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An Post sacks post office worker after she was held at gunpoint

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Comments

  • #62
    danbohan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,914 ✭✭✭danbohan


    DazMarz wrote: »
    Just listened to the interview... What a load... No way could a 'boo-iy' with a sledgehammer access the office so easily... She'd easily have had time to in some way slam the safe door, press a panic button, something....

    That is pandering to the media and the public's sympathies if ever I saw it. What a joke...

    And for the raiders to be that lucky to enter the office the moment she opened the safe...... ha... in the immortal words of Billy Connolly: "Give me a fúckin' break". The safe was probably swinging wide open the whole time anyway.

    i am sure it happened to you you would p;;;; yourself , your full of it , and next day you be with your little union rep trying to figure out how you could get post traumatic stress compo , this lady might have made mistakes , who knows , but at least she was trying to create a income for herself and her family while not having the security of a public sector employee like your good self .


  • #63
    OutlawPete
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,689 ✭✭✭✭OutlawPete


    gogo wrote: »
    How much money, honey;)

    Not enough that a woman way better looking that me, would be willing to date me.

    But more than enough that I could hire her for an hour or three .. ;)


  • #64
    caseyann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,938 ✭✭✭caseyann


    OutlawPete wrote: »
    Not enough that a woman way better looking that me, would be willing to date me.

    But more than enough that I could hire her for an hour or three .. ;)

    I thought you were married :confused:


  • #65
    yogy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 164 ✭✭yogy


    The media and post mistress are making it out that she didn't act correctly once confronted by the robbers. Obviously once confronted with a weapon there is nothing anyone can do. It's what she did/didn't do before the robbery that has her in the ****..

    Anyone with half a brain can read between the lines; she obviously didn't carry out basic SOPs and protocols leaving her vulnerable to a robbery.

    She was post mistress in a sleepy village for over 30 years. Probably taught all the scum were to busy with their tiger kidnappings up in the big smoke to bother with her and so got lax...left doors/safes unlocked etc.

    Too right she got fired, dumb cnut...shame on the media, but no surprise there!


  • #66
    DazMarz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,493 ✭✭✭DazMarz


    danbohan wrote: »
    i am sure it happened to you you would p;;;; yourself , your full of it , and next day you be with your little union rep trying to figure out how you could get post traumatic stress compo , this lady might have made mistakes , who knows , but at least she was trying to create a income for herself and her family while not having the security of a public sector employee like your good self .

    I work in a Post Office, sunshine, and earlier this year, the place was raided by three blokes in painters coveralls, balaclavas and wielding sledgehammers and machetes and possibly had guns.

    I have no union rep.

    But what I did do was follow An Post procedure, pressed my panic button and slammed my cash drawer shut, before backing against the back wall and praying the glass in the window held as the thug slammed into it with a sledge hammer. Thankfully it did and they fled.

    Don't say things to me when you don't know the facts.

    Thanks.


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  • #67
    manta356
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 198 ✭✭manta356


    herbieflowers wrote: »
    Femails should never be given such posts in fairness.

    Or people with spelling difficulties :o


  • #68
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    manta356 wrote: »
    Or people with spelling difficulties :o
    Well spotted. I missed that one. Doh! :o


  • #69
    OutlawPete
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,689 ✭✭✭✭OutlawPete


    DazMarz wrote: »
    But what I did do was follow An Post procedure, pressed my panic button ...

    Did you listen to the interview?

    She couldn't press the button as they were on top of her as soon as they burst through the door.

    She didn't have the safe open all the time, it was on timelock and just pinged open when they got there.
    DazMarz wrote: »
    .. the back wall and praying the glass in the window held as the thug slammed into it with a sledge hammer. Thankfully it did and they fled.

    Lucky for you .. but she didn't have the luxury of reinforced glass to protect her.


  • #70
    Jaxxy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,297 ✭✭✭Jaxxy


    danbohan wrote: »
    i am sure it happened to you you would p;;;; yourself , your full of it , and next day you be with your little union rep trying to figure out how you could get post traumatic stress compo , this lady might have made mistakes , who knows , but at least she was trying to create a income for herself and her family while not having the security of a public sector employee like your good self .

    Actually if you work in a sub-post office, IE one of the offices not overseen solely by An Post (post offices ran by An Post are few but include the GPO, Andrew St., Blanchardstown Shopping Ctr., etc.) then you are privately employed as your contract is directly with the Postmaster/mistress. So you don't get a union representative, post traumatic stress claims or anything of the sort.

    Bit misinformed there.


  • #71
    DazMarz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,493 ✭✭✭DazMarz


    OutlawPete wrote: »
    Did you listen to the interview?

    She couldn't press the button as they were on top of her as soon as they burst through the door.

    She didn't have the safe open all the time, it was on timelock and just pinged open when they got there.



    Lucky for you .. but she didn't have the luxury of reinforced glass to protect her.

    In An Post, you are supposed to have a panic button on your person at all times. I did, clipped to my belt. There is also one under my desk, on the wall next to the safe, on the back wall etc. They are everywhere and this is pretty standard in An Post.

    That the raiders would be SOOOOOO lucky to land in on top of her just as the safe opened is a million to one. Luckiest raiders ever. Or just a woman TRYING (and failing) to cover her own back.

    She didn't follow procedure. She didn't do her job. She lost An Post €100,000. She lost her job. Facts.

    And yes, maybe she didn't have the laminated glass we have, but that still is no excuse for her not following protocol and doing her job.

    Sorry, but all the An Post security procedurals that go on, all the drills, testing the panic buttons, familiarising yourself with panic buttons, etc. that are provided and she neglected to do any of them. That smacks of pure, utter negligence.

    I can sympathise with her trauma, as I've been through the same, and I was shaken... badly shaken, but I was commended by my supervisor for my actions... I realise that it would have been scant consolation had I been injured or killed for the sake of An Post's money, but...
    .
    If she was familiar with procedure and had undertaken training as was in her contract, this would never have happened.


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  • #72
    sesna
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭sesna


    Anita Blow wrote: »
    There needs to be a law similar to Godwin's law which deals with the inevitable NAMA/FF post in every thread

    I see all the FF hacks must have nothing better to do in Mount Street today.


  • #73
    Our man in Havana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 29,466 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    Also time locked safes don't just ping open.


  • #74
    DazMarz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,493 ✭✭✭DazMarz


    Haddockman wrote: »
    Also time locked safes don't just ping open.

    Correct,

    There is a buzzer to tell you the time has elapsed, but you have to open them manually with (usually) two keys and so on. They don't just 'open' like Aladdin's Cave.


  • #75
    homer simpson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,852 ✭✭✭homer simpson


    DazMarz wrote: »
    Just listened to the interview... What a load... No way could a 'boo-iy' with a sledgehammer access the office so easily... She'd easily have had time to in some way slam the safe door, press a panic button, something....

    That is pandering to the media and the public's sympathies if ever I saw it. What a joke...

    And for the raiders to be that lucky to enter the office the moment she opened the safe...... ha... in the immortal words of Billy Connolly: "Give me a fúckin' break". The safe was probably swinging wide open the whole time anyway.

    How do you know they wern't watching the place? how do you know that she was just going to empty the safe? and they knew thay thare are a lot of ifs and buts here , both for and against mind you.
    DazMarz wrote: »
    I work in a Post Office, sunshine, and on the 8th of June, 2010, the place was raided by three blokes in painters coveralls, balaclavas and wielding sledgehammers and machetes and possibly had guns.

    I have no union rep.

    But what I did do was follow An Post procedure, pressed my panic button and slammed my cash drawer shut, before backing against the back wall and praying the glass in the window held as the thug slammed into it with a sledge hammer. Thankfully it did and they fled.

    Don't say things to me when you don't know the facts.

    Thanks.

    sure there were 3 of you as you said this woman worked in the post office on her own dont forget, if you were a (oldish) woman on your own with people shouting and squeeling and pointing guns at you would you have the presence of mind to follow precedure then? i dont think so!!!

    Also if you knew the area at all its about 30 miles from the nearest big town in the republic, but it is about 2 mile from the border with the north, the area is constantly targeted bookies / shops / PO's on a regular basis.

    and one more wee point pressing the panic button would have done feck all because the PO is across the road from a (never manned) gardai barracks, the nearest manned one (unless they are doing patrols ect which they never do here cos they are scared sh!tless) is letterkenny again about 45mins drive away!


    You may work in a PO but dont live in the area where this took place, and also you say you work in a rural PO? its clearly not if t.here are 3 people working there!

    Edit might have misread that there were 3 of you's in the PO, cant see it in the quoted posts and couldnt be arsed to go look for it, lol.


  • #76
    DazMarz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,493 ✭✭✭DazMarz


    homer_simpson wrote: »
    sure there were 3 of you as you said!

    No, there were 3 raiders! I was on my fúcking own!!! Read my post, thanks!


  • #77
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    DazMarz wrote: »
    Correct,

    There is a buzzer to tell you the time has elapsed, but you have to open them manually with (usually) two keys and so on. They don't just 'open' like Aladdin's Cave.
    Correct, the buzzer is usually set to a time period of five, ten, fifteen minutes etc beforehand. The time itself is chosen normally at installation of the safe.

    I agree too, a safe door does most certainly NOT ping open. I have never seen one do this in all my years and I don't believe that the Post Office establishment would buy such a crap safe that might even do this!


  • #78
    sesna
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭sesna


    Sounds like An Post expected security on the cheap from an elderly woman, working on her own. The woman also said it took 24 minutes for the Gardai to arrive. If they were so concerned about losing a potential 80k they should have employed a security guard.


  • #79
    Jaxxy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,297 ✭✭✭Jaxxy


    homer_simpson wrote: »
    sure there were 3 of you as you said this woman worked in the post office on her own dont forget, if you were on your own with people shouting and squeeling and pointing guns at you would you have the presence of mind to follow precedure then? i dont think so!!!

    The last time I was held up I was alone and I managed to follow procedure. As hard as that might seem when there's a gun pointed at you, I still managed to do it. My safe was locked but set to open after I'd closed, and even if it wasn't it contained less than €5,000. The time was 5.25pm and I was in the process of cashing up for the evening. I had €110 in my drawer in tens and fives, and that's what the thieves got.

    Everyone is missing the point here. This woman, alone in a one man post office, had €100,000 on the premises. This, by itself, is gross negligence. According to the statement from An Post the post office had been in breach of many security protocols and procedures previous to this incident. She deserved to lose her job. She got off lightly, her laziness could have been her own undoing, not just her livelihood's.


  • #80
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,305 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Carrigans is on the Donegal/Derry border, small village about 5 miles from Derry. It wouldn't be wise having that type of money there, if at all avoidable.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #81
    homer simpson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,852 ✭✭✭homer simpson


    DazMarz wrote: »
    No, there were 3 raiders! I was on my fúcking own!!! Read my post, thanks!

    i love the way you ignored the rest of my post cos you know i was right and picked out the one thing i was wrong about , even though i went straight in and edited the psot when i realised i misread (which was before you posted this)

    Well if your standing by everything you said in this thread i sincerly hope you get held up when you have had a serious busy day and get sacked because you were cought off guard and raided!


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  • #82
    OutlawPete
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,689 ✭✭✭✭OutlawPete


    DazMarz wrote: »
    In An Post, you are supposed to have a panic button on your person at all times.

    She didn't, there was one and it was over at her seat.
    DazMarz wrote: »
    That the raiders would be SOOOOOO lucky to land in on top of her just as the safe opened is a million to one. Luckiest raiders ever. Or just a woman TRYING (and failing) to cover her own back.

    Again, you are not reading posts.

    There is every chance that the Post Office was under surveillance and they could tell from her movements what she was doing.

    You are implying the safe was wide open and that woman did not strike me as a liar. She worked their for thirty years and if her character was so poor that she would not admit leaving a safe wide open, I think it would have showed in other areas and she would have been let go by now.
    DazMarz wrote: »
    She lost An Post €100,000. She lost her job. Facts.

    Eh, not a "fact" actually, €80,000 was taken.
    DazMarz wrote: »
    And yes, maybe she didn't have the laminated glass we have, but that still is no excuse for her not following protocol and doing her job.

    What protocol did she not follow? That you know for sure that is.

    I seen that Post Office tonight on the news and it is tiny.

    Seems to me it is very plausible that if two guys were suddenly on top of you with guns and sledge hammers, there is fcuk all you could do.
    Haddockman wrote: »
    Also time locked safes don't just ping open.

    They do when you set them to open.

    I have head timed safes open and they make an audible noise.

    Point is she is saying that she timed the safe to open as she needed cash and while she was down at it, they broke down the door.

    So whether it 'pinged', 'dinged' or just made a small click- it's irrelevant.


  • #83
    DazMarz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,493 ✭✭✭DazMarz


    Sorry to all concerned if I seem very stroppy about this, but the facts are:

    -An Post provides its offices and its employees (and those contracted to them) with the best of security and security procedures. These, however, to require strict adherence on the part of said employees and it is required that employees familiarise themselves with the security procedures.

    -Random time-locking and adherence to time locking safes ensures that a safe is never open for any length of time, and is never left open. That armed raiders would happen to arrive at the precise moment she opened the safe beggars belief. if she was foolish enough to open the safe at the same time every, well, that is like an invite.

    -Panic buttons in financial institutions (banks, building societies, post offices etc.) are designed to elicit the maximum response from any Garda units in the vicinity. Average response time to a panic alarm button is (according to statistics) 3.5 minutes

    I do not believe that she followed procedure at all, and she has failed in her duty. I don't think that she should be left in charge of the office at all.

    Again, I feel very strongly about this, as people will blame An Post more, and An Post are totally blameless here. They are probably the best at securing their offices and had their protocol been adhered to, none of this would have happened.


  • #84
    Jedidiah Crooked Steamroller
    Posts: 81,308 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Jedidiah Crooked Steamroller


    OutlawPete wrote: »


    Eh, not a "fact" actually, €80,000 was taken.

    No, it was 100k
    AP only asked for 80k back
    her life was turned upside down when three armed raiders put a gun to her head and got away with more than €100,000 in cash
    From the indo


  • #85
    homer simpson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,852 ✭✭✭homer simpson


    JaxxYChicK wrote: »
    The last time I was held up I was alone and I managed to follow procedure. As hard as that might seem when there's a gun pointed at you, I still managed to do it. My safe was locked but set to open after I'd closed, and even if it wasn't it contained less than €5,000. The time was 5.25pm and I was in the process of cashing up for the evening. I had €110 in my drawer in tens and fives, and that's what the thieves got.

    Everyone is missing the point here. This woman, alone in a one man post office, had €100,000 on the premises. This, by itself, is gross negligence. According to the statement from An Post the post office had been in breach of many security protocols and procedures previous to this incident. She deserved to lose her job. She got off lightly, her laziness could have been her own undoing, not just her livelihood's.

    noone is disagreing that there was a seriously large amount of money taken, but as you telling me thats its impossable to have that kind of money in a PO that covers huge area (because the PO decided to close 2 other PO's near there, that then fell into her area, 1 whole and 1 partailly) and she was and oldish woman, with no immediate help to hand and no protection in the PO, i knwo what i'd do!

    A LIFE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN MONEY!!!!!!!

    PS you and Demarz should get medels for your fantastic service to the PO, and badges of bravery for your efforts :rolleyes:


  • #86
    DazMarz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,493 ✭✭✭DazMarz


    I'm lucky in that I will concede that my office is in the Dublin Metropolitan Area and as such is probably afforded greater security (laminate glass, solid core doors, 3 safes, etc.) than others. Plus we have plenty of Garda barracks within 10 minutes of the office.

    But at the same time, procedure for having monies kept in seperate safes, having safes timelocked for different intervals, NEVER opening safes at the same time every day etc. were obviously not adhered to and hence the guys probably watched her for a week and had a routine down pat.

    Also, if this was a border area that was dodgy, surely she'd have been more cautious??? As I said, I'm in the Dublin Met area and even though that was my first experience of a raid, I'm always pretty sketchy when the place goes a bit quiet, or when it's a bit busy. But busy or no, there is no excuse for allowing security to loosen up. Sorry, that's just a personal feeling of mine.


  • #87
    OutlawPete
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,689 ✭✭✭✭OutlawPete


    DazMarz wrote: »
    Again, I feel very strongly about this, as people will blame An Post more, and An Post are totally blameless here. They are probably the best at securing their offices and had their protocol been adhered to, none of this would have happened.

    They are far from blameless.

    In my opinion, nobody should be working alone where there is €100,000 cash on the premises.

    If An Post are happy to have a woman working alone with that amount, then the least they could do is make sure someone with a sledgehammer couldn't just break down a door and be on top of her.


  • #88
    DazMarz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,493 ✭✭✭DazMarz


    This is why there are time locked safes in post offices. So that even if the office proper is breached, money can not be taken. But the responsibility lies solely with the post office manager/employee to make sure that the safes are time locked correctly and that there is never more cash than is needed out and readily accessible,


  • #89
    homer simpson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,852 ✭✭✭homer simpson


    DazMarz wrote: »
    Sorry to all concerned if I seem very stroppy about this, but the facts are:

    -An Post provides its offices and its employees (and those contracted to them) with the best of security and security procedures. These, however, to require strict adherence on the part of said employees and it is required that employees familiarise themselves with the security procedures.

    -Random time-locking and adherence to time locking safes ensures that a safe is never open for any length of time, and is never left open. That armed raiders would happen to arrive at the precise moment she opened the safe beggars belief. if she was foolish enough to open the safe at the same time every, well, that is like an invite.

    -Panic buttons in financial institutions (banks, building societies, post offices etc.) are designed to elicit the maximum response from any Garda units in the vicinity. Average response time to a panic alarm button is (according to statistics) 3.5 minutes

    I do not believe that she followed procedure at all, and she has failed in her duty. I don't think that she should be left in charge of the office at all.

    Again, I feel very strongly about this, as people will blame An Post more, and An Post are totally blameless here. They are probably the best at securing their offices and had their protocol been adhered to, none of this would have happened.


    Response time 3.5 mins my toot, lol!

    Please bear in mind the nearest manned Barracks is in letterkenny even with blues and twos on would still be over 20mins drive away! That has to be a major factor here, given the circumstances with a gun pointed at your head id do the same!!!! what would you do in the exact same conditons and circumstances as her (the only difference being the cash maybe)????? I think they should send you to carrigains PO see what you think of it:o

    and i know the amount of money is large as ive already said but given the area covered by that PO would it be IMPOSSABLE to have that amount of money there?


  • #90
    OutlawPete
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,689 ✭✭✭✭OutlawPete


    DazMarz wrote: »
    This is why there are time locked safes in post offices. So that even if the office proper is breached, money can not be taken. But the responsibility lies solely with the post office manager/employee to make sure that the safes are time locked correctly and that there is never more cash than is needed out and readily accessible,

    Christ man, why can't you address the fact that the safe WAS timelocked.

    She needed money and set it to open.

    You're disbelieving this woman's word and I fail to see any reason for this.

    As I have said, even Paddy Powers could be unlucky enough to be raided when their safe is be used.

    If they are then thrown against a back wall at gunpoint , where there is no panic button .. it's hardly their fault.


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  • #91
    DazMarz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,493 ✭✭✭DazMarz


    homer_simpson wrote: »
    Response time 3.5 mins my toot, lol!

    Please bear in mind the nearest manned Barracks is in letterkenny even with blues and twos on would still be over 20mins drive away! That has to be a major factor here, given the circumstances with a gun pointed at your head id do the same!!!! what would you do in the exact same conditons and circumstances as her (the only difference being the cash maybe)????? I think they should send you to carrigains PO see what you think of it:o

    and i know the amount of money is large as ive already said but given the area covered by that PO would it be IMPOSSABLE to have that amount of money there?

    Well, as I've said, the office I work in is nearer Dublin and has plenty of Garda stations nearby, so I'll concede that point. The day of the raid in my office, the Gardaí were there so quick I was barely over the shock of the raiders being in and then gone, before the local Garda was in.

    And I've seen offices in smaller towns and out in rural areas (Lisdoonvarna, Ballaghdereen etc.) and yes, they are smaller and so on, but still have the same basic equipment all offices have and also have all the safes other offices have. I cannot speak about Carrigans, as I've never been there.

    And the amount of money itself is not an issue. The issue is that €100,000 was all in one safe, and all so readily available. That is the issue. It was too easy for the scumbags to get at.


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