yesterday evening I legged it out to leeson st and just missed a 145 to Heuston, but not 2 minutes later a 145 with D'Olier st on the front stopped and said he was going to Heuston, he came from Wilton Terrace though and didn't come over the bridge like they normally do so that was a bit weird. But great cos he flew up and I even had time to get a coffee!

    I sent a novel of a complaint into DB last week but haven't heard back yet, but hopefully they'll change it back or at least change it to something that makes sense!


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    That sounds like drivers messing up the whole thing though? Busses coming from the wrong terminus showing no number or the wrong destination is what is stopping this new route being a success!
    genie_us wrote: »
    God I hope so!
    The last few mornings the bus from heuston had no number on it and dropped people round to Wilton Terrace. And yesterday evening I legged it out to leeson st and just missed a 145 to Heuston, but not 2 minutes later a 145 with D'Olier st on the front stopped and said he was going to Heuston, he came from Wilton Terrace though and didn't come over the bridge like they normally do so that was a bit weird. But great cos he flew up and I even had time to get a coffee!

    I sent a novel of a complaint into DB last week but haven't heard back yet, but hopefully they'll change it back or at least change it to something that makes sense!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 480 ✭✭genie_us


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    That sounds like drivers messing up the whole thing though? Busses coming from the wrong terminus showing no number or the wrong destination is what is stopping this new route being a success!

    No to be fair I don't think it is - the one this morning had no number on it but the inspector guy (who is really annoying by the way) was giving him instructions of where to go, ie he says ' be a 91 for this route' - even though the 91 was a totally different route to the 92.
    Very confusing.

    I'm not 100% on how they work it but I think they come from different depots, the 92s used to come from Conyngham Road and I think the 145s are from a different one...

    So the bus this morning was just dropping people off and was told not to pick people up


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Foggy_Lad,perhaps unsurprisingly,posted....
    That sounds like drivers messing up the whole thing though? Busses coming from the wrong terminus showing no number or the wrong destination is what is stopping this new route being a success!

    As a Driver meself,I`v kinda had to suspend my instinct to attempt to enlighten or inform Foggy_Lad by now :rolleyes:

    It`s a lost cause I fear,as his vehement dislike for Busdrivers as a group clouds all else.

    So perhaps it`s best to simply allow his very firm beliefs to actually be confirmed and then to move on to other posters who may be actually interested in the mechanics of reality.

    Genie_us posted...
    No to be fair I don't think it is - the one this morning had no number on it but the inspector guy (who is really annoying by the way) was giving him instructions of where to go, ie he says ' be a 91 for this route' - even though the 91 was a totally different route to the 92.
    Very confusing.

    What you are witnessing Genie_us is the Stance Inspector attempting,under substantial pressure, to regulate the service,as best he can with the resources available to him.

    It is essentially a Juggling Display and generally will attempt to satisfy a peak or spot requirement for capacity along a streatch of the route.

    You are correct in the fact of the different routes coming from different garages
    So the bus this morning was just dropping people off

    Again here we see a re-emergence of a practive which unless absolutely necessary should be avoided as unless accurately recorded it can result in highly inaccutate route data being available for collation....and this dats is what the planners base their future schemes upon.

    For example that Driver,who incidentally,"was told not to pick people up" may well be recorded as actually operating normally.....

    When at some future point the Data from the Ticket Machine is downloaded and assesed by some bright-eyed young graduate,he/she has no record of the instruction to the Driver and simply sees no tickets or passes recorded on that stretch between A and B and deduces from that that no demand exists for that particular journey/service.

    The reality on-the-day as described by many actual users such as Genie_us will have been large crowds of intending passengers left waiting at stops...but officially unrecorded.

    I do hope that Genie_us`s representations are taken on board as the experiences of the passengers are what will decide the future of the company.

    I would also stress that my opinions are just that,Opinions and nothing else,Not Policy,Not Official,Not Corporate,Not Trade Union just personal opinion based upon some level of front-line experience.

    You,or indeed any poster,can take it or leave it as you find it. :D


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,827 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Out of interest, why are we still seeing old numbers on these displays, and old destinations? Is it too hard for someone to go around all the buses in the garage and when they load the new ones, to remove the ones that no longer exist or do not need to be used to ensure that nobody can use the older displays?

    I read elsewhere that some companies with the same destination equipment of Dublin Bus have it set up so every time they go in and out of the depot they are automatically updated. If so it should be quite simple no?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 540 ✭✭✭spareman


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    That sounds like drivers messing up the whole thing though? Busses coming from the wrong terminus showing no number or the wrong destination is what is stopping this new route being a success!
    Finally we have figured out why the route is not working, thanks for that foggy_lad:rolleyes:


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Devnull posted.....
    I read elsewhere that some companies with the same destination equipment of Dublin Bus have it set up so every time they go in and out of the depot they are automatically updated.

    A good point and as far as I am aware the current Ticket Machine/Destination interface does allow for this facility....perhaps nobody read the manual...? :rolleyes:


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,827 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Which begs the question, if it is possible, then why isn't it implemented?

    It would make all of these instances we've seen of strange and inaccurate displays a thing of the past!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 72 ✭✭dazmetron


    Well I see somebody in dublinbus has managed to update the google map route for the 145. Its a pity they didn't manage to mark the correct stops as I see the stop on Westmorland st is still marked instead of the Aston Quay stop. As I don't travel further than "An Lar" I have no idea whether the stops on the quays are marked correctly. I have a feeling not considering the issues with the Arran Quay stop and also considering AlekSmart and SickCert have been discussing their lack of prior knowledge of the correct stops. I also had a discussion with a couple of drivers in Kilmac on the first Monday morning of Network In-Direct as they were wondering themselves which stops were serving the 145 along the Quays.

    I also have to agree with Alek and joegriffinjnr in wondering why the loop off the Kilarney rd to Herbert road wasn't scrapped along with the dart station loop. It would have made sense at the and makes even more sense now that VTs are being used. On one last night going home and the turn onto Killarney lane doesn't look like the easiest especially with a VT at the lights waiting to turn back onto the Kilarney road heading towards town. It isn't too much of a walk to stops on Kilarney road and the 45A also serves the Kilarney land / Herbert rd / Kilbride lane loop so it wouldn't be as if people are being left without any service.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,705 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    SickCert wrote: »
    Have a look at Carlisle in 1982 a little yellow advert. This type of advert/sticker saves so much time.
    Don't I vaguely recollect these closer to home for a long period of time?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 394 ✭✭Propellerhead


    Victor wrote: »
    Don't I vaguely recollect these closer to home for a long period of time?

    Buses in Dublin (not "busses", ugh) had black and white waistband stickers saying "exact fare only" from the time that one-person operation was introduced on the 38A sometime in the mid 1980s.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    ok i am prepared to say it is not all down to drivers as there are inspectors going around in circles too and managers that are sitting in offices who will not accept there are issues and who think busses are only for the peasants and who would rather take their own car with a generous milage allowance or get the company pay for expensive taxis than take a bus, the problem may be some drivers being a bit "old fashioned"in not accepting change too well but it seems the whole company is in on the act from the very top (who seem oblivious to the issues at the stops) down to the drivers inspectors etc.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 96 ✭✭axiom


    back in college yesterday ...

    went to get the 145 at 4 o clock yesterday and today ....

    both times been waiting at least 45 - 50 mins on an empty enough bus ...

    yesterday, 2 came in the space of 40 mins, absolutely rammed ... luckily got one 5 mins after....

    a good 5 out of service buses went by ....


    then today was waiting 50 mins, again only 2 jammed to the rafters went by in the space of 45 mins, got one at 16.50 after bein there from 16.00
    again with 7 this time, out of service buses going by

    all I can say is no way the 10 min schedule working

    can't wait until this luas extension opens up in 3 weeks


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Axiom,s experiences with the NEW ! IMPROVED ! 145 Route.....
    Yesterday, 2 came in the space of 40 mins, absolutely rammed
    Today was waiting 50 mins, again only 2 jammed to the rafters went by in the space of 45 mins, got one at 16.50 after bein there from 16.00


    From speaking to random folks about town and between Leeson St and Westmoreland St,Axiom`s experiences appear representative of many.

    I`m uncertain of what come`s next.

    It appears that a section of senior people have,shall we say...a different perspective on events as they are occurring.

    A colleague yesterday had a Head Office personage on their (Late and VERY full) 145 journey.

    As this HO Personage was exiting they bade the driver good day,and expressed the following incredible sentiment......:eek:
    "Isn`t it great to see the buses being used again,I have`nt seen a full one for so long..."

    If,and I stress IF,this is indicative of a general perception within the Management Suite,then we,both Staff and Customers,have a problem.

    On the one hand we attempt to portray an image as a professional forward looking 1st World Public Transport Provider,yet if this throwaway remark is to be taken seriously our Management ethos is to be taken straight from some of the raunchier 3rd World environments which feature customers sitting on the roof along with their poultry and assorted chattels...:confused:

    However,perhaps the Managerial types have taken their eye of the Elephant in the Room as outlined in Axiom`s farewell.....

    Can't wait until this luas extension opens up in 3 weeks

    Ignore that sentiment at your peril I say....!


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    Inspections on the route tomorrow after complains for passengers. Drivers beware!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Inspections on the route tomorrow after complains for passengers. Drivers beware!

    SteveK101...The Drivers need not beware of anything....If the mood of the passengers I have spoken to is anything to go by it`s the Inspectors who`ll need to don the flak-jackets.

    I do take your point however,that in order to present some PR image of somebody doing something,whilst nobody actually does anything,a certain element of Hi-Viz Supervisory Talent will be on display.

    However,the all too apparent reality of the situation is that urgent remedial action is now required if the successful 46A and 145 service which existed prior to Sept 19 (Our own 1911 !!) is to be restored.

    I do hope it stays dry for them :)

    Once again,given the certainty amongst some posters here that this is a Driver caused situation,perhaps Foggy_Lad planted a seed in the Executive Washroom ?? :eek:


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    This inspection is over drivers not stopping at designated stops leaving late etc. Granted RTPI would allow them to check this from the office but they are to be out on the beat today. To see what the real problems are.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,035 ✭✭✭✭-Chris-


    Stevek101 wrote: »
    This inspection is over drivers not stopping at designated stops leaving late etc. Granted RTPI would allow them to check this from the office but they are to be out on the beat today. To see what the real problems are.

    If you're close to the situation (as you seem to be), would you mind sharing some of their findings and the proposed remedies when they're available?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 480 ✭✭genie_us


    -Chris- wrote: »
    If you're close to the situation (as you seem to be), would you mind sharing some of their findings and the proposed remedies when they're available?

    I second this motion! Fingers crossed they'll sort it out

    I bet it'll all work perfectly today though :(


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Stevek101 wrote: »
    This inspection is over drivers not stopping at designated stops leaving late etc. Granted RTPI would allow them to check this from the office but they are to be out on the beat today. To see what the real problems are.
    i wonder then will it be a case of the inspected services running pretty much to schedule?

    really it is unlikely to be just down to drivers but poor inspectoring and not enough on the ground experience from the management side of things but hopefully that will be somewhat sorted out tomorrow:)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 538 ✭✭✭SickCert


    Stevek101 wrote: »
    Inspections on the route tomorrow after complains for passengers. Drivers beware!

    And a few union lads start to finish.
    I carried 316 passengers Between Heuston and Kilmac on a peak trip this morning. Smaller EV type bus. 20 mins down at Kilmac returning back to Dolier st. The bus before me was also a Dolier st. Some big gaps this morning heading from Heuston station.
    Todays blame was a car crash at Capel st ~ Tomorrows blame possibly rain ~ Saturdays blame TBA!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,124 ✭✭✭wolfpawnat


    Have to say, was waiting outside Heuston the other day for more than the promised 10 min (about 30 to be precise) but overall a definate improvement in my neck of the woods. I am not waiting as long, and they are not overfilled when they get here. I think that idea of stopping them going to Bray Dart station was a genius idea. I used have to wait there for 10-20 min while they gossiped like women some days!!!


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,827 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Any idea what come of the observations?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    have they not spent the day at their observations? are they expecting the evening to mirror the morning rush hour? also friday is the worst day as they can easily blame anything they dont like on the fact that it is friday and not a true representation of weekday services


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    They can easily blame anything they dont like on the fact that it is friday and not a true representation of weekday services

    It may take a wee while Foggy_Lad,but you are starting to display some very promising signs of Mangerial Talent !! :)

    You`re getting the hang of it nicely......


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    It may take a wee while Foggy_Lad,but you are starting to display some very promising signs of Mangerial Talent !! :)

    You`re getting the hang of it nicely......
    will they be having lunch in hueston station or across in the ashling hotel? depends on who is paying for it i suppose:)


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