Abortion Discussion, Part the Fourth

Loafing Oaf · 13-05-2026 10:26AM

Gonna be a vote on the legislation today, pleasantly surprised at how quick things are progressing considering how long the issue had been fingered up to now

https://www.thejournal.ie/abortion-legislation-social-democrats-7037859-May2026/

This doesn't sound too promising though

A government spokesperson said feedback received identifies that some of the proposed amendments are unnecessary and are already addressed through the existing legal framework.
It is also of the view of the government that other provisions within the proposed legislation are problematic from an operational and legal perspective.

Hope Holly had her homework done…

Loafing Oaf · 13-05-2026 11:31AM

Bill currently being debated, Peadar Toibin putting the boot in as I type

Loafing Oaf · 13-05-2026 08:13PM

Not sure if vote has been taken yet on bill but presume it will be defeated cos SF are opposing

https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/oireachtas/2026/05/13/free-vote-matter-of-conscience-for-government-tds-on-abortion-reform-bill/

The Labour Party, People Before Profit and the Green Party have supported the legislation but the Minister for Health Jennifer Carroll MacNeill has rejected it as has Sinn Féin, Independent Ireland and other Independent TDs.

SF surely going to get slaugntered by the rest of the left over this?

Quantum Erasure · 13-05-2026 09:28PM

Just seen this was defeated

Have I got this wrong or were they trying to decriminalise abortion up to birth?

Hotblack Desiato · 13-05-2026 09:52PM

Someone should have told SF it was supposed to be a free vote 🙄 all of their TDs abstained. Do any of them have an opinion on anything which is not dictated to them from West Belfast?

Disgraceful and constitutionally ignorant comment from the SF health spokesperson Cullinane, any legislation passed by the Oireachtas has full democratic legitimacy.

We expressly voted to NOT put the conditions under which an abortion may be obtained into the constitution. It's a matter for legislation. The current law is not and should not and indeed must not be regarded as set in stone.

Does the government have any proposals on making the changes recommended by the independent review published nearly three years ago now?

At the very least abolition of the three-day wait should have been put forward as a standalone measure, it is indefensible and a straightforward change.

Simi · 13-05-2026 09:59PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124466289#Comment_124466289

Agreed incremental bills are probably the only way forward. A bill like this was pretty much guranteed to be defeated. Shame as it would have essentially ended abortion as a political issue once and for all.

I was already planning to not vote Sinn Fein in the future over their populist lurch to the right, but this cements my never voting for them again in any capacity.

Simi · 13-05-2026 10:00PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124466231#Comment_124466231

It would have removed all criminal sanctions for abortion. The gestational guidelines would have remained in place.

Quantum Erasure · 14-05-2026 01:22AM

I'm actually surprised how little discussion there was (on here and in general) before the last vote in December, and for this vote, I had no idea it was happening at all…

Red Silurian · 14-05-2026 09:21AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124464561#Comment_124464561

That's government speak for

We can't support opposition bills no matter how good they are.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124466309#Comment_124466309

There's a lot of commentary lately on the SF populist lurch to the right. I largely ignored it and brushed it off as govt supporters trying to gaslight the SF supporters

Indeed the last few months, their support of the anarchists that blocked up our roads last month, and now this, leads me to think there might have been a level of truth to the commentary

With all that being said, the Social Democrats are doing a lot of the right things. Holly Cairns is looking more and more like our first female taoiseach every day

Loafing Oaf · 14-05-2026 10:22AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124466289#Comment_124466289

At the very least abolition of the three-day wait should have been put forward as a standalone measure,

This will surely happen before the year is out, given the total consensus for it. Hard to see it getting bundled in with any other liberalisation now, now matter how incremental, given the line the shinners are taking.

Hotblack Desiato · 14-05-2026 10:52AM

Labour even with 37 seats in 2011 didn't get a shot at Taoiseach, it'll never happen for the SDs even if they hoovered up every single former Labour voter.

Benedict XVI · 14-05-2026 11:10AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124466863#Comment_124466863

Holly Cairns is looking more and more like our first female taoiseach every day

They'd have to be part of a government for that to even be a possibility.

And as we have seen from the last two general elections they are afraid of going into government.

Much easier to be in opposition and come up with these grandiose bills and impress the likes of yourself.

Red Silurian · 14-05-2026 12:33PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124467137#Comment_124467137

I'd argue it's easier to be in government than in opposition - when in government you have a better chance at getting your policies over the line and improving your likelihood of gaining voter share. As long as you don't blatantly lie to your electorate when seeking election of course

aloyisious · 15-06-2026 07:13PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124466998#Comment_124466998

RTE News has it on it's F/B news page from 2 hours back that Government TDs are to have a free vote on Sinn Féin legislation to remove the mandatory three-day wait period for abortion in early pregnancy.

Loafing Oaf · 16-06-2026 10:47AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124553327#Comment_124553327

My understanding is FF TDs get this automatically on all such legislation? Anyway will surely be overwhelmingly approved, SF doing the bare minimum to regain some progressive cred on this issue…

Hotblack Desiato · 16-06-2026 12:49PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124553327#Comment_124553327

Presumably SF will be supporting their own bill…

Question is what is so different about this one compared to the previous one that they couldn't support it. Apart from not being written by SF of course 🙄

For a party which goes on and on about a 'left alliance' they seem hell bent on doing everything they can to piss off every other potential ally. Maybe they now see Independent Ireland as their potential ally, who the feck knows these days.

FF always give a free vote because otherwise 1/3 to 1/2 of the party would defy the whip. FF like to keep quiet about this sort of thing (in urban areas anyway) but there's still a large socially regressive element in the party

Say what you like about Enda Kenny but he had the guts to stand up to the FG knuckledraggers in 2013 and had no hesitation in expelling them from the party (over legislation whose sole function was to stop women dying ffs - this was 5 years before Repeal - opposition to that minimum possible legislative change was always such a ridiculous hill for the Renua lot to die on)

aloyisious · 16-06-2026 02:34PM

It's certainly got the Liveline show on RTE astir.

Quantum Erasure · 16-06-2026 04:29PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124554889#Comment_124554889

Question is what is so different about this one compared to the previous one that they couldn't support it. Apart from not being written by SF of course 🙄

Well, this one is just about removing the 3 day wait period, not about fully decriminalising abortion.

Also, currently a fetus with a fatal abnormality, which would not survive beyond 28 days post birth, would be eligible for an abortion. The previous bill sought to remove this 28 day limit.

Loafing Oaf · 16-06-2026 04:35PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124554889#Comment_124554889

FF always give a free vote because otherwise 1/3 to 1/2 of the party would defy the whip. FF like to keep quiet about this sort of thing (in urban areas anyway) but there's still a large socially regressive element in the party

Not sure this is true anymore? IIRC only four FF TDs voted against the final reading of post-repeal abortion legislation, and that's a while ago now. This SF bill will tell a tale in that regard I suppose…

Loafing Oaf · 16-06-2026 05:11PM

https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2026/0616/1578741-dail-abortion/

This should guarantee a landslide…

Hotblack Desiato · 16-06-2026 09:22PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124555225#Comment_124555225

Just takes a couple of loquacious cranks to make it sound like the whole country is for or against something on that show, it's a joke

Imagine having nothing better to do on a weekday afternoon than to phone Liveline for a whinge

aloyisious · 16-06-2026 11:07PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124556218#Comment_124556218

Even in the "hope" of resurrecting the late referendum expecting to get the opposite result.

Hotblack Desiato · 17-06-2026 03:31PM

https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2026/06/17/some-of-those-who-added-the-three-day-wait-to-irish-abortion-law-look-set-abandon-it/

Interesting to note that the three day wait was not recommended by the citizens' assembly or even the Dail committee. It was pure politics. But it may well have been what got Simon Coveney - the anti-choicers' last great hope within the Cabinet - onside.

Breda O'Brien wrote a very nasty article about Coveney in the IT when he retired from politics. (How "christian" of her.) They've never forgotten, or forgiven him. But repeal would have happened regardless of his support.

Maybe the three day wait was politically necessary in 2018 (in my view, probably not) but a review of the operation of the legislation was envisaged from the outset and this was published a full three years ago. The government has not moved forward with a single one of the report's recommendations for change, or promised to do so, and it's not part of the programme for government - no doubt the rural independent TD's wouldn't have liked it 🙄

Basically SD and SF have shamed them into this minimal change. But what about the rest of the review report's recommendations?

Loafing Oaf · 17-06-2026 09:58PM

https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2026/06/17/number-of-government-tds-to-vote-against-sinn-fein-bill-on-abortion-services/&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwiAxvj7k4-VAxV0YEEAHWoJHygQxfQBKAB6BAgIEAE&usg=AOvVaw2JWBH0K147V2azQLuhOB5I

bill passes by 86 votes to 70. Tighter than I would’ve expected. Suggests it would be difficult To get further liberalisation though and therefore there is unlikely to be any attempt innthe current dail.

Hotblack Desiato · 18-06-2026 03:20PM

So we're back to cowardly politicians again and an anti-choice minority in this country being pandered to.

The absolute brainlessness of what some of them are coming out with is something to behold. The Irish people expressly voted to NOT have future referendums decide what abortion policy in this country should be. To claim the 2018 legislation must somehow be set in stone is idiotic.

It seems there are plenty of closet anti-choicers in the Dail, I hope the electorate are taking note. There is one local TD who will never again get a preference from me

ohnonotgmail · 18-06-2026 04:11PM

Is there a list of which TDs voted against it?

Hotblack Desiato · 19-06-2026 12:19AM

Here…

https://www.kildarestreet.com/debates/?id=2026-06-17a.501

or the official site here

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/debate/dail/2026-06-17/67/

ohnonotgmail · 19-06-2026 08:33AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124562078#Comment_124562078

Am i correct in think that somebody not mentioned abstained from the vote?

Hotblack Desiato · 19-06-2026 07:53PM

Give us a clue.

Ozymandius2011 · 19-06-2026 08:03PM

I think to an absolutist, there should be either a complete ban, or no regulations at all.

As someone who voted yes, I did not believe I was voting for no regulation.

I assumed the number of abortions would be similar to before. Instead it's about twice as many.

I dont see 3 days as making much of a difference but I do think that when someone is making an irreversible decision, a period of reflection does no harm. It does seem from what several TDs have said that thousands of women decided not to proceed with abortions after the 3 days kicked in.

I'm not making a moral judgement but I am concerned about declining birth rates, which are ironically happening despite high immigration. It would seem to show that the latter doesnt remedy the former.

Abortion Discussion, Part the Fourth

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