Good Friday - no drink - acceptable now?

Lazare · 21-03-2008 01:49PM

derek27 wrote: »

The fact that the sale of alcohol is forbidden and abstinence from meat is expected on Good Friday are the only things that actually make the day stand out from any other day in the year... most people, including people who regard themselves as being religious, don't even know what Good Friday is about from a religious perspective... if we could go pub and what not as usual, then the religious celebration of Good Friday would slip into oblivion as people would just do what they would every other Friday and not even know when Good Friday was coming about.

Why am I forced to care what 'Good Friday is about from a religious perspective'? Why would I care if it 'slipped into oblivion'?

I'm so sick of that pathetic organisation forcing it's ridiculous beliefs on society.

DubArk · 21-03-2008 01:50PM

Tusky wrote: »

Christmas has become less and less about religion and more about a seasonal end of year celebration. Nothing wrong with that. How many people give a second thought about religion when opening their presents or chatting to family ? Regardless of the religious affiliation, people need holidays throughout the year.

I 100% agree.
Religion is not important to a lot of people but saying that it is to a core of Christians (Im not One) in this country and traditionally that has been the case here in Ireland for quite some time. I believe that respect must be shown to those who wish to celebrate their religious festivals as they always have. Of course that will al change with time as we become a more multi ethnic society but my mother for example would be a devout Christian and this time of year is very important to her and her beliefs.
So TWO DAYS without been legally allowed to enter a pub or buy alcohol is such a tiny thing when you look at the bigger picture.

Stercus Accidit · 21-03-2008 02:00PM

I'm Irish, always have been.

But 22 years ago my father had the good sense to see that alot of people are full of sh1t, and didn't force fairy tales on me.

Now I'm told I cant buy a couple of good beers to have on the beginning of my long weekend(which is more about a few days off my boss decided to give me than because of any ridiculous story book), because of others beliefs.

This IS a secular state, I AM Irish, and I drink very little, but today I feel like having a few beers.
This isn't Saudi Arabia, we aren't governed by religion, and if any of you hypocrites want to impose these ridiculous laws, you had better turn veggie for the day, not use condoms and abstain from impure thoughts.

Fuck this.

Dave! · 21-03-2008 02:09PM

sombaht wrote: »

Just out of curiosity, do you object as strongly to having to take St Patricks Day off? Another religious motivated holiday celebrating the introduction of Catholocism to this land? Or is that ok 'cos you can still get a pint?

Cheers,
sombaht

No I don't, because I think there should be more public holidays anyway, irrespective of what religious festivals occur throughout the year. However I do object in principle to the state recognising certain religious festivals and not others. If St Patricks Day was done away with and we got a replacement holiday instead, I'd be just as happy. I'm not a huge drinker at all, but banning the sale of alcohol is a more overt indication of religious influence because it is a restriction rather than a liberty, and so it obviously arouses more concern. If instead of alcohol they banned the sale of pistachio nuts on good friday, I would be just as concerned, even though they give me the trots.

DubArk · 21-03-2008 02:09PM

Motosam wrote: »

I'm Irish, always have been.

But 22 years ago my father had the good sense to see that alot of people are full of sh1t, and didn't force fairy tales on me.

This IS a secular state, I AM Irish, and I drink very little, but today I feel like having a few beers.
This isn't Saudi Arabia, we aren't governed by religion, and if any of you hypocrites want to impose these ridiculous laws, you had better turn veggie for the day, not use condoms and abstain from impure thoughts.
.

Your father may of thought a lot of good things but this is not a secular state, our constitutions is so rapped up in the Catholic religion it’ll blow your mind!!

This isn't Saudi Arabia…………. very true and thank who ever, it’s Ireland.;)
We aren't governed by religion……….. again our constitution is!!

Veggies, condoms, impure thoughts…….. Well really!! You’ll be starting your own religion up next!

Jesus Wept · 21-03-2008 02:14PM

DubArk wrote: »

I 100% agree.
Religion is not important to a lot of people but saying that it is to a core of Christians (Im not One) in this country and traditionally that has been the case here in Ireland for quite some time. I believe that respect must be shown to those who wish to celebrate their religious festivals as they always have. Of course that will al change with time as we become a more multi ethnic society but my mother for example would be a devout Christian and this time of year is very important to her and her beliefs.
So TWO DAYS without been legally allowed to enter a pub or buy alcohol is such a tiny thing when you look at the bigger picture.

How about you abstain from drinking on those days (and/or other days), instead of enforcing it?
Surely that would show more dedication (or any at all) to your god?

Stercus Accidit · 21-03-2008 02:14PM

DubArk wrote: »

Your father may of thought a lot of good things but this is not a secular state, our constitutions is so rapped up in the Catholic religion it’ll blow your mind!!

This isn't Saudi Arabia…………. very true and thank who ever, it’s Ireland.;)
We aren't governed by religion……….. again our constitution is!!

Veggies, condoms, impure thoughts…….. Well really!! You’ll be starting your own religion up next!

No meat on good friday, no condoms, no coveting this that and the other, no sex before marriage, no abortion, babies go to limbo, wait they dont, wait they do, wait they dont.

Now let anyone who believes all of this choose not to drink, not impose it on me.

sombaht · 21-03-2008 02:15PM

I do object in principle to the state recognising certain religious festivals and not others.

What religious festivals are we not recognising?

Cheers,
sombaht

DubArk · 21-03-2008 02:20PM

Motosam wrote: »

No meat on good friday, no condoms, no coveting this that and the other, no sex before marriage, no abortion, babies go to limbo, wait they dont, wait they do, wait they dont.

Now let anyone who believes all of this choose not to drink, not impose it on me.

Then have a drink! Eat a Big Mac! Pop a Condom on... Ride somone.. and get over it!!

YOUR free to do all these things today! You just cant purchase any booze from a shop or pub!

The abortion issue is another subject I agree!! To big to even go into on this thread!!
Happy Holiday my freind.

robinph · 21-03-2008 02:25PM

sombaht wrote: »

What religious festivals are we not recognising?

Well there is a current ban on me being able to celebrate one of the most important dates in my own personal religion. This involves lots of drink and meat eating and just happens to fall on the Friday before the first Sunday after the spring full moon each year.

tolosenc · 21-03-2008 02:36PM

sombaht wrote: »

What religious festivals are we not recognising?

Hannukah, Eid-Ul-Adha... Anything not Christian.

sombaht · 21-03-2008 02:42PM

Well there is a current ban on me being able to celebrate one of the most important dates in my own personal religion. This involves lots of drink and meat eating and just happens to fall on the Friday before the first Sunday after the spring full moon each year

I don't think there is a ban on the consumption of meat and alcohol on the Friday before the first Sunday after the spring full moon each year for non-Catholics, more just a ban on the purchase of alcohol on the same day.

Cheers,
sombaht

sombaht · 21-03-2008 02:44PM

Hannukah, Eid-Ul-Adha... Anything not Christian.

So if were to close the pubs on those days as well and take a days holiday it would be ok yeah?

Cheers,
sombaht

Edit: Actually I would be all for celebrating every other religious festival under the sun if it entitled me to a few more days off work!

DubArk · 21-03-2008 02:45PM

The-Rigger wrote: »

How about you abstain from drinking on those days (and/or other days), instead of enforcing it?
Surely that would show more dedication (or any at all) to your god?[/quote]

I have at least four time said in all me responses IM NOT A CHRISTIAN! Im not affiliated to any religion.

So don’t assume that I am. :mad:

Why didnt you buy some drink yeaterday?

Peyton Manning · 21-03-2008 02:48PM

I had 6 shots of aftershock in front of me at 12:05am last night/today. Sure I bet himself was dieing for a pint up on that cross.

DubArk · 21-03-2008 02:53PM

Archimedes wrote: »

I had 6 shots of aftershock in front of me at 12:05am last night/today. Sure I bet himself was dieing for a pint up on that cross.

Guinness tastes smooth and velvety and slides easily down the throat which means several more can be drank quickly compared to other beers. Beware though, because of this and an ABV OF 4.1% it can leave you with a condition called Guinness tongue which leaves you slurring and talking gibberish.
There isn't the hoppy after taste that you get with other beers which means you don't actually get sick of the taste of it.

Yum yum!!!

Dave! · 21-03-2008 02:54PM

sombaht wrote: »

What religious festivals are we not recognising?

Cheers,
sombaht

Eid

edit:

sombaht wrote: »

So if were to close the pubs on those days as well and take a days holiday it would be ok yeah?

Cheers,
sombaht

Edit: Actually I would be all for celebrating every other religious festival under the sun if it entitled me to a few more days off work!

So where do you draw the line? Only major religions? Then you're discriminating against the other religions. Does having less numbers in some way illegitimise others' faiths? Is it only recognized religions in Ireland that should be given this benefit? What if I have my own personal beliefs that involve me taking a week off to pray every month? Just tough luck I guess.

Or should we just recognize everybody's religion and have 365 days of religious festivals and never go to work? Sounds good to me. Can't see it working however.

robinph · 21-03-2008 03:12PM

sombaht wrote: »

I don't think there is a ban on the consumption of meat and alcohol on the Friday before the first Sunday after the spring full moon each year for non-Catholics, more just a ban on the purchase of alcohol on the same day.

Thats all fine except that my religion requires that all of this consumption takes place in special religiously consecrated buildings that you may have heard of refered to as pubs and also the paying of large donations which then get shared between the governent, diageo and what other in religions may be called a preist, but I prefer the name "landlord".

sombaht · 21-03-2008 03:29PM

o where do you draw the line? Only major religions?

I dont see where I'm drawing the line? As said " I would be all for celebrating every other religious festival under the sun", I think thats pretty all encompassing. If push came to shove I guess it would include all religions that are "recognised by the state" to prevent "silly" people from dreaming up a religion that requires them to take 6 out of every 7 days off for "religious practices".:)

Malaysia celebrates Muslim, Chinese, Hindu and I think Christian festivals including the ones that require days, so you get Muslim owned business closing for the likes of Deepavali. Would be nice to see similar here in Ireland

Regards,
sombaht

MrJoeSoap · 21-03-2008 03:32PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gp6A1KeXDC0

sombaht · 21-03-2008 03:36PM

special religiously consecrated buildings that you may have heard of refered to as pubs

Heard of them, even frequented once upon a time. Not much anymore though, not since they dont seem to serve the beers I like to drink.

(most of them anyway)
And this religion of yours then, what's it's name? The Church of Robinph?:p get it recognised as a valid religion and you might have a case on your hands, provided we could get the state to celebrate all "recognised" religious holidays.

Cheers,
sombaht

Dave! · 21-03-2008 03:41PM

sombaht wrote: »

I dont see where I'm drawing the line?

....

I guess it would include all religions that are "recognised by the state" to prevent "silly" people from dreaming up a religion that requires them to take 6 out of every 7 days off for "religious practices".:)

Boom! You just drew a line!

For the sake of being practical you're discriminating against people who might not have as populist views as the rest of the country. They supposed to just slave away on their days of prayer? Or dip into their precious holidays?

"44.2.3° The State shall not impose any disabilities or make any discrimination on the ground of religious profession, belief or status."

sombaht · 21-03-2008 03:46PM

Boom! You just drew a line!

Not quite, if you look at the FULL context of the quote I said

If push came to shove I guess it would include all religions that are "recognised by the state"

And my reasons for that were

to prevent "silly" people from dreaming up a religion that requires them to take 6 out of every 7 days off for "religious practices".

because as you quite rightly pointed out

should we just recognize everybody's religion and have 365 days of religious festivals and never go to work? Sounds good to me. Can't see it working however.

It would indeed never work.

Cheers,
sombaht

sombaht · 21-03-2008 03:51PM

For the sake of being practical you're discriminating against people who might not have as populist views as the rest of the country. They supposed to just slave away on their days of prayer? Or dip into their precious holidays?

Well actually this is allready in place, as a Muslim colleague of mine had to dip into his holiday bank to take a few days off for Eid al Fitr (end of Ramadan I think). Now id we could get the government to recognise these religious holidays he wouldnt have to do this, and we'd all get a few extra days as well.
See, religious based holidays are not a bad idea! @)

Cheers,
sombaht

Dave! · 21-03-2008 03:55PM

Of course, but it would still be necessary to draw that line for the reasons we both highlighted. And by so doing you are deciding what is and is not acceptable as a religion. Who are you (or indeed anybody) to say that someone's faith is of less import than another person's? That for the sake of convenience, certain people should not be free to celebrate their festivals and carry out their customs, while others are. It so happens that Catholics in Ireland have a rather benign and soft idea of what religious expression is, but not everyone shares that view, and their silly religion warrants just as much respect as the major (silly) religions, surely.

sombaht wrote: »

Well actually this is allready in place, as a Muslim colleague of mine had to dip into his holiday bank to take a few days off for Eid al Fitr (end of Ramadan I think). Now id we could get the government to recognise these religious holidays he wouldnt have to do this, and we'd all get a few extra days as well.
See, religious based holidays are not a bad idea! @)

Cheers,
sombaht

Indeed -- and this is fair? We both think not. So then Christians and Muslims get their festivals celebrated, but not smaller sects and cults and individuals.

robinph · 21-03-2008 03:55PM

sombaht wrote: »

... prevent "silly" people from dreaming up a religion ...

I thought the whole cause of this thread was down to some daft beliefs and imaginary friends that some people came up with a few thousand years ago?

sombaht · 21-03-2008 04:05PM

And by so doing you are deciding what is and is not acceptable as a religion. Who are you (or indeed anybody) to say that someone's faith is of less import than another person's?

Actually I am not deciding what is or is not a religion. I believe the state does that allready. Islam is a recognised religion within Ireland as is Sikhism, Hindu, Buddhist etc etc. As to what makes these recognisable and other not, I cannot be sure but I believe it has to do with a certain % of the population practising it, this is usually determined during the census.
I seem to recall something in the last census in the UK that tried to claim Jedi as a religion as a certian percentage of people put down Jedi Knight as their religion.:) Dunno what the outcome was though.

Cheers,
sombaht

sombaht · 21-03-2008 04:06PM

I thought the whole cause of this thread was down to some daft beliefs and imaginary friends that some people came up with a few thousand years ago?

Nice one! Well spotted!

Cheers,
sombaht

Dave! · 21-03-2008 04:08PM

sombaht wrote: »

Actually I am not deciding what is or is not a religion. I believe the state does that allready. Islam is a recognised religion within Ireland as is Sikhism, Hindu, Buddhist etc etc. As to what makes these recognisable and other not, I cannot be sure but I believe it has to do with a certain % of the population practising it, this is usually determined during the census.

Yeah I know it's already done -- is that fair? Or merely practical? :pac:

sombaht · 21-03-2008 04:14PM

is that fair? Or merely practical?

Practical most likely, but I would not call it unfair either.

Cheers,
sombaht

Good Friday - no drink - acceptable now?

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