Waterford North Quays

Probably bigger than the total retail space planned for the North Quays.

Mmm.. It's retail.. You're hardly going to be in a SC looking outside at the views when shopping and the tenant paying a premium for said location too.. You know and I know, offices, hotels and apartments etc are different in this regard when it comes to location

The whole retail debate has been done to death here a number of times. The decision has been reached to concentrate on and support retail in the existing shopping area. I think it's probably the best approach.

Unless you have an expertise in retail strategy and/or urban planning then it's just an opinion/desire that retail should be big component. Those who understand the market, have a track record of creating a viable mixed use developments, and are willing to invest hundreds of millions, have reached a different conclusion.

As mentioned by Bards, there is ample space and opportunity on the south bank to provide an excellent retail offering. This requires an environment being created so that the demand that is in the region and going elsewhere, is met.

It has been decided that a huge shopping on the NQ is not the way to do that.

The additional footfall and spend from the hundreds of apartments as well as the two proposed hotels (which includes a conference centre), plus making Ferrybank very accessible, will mean that the existing city will be much more attractive for retailers.

City centres' will be much less one dimensional than just retail in future. Tourism and leisure will be a much bigger element. Waterford tourism offering has really taken off over the last 10 years or so. We used to get hundreds of thousands of mainly Americans, bussed into the old glass site on the Cork road before being bussed out again to Killarney or elsewhere. Now with the showrooms on the Mall, the Viking Triangle which includes six high quality museums, the city centre is in a much better place.

The NQ development will help to drive tourism growth especially as the New Ross greenway will link with the Waterford greenway at the new bridge.

The extra retail that flows from all of that will probably be incremental and will take time. The final results should be much better for the city in the long-run compared a soulless shopping centre on the NQ, that could be anywhere.

Yeah but they're hardly the only 'big' retailers present in the areas, most of the retailers we'd look to attract are already there. That was what was exciting about the initial north quays proposal, they were going to bring in shop chains that weren't in Ireland for the most part.

Tbf to Sports direct some of their shops are pretty good, the one in Mahon point has a lot of nice clothing brands, its not just 1 pound mugs there anymore.

It kind of goes back to my original point about debenhams, when they were in CSquare nobody had any money so they sold relatively very little, as opposed to now when people have much more disposable income and would actually be able to buy.

Will the smaller cruise liners still be able to Dock there,,would be a nice feature there.

You think that location doesn't matter when it comes to retail? This is a fundamental misunderstanding of how retail functions and is the prime reason why some retail centres are booming and others are not.

Same as anything. Location. Location. Location.

I love Waterford but it is clear from the lack of retail interest over the years that the current city centre is wholly undesirable. Expecting different results while attempting the same is just pure madness. Even with a new attractive North Quays development this will not change

I sometimes wonder if people posting on here take their heads out of the papers and actually visit attractive, desirable locations to see how well they are doing. They are thriving, bustling, vibrant and pulling in serious cash. They show what can be done with the right development in the right place. We have an opportunity here to suck all the money in from tipperary, Kilkenny and wexford to become the true capitol of the south East but the small town attitude is holding us back as usual.

Also, the retail strategy may be focusing on the existing centre but this has been nothing short of a catastrophic failure. Parts developed for a decade and nothing new or exciting happening at all, only dereliction. Either Waterford is a poison chalice or the strategy being deployed is totally wrong and only a new modern centre on the north side of the river can fix this. You might all argue with this but the lack of retail investment in the existing centre tells its own story.

Ive been saying for years why they don't built a cruise ship terminal in part of this project to bring cruise ships of size to the quays and allow a massive footfall of passengers to visit Waterford City and also have easy access to Kilkenny/wexford.it would transform tourism for all in this region.

There will bea cruise terminal on teh Cassin Wharf in this development but it will only cater for small liners as depth, tide, length issues all affect the site. There isa business in bijou top end small liners though and the Hurtigruten ships like MV Maud show the way here with approx 200 passengers. Larger ships would still have to berth at Belview. A rail car between there and the new railway station (transport hub) would be an interesting project for use on days when liners were in port.

Without wishing to upend this thread, the university issue was/is probably the most pressing one for Waterford. We traditionally have not had a tourism industry and retail IMHO was dictated by the Waterford Glass presence and its factory/workers retail demands which were at best very limited, almost uniform. Recovering from the loss of that milieu spend coupled with Covid and internet has been very difficult. The damage done to WIT by SETU has, up to now anyway, been extraordinary. The place was literally beaten into submission since FG came to power in 2011. Promises have not been kept, new investment and courses not delivered. Its name gone, its management nowhere. Read Invara on here.

A real university would have completey altered the chicken and egg in terms of national profile and perception as to the future of Waterford as a regional city and attracted investment. That is why it was/is being so strongly resisted. Maybe it still will, but its very hard to make that perception/differentiation argument when Clonmel, Wexford, Thurles,Ennis,Carlow, Athlone etc are all claiming to be "universty towns". This has been the poisonous gift of Simon Harris and his local claque of shameful appeasers to Waterford city.

It is increasingly like the days of the IDA industrial estate in every village with an "Advance Factory" standing idle. It took a generation for that to die. Maybe the widespread"university town" idea will go the same way.

Honestly I don’t mean to sound negative. Just saw the renders from the link. But there is nothing exciting from this. The hotel is a 5 storey square box. The apartment blocks are copy paste all the same. It gives very Dublin Docklands look. Nothing quirky related to our shipping history. No landmark tower. Overall disappointing from the renders. Hopefully this is only phase one and something unique will follow in the next phases!

One of the images from the article

What happened to the 14 storey hotel? Gone the way of the retail section has it?

I mentioned above that my theory for the delay in plans was them removing a lot of their previous plans in favour of extra housing. Judging from that render I was right.

Maybe they meant 1.4 storey hotel.

Story is back up with additional renders

https://waterford-news.ie/2024/04/29/game-changing-north-quays-planning-submission-in-waterford-to-be-made-within-fortnight/

https://www.wlrfm.com/news/planning-for-north-quays-development-to-be-submitted-357880