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Limerick improvement projects

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,268 ✭✭✭✭phog




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,031 ✭✭✭adaminho


    It was mentioned in the press release for the Good shepherd development that PP was being sought for Georges Quay but no design has emerged yet.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 291 ✭✭rdser


    IS there not the original part of Barringtons and a newer bit that was added on about 15-20 years ago? On the right hand side?

    NO matter what goes in there you are gutting the building. A classic building like that doesnt go out of fashion if done correctly. One Perry Square is a fabulous facility in a (mainly) Georgian building.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 13,111 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    It's quite common these days to demolish every thing except the facade and build a modern building inside the shell. That could easily be done with Barringtons if any developer wished to do so.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,551 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    The newer bit is pretty small so unless they took over LSAD or the band hall I don't see a hotel happening.

    If they had more land something like the Moxy in Cork would fit perfectly. The front of Barringtons might never go out of fashion but retrofitting old buildings into hotel rooms has.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    Barringtons Hospital - The Property.png

    This is what the agents Bannon had in their sales prospectus about the property.

    A mixture of Freehold and Leasehold on offer.

    I still don’t get it if the sale has gone 100% through between Bon Secours and NKF Limited ?

    Limerick Leader wrote . . .

    Developers NKF Limited has been given permission by the chief executive of the Bon Secours Health System, Bill Maher, to engage with Limerick City and County Council on the future use of the building.

    Mayor Moran should get proactive here and invite these two parties to the city hall to find out what they have planned for the Barrington’s site.

    NKF Limited is a “Brass Plate Company” registered in the UK and owned by a citizen from the Peoples Republic of China.

    It’s not the best type of company to siting on a prominent city centre property with just short term speculating / letting in mind.

    I was delighted that the Limerick Chamber red flagged the proposed IPAS as not in the interest of the city centre.

    Its ironic that EU countries pay billions to accommodate Ukrainian War Refugees where as PRC economically gains from Putin’s War.

    Ironic in that if NKF Limited, had got the IPAS for Barringtons Hospital, then the profits would flow back to the PRC.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,551 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    I hadn't realised "block C" was part of the hospital.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,031 ✭✭✭adaminho


    Planning permission in the Post this week for the art college on Georges Quay but no drawings online yet.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    68b847d8d431e.jpg

    TUS reveal plans for George's Quay campus (live95fm)

    The plans will maximise the Fanning's Castle site which is located adjacent to the proposed new design hub

    The Mary St site is located adjacent to the historic Fanning's Castle, and the proposal aims to maximise the relationship to Fanning’s Castle, offering a new street frontage to Mary Street.

    Designers for the project want to bring an existing underutilised courtyard adjacent to Fanning’s Castle back to life by creating a new landscaped area for public access and users of the Forge facility.

    The Forge Design Factory will be Ireland’s first interdisciplinary design and learning hub, joining a global network of 40 design factories.

    The vision is to cultivate a vibrant ecosystem of designers, industry leaders, and stakeholders, driving impactful solutions to real-world challenges.

    68b848011e6bc.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,268 ✭✭✭✭phog


    They should cross the road there too and do something with the old garda station, it's criminal that it was allowed to fall in to the state that it is now, Edward St Station is the nearly as bad



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    I had a look at the TUS planning 2560879 for Mary Steet / Fanning’s Castle site.

    Proposed Development: The change of use of existing storage building on Mary Street at to an education and research facility including demolition of existing storage facility 736 sqm and replacement with two storey education and research facility 697 sqm including office space, computer workstations, learning spaces and associated WC and changing facilities, a new entrance to Mary Street and new signage to Mary Street. Associated landscape works and improved public access to Fanning’s Castle from Mary Street are proposed with upgrading of existing Mary Street gates and boundary. The proposed building is within the curtilage of the National Monument No. 383 known as Fanning’s Castle and the following protected structures: 21513070

    In my opinion TUS could have done more here with that site by doing a reconstruction of a row of Four Dutch Gables that once stood there and integrate them as part of the Forge Design Factory / Fanning’s Castle.

    The Mary Street / Nicholas Street was the original main thoroughfare of the old English Town and these type of building once graced them.

    The following drawing was done by a poster called Gunter who posted on the defunct Archiseek forum where he showed his keen interest in the Dutch Billies associated with Dublin.

    Mary Street Drawing By Gunter.jpg Mary Street 1898.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,551 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    But that would totally block out Fannings castle no ?

    I'm not a huge fan of the building they are going ahead with though. It's a glorified shed.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 13,111 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    They're quite obviously doing this on a budget. Building a whole block would cost an absolute fortune.

    And I don't see the point of a pastiche recreation of something that's been gone for decades.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    @Cookiemunster

    And I don't see the point of a pastiche recreation of something that's been gone for decades.

    No, not a pastiche recreation like Castle Lane but a reconstruction on the original foundations.

    There are many such reconstructions of such buildings in Europe after their total destruction during the second world.

    Reconstructions brought back some authenticity to the old quarters of many a city.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    @breezy1985

    But that would totally block out Fannings castle no ?

    You are probably right, the four Dutch Gables marked B, C, D, E that I was referring to in that drawing were further right than I thought.

    I would say Fanning's Castle would be better served if they accessed it at Creaghs Lane.

    Would be cool if TUS could acquire those buildings (derelict) on Creagh Lane and develop a nice courtyard around the castle remains.

    Fannings Castle - Creagh Lane.png Fannings Castle - Birds Eye View.png


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 13,111 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    You're refering to buildings that were bombed by the Allies and rebuilt after the war. That is completely different to buildings that were purposely demolished and have had other buildings built on that site since.

    Rebuilding them to their original plans would also lead to buildings totally unsuitable for the needs of TUS. Therefore what you would actually get is a pastiche recreation of the facade Infront of modern buildings.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    The WW2 destruction period lasted six years but the reconstruction took decades.

    The destruction period of the gable buildings along the main thoroughfare of the English Town took longer.

    It was economics, not explosives.

    It probably started when the Corporation moved to Rutland Street in Newtown Pery.

    Once the Georgian boom took hold the importance of the English Town went into decline.

    Maintaining those buildings was not profitable enough so the buildings went into decay and were downsized by removing the upper floors.

    Worst some were demolished like the Exchange and Ireton’s Gable house on Nicholas Street to make way for a graveyard extension at the Cathedral.

    Gable -Exchange 1820.jpg Exchange1884.jpg

    If the English Town or Kings Island as it is known today wants to revive its late Medieval period then some of the existing buildings could return to their Dutch Gable glory by adding a floor or two with a little pediment on top.

    The Treaty City Brewery would be an ideal candidate.

    Treaty City Brewery.png

    Here is an Impression of the same Nicholas Street in 1845.

    Nicholas Street Impression 1845.JPG


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,551 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    What happened is part of the history of the street now. Recreating a fake version for the sake of it isn't for me.

    Also who pays for it. Do Treaty pay or are you forcing some council flats on to their roof ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    What’s fake about the Treaty Building?

    To me it’s about the possible restoration of two gable buildings.

    The stone work at the doorway and the positioning of the drainpipe are interesting details of what could be underneath.

    But of course a survey of the building would have to take place first.

    Maybe Mayor Moran might get funds for such heritage purposes.

    However I’m not advocating a total rebuilding of a Gable Building landscape.

    Treaty City Brewery Details.png


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 772 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    For a relatively small city on a European scale, I always think Limerick City Centre is extremely impressive looking and makes the city look and feel way bigger than it is. The grid and wide streets always look great, I think. The only thing it's missing are trees



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 117 ✭✭Jose Maria


    Old towns rebuilt all over Europe after wars, most recently in the Balkans, and now we go visit these places and rave about the old towns, so why not?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,551 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    You are talking about old towns that were destroyed and immediately rebuilt as the same old towns. Not places that have transformed over years and are being returned to an old style years later.

    Building a brand new building ad making it look old without looking fake is very hard.

    Also from a historical point of view why are we fetishising the Victorian or Georgian era. Why are we not remaking Nicholas St. how it is "supposed to look". Those Dutch gabled houses tore down and destroyed historic buildings just as much as we did to them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 829 ✭✭✭LeoD




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,551 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    "allow bikers cycle head-on against cars"

    What a load of balls from Rabbitte. Firstly who calls cyclists bikers and the term head on is deliberately trying to make the situation sound highy dangerous.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 648 ✭✭✭Cetyl Palmitate


    Is it not incumbent on a reporter not to directly quote such hyperbolic nonsense in relation to such minor changes?

    If I am so used to 40 years coming down here and the next thing a bike comes into you, God forbid: there could be a fatality

    Surely, over this past 40 years, there has been an occasion where they have been driving down this quiet residential street and come across some human shaped obstacle. Maybe somebody walking down the road. Or standing in the road staring at their shiny new car. What have they done? How have they managed to avoid causing death or serious injury to this being? Maybe they have superhuman reflexes. Or F1 level driving skills.

    Who knows. God forbid.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,551 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Wasting John Moran's time with this unimportant nonsense too. The same people will probably then complain when the mayor doesn't get anything done.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,399 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    If it's the one I'm thinking of then cars and bikes alike are always going the wrong way on that road and none of them have ever been hit. They don't need any sign to tell them what to do 🤣🤣🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    @breezy1985

    You are talking about old towns that were destroyed and immediately rebuilt as the same old towns. Not places that have transformed over years and are being returned to an old style years later.

    Building a brand new building ad making it look old without looking fake is very hard.

    Also from a historical point of view why are we fetishising the Victorian or Georgian era.

    ********************************************************

    Therefore you would disagree with the west wing extension of Barringtons Hospital in 2004 which was built 175 years later.

    Would a mixture of classical and modern elements deem it as fake too?

    Pictures Healy Architects + Olde Limerick Journal

    BH - East Wing Ext 2004 A.jpg BH - East Wing Ext 2004 B.jpg MontDePieteDrawing.JPG


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,551 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    That proves my point I think. It's so blatantly fake.

    It fits well as what is obviously a modern addition to an old building but trying to sell an "old town" to tourists using this model will be instantly recognised as a sham.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭Brennans Row


    @breezy1985

    That proves my point I think. It's so blatantly fake.

    It fits well as what is obviously a modern addition to an old building . . .

    ********************************************

    I agree, if it fits well and if the quality is right, we don't have to be purists about if it looks "fake" or "pastiche".

    The National Built Heritage Service writes about Barringtons Hospital . . .

    The recent addition to the west has classical references nodding at a symmetrical composition with the east wing, leaving the central principal block the most important element within the ensemble.



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