Deportation case mother had fake baby death papers, inquiry told

Degsy · 27-03-2009 02:43PM

tbh wrote: »

"This is going to happen to me if I return home" - and, importantly, this can be established - then we have an obligation to protect her

No..we have an obligation (to our own people) to find out if she's telling the truth.
If she isnt we're well within our rights not to listen to such a story again.
Anyway,its not up to us to protect people from savagry..we're a small country..we dont have room for all these hard luck cases.
if they dont agree with waht happensd at home they should attempt to chnage things from withing,not flee with a cock and bull story looking for handouts.

Nodin · 27-03-2009 02:44PM

Degsy wrote: »

What if(.....)prison.

Reductio ab adsurdum again. We're talking about a woman who made a claim which may not be true. Even if there were twenty more, it doesn't give you the right to generalise about a group that comprises 150 million people......Nor would a false claim of attack in one instance or more nessecarily mean that attacks of that kind do not happen.

Daroxtar · 27-03-2009 02:45PM

WindSock wrote: »

Male circumsicion was never carried out in order to hinder his sexual function. It was initially a custom from North Africa, the middle east and sandy countries that helped prevent sand getting stuck in the foreskin and prevented infections. It has even been proven today that circumcised males suffer less stds. The roots of Female Circumcision differ vastly and is extremely invasive and unthinkable when you have to consider she will be giving birth not long after.

Did i ask for my member to be mutilated?
No.

Was chopping off the skin invasive?
Yes.

Do i live in the desert?
No.

Consider this- if the child is going to be giving birth not long after having this procedure then the circumcision is probably the least of her worries.

Nodin · 27-03-2009 02:46PM

Degsy wrote: »

No..we have an obligation (to our own people) to find out if she's telling the truth.
If she isnt we're well within our rights not to listen to such a story again.

So a false accusation of rape means theres no such thing as rape?

De Hipster · 27-03-2009 02:48PM

WindSock wrote: »

I couldn't give a **** about my taxes being 'wasted' if it raises the issue of genital mutilation.

I would suggest that she has undermined & damaged genuine campaigns & mocked the sufferings of those who have been or face genatile mutilation.

S.L.F · 27-03-2009 02:49PM

tbh wrote: »

we have an obligation to protect her

And I'll answer that one.

There is no direct link between Ireland and Nigeria

She said she came through Amsterdam so she should be sent back to her point of entry then the Dutch people would have to deal with her not us.

tbh · 27-03-2009 02:50PM

S.L.F wrote: »

And I'll answer that one.

There is no direct link between Ireland and Nigeria

She said she came through Amsterdam so she should be sent back to her point of entry then the Dutch people would have to deal with her not us.

she's a human being. that's what I meant.

dontcallmecrazy · 27-03-2009 02:52PM

Daroxtar wrote: »

Consider this- if the child is going to be giving birth not long after having this procedure then the circumcision is probably the least of her worries.

where do you get that from?

giving birth while fully functional and afforded the ability to dilate

or

giving birth while the birth canal is stiched up and relying on the baby's head to tear the skin

mmmm, think i know what option id go for.

Lu Tze · 27-03-2009 02:52PM

tbh wrote: »

I'll field this one. I'm not saying that the Irish army should invade Nigeria to stop this from happening...

Here here, as we all know it would interfere with Star fleets Prime Directive...

herya · 27-03-2009 02:53PM

Daroxtar wrote: »

Was chopping off the skin invasive?
Yes.

I'll say it once again, FGM is not circumcision.

Daroxtar wrote: »

Consider this- if the child is going to be giving birth not long after having this procedure then the circumcision is probably the least of her worries.

If you hear you're going to pass a kidney stone (possibly one of the most painful things in the world) go and chop off your willy, it will be the last of your worries.

Daroxtar · 27-03-2009 02:55PM

dontcallmecrazy wrote: »

let alone the fact that they will never enjoy sex because the nerve ending are destroyed...

I take it the g spot is a myth so?

tbh · 27-03-2009 02:57PM

Degsy wrote: »

No..we have an obligation (to our own people) to find out if she's telling the truth.

hence my use of the words: "and, importantly, this can be established". So when you said no, you really meant yes, because you went on to make my point again.

If she isnt we're well within our rights not to listen to such a story again.

not to listen to such a story FROM HER again, yes. It has no bearing on other cases. You live in Finglas right? If you found yourself in court, would you like the judge to judge or pass sentence based on the actions of other people from finglas he's dealt with before? And if not, why is it acceptible for you to treat others any differently from how you'd like to be treated yourself?

Anyway,its not up to us to protect people from savagry..we're a small country..we dont have room for all these hard luck cases.
if they dont agree with waht happensd at home they should attempt to chnage things from withing,not flee with a cock and bull story looking for handouts.

I dunno degs, I think the "I'm all right jack" policy isn't one we want to be clinging to these days.

Crann na Beatha · 27-03-2009 02:57PM

This post has been deleted.

dontcallmecrazy · 27-03-2009 03:01PM

Daroxtar wrote: »

I take it the g spot is a myth so?

well judging by your lack of knowledge in the biology department im surprised you've even heard of it let alone ever found it.

get a grip, here seriously its because you have a penis that you will not understand..

how about we get your mother or sister up on the kitchen table and cut of her labia and sew her back up, leave her in the garden shed for a few weeks for recover....still so bloody flipant about it now??

Daroxtar · 27-03-2009 03:05PM

WindSock wrote: »

Male circumsicion was never carried out in order to hinder his sexual function. It was initially a custom from North Africa, the middle east and sandy countries that helped prevent sand getting stuck in the foreskin and prevented infections. It has even been proven today that circumcised males suffer less stds. The roots of Female Circumcision differ vastly and is extremely invasive and unthinkable when you have to consider she will be giving birth not long after.

Thats where i'm getting that from. Now either pamela lied about what age the (alleged) child was when the fgm was carried out or pedophelia is rife over there. If it is common practise to get infants pregnant then in my belief the fgm is the least of the worries. So, is pamela a liar or is the above emboldened text a lie? I cant believe them both.

marcsignal · 27-03-2009 03:06PM

Terry wrote: »

Why the **** isn't she paying her own legal costs then?

good question.

herya · 27-03-2009 03:07PM

Daroxtar wrote: »

Thats where i'm getting that from. Now either pamela lied about what age the (alleged) child was when the fgm was carried out or pedophelia is rife over there. If it is common practise to get infants pregnant then in my belief the fgm is the least of the worries. So, is pamela a liar or is the above emboldened text a lie? I cant believe them both.

Are you for real? Has it ever occurred to you that Africa is a vast continent with FGM in place in many coutries and local customs are varied, sometimes it affects small children and sometimes young women?

Daroxtar · 27-03-2009 03:11PM

dontcallmecrazy wrote: »

well judging by your lack of knowledge in the biology department im surprised you've even heard of it let alone ever found it.

get a grip, here seriously its because you have a penis that you will not understand..

how about we get your mother or sister up on the kitchen table and cut of her labia and sew her back up, leave her in the garden shed for a few weeks for recover....still so bloody flipant about it now??

I see where you're coming from now alright, as if it wasn't evident. As a husband and the father of a baby daughter I understand perfectly the horrors that could be inflicted. It doesn't mean i buy the bullsh!t and lies posted here in defense of a fraud.

ShooterSF · 27-03-2009 03:11PM

Two things sadden me here.

1: The joke of a system we have in this country and Europe that allows someone who has shown no respect for our countries laws to stay in the country this long.

2: People who are still standing by someone who is now more and more obviously lying to our courts. When someone legit applies for asylum it would be harder to listen to the opinion of people who would have a scam artist stay cause "she's a human being". I'm sorry but while in a perfect world we could take in anyone who wanted to come here (for what, in my opinion, this lady is really here for) economic reasons, we simply can't and more to the point the worst off are not the one's that can afford to even get this far.

Trust me she is doing nothing but harm when it comes to peoples opinion of multi-culturilism(sp?) rightly or wrongly and no one (regardless of your opinion on asylum issues) should be supporting this woman now.

Elessar · 27-03-2009 03:12PM

Ha, I knew it. Good riddance! Don't let the door hit you on the way out!

dontcallmecrazy · 27-03-2009 03:14PM

Daroxtar wrote: »

Thats where i'm getting that from. Now either pamela lied about what age the (alleged) child was when the fgm was carried out or pedophelia is rife over there. If it is common practise to get infants pregnant then in my belief the fgm is the least of the worries. So, is pamela a liar or is the above emboldened text a lie? I cant believe them both.

FGM is carried out at various ages, anywhere from 3 to 5 years old right up to puberty or what they deem 'sexual marturity' i.e. ready to be sent of for marriage in exchange for a few goats or whatever as a man in areas where this practiced will not take a girl for marriage with out being mutilated as his train of though would be ''if she hasn't been mutilated well how do i know she is a virgin' 'and after a few kids the sex will crap' the general thinking is that the girl is dirty or whatever. for a man to have a daughter who has not been mutilated is as scary as anything because he is left with the prospect that no other man will take her of his hands and he will be left having to feed her for the rest of her life, for the father this brings some sort of 'shame' on him and the family. the woman are just brainwashed to go along with the men.

herya · 27-03-2009 03:14PM

Daroxtar wrote: »

I see where you're coming from now alright, as if it wasn't evident. As a husband and the father of a baby daughter I understand perfectly the horrors that could be inflicted. It doesn't mean i buy the bullsh!t and lies posted here in defense of a fraud.

A fraud is a fraud and FGM is FGM. That she had lied and especially invented a dead girl to carry her through asylum procedure for personal gain is an utter disgrace and I hope she will bear the consequences. But to question all FGM cases basing on this is simply ignorant.

RasTa · 27-03-2009 03:15PM

In all honest, why gives a fcuk!

Degsy · 27-03-2009 03:15PM

Nodin wrote: »

Even if there were twenty more, it doesn't give you the right to generalise about a group that comprises 150 million people......

Nigeria isnt a group,its a country.
I can generalise about a country if i so choose,everybody else does.
Or are we NOT allowed to generalise about a country if the inhabitants happen to be black?
You're actually displaying racism yourself but you dont realise it.
What you're doing is being patronising towards black people,you think that they cannot sort out thier own affairs(as a race) and that white people like you can fight thier corner for them,obviously from the safety of home.
This implies that you,as thier spokesman,feel supeirior in some way to the people you think you're defending.

tbh · 27-03-2009 03:25PM

Degsy wrote: »

Nigeria isnt a group,its a country.
I can generalise about a country if i so choose,everybody else does.
Or are we NOT allowed to generalise about a country if the inhabitants happen to be black?
You're actually being racist yourself but you dont realise it.
What you're doing is being patronising towards black people,you think that they cannot sort out thier own affairs(as a race) and that white people like you can fight thier corner for them,obviously from the safety of home.
This implies that you,as thier spokesman,feel supeirior in some way to the people you think you're defending.

Timmeh!

the ironic thing is Degsy that if everyone had the same atitude as you, you wouldn't have been able to get taxpayers money to help you buy your gaff. I didn't get any help off the government to buy my house, so why should you? Luckily for you, most people, like me, have a live and let live attitude. I wouldn't be too loose with oul spongers comments if I were in your house tho

Nodin · 27-03-2009 03:25PM

Degsy wrote: »

Nigeria isnt (....)nding.

The nationality 'nigerian' is a grouping, however.

I've proposed no solutions to any of the problems touched on, so I'd suggest your comments about my views on Africa are wild speculation.

I've merely taken issue with the sweeping generalisations, and the rather silly comment

Degsy wrote:

No..we have an obligation (to our own people) to find out if she's telling the truth.
If she isnt we're well within our rights not to listen to such a story again.

As I asked you earlier, does this mean that a false claim of rape means that theres no such thing?

Dudess · 27-03-2009 03:27PM

Wow, if she was scamming, send her home.

But really, using her case to condemn all Nigerians/Africans/immigrants is just appalling - as is using her case to condemn all asylum-seekers, including the genuine ones (seriously, read some Amnesty literature on some of the horrors being carried out against people around the world - you'd want to get the hell out too).
And finally, being dismissive of female genital mutilation - learn what the **** it is first instead of displaying your ignorance so explicitly. LOL at someone who effectively said a circumcised woman can still experience sexual pleasure because her g-spot is left... :rolleyes:

dontcallmecrazy · 27-03-2009 03:29PM

Daroxtar wrote: »

I see where you're coming from now alright, as if it wasn't evident. As a husband and the father of a baby daughter I understand perfectly the horrors that could be inflicted. It doesn't mean i buy the bullsh!t and lies posted here in defense of a fraud.

im not going to say this woman is fibbing or not simply because i have no right to say that she is a liar when i cant see inside her head to know if she is being truthful or not as another poster said only her and the doctor know the real truth, and i just feel for her if she is being honest because all she wants to do is protect her children.

but its the topic of FGM that riles me when it is such a sensitive thing to be flippant about and not to recognise it for what it is.

27-03-2009 03:34PM

dontcallmecrazy wrote: »

im not going to say this woman is fibbing or not simply because i have no right to say that she is a liar when i cant see inside her head to know if she is being truthful or not as another poster said only her and the doctor know the real truth, and i just feel for her if she is being honest because all she wants to do is protect her children.

but its the topic of FGM that riles me when it is such a sensitive thing to be flippant about and not to recognise it for what it is.

But what actually riles me up is there are people out there who have had children die as a result of this practise.
IF she is lying about the death of a child, I think deportation is too good for her.

Degsy · 27-03-2009 03:35PM

dontcallmecrazy wrote: »

but its the topic of FGM that riles me when it is such a sensitive thing to be flippant about and not to recognise it for what it is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPAVmZFgwW0&feature=PlayList&p=F1E38D17FA13BE26&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=42

There it is in all its glory....NEXT!

Deportation case mother had fake baby death papers, inquiry told

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