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Lisbon 2 The Return!

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Comments

  • #752
    limklad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,980 ✭✭✭limklad


    FutureTaoiseach wrote: »
    Why are the results of this poll different from that on the European Union forum, where the gap is less than 3%?
    Not everybody is interested in politics and goes in the politics threads..


  • #753
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    limklad wrote: »
    You are forgetting that when people goes to the polls that they have to choose from a rotten barrels of apples.

    From the Last EU Commission Survey taken from the Lisbon Referendum 1 was not Anti politician vote or a cool anti establishment vote. THERE RESULTS BLOWS A HOLE IN YOUR ASSUMPTIONS!!

    Just because we voted for a politician does not mean we agree with all of their decisions and views.
    I have voted Fianna Fail, Fine Gael (but I do not agree on their view of Joining NATO) , Labour and green candidates in the past.
    I went against their advice in how to vote in the Last Lisbon Referendum as they failed to give good reasons and failed to answer questions bout the Treaty properly and used evasion tactics with scaremongering and doom scenarios comments.

    To those who smear No voters as Libertas loving, COIR hugging and Sinn Fein bombers are noting but succumb themselves and no better than those extreme groups in their narrow views.
    You just cannot get any good well rounded intelligent candidate in elections these days. :mad:

    It doesn't really as they often are the underlying issues. You can see it in posts here, eg. the No means No posts.

    Unfortunately there are very few normal, respectable No groups to represent No voters and the issues are forgotten about after referenda.

    People don't like the idea of losing sovereignty etc. but it is a non issue come general elections. They don't like the principle but it has little affect on them in normal, everyday life.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #754
    limklad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,980 ✭✭✭limklad


    K-9 wrote: »
    It doesn't really as they often are the underlying issues. You can see it in posts here, eg. the No means No posts.
    ???????
    K-9 wrote: »
    Unfortunately there are very few normal, respectable No voters to represent
    ??????
    No voters and the issues are forgotten about after referenda.
    They just been ignored not forgotten.
    K-9 wrote: »
    People don't like the idea of losing sovereignty etc. but it is a non issue come general elections. They don't like the principle but it has little affect on them in normal, everyday life.
    you are as bad as the politicians evading and minimising the many different issues that voters have.


  • #755
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Edited my post there.

    No voters in general seem a rather sensitive bunch, seem to actually seek offense.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #756
    FutureTaoiseach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭FutureTaoiseach


    K-9 wrote: »
    Edited my post there.

    No voters in general seem a rather sensitive bunch, seem to actually seek offense.
    Having your views compared to the Lockerbie bombers in the Irish Times (Tony Kinsella's now infamous article) can have that affect on you. :rolleyes:


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  • #757
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    vote NO on Liscon 2


  • #758
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    FutureTaoiseach wrote: »
    Having your views compared to the Lockerbie bombers in the Irish Times (Tony Kinsella's now infamous article) can have that affect on you. :rolleyes:

    Don't worry, I'm selling out Pearse.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #759
    Dinner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,132 ✭✭✭Dinner


    zenno wrote: »
    vote NO on Liscon 2
    It's getting easier and easier get a post thanked by FutureTaoiseach...

    Well done on the large font type by the way. Is that what you think of the Irish voter? That if you shout at them they'll do what you say.

    And you people have the balls to call the yes side bullying.


  • #760
    leitrim lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,013 ✭✭✭leitrim lad


    hello all hows your saturday going, my opinion today is the same as yesterday, and im very happy to see our polls state what i am saying is true, and is on the tip of the nations tongue,


    a big fat no

    would save alot of taxpayers money if they just used this poll ,and it probably would be more akurate


  • #761
    leitrim lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,013 ✭✭✭leitrim lad


    Dinner wrote: »
    It's getting easier and easier get a post thanked by FutureTaoiseach...

    Well done on the large font type by the way. Is that what you think of the Irish voter? That if you shout at them they'll do what you say.

    And you people have the balls to call the yes side bullying.


    judging by your post ,i would be under the impression that you have strong fianna fail connections with ,the way you think seems to be the fianna fail way alright,

    "sher if they dont like we will just run it again and again and again and again, a real democratic vote , brought to you by fianna fail:rolleyes:


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  • #762
    FutureTaoiseach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭FutureTaoiseach


    leitrim lad wrote: »
    hello all hows your saturday going, my opinion today is the same as yesterday, and im very happy to see our polls state what i am saying is true, and is on the tip of the nations tongue,


    a big fat no

    would save alot of taxpayers money if they just used this poll ,and it probably would be more akurate
    The task of predicted the outcome is made more difficult though by there being two boards.ie polls this year, one in Politics-EU and the other here, given that they diverge and that last year, I think there was just one and that being in After Hours. Yes I know this poll is in After Hours like the old one that had the no side on 54% and was very accurate. But still.


  • #763
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    Dinner wrote: »
    It's getting easier and easier get a post thanked by FutureTaoiseach...

    Well done on the large font type by the way. Is that what you think of the Irish voter? That if you shout at them they'll do what you say.

    And you people have the balls to call the yes side bullying.

    crazy isn't it that "dinner" only seems to think i am telling people what to do. QUOTE: Is that what you think of the Irish voter? That if you shout at them they'll do what you say. well you and most other people have being doing what your been told by this **** government for decades lol. they are the ones that have you brainwashed. another braindead person.

    I hope you liked my placard "dinner" choke on it


  • #764
    Dinner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,132 ✭✭✭Dinner


    zenno wrote: »
    crazy isn't it that "dinner" only seems to think i am telling people what to do. QUOTE: Is that what you think of the Irish voter? That if you shout at them they'll do what you say. well you and most other people have being doing what your been told by this **** government for decades lol. they are the ones that have you brainwashed. another braindead person.

    Haha yep. You've got my number all right. I'm one of those 'sheeple' that you people cleverly call people who don't blindly believe what you do. You're a champion of the people, defender of democracy, brave warrior against the NWO. Keep it up.

    You forgot to increase the font size in that post though, so I don't believe you as much as I did in your previous post. You're slipping up, gotta pull up them socks and fight the good fight.

    EDIT: Nice edit zenno, my good friend. Resorting to a personal attack. You must really have a solid argument.


  • #765
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    Dinner wrote: »
    Haha yep. You've got my number all right. I'm one of those 'sheeple' that you people cleverly call people who don't blindly believe what you do. You're a champion of the people, defender of democracy, brave warrior against the NWO. Keep it up.

    You forgot to increase the font size in that post though, so I don't believe you as much as I did in your previous post. You're slipping up, gotta pull up them socks and fight the good fight.

    EDIT: Nice edit zenno, my good friend. Resorting to a personal attack. You must really have a solid argument.

    LOL. don't take it personally. it's all a rant at the end of the day and i don't even know you so just ignore it


  • #766
    marco_polo
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 10,093 Mod ✭✭✭✭marco_polo


    leitrim lad wrote: »
    judging by your post ,i would be under the impression that you have strong fianna fail connections with ,the way you think seems to be the fianna fail way alright,

    "sher if they dont like we will just run it again and again and again and again, a real democratic vote , brought to you by fianna fail:rolleyes:
    zenno wrote: »
    crazy isn't it that "dinner" only seems to think i am telling people what to do. QUOTE: Is that what you think of the Irish voter? That if you shout at them they'll do what you say. well you and most other people have being doing what your been told by this **** government for decades lol. they are the ones that have you brainwashed. another braindead person.

    I hope you liked my placard "dinner" choke on it

    The Referendum is not a proxy vote of confidence in the government. The correct place to have used such a vote was the last General Election, it is pointless to now turn around and use Lisbon as a stick to beat the Government with. I am a Yes voter, and would be deemed a floating voter in terms of party loyalty. I know I certainly voted for change in Government the last time, and if more of the electorate had done the same last time around we would not be having this discussion right now.


  • #767
    Kashkai
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,399 ✭✭✭Kashkai


    Please forgive me for being naieve (spelling???), but surely a 'No' vote last time should have been the end of it. I'm pretty sure that if there had been a very slim majority in favour of the treaty, say 50.000001% voting yes, then the politicos would have stated that "the people have spoken and in a democracy, the majority rule!".

    Its a disgrace that the people of Ireland have to vote again (and possibly again and again) until us thickos get it "right". Thats democracy EU style. Says a lot about how they respect our democracy and how safe we'll be in a more representative EU when we do the "right" thing and vote yes to Lisbon (and I'm being completely sarcastic here in case there is any doubt :p:D)


  • #768
    leitrim lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,013 ✭✭✭leitrim lad


    marco_polo wrote: »
    The Referendum is not a proxy vote of confidence in the government. The correct place to have used such a vote was the last General Election, it is pointless to now turn around and use Lisbon as a stick to beat the Government with. I am a Yes voter, and would be deemed a floating voter in terms of party loyalty. I know I certainly voted for change in Government the last time, and if more of the electorate had done the same last time around we would not be having this discussion right now.


    i see your point, i too am partyless, at the minute, i was fianna fail to the back bone, until a number of tds decided i wasnt good enough to hold a meeting with to discuss saving employment in my area of leitrim and kildare, and you want to see the nice letter i got from a certain minister who was on a 9 week holiday ,but yet his diary was that full he couldnt make the time to hold a meeting with the people who canvassed and done his posters for him,
    or the leitrim senator who taught it was alright for the banks to take money and close accounts on ordinary decent people who are rearing young children, when these people came to me and i brought them to the senator, that was the responce they got off him ,and im witness to what he said,

    fianna fail dont give a **** about any of us as long as them and their nice golden circles are kept in power, and their arses are kept nice and warm(fat) at our expence, so its time to get rid of the smell that is irish politics and run a whole new line of candidates for the role that is currently held by irelands soon to be top 80 most wanted criminals

    and my opinion on lisbon is basically the same , the corruption of europe got togethar and tried to force another hitler regeime on the people of europe, if the whole continent went to a vote it would be a big no


  • #769
    PrivateEye
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,283 ✭✭✭PrivateEye


    Vote Yes because the nuts are on the no side


    O rly?


  • #770
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    do you all remember what was said by sarkozy the last time we voted no quote: In the aftermath of the Irish No vote, Sarkozy was determined to resolve the "Irish problem" during France's six-month EU presidency. he responded to our majority no vote as saying it was a problem. in a so called democracy we should have being respected of our decision that just shows how much bullying the no side had to put up with as well as the yes people. well i'm pritty convinced this time it will be another majority no. it's time to get rid of this treaty and FF once and for all.


  • #771
    Bob_Harris
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,619 ✭✭✭Bob_Harris


    I ran the defeated 2005 EU constitution through a plagiarism checker against a consolidated version of the Lisbon Treaty, which returned a 99% probability of plagiarism.

    Three No's to the same basic content and it's still not accepted. What happens if we vote No again?

    (No x No) + (No x No) = 2No² => Yes?


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  • #772
    Darlughda
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,886 ✭✭✭Darlughda


    Bob_Harris wrote: »
    I ran the defeated 2005 EU constitution through a plagiarism checker against a consolidated version of the Lisbon Treaty, which returned a 99% probability of plagiarism.

    Three No's to the same basic content and it's still not accepted. What happens if we vote No again?

    (No x No) + (No x No) = 2No² => Yes?

    Thank you for this post. A gem of humour at last. I have just experienced the much spoken of phenomenon of spitting my coffee at the computer screen laughing.:pac:


  • #773
    zenno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭zenno


    and another thing for the no voters coming up to october 2nd don't be put off by remarks like this, this sort of braindead talk from braindead people especially the press quote:"No campaigners get likened to terrorists in the national press". these kinds of remarks are twisted. an insane person would normally come up with this kind of s hit. vote no and it will be the last of it for sure.


  • #774
    leitrim lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,013 ✭✭✭leitrim lad


    as we all should have copped on to by now, if the government hears the people are going against their opinion, the people are mad, terrorists,

    a fine example mary lou mcdonald, lost her seat in european commision ,due to the other parties critisizing her for being pregnant, therefore she was a dosser, avoiding going to work because she was probably in hospital giving birth, or looking after the interests of her young family,

    treeeeeeeeeeezon if you ask me, thats what this government and lisbon combined are.

    and i think michael martin will be fully bald before it passes


  • #775
    FutureTaoiseach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭FutureTaoiseach


    leitrim lad wrote: »
    as we all should have copped on to by now, if the government hears the people are going against their opinion, the people are mad, terrorists,

    a fine example mary lou mcdonald, lost her seat in european commision ,due to the other parties critisizing her for being pregnant, therefore she was a dosser, avoiding going to work because she was probably in hospital giving birth, or looking after the interests of her young family,

    treeeeeeeeeeezon if you ask me, thats what this government and lisbon combined are.

    and i think michael martin will be fully bald before it passes
    European Parliament you mean.


  • #776
    marco_polo
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 10,093 Mod ✭✭✭✭marco_polo


    leitrim lad wrote: »
    and my opinion on lisbon is basically the same , the corruption of europe got togethar and tried to force another hitler regeime on the people of europe, if the whole continent went to a vote it would be a big no

    Essentially you are saying that the Government of all 27 member states are corrupt facists?. If that is actually your world view I can see why one would be voting no.

    As for the Hitler refernce I do not see the similarities between Mein Kampf and the Charter of Fundamental Rights myself.


  • #777
    ghost_ie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 545 ✭✭✭ghost_ie


    I'm voting no for one reason. We were told by the yes side in the first referendum that if one country voted against the Treaty then the Treaty was dead. Now the yes side are telling us that if we vote no again terrible things will happen because the rest of Europe will go ahead without us. Obviously they lied the first time around (the Treaty was rejected by one country - us - and, far from being dead, is being voted on by us again). Having been lied to once, why should I trust anything the yes side say this time?


  • #778
    An Fear Aniar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,377 ✭✭✭An Fear Aniar


    marco_polo wrote: »
    Essentially you are saying that the Government of all 27 member states are corrupt facists?. If that is actually your world view I can see why one would be voting no.

    Why do you put your faith in European governments? Look at what European leaders did in the 20th century... millions and millions and millions of dead. Why would anyone ever trust the ruling elites?

    .


  • #779
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    The last few pages are pure comedy gold.

    LOLZ at the EU and war comparisons. Really scraping the barrel now. Talk about getting what the EU is about arseways.

    The main reason there has been no wars in EU countries over the last 65 years is the EU.

    It's a shame, the level of debate was higher the last time.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #780
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    An Fear Aniar wrote: »
    Why do you put your faith in European governments? Look at what European leaders did in the 20th century... millions and millions and millions of dead. Why would anyone ever trust the ruling elites?

    .
    I would trust no European Government, we should have learned from our history.

    It is far easier for leaders of the 21st century to control the masses than it was for any of their predecessor of the last century.

    Adolf Hitler or Stalin would have given their right hands for the digital technology of today that can and will be used by the powers that be to access all personal records and details of ever citizen.


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  • #781
    PrivateEye
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,283 ✭✭✭PrivateEye


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zJZ7mT7fIY


    Interesting, this seems to be a coalition of unionists (Trade unionists, not the other kind!) like Jimmy Kelly from Unite (who were involved in the Waterford workers occupation) and the political party left (Joe Higgins, Mary Lou McDonald, PBPA etc.)

    I seen the first No posters lately too, Eirigis fantastic Sex Pistols mock up
    'NEVER MIND THE B0LL0CKS- ITS THE SAME TREATY' and the new 'Coir the Christians' efforts.


This discussion has been closed.
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