Irish rail fleet and infrastructure plans

flyingsnail · 24-10-2025 03:51PM

There is nothing stopping a direct service from Cork to Waterford as it stands, they would just have to reverse at the pocket loop in the same way the Limerick Junction to Waterford services do now.

end of the road · 24-10-2025 03:57PM

the reversals at lj are not optimal though to be fair, but perhapse it's a case of so be it nothing can be done which if so the service will have to go ahead regardless.

BestWestern · 25-10-2025 12:54AM

Am I hallucinating, but did IR run through trains from Dublin to Ennis at one stage?

Glaceon · 25-10-2025 06:20AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123935211#Comment_123935211

They did in the mid to late 2000s, it would arrive into Limerick from Dublin with Mark 3s and a 201 or 071, they’d then put a pair of 141s on the other end to take it to Ennis.

goingnowhere · 25-10-2025 07:07AM

Friday only 1725 ish out of Heuston, whatever they had on hand in Limerick did the honours for the trip to Ennis

Rulmeq · 25-10-2025 08:45AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123935211#Comment_123935211

Back in the late 90s I got the train to Limerick, and the train out to Ennis was supposed to be one of the DMUs, instead they brought the train I was on all the way out (I'm very fuzzy on the details though, it was 25+ years ago, and I honestly didn't know much about trains, but I do remember it was a loco hauled mark iv set, and I really wish I'd paid attention to it). I don't even remember why I was on the train (I guess it could have been for one of the hurling matches, so 1995, or 97 maybe)

BestWestern · 25-10-2025 10:44AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123935293#Comment_123935293

That's what I was remembering. I just don't ever remember getting a direct train to Dublin.

Looking at the volumes on changing at Limerick, the demand is there for this to return, but it's probably complicated by the fact that the train would need to continue to Athenry.

end of the road · 25-10-2025 02:45PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123935211#Comment_123935211

i think they ran a friday's only through service yes.

have no knowledge of the frequency though, might have been a dublin ennis only?

ballina had a friday's only through as well.

bikeman1 · 26-10-2025 06:48AM

The service at the end was:

17:05 Dublin Heuston - Limerick

Forward with the same train at

19:20 Limerick - Ennis arrive 20:00

It then ran as

20:20 Ennis - Limerick 21:00

8 Mk3’s with a 201 into the station at Limerick, then 2x121/141/181 or 071 hooked on at the rear and took the train forward. It was a very popular service. Did many many times.

CatInABox · 26-10-2025 08:31AM

The contract for the enterprise fleet replacement is now under judicial review.

The Spanish crowd CAF have taken the case over the award of contract to Stadler.

https://m.independent.ie/business/irish/spanish-firm-in-legal-challenge-over-awarding-of-650m-fleet-contract/a1117458650.html

FFS. It's long gone far past a joke at this stage.

BestWestern · 26-10-2025 09:49AM

Between over regulation, and everything being JR'd it's impossible to get anything done in Ireland anymore.

flyingsnail · 26-10-2025 11:08AM

I have no idea how much, if at all, this will affect these proceedings, but I cant imagine the fact that CAF has been recently added to a UN blacklist will help them win this contract.

https://rollingstockworld.com/economy/caf-added-to-un-blacklist-faces-contract-loss-risks/

Jamie2k9 · 26-10-2025 11:44AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938667#Comment_123938667

Just remember if the NTA were managing the process it would be even longer.

Cases like this will be resolved quickly. CAF should focus on building rolling stock that dosn't crack months after going into service.

dublinman1990 · 26-10-2025 11:57AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938982#Comment_123938982

That would mean the Commuter trains that are made by CAF currently in IÉ's fleet could be replaced with newer trains made by either Stadler or manufacturers in the near future.

I don't really see an issue with that situation tbh. For me that's a big win in my book. From a passenger perspective; those Commuter trains in IÉ made by CAF are horrid yokes.

Other passengers would be delighted to see these trains consigned to the dustbin of History if they eventually get scrapped from IÉ's fleet in the future.

BTW; is the provision of blocking Un blacklisted companies that work here with Israel formally included in the OTB from the Government?

Jamie2k9 · 26-10-2025 12:43PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123939105#Comment_123939105

It will change nothing from an Irish Rail prospective.

LXFlyer · 26-10-2025 12:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123938667#Comment_123938667

This course of action in these scenarios (rolling stock orders) is far from restricted to Ireland.

PlatformNine · 26-10-2025 01:01PM

If the JR went in CAF's favour, what would happen? Would they just be awarded the contract and things would go forward as normal? Or would they have to completely redo the tender? I would hope not the later as that could be devastating to our fleet capabilities as the DDs might not until a replacement arrives.

On a lighter note and hoping all goes well, I am not surprised to see Stadler won and I will be curious to see what the fleet will be capable of when more finalised designs are released. I imagine it will be a FLIRT, but I wonder what the top speed, number of cars, etc will be. I am especially curious to see if there will still be a buffet car.

Even if the JR is resolved quickly, could it still be some time before a more finalised design is shown to the public?

Jamie2k9 · 26-10-2025 01:25PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123939265#Comment_123939265

They would likely re-tender or they might be open to other legal cases.

DD fleet will be fine beyond 2029, don't mind claims its life expired etc. It’s possible the new fleet might be delayed (not because of this), faults and delay acceptance. The DD fleet will continue.

bk · 26-10-2025 05:00PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123917068#Comment_123917068

I was actually in Paris last week and got to ride the RER A, damn impressive service. The whole Paris public transport system was, extensive Metro lines all over the city, everywhere was within a few minutes walk of a Metro station. For just €2.50 you could not only travel all over Paris via the Metro, but then on the same ticket jump on the RER A to go 40+km to Disneyland!

So quickly and easy to jump between Disney and nearby towns, just turn up and go service. How all commuter systems should be.

I noticed that the RER A double deckers, that the lower deck is actually mostly below platform level, like 2/3rds of the lower deck was below the platform, so I think our high platforms would actually work well with that and be an advantage. But I agree with all your other points, much easier for us to start by fixing capacity issues by having enough trains to ensure full length trains on all services and then follow that up with the higher frequencies that DART+ is promising.

As an aside, there is a whole separate conversation about if double deckers trains are actually a good idea, at least for very frequent metro like services. Double deckers trains normally have less doors and it takes people more time to get up and down the stairs, which all leads to slower dwell times at stations, and thus less potential for high frequency. RER tries to deal with this by being the only DD train with three doors, but then the extra doors mean more space needed for stairs, which cuts into the extra capacity, so a trade off. DD can work well for long distance services, but there is a reason why high frequency Metros are all single deckers.

On the news of Stadtler winning the enterprise contract and CAF going to JR:

On the one hand I’m excited that Stadtler won the contract, they seem to make great trains, with great modularity, that would be well suited for our unusual needs and FFS on CAF bringing a case like this.

Pete_Cavan · 27-10-2025 12:02PM

Can the recent posts on the Enterprise fleet be moved to a new thread specifically on that topic? This thread is impossible to follow with all sorts of things being discussed in the last two weeks alone.

Citizen Six · 27-10-2025 02:01PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123941413#Comment_123941413

You mean this one?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058341796/enterprise-replacement-and-connolly-station-based-trains-generally

end of the road · 27-10-2025 02:16PM

enterprise is part irish rail fleet though so should be fine here as well.

Pete_Cavan · 28-10-2025 05:32AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123941745#Comment_123941745

Everything is fine in this thread, sure no need for any other threads?

Nibs05 · 28-10-2025 08:21AM

Any locomotive orders ?, there was a rumour IE were looking at the class 93 type, also a Stadler build.

goingnowhere · 28-10-2025 10:00AM

No tenders issued and yes the CME and CEO have been climbing around various locomotives at InnoTrans in Berlin last two years, then again everyone who goes does that

93 on diesel is at best 071 performance, you want the beast that is the 99 which is better than a 201 on diesel and twice as powerful on electric

All dreams though nothing for them to do if purchased. The 071 class will go forever and there are 3 more idle in Belfast.

Decision point is around 2030 as the Mk4 fleet is on the way out by then and you would be moving on electrification on Dublin Cork and purchasing more of the proposed Dublin Belfast fleet

PlatformNine · 30-10-2025 06:29PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123942987#Comment_123942987

IÉ's Rail Freight 2040 strategy plans on the 071s reaching end-of-life in 2030, but given how things are going with the rest of the fleet I wouldn't expect them to be replaced until closer to 2035 (both the Enterprise and 8100 fleet have exceeded their original life expectancy).

My current hope is that they will start tendering in the next year or two with expected delivery and service for 2032 or 2033. iirc IÉ has been very interested in the Class 99 as goingnowhere mentions, not the 93. Although they could always order some half-93/half-99 model to best suit whatever IÉ wants for the network. For example, they would be likely to want something with a battery pack which the 99 doesn't have, but may want the more powerful diesel of the 99.

goingnowhere · 31-10-2025 10:08AM

Problem is weight, 99 is a 6 axle loco, 93 is 4 axles and it's several tons over the axle weight limits

IE would need it fitted with ETCS and 1500V capability might fit in the limits, adding a battery you are overweight…

The most sustainable approach is to keep plugging away with a 071, light, cheap to run and can handle the weights as train lengths are limited by infrastructure as it stands right now committed electrification where freight operates is Hazelhatch-Spencer Dock that doesn't justify a new fleet. Its wait and see with Foynes to see if it actually generates business

PlatformNine · 01-11-2025 11:46AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123950761#Comment_123950761

Honestly staying underweight may be a problem anyways as the 99 already seems to be at or just over the axle limit. However this was also my point about IÉ will need to order a model that suits them best.

Also at the end of the day they are already 50 year old units and there are only so many of them. While they still have some good life left to them, going from tender to service will probably be at least 5 years and probably longer. So they do need to be at least a bit forward thinking for both their replacement and for expanding services. At least since, as far as I am aware there aren't many locos to spare with ost of the 071s are already in use between freight, infrastructure, and RPSI operations.

bikeman1 · 01-11-2025 01:30PM

Keeping the 071s in traffic is a solid move. They owe them nothing, can keep battering them into life, and do the job amicably.

Those locos are probably the best buy that the Irish State has ever done. Simply amazing machines.

Citizen Six · 01-11-2025 02:23PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123953285#Comment_123953285

Hard to say which direction freight is going to go, with North Wall essentially shut down. Almost 10 million wasted on the new freight terminal, and it's just a white elephant now. Less need for locos there anyway.

They do have an 071 on standby for the Dart+ project now.

RPSI doesn't really run that often, and isn't that much of a drain on resources of 071s.

Irish rail fleet and infrastructure plans

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