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Harris Vs Trump 2024 US Presidential election - read the warning in the OP posted 18/09/24

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Comments

  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    So again, why does this not apply to Trump when he calls Harris a communist trying to destroy America?

    Why is it not hypocrisy when you guys ignore this stuff and then cry when people say mean things about Trump?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,047 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    There is no issue with people giving donations. It is the clear, and open, corruption with Musk that is the problem. Trump has promised him a seat in the cabinet and even went as far as to say that while before he didn't like electric cars now he has to like them because Musk is buying him.

    Harris didn't compare Trump to Hitler, that was his former CoS. Do you have any comment on the real story here? That his former CoS, a former highly accomplished General, is coming out with such details.

    Let's remember that he ran his original campaign based on locking up his political opponent. He has stated numerous times that he will go after those that he feels don't support him. He has said he will fire any civil servant who doesn't agree with him and bring in those who do.

    And that he sat idly by as his VP was being tracked down to be lynched simply because he wouldn't break the constitution and illegally install him as POTUS.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,028 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Tacking posters who are clutching pearls about a Hitler reference need to be asked first - "if trump came out tomorrow and said he wanted generals like Hitler, would you still support him".

    Because what happens time and time again is MAGA folk freak out at accusations, and then when they are proven to be true, equivocate or endorse what trump said.

    It boils down, time and time again to...

    He didn't say that and if he did, he didn't mean it. And if he did, you didn't understand it. And if he did, it's not a big deal, others have said worse.

    Elect a clown... Expect a circus



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I mean even that refrain requires that supporters actually state their opinion on things. So far it's a challenge to get them to acknowledge certain statements exist in the first place.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,565 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    She didn't call him Hitler, at worst she called him a fascist. Kelly himself said the exact same based on working with him. The toxicity is a result of Trump. It's not toxic to call a spade a spade though. We've seen how Trump behaved as a president, we've seen him egg on insurrection.

    Also you can claim she's stupid but the likes of Timothy D Schneider has said pretty much the exact same things on Trump, he's a globally respected Yale Historian and has detailed the fascistic tendencies of Trump. So when there's a wealth evidence, sometimes bluntness is needed.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,418 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    You'll blame them?

    Good for you. I can't see it having much impact on the election though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,684 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    Right, unless there is some actual, real drama beyond all the gossipy stuff, I'm done with Trump/Harris debating till we actually know what the result is after the election. This thread has got stupid with all the tit for tat sniping and nonsense arguments. The betting stuff is nonsense, the polls are too close and the arguments have got tedious. See you after the election.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭erlichbachman


    Firstly, can you explain what was meant by “like hitler” - are we saying a profound desire to wipe out the Jewish population, or a square moustache?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 737 ✭✭✭RickBlaine


    I know American political discourse has seen a slow descent into madness since 2016, and things that would have shocked the nation 10 years ago are now barely a blip in the news cycle, but the fact that f*cking Hitler is now a talking point in an American Presidential election in 2024 is absolutely insane!



  • Subscribers Posts: 42,874 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    You need at ask trump, as he's the one who said he wanted loyal generals 'like Hitler'



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,310 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    I honestly can’t see anything other than a win for Harris

    A brave call, that is more pinned on hope than anything else.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,310 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Morning polls are out, and the National Polls are now almost a dead-heat.

    Also, the mood music around Harris ain't improving.

    image.png


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,388 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    You posted an article onto this thread which at the very least called Trump someone likely to be an enabler of fascism, and being incapable of good governance.

    The article also contained commentary detailing why some political experts consider Trump a fascist.

    This has now been memory holed by you.

    Your claims have no credibility.

    Hypocrisy and hyperbole? Take a read of your own posts.

    Occam's razor, the reason why experts, Trump's former staff, senior generals, even Trump's VP pick are talking about Trump, fascism and Hitler in the same sentences is that Trump is actually a fascist with contempt for democracy and the rule of law?

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Into the hole along with calling Harris a communist out to destroy America.

    Along with saying that immigrants poison the blood of the nation and eat pets.

    Along with claiming the previous election was stolen which has lead to death threats to poll workers.

    Along with claiming that he would use the military on the "enemy within" and the "far left" (a term often used to describe his opponent.)

    Along with claiming that he would lock up his political opponents.

    Along with claiming that there is a shadowy cabal working against him and destroying the country.

    Huh. All that stuff does sound awful familiar…

    Oh and calling neo-nazis "fine people." Almost memory holed that one myself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,030 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Given that anyone who was associated with attempts on Trumps life, or planning to make an attempt on it was a Republican, you should be more concerned that if it was Biden and Harris referring to him in a particular way (rather than the Republicans who also referred to him in the same way) that that must mean that a lot of Republicans are listening to the Democrats message and paying attention to it.

    If that is the case, what do you think that might say about what Republicans are actually doing when they step in to the ballot box?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭erlichbachman


    My comprehension is fine, can you help me with interpretation?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,388 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Yes, Trump goes around chanting about locking people up, deporting them, using the military, spreading scurrilous race baiting lies about immigrants eating pets.

    And if you call Trump out on that, apparently it is the liberals and Democrats who are being divisive!

    Meanwhile, hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil policy engaged for Trump's objectively vile remarks. Divisive and toxic doesn't even begun to sum them up.

    This is the world of those defending Trump.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,015 ✭✭✭✭briany


    It's another high watermark.

    Imagine if you time-travelled back to 2012 and showed them what American politics looked like now. They'd find it hard to believe.

    But, it didn't get there overnight. It's all been due to an incremental intensification of rhetoric and gradual shifting of the Overton Window and riding the wave of a couple of different strands of disaffection.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,554 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    Feels like nothing has changed beyond what most people have been saying for weeks now: every reliable indicator is still that is an extremely close race, so doesn't feel there's any real evidence for calling it either way. Even as Trump has undeniably gained momentum in the polls over the last week or two, it hasn't been enough to move it beyond toss-up territory. And then just yesterday Nate Silver noted it was a day of pretty solid polls for Harris. It's just knife-edge stuff, unless the polls are extraordinarily wrong. At the moment the margins are so tight even a fairly decisive victory for one or other candidate in the electoral college thanks to a swing state sweep wouldn't be too off what the polls are saying - all depends how those final votes (the only metric that counts) end up. I'll remain completely unsurprised if either candidate wins in two weeks time.

    On a different note, I would say that Harris boosting and boasting about support from anti-Trump conservatives is actually a pretty risky play. The Cheneys are widely disliked figures (on both the left and right), so wheeling Liz out as a star attraction at rallies is going to turn off as many voters as it entices. Ditto all the other neo-cons coming out in favour of Harris or at least in opposition to Trump - I believe I read her campaign or at least a supportive PAC has even cited John Bolton comments in an ad? Arch-hawk John Bolton!

    Harris is one of the most right-leaning Democratic candidates of recent times on many issues, so at a certain point the Dems are just alienating what should be part of their base more and more by so explicitly courting the neo-cons.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    To me it just proves and highlights how ungenuine all of the offense and and nitpicking is.

    If they were simply ignorant of the statements made by Trump, then there'd be attempts to deny or even defend. But most are just out and out ignore and never acknowledged.

    They know full well what he said and what he meant. They know that it cuts the legs out from any offense they pretend to take about Trump being rightly called a fascist. They know they can't defend the comments without just agreeing with them.

    So, just cut them out of their reality and expect people to do the same.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Where is the original tweet for the content of this post?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I think that this is just unfortunately what it takes to win in America these days.

    Harris is still being labeled as far left and a communist. I don't think it's possible for anyone further left to be in with as much of a chance as she is.

    I don't think anyone who would be alienated by the Dems cozying up to shitheads like the Cheneys would be then likely to switch their vote all the way to Trump. More likely these folks would just not vote. And given how high turn out is already, I don't think this has been as much of a factor.

    I think it probably has tugged more undecided and rational republicans to her side than people's she's lost.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,948 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    Your not familiar with Mr Kelly are you , you can;t t write this stuff ,

    You say If i think a four star general would lie about something like this its says more about me @
    Do you remember this headline back in 2018,

    John Kelly Confirms He Was Lying All Along: The White House Is in Chaos


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,554 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    TBH Trump and co are going to label absolutely every Democrat 'far-left' - it's their bog-standard and nonsensical attack line (they just this week used it to refer to the UK Labour party under Keir Starmer LOL), and the Dems are never going to win over any voter that falls for it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    A Chief of Staff covering up the chaos at his WH is a whole other level to admitting that the President wants his generals to be like Hitler. Again if you think a 4 star general is lying about something like that, it says more about you than him. I never suggested Generals aren't professional liars, especially for operational security. But for the same reason a 4 star general would not fabricate that a POTUS asked his generals to be loyal like Hitler's generals. Their interest is in the national security after all.

    Your google-fu is desperate.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,579 ✭✭✭McFly85


    Hope is a part of it, sure - but nothing about the current polling feels reliable, and more than any other year both betting and polling indicators feel gamed.

    Personal opinion of course and could be wrong, but would not be at all surprised to see polling info be way off from the final result.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,948 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    Your like Harris finding it hard to keep up with what your saying from one post to the next .,

    "And if you think a four star general would lie about something like this it says more about you than him"

    Four star general says he lied

    I think i'll believe the man himself over you ,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,015 ✭✭✭✭briany


    'Marxist' is another one they trot out.

    I'd like to ask one of them something like, "So, exactly which criticisms or solutions, as laid out in Das Kapital, do you disagree with?"

    Their response:

    image.png


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Ok. So then we're swinging back around to him just lying about his own opinion.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,310 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Fair point!

    It is weird that many so-called liberals and progressives are cheering and hollering for Dick Cheney and John Bolton.



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