DART+ (DART Expansion)

Citizen Six · 07-02-2026 04:51PM

Isn't there already a dedicated thread for talking about the Athens Metro? 😂

EarWig · 07-02-2026 05:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124215195#Comment_124215195

You're joking but sometimes comparisons do show us up as being nowhere near 1st world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLKN_Rmb39I

Citizen Six · 07-02-2026 06:04PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124215413#Comment_124215413

When I feel deflated at how bad we do things here, I just try to remember how they built the Charleroi Metro, and I feel better.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeMJBqU_eYc&t=5s%20

murphaph · 07-02-2026 07:28PM

Even the unused Charleroi line will be brought into service in the next couple of years too.

DrivingSouth · 07-02-2026 10:55PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124215454#Comment_124215454

Maybe have a read of this disastrous effort at a tram system in campinas in Brazil.

http://tramz.com/br/lr/ca.html

spacetweek · 08-02-2026 10:33AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124213241#Comment_124213241

I quite simply don’t believe that. Has there been a reliable press release on this?

https://www.instagram.com/p/DUa6cSsDA4B/?img_index=2&igsh=NDZseDRtYnRpbzIw

spacetweek · 08-02-2026 10:43AM

It was supposed to be enabling works this year and full construction next year. Minister for Transport and Taoiseach need to intervene.

Crakepottle? · 08-02-2026 10:55AM

Notice to treat has been served on property owners for Dart South West. I wonder when will the work start.

cgcsb · 08-02-2026 11:51AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124216736#Comment_124216736

On South West, 2030 according to the NDP.

cgcsb · 08-02-2026 11:57AM

Heritage surveys for West will start in July. In September we'll see intrusive surveys at Spencer Dock and Ashtown. Then demolition work in the Spencer Dock area. Main contractors will probably also be appointed around December, so detailed design and some main construction will still be a go before the end of 2027. The late 2028 start for construction is possibly a reference to construction in a particular area or of a particular structure.

SeanW · 08-02-2026 12:49PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124216867#Comment_124216867

Let's hope so - it would be absurd to do no building work until late 2028.

MICKEYG · 08-02-2026 01:02PM

You wonder were the government hoping for more JRs so they could hide behind them. Now planning is in place they have been caught with their trousers down and are scrambling.

So annoying as these projects pay for themselves. Borrow if needed, its capital expenditure and an investment in both the country and the citizens quality of life

Sam Russell · 08-02-2026 05:35PM

The problem we have is that we have two incompatible gauges for heavy and light rail. We also have two voltages - 750v and 1500v so we have not made it easy for ourselves.

There is no way our heavy rail could be converted to standard gauge, but we could rationalise the voltages by settling on 25kv ac for all new electrifications, with dual voltage trains where appropriate.

L1011 · 08-02-2026 05:47PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124217854#Comment_124217854

25kv AC light rail would be insanity and solve nothing.

Sam Russell · 08-02-2026 05:58PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124217904#Comment_124217904

25kv ac would be inappropriate for light rail, but 1500v dc would not be a good choice for Dart type services outside Dublin. We have a lot of 25kv ac lines to build, but Luas lines will be short and few - only being in a few cities (if any).

murphaph · 08-02-2026 06:17PM

I think that outside Dublin it will all be 25kVac with dual voltage trains being the plan, so that long term we could convert the whole thing gradually to 25kVac (obviously talking heavy rail here)

bk · 08-02-2026 06:47PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124217854#Comment_124217854

That isn’t really a major problem though!

If you look at cities with old Metro networks like Paris, different lines can be a mishmash of different track gauges, different power systems, different signalling systems and even rubber versus steel wheels and other weirdness.

it doesn’t really matter, they just keep the lines separate.

I wasn’t for a moment suggesting that DART needs to convert to standard gauge or anything like that!

More of a case if you increase the frequency of DART to every 5 minutes, it basically becomes Metro like.

Then if you decide to brand it as a “Metro” line or not is basically a branding exercise, though obviously those of us with an interest will know the differences behind the scenes.

murphaph · 08-02-2026 07:11PM

I think we should strive for a common national signage design for metro, Luas and heavy rail stops/stations. The name on the door doesn't really matter. Navigating the system is much easier if the signage is uniform though. There would be absolutely nothing stopping us from rebranding DART as Metro to help visitors that little bit. If we are doing that though we should probably rename Luas to Tram first!

Kermit.de.frog · 08-02-2026 07:50PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124218278#Comment_124218278

The metro will be operated by a private company so I highly doubt Irish Rail or any other entity would be taking on their branding. They are fundamentally different systems anyway. I really don't see the issue.

murphaph · 08-02-2026 08:13PM

"Their" branding is whatever the NTA says it is. Look at the increased uniformity of buses and bus stops nationwide. Station signage could be equally uniform. There's absolutely no reason not to standardise it and every reason to do so.

Bsharp · 08-02-2026 08:17PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124217018#Comment_124217018

the metrolink passing through JR quickly has caught them on the hop in terms of funding profile and progress of governance approvals/business cases, so yes

spillit67 · 08-02-2026 09:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124218278#Comment_124218278

We should but each time we do some transport initiative the people bringing it about what to put their own “stamp” on it. And then there was the CIÉ / RPA and then NTA politics.

I’m strongly the view that it would have made it easier to firstly construct Luas lines and then MetroLink by simply using the DART brand. Once Luas became built everyone wanted one then of course and it will be the same with ML.

Sam Russell · 08-02-2026 10:32PM

I think it would be logical to think of ~~MetroNorth~~ MetroLink as just a working project name. Just call the final name Metro.

Kermit.de.frog · 08-02-2026 11:35PM

Curiously Sean Sweeney did previously indicate the name might actually change at some point. I think his rationale was the name didn't provide enough distinction given so many transport lines of varying standards around the world have the same name. Manchester has a "Metrolink" but it's just a tram. There is five cities alone in the USA with networks of same name.

I guess it's ok but it's not the most inspired branding. Prefer just "Metro" tbh.

Zebra3 · 08-02-2026 11:52PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124219023#Comment_124219023

Yep, ML is really a crappy name.

Metro or Dublin Metro for the company name, but maybe call the line M1 or something to keep the pressure on for another line.

DART and Luas lines should get numbers too. Colour as a distinction is quite outdated with a greater appreciation of colour blindness.

Sam Russell · 09-02-2026 11:00AM

I think DART has been accepted as a generic name for urban heavy rail (at least in Dublin). So perhaps they should name various possible routes for the finished routes as Dart 1, Dart 2, etc.

If the Dart Underground actually happens, then the number of possible routings increases significantly. Again, if the Maynooth line was linked to Heuston, that also allows more routing possibilities. Plus the Navan route might become a player, increasing the network for Dublin rail.

Many possibilities.

bk · 09-02-2026 12:50PM

I don’t think we necessarily need to rename DART “Metro”, DART is a great and well respected brand name. Copenhagen is an example where they keep their Metro and S-Tog (DART) branding separate, but then it is practically integrated in every other way in terms of ticketing, signage, etc. and on transport maps they certainly show both as tier 1 transport methods and of equal status.

Really the point I’m trying to make, I notice with the general public they don’t really seem to realise the incredible potential there is with the DART+ network. That if we develop the DART network over time, we can turn those lines into Metro like service. That in time and without too crazy an investment, we could go from having no metro like lines to 5 of them!

In future we could see DART operating at a 5 minute frequency, very much a turn up and go, Metro like service.

KrisW1001 · 09-02-2026 01:14PM

DART and Metro should remain as separate names, given that they are different levels in a hierarchy of rail services:

DART: Suburban-to-regional service, lines reach 20~40 km from city centre, up to 1000 per train, stops 2 km apart on average (closer in city centre)
Metro: Suburban and urban service: line reaches 12 km from city centre, ~500 per train, Stops every 1 km.
Luas: Urban: lines mostly within city, ~300 per tram, stops every 500~600m

Zebra3 · 09-02-2026 01:19PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124220088#Comment_124220088

Most people have given up on believing FFFG have any interest in delivering.

Paulzx · 09-02-2026 01:20PM

I've always equated DART with the S Bahn in Germany and the Metrolink with their U Bahn. Brilliant integration between both of them in German cities but a distinct difference in function despite being able to use the S Bahn as a U Bahn in the inner city areas.

DART+ (DART Expansion)

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