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Attitudes to Porn... Mod Warning Post 719

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Comments

  • #602
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    oceanclub wrote: »
    Why?

    Pornography does affect other people, either directly or indirectly. Moderate alcohol consumption does not.

    Or are you asking me why I have decided not to?


  • #603
    tbh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15,914 ✭✭✭✭tbh


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Pornography does affect other people, either directly or indirectly. Moderate alcohol consumption does not.

    Or are you asking me why I have decided not to?

    If I watch porn the odd time, made by consenting adults, who does that affect?

    Moderate use of pornography is just the same as moderate use of anything else Jakkass, it is not inherently wrong.


  • #604
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    tbh wrote: »
    If I watch porn the odd time, made by consenting adults, who does that affect?

    Moderate use of pornography is just the same as moderate use of anything else Jakkass, it is not inherently wrong.

    You have to remember that Jakkass is a Christian fundamentalist (no offence Jakkass, but it's true) so he is not going to have anything close to a non-conservative opinion of sex, and there's no way he is going to budge from his position on this topic.


  • #605
    1sittingduck
    Closed Accounts Posts: 38 ✭1sittingduck


    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    As for quoting/ using the bible etc in relation to this, It also says "Judge not lest you be judged".
    Claiming that "I'm a good christian because......" is they type of behaviour one would expect from a Whited Sepulchre.

    I don't think Jackass is judging any individual or group here. He's only talking about the morality of their actions. That doesn't necessarily reflect on the person themselves.

    I was reading something yesterday (good/bad old Wikipedia) on Joan of Arc. One part of her trial hinged on whether or not she believed herself to be within God's grace. (I know some posters dismiss the notion of God's existence, but please bear with me.) The point is that no-one can say for sure that they're in a state of grace. That was news to me (thought one was in state of grace after valid Confession, etc.). But it also holds relevence for what you've said; that is, no-one is perfect and everyone needs to realise that. It's better to say "I hope I'm a good person" than "I am a good person".

    Hope that's not too OT.


  • #606
    oceanclub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,413 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Pornography does affect other people, either directly or indirectly. Moderate alcohol consumption does not.

    I'd say it's a betting certainty that alcohol consumption in Ireland ruins far more lives than pornography. But you have a black and white view of the latter, but a morally relativist view of the former.

    Which I wouldn't mind except that you've been lecturing others about their moral relativity throughout the entire thread.

    P.


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  • #607
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    You have to remember that Jakkass is a Christian fundamentalist (no offence Jakkass, but it's true) so he is not going to have anything close to a non-conservative opinion of sex, and there's no way he is going to budge from his position on this topic.

    Now, I have to say though, intending to defame my character on this thread is a bit extreme.

    Indeed, who is judging now? (with very little knowledge of who I am)


  • #608
    pretty-in-pink
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,007 ✭✭✭pretty-in-pink


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Ever heard of the phrase "Love the sinner, hate the sin"?

    I'm not good at all. Part of being a Christian is recognising that we are not good, and that we need to be forgiven so that we can live our lives to the full, and become reunited with God.

    I have done, I'm not knocking your belief in God. I just have a slightly different view on him then you. but thats a whole other discussion.
    Jakkass wrote: »
    Rather I'm arguing for reasons why porn might be bad for us in general, bad for the way we do things, and in relationships. This is what the Daily Mail argues, and I agree with the article.

    Now, is saying that porn is a bad influence on society judging any individual? I don't think so. Just because you choose to do something doesn't mean you are not worthy of my respect. People disagree with what others do every day of the week, it does not mean that they cast judgement on ones character.
    Obsessive use is bad for people, sure, but just regular/normal use (I know that if you're againnst porn then there is no way any use could be considered normal or regular in its dose, but bear with me here) is ok in my view.

    As I said previously, I would prefer my OH to get his jollies that way when we're apart then get them from another woman. And he feels the same about me. I don't find porn movies all that sexy, I prefer the hint of things,the thought. However that said, there are some porn related movies etc that are sexy. I guess its in the eye. I also am of the opinion that most people are aware that real life is not like in the movies,and so are unlikely to try act them out- beyond maybe a less in your face home spun version.
    Jakkass wrote: »
    Theft has always been around. Prostitution has always been around. Murder has always been around. Lying has always been around. Just because something has always been around doesn't mean that we have to agree with it or find it acceptable.
    True, however theft and murder are things that are deliberate attempts to hurt another person.
    Porn and prostitution - where all parties are consenting adults, taking all safety precautions- well it's not a deliberate attempt to hurt someone. Its grown ups, having some fun. And other grown ups profiting from this by way of supplying the service.
    Jakkass wrote: »
    I don't know if you are both in love with someone while finding them attractive that one automatically forgets about the character of the person and focuses only on their outward appearance. Perhaps this is due to my view that there is something special about the way that this happens. I'm a bit of a hopeless romantic I guess. We lose something without this. Without this, we don't follow our hearts anymore.

    See to me, my OH is both my lovely boyfriend, and best friend,while also being someone I quite like to see naked and think about that way. He's sexier because I love him, however I can see the sexual attraction between two adults who are just in it for sex is also very real (and fun).

    Sex is fun, and it de-stresses you.Why should only those who are married (lets follow the bible thing here again, no sex outside mariage right) get to be de-stressed? Although aren't you only meant to have sex, while married, to pro create? Thats just goes againnst the fun of it,and biological good sense.

    Jakkass wrote: »
    I don't wish to put this tag on other people at all.

    I hope my post makes my position clearer. Again, I knew people would start regarding posts opposed to porn as being against the people who watch porn.
    It does help clear things up. Hope mine does too.But its easy to get someones back up when they read things that say there must be something wrong in their relationship as they use vibrators/ porn etc.


  • #609
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    oceanclub wrote: »
    I'd say it's a betting certainty that alcohol consumption in Ireland ruins far more lives than pornography. But you have a black and white view of the latter, but a morally relativist view of the former.

    Which I wouldn't mind except that you've been lecturing others about their moral relativity throughout the entire thread.

    Your first point doesn't takes into account that I disagree with drunkenness also.

    Moral relativism, as a philosophical idea suggests that morality is different from person to person. I disagree with this. It is as moral for me to drink moderately as it is for you to drink moderately. It is immoral for me to drink excessively, as it is for you to drink excessively. It doesn't differ between people. Therefore it doesn't conform to moral relativism.

    I haven't been "lecturing" anyone. I've been merely expressing my disagreement at pornography.


  • #610
    Catari Jaguar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,649 ✭✭✭Catari Jaguar


    Jakkass wrote: »

    3. Well, if you are getting your sexual satisfaction from pornography instead of your wife or husband, it could be described as a third sexual partner. Albeit not a literal one, but it certainly could be regarded as infidelity or unfaithful.

    Porn watchers of the thread, are any of you getting sexual satisfaction from secret porn INSTEAD of your partner??!!

    I highly doubt it, because most people watch porn as an aid or extra in their sex life. Unless they're single of course and prefer to watch porn instead of having one night stands with strangers ( apparently that would be immoral) If a man/woman feels their only outlet is porn and masturbation due to frustration from lack of sex, then the marriage is alrady doomed and it certainly isn't porns fault.

    Sometimes, porn can even get you in a sexy mood thus encouraging you to have sex with your partner! Shocking stuff.

    And is porn still as evil and sinful even if the partner consents to her/his partner watching it and openly encourages it? Because not all porn watching is done on the sly you know. Porn can even be watched together to learn what turns their partners on so that their sex can be improved.

    I also think that NO ONE'S sexuality should ever ever be stifled in a relationship. Forbidding someone to watch porn/ masturbate/ fantasize because it offends you is just wrong. Some women are bisexual or bi curious. They might not act on this because they don't want to cheat on their partners. Should they be denied a chance to watch some lesbian porn to feed their fantasies?

    Also, I am a firm believer in sex before marriage. Some people just are NOT sexually compatible. If you like to cross dress and your partner disapproves or is horrified then you need to find someone that accepts you for who you are. Sexuality is a HUGE form of self expression and is a very psychological thing.

    I also saw that you agree with XXX Church going to porn conventions. I think they have no right to be there spreading their anti-porn message. Anyone with a sex or porn addiction (addiction meaning that this porn is negatively affecting their daily lives and harming them and others around them) should be dealt with through a psychotherapist and CBT. Jesus and the Church have NO PLACE whatsoever in the bedroom.

    Sex is just another primary function. It is animalistic and should be instinctive, uninhibited and unbridled. There is no need for romance, spirituality or even love. It's basic point is to provide an orgasm (and a baby!). You don't express physical love through sex, you show love through cuddling, holding hands, bringing your partner a cup of tea etc.. You show lust and attraction through sex.

    Also and this goes for serenacat too, PLEASE stop going on about women being degraded through porn. You are putting womens rights so far back with this attitude. Women are entitled to have sex. Even to have dirty, slutty sex like a man. Some even like it. And how can two men be seen as a bad thing? Twice the pleasure imo. A man in a 3some with two girls isn't being degraded or objectified. So why say women are?!


  • #611
    Ickle Magoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,485 ✭✭✭✭Ickle Magoo


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Such an understanding would seem to be very hedonistic to me. It's a mere opinion.

    Nowhere have I argued that pleasure is the only thing of value in life. I think it is for other people to decide what is pleasurable to them and if in a relationship, to work out the boundaries they wish that relationship to function within. As long as it is between consenting adults, I don't believe it is my place to declare what they do as right or wrong.
    Jakkass wrote: »
    We're different folk then. I believe that people have an inherent worth, and are worth far more than the subjects of sexual gratification alone. People aren't just things to be used for a few minutes than then forgotten about.

    Quite aside from being able to separate real life from fantasy, thinking someone is sexy or looking at or touching their body with their permission doesn't define either party, as worthless or anything else.
    Jakkass wrote: »
    How would you feel if one of your children were involved in pornography? (If you don't have any regard it as a hypothetical)

    I can't say I'd be anything but saddened by it.

    As the eldest of my kids is five, if I knew they were involved in pornography I'd call the police.

    As adults, it wouldn't be the career I'd choose for them any more than for myself but I'd have to respect if that's what they want to do that they are grown ups and have the right to make choices I don't like or agree with.


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  • #612
    oceanclub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,413 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Your first point doesn't takes into account that I disagree with drunkenness also.

    So you're similar of someone who thinks that soft-core pornography is fine, but disagrees with hardcore porngraphy.
    I haven't been "lecturing" anyone. I've been merely expressing my disagreement at pornography.

    ... all the while pointing out that you are the only one with a black and white morality in the thread, and presumably are therefore a better human being.

    P.


  • #613
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    Obsessive use is bad for people, sure, but just regular/normal use (I know that if you're againnst porn then there is no way any use could be considered normal or regular in its dose, but bear with me here) is ok in my view.

    I used to agree with this view before I became a Christian. I understand where you are coming from.
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    As I said previously, I would prefer my OH to get his jollies that way when we're apart then get them from another woman. And he feels the same about me. I don't find porn movies all that sexy, I prefer the hint of things,the thought. However that said, there are some porn related movies etc that are sexy. I guess its in the eye. I also am of the opinion that most people are aware that reallife is not like in the movies,and so are unlikely to try act them out- beyond maybe a less in your face home spun version.

    There isn't much of a difference in my view.

    Lusting after another person, to me is the same as committing adultery in your heart. Your partner, or your spouse, who has agreed to be with you and to be with you alone, has expressed a longing for another person albeit temporarily through pornography.

    I know you don't agree with me, but do you see where I am coming from?

    Again, I'm only doing this for a bit of a discussion. I respect you and I'm looking to hear your thoughts on this. I can't believe how many people have gotten riled up about this.
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    True, however theft and murder are things that are deliberate attemts to hurt another person.
    Porn and prostitution - where all parties are consenting adults, taking all safety precautions- well it's not a deliberate attempt to hurt someone. Its grown ups, having so fun. And other grown ups profiting from this by way of supplying the service.

    I disagree with you. There is no assurance either in the case of porn or prostitution that the parties are genuinely consenting, they could well be doing it out of financial coercion. If this is the case it could be considered to be rape, albeit in a different form to what we are used to.

    I also disagree that it isn't a deliberate act. It's particularly painful when one person does not know that you are doing it only to find out later.
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    See to me, my OH is both my lovely boyfriend, and best friend,while also being someone I quite like to see naked and think about that way. He's sexier because I love him, however I can see the very real sexualattraction between two adults whoare just in it for sex too.

    I think the last line is really important. This isn't sexual objectification, it's something that's done out of love and compassion. That's different to mere objectification. I'd like to hope I'd feel the same about someone else some day, obviously changing the him to her.
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    Sex is fun, and it de-stresses you.Why should only those who are married (lets folow the bible thing here again, no sex outside mariage right) getto be de-stressed? Although aren't you only meant to have sex, while married, to pro create? Thats just goes againnst the fun of it,and biological good sense.

    As for only meant to have sex to procreate, that is only Roman Catholic teaching. I'm personally not a Roman Catholic. The Biblical text encourages sexuality between two people who have been brought together by God. It even suggests that a man and his wife shouldn't deprive each other sexually. It's a real important part of marriage. I don't feel it is right to limit it to procreation. I would also support the use of contraceptives within marriage as this isn't written in the Bible.

    I know you disagree, but I had to clarify this.
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    It does help clear things up. Hope mine does too.But its easy to get someones back up when they read things that say there must be something wrong in their relationship as they use vibrators/ porn etc.

    I've given you my reasons why I disagree with porn, again I've been as honest as possible with you here.


  • #614
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Now, I have to say though, intending to defame my character on this thread is a bit extreme.

    Indeed, who is judging now? (with very little knowledge of who I am)

    I am basing my opinion on every single one of your posts. :)

    You aren't able to participate in any discussion without it being about your faith or Christian values.

    I think that's a fair observation.

    My point was no one is going to be able to make you budge from your current position, no matter how excellent their argument is. The reason for this is because you live your life according to a set of strict Christian rules.


  • #615
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    Kimia wrote: »
    Serena, seriously, why won't you respond to all the women that have told you straight out that they like watching porn and they haven't been pressured into it by their boyfriends/husbands??

    Truthfully - you have said over and over that if someone watches porn whilst in a relationship, then there must be something wrong with that relationship and that the husband must have pressured the wife into watching the porn (plaster over bullet wound i think you called it).

    What response do you have then do the women (like sam for example) or me ! when we say, maybe we just like watching porn?


    she seems incapable of acknowledging that, so i presume she's going to ignore it, along with other truths she doesnt want to acknowledge


  • #616
    Catari Jaguar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,649 ✭✭✭Catari Jaguar


    actuallylike wrote: »
    Sweatshops pay people too and surely they have a choice, agree with them? And if you think pornstars get paid well then you're misinformed, yes the big stars, Jeremy, Jameson will get a big bite but vast majority get paid pittance.

    Well what if a sweatshop worker actually ENJOYED their work, or didn't even do it as a living but just liked the act of amateur sweatshop work. What if they decided with their partner or some friends or their sweat shop group, that they were going to make a video of their sweat shop work and put it online because they love it so much and wanted to share it with others.


    Would that be degrading to women? :rolleyes:


  • #617
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    Lil Kitten wrote: »
    I also think that NO ONE'S sexuality should ever ever be stifled in a relationship. Forbidding someone to watch porn/ masturbate/ fantasize because it offends you is just wrong. Some women are bisexual or bi curious. They might not act on this because they don't want to cheat on their partners. Should they be denied a chance to watch some lesbian porn to feed their fantasies?

    I'm merely saying that if I were in relationship / marriage, I'd be fairly upset to think that I wasn't enough. Is this reaction wrong?

    I guess this is the kind of discussion that people should be having at the start of their relationship to make sure that they are right for each other.
    Lil Kitten wrote: »
    Also, I am a firm believer in sex before marriage. Some people just are NOT sexually compatible. If you like to cross dress and your partner disapproves or is horrified then you need to find someone that accepts you for who you are. Sexuality is a HUGE form of self expression and is a very psychological thing.

    I would personally consider how my heart felt above and beyond sexual compatibility. Again, perhaps that makes me overly idealistic, but I don't buy the whole try it first mindset.
    Lil Kitten wrote: »
    I also saw that you agree with XXX Church going to porn conventions. I think they have no right to be there spreading their anti-porn message. Anyone with a sex or porn addiction (addiction meaning that this porn is negatively affecting their daily lives and harming them and others around them) should be dealt with through a psychotherapist and CBT. Jesus and the Church have NO PLACE whatsoever in the bedroom.

    Of course I do. I think it's right that they are offering help for people who are dealing with pornography. They particularly are there for Christians who want to reclaim their lives from a porn addiction.

    In your opinion Jesus doesn't have a role in sexuality. I believe that Jesus has a role in every part of my life. Is it wrong that I live according to His standard? Interesting. I'm merely suggesting that there is more contention in this argument than people make out. I've noted how interesting it is to see how defensive people have got when people criticise pornography.
    Lil Kitten wrote: »
    Sex is just another primary function. It is animalistic and should be instinctive, uninhibited and unbridled. There is no need for romance, spirituality or even love. It's basic point is to provide an orgasm (and a baby!). You don't express physical love through sex, you show love through cuddling, holding hands, bringing your partner a cup of tea etc.. You show lust and attraction through sex.

    So sex is something like eating, drinking, and so on? I guess I'm nuts, but I regard it as something special.


  • #618
    oceanclub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,413 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/3072021.stm
    Men could reduce their risk of developing prostate cancer through regular masturbation, researchers suggest.
    They say cancer-causing chemicals could build up in the prostate if men do not ejaculate regularly.

    And they say sexual intercourse may not have the same protective effect because of the possibility of contracting a sexually transmitted infection, which could increase men's cancer risk.

    Australian researchers questioned over 1,000 men who had developed prostate cancer and 1,250 who had not about their sexual habits.

    They found those who had ejaculated the most between the ages of 20 and 50 were the least likely to develop the cancer

    Maybe that's God trying to tell us something.

    P.


  • #619
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    You aren't able to participate in any discussion without it being about your faith or Christian values.

    I have in a few cases. I generally post between AH, Atheism & Agnosticism, and Christianity now. I've had a few discussions on news topics, politics, and on philosophy. I also post on one of the university forums.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    My point was no one is going to be able to make you budge from your current position, no matter how excellent their argument is. The reason for this is because you live your life according to a set of strict Christian rules.

    Why should I change my position?

    Your argument is ridiculous. It's "lose your faith, or be regarded as a fundamentalist". Great choice.

    This doesn't conform to any definition of fundamentalism, but I can tell you now, if it's a choice between God, and losing my religion. I love God.

    I better provide a definition:
    fundamentalism - the interpretation of every word in the sacred texts as literal truth
    Now, I don't regard all parts of the Bible to be regarded as literal. In fact, much of it is allegorical and poetical, with an underlying meaning. How about attempting to get to know me as an individual before judging me?


    This thread isn't about me though, please remind yourself of that.


  • #620
    pretty-in-pink
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,007 ✭✭✭pretty-in-pink


    Jakkass wrote: »
    I used to agree with this view before I became a Christian. I understand where you are coming from.
    I am Christian though, I believe in God, Jesus et al.
    Jakkass wrote: »
    There isn't much of a difference in my view.

    Lusting after another person, to me is the same as committing adultery in your heart. Your partner, or your spouse, who has agreed to be with you and to be with you alone, has expressed a longing for another person albeit temporarily through pornography.

    I know you don't agree with me, but do you see where I am coming from?

    I think most people recast their partner as the staring role, and that its more likely the situation that turns them on. As for finding someone else attractive, well thats human nature. Trying to be with that person, and rejecting your OH to pursue this is infidelity to me. But an apprecitive look? Well thats ok.

    I can see your POV, it just seems to take it to an extreme is all.

    Jakkass wrote: »
    Again, I'm only doing this for a bit of a discussion. I respect you and I'm looking to hear your thoughts on this. I can't believe how many people have gotten riled up about this.

    Probably because its a personal thing, sex, and things that are close to you get you more involved.
    Jakkass wrote: »

    I disagree with you. There is no assurance either in the case of porn or prostitution that the parties are genuinely consenting, they could well be doing it out of financial coercion. If this is the case it could be considered to be rape, albeit in a different form to what we are used to.

    I also disagree that it isn't a deliberate act. It's particularly painful when one person does not know that you are doing it only to find out later.
    Deception is what makes it cross the line from acceptable to unacceptable, as Iagreee it can be hurtful. And I would view using prostitutes while you're in a relationship as infidelity (unless both people in the relationship know about it and are ok with it)
    There are those forced into porn, prostitutuion etc, and thats a legal issue, and as its not fully consensual its wrong. I am commenting on those who actively choose- for themselves- to do either career.


    Jakkass wrote: »
    I think the last line is really important. This isn't sexual objectification, it's something that's done out of love and compassion. That's different to mere objectification. I'd like to hope I'd feel the same about someone else some day, obviously changing the him to her.
    love makes sex more meaningful, however in and of itself sex is a wonderful thing. Enjoying it regardless of which situation you're in is not wrong in my book. And trust me, a lot of people like a little objectifaction every now and again (some like it frequently). We are sexual beings. Denial of that can cause more serious problems then accepting it.

    Jakkass wrote: »
    As for only meant to have sex to procreate, that is only Roman Catholic teaching. I'm personally not a Roman Catholic. The Biblical text encourages sexuality between two people who have been brought together by God. It even suggests that a man and his wife shouldn't deprive each other sexually. It's a real important part of marriage. I don't feel it is right to limit it to procreation. I would also support the use of contraceptives within marriage as this isn't written in the Bible.

    I know you disagree, but I had to clarify this.
    Fair enough, I think that sex is something that doesn't need to be confined to people who are married, and that its an essential part of life. Sex predates marriage, so it leaves "brought together by God" open to interpetration- by a religous ceremony? or by love? or by mutual attraction?

    Jakkass wrote: »

    I've given you my reasons why I disagree with porn, again I've been as honest as possible with you here.
    True, however I have read parts where it has been said porn has negative connotations for a relationship. and that therefor a relationship that includes the use of porn is not a healthy one. And that can be read as an attack on people livesand personal choices. Which is something nobody likes. However right or wrong you feel their lifestyle is


  • #621
    drkpower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,474 ✭✭✭drkpower


    I was wondering when I signed in why this thread had taken off and grown by about 10 pages; and then I realised...... some feckin' eejit let Jakkass on, pontificating on his attitudes on the personal and private lives of other adults.....:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:.

    Someone call a moderator/priest/Dawkins...


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  • #622
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    Jakkass wrote: »
    This thread isn't about me though, please remind yourself of that.

    it wasnt about god either, until you came along.


  • #623
    Silverfish
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,698 Mod ✭✭✭✭Silverfish


    This is getting off topic.

    Instead of discussing whether ladies agree with the Daily Mail opinion, it's now religion vs porn.

    Might I recommend a new thread in a different forum for that particular topic.


  • #624
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    sam34 wrote: »
    it wasnt about god either, until you came along.

    Please look at the thread, and see that other people brought that in. Particularly oceanclub.

    This is a typical trend. I post on the thread. People know of my beliefs. People bring them into the discussion. I even linked people to the Christianity forum when I started posting here.

    Consult the evidence for yourself and get back to me.


  • #625
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    Lil Kitten wrote: »
    Well what if a sweatshop worker actually ENJOYED their work, or didn't even do it as a living but just liked the act of amateur sweatshop work. What if they decided with their partner or some friends or their sweat shop group, that they were going to make a video of their sweat shop work and put it online because they love it so much and wanted to share it with others.


    Would that be degrading to women? :rolleyes:

    i can answer on behalf of some other posters here:
    i think working in a sweatshop is degrading.
    therefore, by extension, everyone doing so is being degraded, and everyone using materials made there is contributing to this degradation.

    it is not possible for me to comprehend your point about people enjoying it.

    i dont, and as far as im concerned that means noone else does either.

    :D:D


  • #626
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Please look at the thread, and see that other people brought that in. Particularly oceanclub.

    This is a typical trend. I post on the thread. People know of my beliefs. People bring them into the discussion. I even linked people to the Christianity forum when I started posting here.

    Consult the evidence for yourself and get back to me.

    from what i can see, your first post on this thread is backing up xxxchurch.com (to be fair, that was introduced by someone else, serenacat)

    but please dont try and deny that you have been engaging in discussion about god throughout this thread.


  • #627
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    I can see your POV, it just seems to take it to an extreme is all.

    Do you think this is extreme?
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    Probably because its a personal thing, sex, and things that are close to you get you more involved.

    See the problem with this is, I know for sure my views are controversial. I know they aren't the norm either. However, is it better for me to be honest, or just to agree with everyone else?
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    There are those forced into porn, prostitutuion etc, and thats a legal issue, and as its not fully consensual its wrong. I am commenting on those who actively choose- for themselves- to do either career.

    Interesting. How best can we stop this from happening?
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    love makes sex more meaningful, however in and of itself sex is a wonderful thing. Enjoying it regardless of which situation you're in is not wrong in my book. And trust me, a lot of people like a little objectifaction every now and again (some like it frequently). We are sexual beings. Denial of that can cause more serious problems then accepting it.

    I haven't denied that we are sexual beings. I have a different idea about how best to express it.
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    Fair enough, I think that sex is something that doesn't need to be confined to people who are married, and that its an essential part of life. Sex predates marriage, so it leaves "brought together by God" open to interpetration- by a religous ceremony? or by love? or by mutual attraction?

    Click here for context.
    pretty-in-pink wrote: »
    True, however I have read parts where it has been said porn has negative connotations for a relationship. and that therefor a relationship that includes the use of porn is not a healthy one. And that can be read as an attack on people livesand personal choices. Which is something nobody likes. However right or wrong you feel their lifestyle is

    I personally believe that it does in a lot of cases, this is what the Daily Mail articles about (so back on topic).
    sam34 wrote: »
    from what i can see, your first post on this thread is backing up xxxchurch.com (to be fair, that was introduced by someone else, serenacat)

    but please dont try and deny that you have been engaging in discussion about god throughout this thread.

    Did I link to the Christianity forum at the start of when I posted yes or no? I obviously cannot deny that I have spoken about it.


  • #628
    krudler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,788 ✭✭✭✭krudler


    Of course I do. I think it's right that they are offering help for people who are dealing with pornography. They particularly are there for Christians who want to reclaim their lives from a porn addiction.

    Would you feel the same about an atheist group turning up at your church to help people who want to reclaim their lives from religion and free themselves from an archaic belief system?


    thought not


  • #629
    tbh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15,914 ✭✭✭✭tbh


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Is it wrong that I live according to His standard?
    it's neither wrong nor right. it's just your choice.


  • #630
    oceanclub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,413 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    sam34 wrote: »
    from what i can see, your first post on this thread is backing up xxxchurch.com (to be fair, that was introduced by someone else, serenacat)

    but please dont try and deny that you have been engaging in discussion about god throughout this thread.

    Yeah, sorry to point out Jakkass but your very first post in the threading was pimping (no pun intended) a Christian web site.

    P.


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  • #631
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    krudler wrote: »
    Would you feel the same about an atheist group turning up at your church to help people who want to reclaim their lives from religion and free themselves from an archaic belief system?

    They don't just "turn up" though. They apply like everyone else to be a part of the porn show, they are even widely respected by porn stars for giving people the option out. It appears that you don't know the context. Watch some of their youtube videos.


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