M20 - Cork to Limerick [preferred route chosen; in design - phase 3]

Honestly I don't think it's of any real benefit. My daily commute is by bike so this isn't an anti cycling take. I honestly don't see it being used. It's not like it's going to be a quiet greenway, meandering through the country side along an existing former rail line, usually with mature vegetation.

This is going to be a cycle lane running along the side of a motorway, it will be wide open, noisy and provide little to no shelter. I have cycled along dual carriageways before and they are not a pleasant place to cycle because of how open they are.

It's nothing more than green window dressing to make them feel good about allowing a road project to progress.

This is going to be a cycle lane running along the side of a motorway, it will be wide open, noisy and provide little to no shelter

Is this actually the case or hyperbole?

Primarily hyperbole.

The project team is aiming for a large separation, including grade separation, fencing, landscaping etc. They haven't formally agreed the separation width but I remember being surprised by how large they were proposing, certainly 10m, and I think I remember them saying 30m. That would be roughly what the Blackrock greenway has along the N40 in Cork.

Thus the proposed greenway will not be along the side of the motorway but at distance from it. Large portions of the route (~35%) will be nowhere near the motorway alignment at all.

It will not be wide open: there will be grade separation, fencing and landscaping.

I can't speak about it being noisy until the separation distance is agreed, but the design team are explicitly aiming for it to not be noisy.

I'm not sure about "little to no shelter" though: I don't know of any road or greenway that I could say is "sheltered" so I won't try a rebuttal there.

Drawings available here:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/hgypxyhr1okcddkqovmhs/A1-Drawing.pdf?rlkey=4wmk8qu92ttcwgd4sp3dvsdw2&e=1&st=5isnd1ne&dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/5g5uyr3jtl7s3a9bses97/Developing-Design-Active-Travel.pdf?rlkey=5hv2y4j958t2eoe7p42tsa046&e=1&st=xu3icm98&dl=0

I'd be hopeful that the groundwork done by the project team over the last few years, especially the communication and public consultations and the subsequent reworking of the plan to take account of points raised will bear fruit and smooth the path through ABP and head off any attempt at JR. Nothing is certain, but the handling of this project is 1,000,000 miles away from the incompetence and arrogance that CCC et al displayed in relation to the M28. Hopefully this project will have a much smoother path, aided, abetted and supported by a minister that isn't e. ryan esq.

It's Eamon Ryan's changes to this project to promote active travel, EV use and public transport that will protect it from JRs on the grounds of our climate treaty obligations.

I find these claims about sustainability here to be a marketing exercise. As I said before, they have some car parks which they have labelled as "hubs" but you wouldn't know much of the road is to run parallel to the rail line.

But designing the road without consideration for the railway does tie IÉ into locations that may not suit their other plans. Anything IÉ may look to do will have to work with the road as designed. Had both been taken into consideration together, something may have been done differently to accommodate IÉ. As it is, IÉ want a P&R at Blarney but the obvious location for a Blarney station will have four roundabouts between it and the motorway, limiting its attractiveness as a P&R. With the way the road is being designed, they'd be better off having Blarney as a station for the town only (with a bus link). They should put the P&R at the next junction north which is beside the rail line so easy access/exit which might entice people out of their cars. I don't see any negative in considering station locations in conjuction with the road, once the road is built it definitely have an impact on future potential station locations so better to do it now.

Regarding the "Transport Hubs", they can accommodate existing carpoolers and maybe attract a few more but it is hardly a win for sustainability as the motorway itself is going to facilitate an increase is car journeys. A place for carpooling (and probably dogging) is hardly a transport hub. P&Rs with bus services only is a hard sell as people have to get into their car to start their journey and will later face the same traffic in a bus as they would in their car. It seems like a huge missed opportunity that there will be trains running to Mallow every 10 minutes but will run non-stop for 25km between Blarney and Mallow. Yet with the €1bn road project which is supposedly big on sustainability, they are only providing "Transport Hubs" which may be served by buses (what routes, what frequency, etc. unknown). I'm sure I'll be told that the project team have nothing to do with buses which is true but without buses, these "Transport Hubs" are definitely just car parks. The rail line is there and the services are being put in place, why not connect to those?

Still no sign of the preliminary business case for approval by Cabinet, so it can then be submitted to ABP?

Probably a stupid question, but I'm renowned for them!

is there any fear that if this motorway is successfully completed that Cork Airport comes under risk?

I know that Galway Airport went downhill rapidly once you could get to Shannon in 45 mins (and yes Knock too).

Galway used to serve 10 or so UK destinations, plus France, Spain and Portugal and I once flew from Cork to Galway in 20 minutes!

Not a stupid question at all. Actually, I think the road could be good for both airports, as it would allow them to function as a complementary pair, rather than two isolated services.

Right now, Shannon’s limited catchment means it struggles to get passengers, but it can do something that Cork cannot: it is capable of handling large aircraft and long-haul flights.

I’m based in Cork. If I were travelling to the USA, my current options are to fly via a Cork-London first hop, or drive to Dublin for a more direct link. Dublin has fewer US destinations, but it has the huge advantage that I can go through the monster ball-ache that is US immigration before I board the plane… but going to Dublin means a nearly three-hour drive, making it slower than London overall. (That drive is fine outbound, but not so good when you’re seriously jetlagged on return)

Shannon also offers that US pre-clearance, and with M20 in place it would be a little over an hour away by road. I and the other half a million people living in Co. Cork will suddenly be able to consider Shannon as a reasonable option.

That might make you worry about Cork’s future, but the thing is, for a short haul fight, that hour of travel to Shannon isn’t worth it, unless you’re trying to avoid a connection. So, Cork will still be able to offer its short-haul and holiday flights, but the road link works both ways, and they could pick up some Limerick customers too. In this, there’s scope for both airports to offer a more complementary set of destinations, so that your choice becomes a flight out of Cork or Shannon, and everyone in the Southwest is less likely to need to go to Dublin just to fly to a nearby European city.

Out of interest, what would the travel time be Cork to Shannon and Limerick to Cork Airport?

I misunderstood the question. But even now it's not too bad, I use Shannon a bit from Cork. The airports are both an absolute pleasure, once you arrive there's little stress left. It's the unpredictability of the journey between the two that's the problem currently. Think of even diverted flights - currently an annoyance of mine - it would now really only mean a reliable enough extra 90 min delay.

I keep harping on about it, but if either airport got the local connectivity dialled it would be a game changer.