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More private-sector cuts on the way

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Comments

  • #122
    Citizen_Cutback
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭Citizen_Cutback


    wicorthered wrote: »
    I'm a public servant and in the last few months we've lost quite a few temporary staff. The most maddening thing is that the staff we lost were good, clever hard working people who cared about their job. What we have been left with is lazy, under motivated and for the performance they put in over paid wasters!!!

    We're getting hard time lately most of it unfairly but there is a massive problem in the PS with staff who are either not needed or couldn't give a hoot about their jobs. These guys then have permanent jobs while my contract ends in August:mad:

    The sickening thing is that it is these wasters the unions back up for the hard working temps. Unions cant do a thing for me in August but if someone asks one of our THREE receptionists to work harder there's murder.

    The Neoliberalists have thanked you for your post but none of them replied to offer you sympathy etc... Why?

    A lot of people in contract positions in the Public Service have lost their jobs in the last two years. Those who thanked for your post want you to lose yours as well. They would prefer if your were employed by a Private Sector company on an even lower wage and in an even more precarious existence so that your job could be done more efficiently; what they don't tell you is that also want your Private Sector employer to make a profit which is taxed at 12.5%, this profit would be the difference between what it costs to employ you and what they can charge for your services.

    Sure there are inefficiencies in any large organisation and the Public Sector is no different but those inefficiencies can be rectified. Be in no doubt that in the end of the day that the Public Sector is more efficient because it recruits staff directly to provide services rather than letting the Private Sector provide these same services for a profit.

    The Private Sector is most efficient in the provision of goods and services which the government can not provide as effectively or efficeintly, such as telecommunications, where having many service providers promotes choice and competition.


  • #123
    murphaph
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,997 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    paraletic wrote: »
    i speak for me,
    The goverment and union has let us down and i don't trust them
    some reform is needed, it has been needed for decades,
    however all workers rights should be protected, during these reforms,
    Do you consider it a right, not be be made redundant?

    You have admitted that reforms are needed. Meaningful reforms must deliver efficiencies which in turn must deliver redundancies, is that agreed or do believe there is no scope for redundancies in the public sector?


  • #124
    IrishTonyO
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,321 ✭✭✭IrishTonyO


    Citizen_Cutback wrote: »
    The Neoliberalists have thanked you for your post but none of them replied to offer you sympathy etc... Why?

    A lot of people in contract positions in the Public Service have lost their jobs in the last two years. Those who thanked for your post want you to lose yours as well. They would prefer if your were employed by a Private Sector company on an even lower wage and in an even more precarious existence so that your job could be done more efficiently; what they don't tell you is that also want your Private Sector employer to make a profit which is taxed at 12.5%, this profit would be the difference between what it costs to employ you and what they can charge for your services.

    Sure there are inefficiencies in any large organisation and the Public Sector is no different but those inefficiencies can be rectified. Be in no doubt that in the end of the day that the Public Sector is more efficient because it recruits staff directly to provide services rather than letting the Private Sector provide these same services for a profit.

    The Private Sector is most efficient in the provision of goods and services which the government can not provide as effectively or efficeintly, such as telecommunications, where having many service providers promotes choice and competition.

    Well it's very good to see that you can read other posters minds and tell them what they want, how do you do that?


  • #125
    murphaph
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,997 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Citizen_Cutback wrote: »
    Be in no doubt that in the end of the day that the Public Sector is more efficient because it recruits staff directly to provide services rather than letting the Private Sector provide these same services for a profit.
    hahaha, you're having a laugh surely! The public sector is inherently innefficient because there is no fear of failure built into it. Every private sector worker can contribute directly to the success (and perhaps more importantly) failure of his employer. This tends to focus the mind...everyone tends to work together to ensure their collective survival, quite socialist actually. In the public sector there is no fear of failure as the employer can just borrow more money or charge the consumer (taxpayer) more for it's services...a great number if you can get it. Therefore, the employees in the PS tend to be less careful with how they spend their budgets or how often they take sickies (well documented high rates of absenteeism in PS) or how many staff they employ etc. etc. etc.
    Citizen_Cutback wrote: »
    The Private Sector is most efficient in the provision of goods and services which the government can not provide as effectively or efficeintly, such as telecommunications, where having many service providers promotes choice and competition.
    ...telecoms! Of all the examples you pick one in which the public sector regulator (Comreg) has done such an abysmal job that we have some of the worst broadband penetration in Europe with some of the slowest speeds. Telecoms is not a good example as licences are required from the state and it is not an open market.


  • #126
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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  • #127
    Citizen_Cutback
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭Citizen_Cutback


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.
    Tax the workers or cut their pay is your only solution to our current fiscal crisis.

    When is the Private Sector going to change it's emphasis from trying to rip-off this country and go and create some export-led jobs or have they sent all those jobs to China? Every which way all the Private Sector Corporatons have to do is pay 12.5% tax.


  • #128
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    Citizen_Cutback wrote: »
    Tax the workers or cut their pay is your only solution to our current fiscal crisis.

    When is the Private Sector going to change it's emphasis from trying to rip-off this country and go and create some export-led jobs or have they sent all those jobs to China? Every which way all the Private Sector Corporatons have to do is pay 12.5% tax.

    and the waffle of the day award goes to...


  • #129
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


  • #130
    Citizen_Cutback
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭Citizen_Cutback


    murphaph wrote: »
    ...telecoms! Of all the examples you pick one in which the public sector regulator (Comreg) has done such an abysmal job that we have some of the worst broadband penetration in Europe with some of the slowest speeds. Telecoms is not a good example as licences are required from the state and it is not an open market.

    Comreg isn't the problem, it's Eircom! (Eircom is a Private Sector company).

    The problem is that the entire telephone network was privatised as part of Eircom.

    This telephone network infrastructure should have remained in State control and service providers should have been allowed access to the system without Eircom interference.

    How many times has Eircom been turned now over by corporate raiders, the first of which was Sir Tony Baloney of Independent newspapers?


  • #131
    murphaph
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,997 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Citizen_Cutback wrote: »
    Tax the workers or cut their pay is your only solution to our current fiscal crisis.

    When is the Private Sector going to change it's emphasis from trying to rip-off this country and go and create some export-led jobs or have they sent all those jobs to China? Every which way all the Private Sector Corporatons have to do is pay 12.5% tax.
    Most SME's pay an effective tax rate of app. 20% in reality, when rates etc. are factored into the bill. Only the headline job creator FDI corporations get away with 12.5%.

    Anyway, your post wasn't an answer, just went off on a tangent really. What would you do to address a 20bn defecit, without raising taxes to the point where it drives all the talented people out of the country (if anything, we absolutely cannot afford to lose talented people at this time, especially to our competition). What do you suggest?


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  • #132
    Citizen_Cutback
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭Citizen_Cutback


    ei.sdraob wrote: »
    and the waffle of the day award goes to...
    Ah! Is it you Bertie?


  • #133
    murphaph
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,997 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Citizen_Cutback wrote: »
    Comreg isn't the problem, it's Eircom! (Eircom is a Private Sector company).

    The problem is that the entire telephone network was privatised as part of Eircom.

    This telephone network infrastructure should have remained in State control and service providers should have been allowed access to the system without Eircom interference.

    How many times has Eircom been turned now over by corporate raiders, the first of which was Sir Tony Baloney of Independent newspapers?
    Way to ignore the rest of my post and pick up on an afterthought. Comreg are a joke. Eircon are a joke. See, I am capable of criticising a private company, can you bring yourself to criticise the Public Sector I wonder...


  • #134
    Citizen_Cutback
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭Citizen_Cutback


    murphaph wrote: »
    Most SME's pay an effective tax rate of app. 20% in reality, when rates etc. are factored into the bill. Only the headline job creator FDI corporations get away with 12.5%.

    And I thought rates etc... was tax deductible!


  • #135
    murphaph
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,997 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Citizen_Cutback wrote: »
    And I thought rates etc... was tax deductible!
    Do you know what tax deductible means?


  • #136
    Citizen_Cutback
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭Citizen_Cutback


    murphaph wrote: »
    Way to ignore the rest of my post and pick up on an afterthought. Comreg are a joke. Eircon are a joke. See, I am capable of criticising a private company, can you bring yourself to criticise the Public Sector I wonder...

    Comreg is hog-tied by Eircom's ownership of the Telephone infrastructure.


  • #137
    Citizen_Cutback
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭Citizen_Cutback


    murphaph wrote: »
    Do you know what tax deductible means?

    If it's in Gombeen-speak I probably don't.


  • #138
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


  • #139
    NUIG_FiannaFail
    Closed Accounts Posts: 161 ✭✭NUIG_FiannaFail


    My uncle says we need to sack 70,000 public servants and privatise everything


  • #140
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    NUIG_FiannaFail wrote: »
    My uncle says we need to sack 70,000 public servants and privatise everything

    Perhaps he can come on to boards while you take a week off, then. Resumption of this kind of daft trolling on your return will lead to a permanent ban.

    moderately,
    Scofflaw


  • #141
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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  • #142
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    your an auctioneer? i knew it!


  • #143
    rightwingdub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 725 ✭✭✭rightwingdub


    NUIG_FiannaFail wrote: »
    My uncle says we need to sack 70,000 public servants and privatise everything

    Your uncle is a sensible man:D


  • #144
    murf313
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 442 ✭✭murf313


    NUIG_FiannaFail wrote: »
    My uncle says we need to sack 70,000 public servants and privatise everything
    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.
    rightwingdub wrote: »
    Your uncle is a sensible man:D
    your uncle must be a blinkered, bitter guy who bangs on about the same crap every 10 minutes as well. :P


  • #145
    johnnyskeleton
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 14,568 Mod ✭✭✭✭johnnyskeleton


    DidierMc wrote: »
    Donegalfeela you seem to be suggesting that Public Sector pay cuts will benifit the private sector. Will it not just lead to further deflation of the economy and less consumption which will cost jobs in the private sector?

    This is the argument that there should be no cuts in government expenditure because those cuts mean people spend less. Instead, people should be paid more so that they spend more and the economy improves.

    Where this argument falls down (apart from the fact that we can't borrow any more money) is that public servants if given more money, are less likely to spend it on consumer goods etc than other categories of persons e.g. students.

    Give a heavily indebted, middle aged PS worker with a dependent family an extra €100 and he might spend €40 on consumer goods, €40 on repaying his mortgage and €20 saving up for a rainy day. Give the same to an 18 year old student and they will spend it all on food booze and cigarettes.

    So to avoid deflation (if that is the goal) we should cut PS pay and increase the student grant by the same amount, thus redistributing the money to those who consume more.


  • #146
    DJCR
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 986 ✭✭✭DJCR


    johnnyskeleton wrote: »

    So to avoid deflation (if that is the goal) we should cut PS pay and increase the student grant by the same amount, thus redistributing the money to those who consume more.

    I must write that one down and stick it on facebook!! Love the idea... Oh Mary.... :D:D:D


  • #147
    hondasam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,418 ✭✭✭✭hondasam


    join the ps and see if it really is all like that, you might be shocked,


  • #148
    Emelio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 176 ✭✭Emelio


    i dont have an uncle


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