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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,751 ✭✭✭flutered


    ukraine recieved a measly 20 himars, with short range ammo



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Ignoring the short range ammo (that's another debate) but 20x Himars is plenty. Ukraine only need about 8 to cover the entire front line at once.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭zerosquared


    what a strange statement

    Care to list what exactly Israel got?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,751 ✭✭✭flutered


    last nights action over the middle east cost 1billion



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    So 10% of 1 billion…. 100mil and the Ukraine war would be over in a month?

    That's definitely within a gofundme goal!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,751 ✭✭✭flutered


    it would be kinda quite over there, the us is argueing over a measly 60b at the moment



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    But for 100 million, the war would be over in a month though? That's what you claim?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,751 ✭✭✭flutered


    yeah, if 60b would suffice then what would 100b do, we are argueing over zilch, i am off to bed



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,242 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Desperate post.

    The equipment you call out of date is still amongst the best armaments in the world and given by Presidential executive order.

    It dwarfs the bits given from Western Europe, who if Ukraine had to rely on would be fighting the Russians West of kyiv.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Do you actually think Military aid comes in the form of dollar bills?

    Can you specifically call out the equipment that was junk?

    This is what the US has actually provided Ukraine:

    https://media.defense.gov/2023/Dec/06/2003352825/-1/-1/1/202311206_UKRAINE_FACT_SHEET_PDA_52_003.PDF

    Patriots, NASAMS, AIM-9M missiles, Stingers, Himars, GLSDM, Abrams, Bradleys, Strykers, MRAPS, Javelins, TOW missiles.....

    That all junk in you eyes?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭zerosquared


    EU alone gave 50 bill euro this year (not too far off 60bn dollars at current rates) and various western countries (Norway, Japan, Korea, UK, Canada) and eu states gave more on top already

    so either backup your bizzare statement with facts or admit to talking up bullcrap

    The theatre in congress will be resolved, and even if it’s not and Russia “wins” what exactly is it that they will win? As I said before there is no universe in which sanctions are dropped



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,669 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Are you still talking about the US equipment? It wasn't "junk" (or rubbish, as some quirky American-language speakers still call it over here).

    Some of it was pretty new I think (a patriot air defence system + the missiles for it, fancier guided shells and rockets for artillery systems, Himars etc.).

    Seems like even the old(er) stuff they took from stockpiles was more than a match for the best that Russia can put out, so not "junk" by definition.

    As we lament here + discussed in recent pages, the US didn't send over enough of it when they were able to, and can't send more at present due to internal politics.

    On the sending of confiscated cars to Ukraine, vehicles (assuming good working order) are always useful, more to keeping a country going than fighting and weapons. I imagine Ukraine is quite hard on them at the moment, for many reasons.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭zerosquared




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow


    Really?

    The US pledged these F-16's. How many of them? 10? 20?

    If an F-16 was to arrive in Ukraine it probably would have had Maverick's saliva on the windshield. Oh and in order to launch an F-16 you need a specific runway. They can't just land and take off from Stansted.

    Not a one has arrived. When were those special runways constructed? NEVER?

    The Ukrainian forces hated the junk that was given to them. Abrams tanks useless, Bradleys breaking down. Leopard tanks pathetic. Blown to pieces in a month.

    Oh…HIMARS, though. Now we're winning. And all the while the orcs are so dumb. What was it? … "Thank God they are so f**king stupid"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow


    Thanks for that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,016 ✭✭✭✭Say my name




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow


    Well yes, it IS junk. How successful has any of this been?

    As I mentioned before, the Ukrainians hate using this garbage because it doesn't work properly or at least the way it ought to.

    An Abrams tank is a sitting duck. It has no heat shield so it can be seen at night from a man on the Moon. It also has a turbine engine which means it actually does gallons to the mile rather than miles to the gallon.

    So yeah…junk. Like sending a Harley-Davidson into the TT races. Hog and rider into a tree after 100 yards.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,706 ✭✭✭Virgil°


    There's honestly so much wrong with everything you post it's really hard to pick a place to start…… So I won't.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,415 ✭✭✭dinorebel


    Should probably change your name to DoyleWrongAgain.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow


    Ike it has been said before……why should we fear Russia if garbage can hold them back?

    It reminds me of that scene in the movie "A Few Good Men".

    "Colonel, if you ordered your men not to touch Santiago….and your orders are always followed…then why was it necessary to have him transferred off the base?"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow


    Well if it was so amazing then why are people crying about the GOP not giving more of it?

    Bradleys blown to atoms. Leopards just breaking down….Abrams sinking in the mud.

    Yes…junk. What next? An aircraft carrier that is as useless as an inflatable dartboard? Let's send a stealth bomber. It can only fly when it's not raining and needs a billion dollar hangar that takes years to build.

    Don't you find it questionable that when the US attacked Iraq one of their soldiers had to ask that old dick, Rumsfeld, "why do we have to scavenge in scrapyards to weld and up-armour our Humvees?"

    So if the US can't even spare a fraction of the money that they are making to give their grunts a modicum of protection in Iraq, what makes you think that they are going to give unlimited dough and state-of-the-art kit to Ukraine?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow


    If Russia is such a threat to the world then why would internal politics have anything to do with that?

    Drop the gavel and mobilize before we are all gobbled up by Putin…no? Why aren't NATO massing on the borders of Norway and the Czech Republic and carrier groups off the coast of Vladivostok for fear that our kids will be learning ballet instead of hip-hop dance moves?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 DoyleLoneganYouFollow


    And you expect to win a war when this is going on:

    " Ukraine has paid contractors hundreds of millions of dollars for weapons that have not been delivered, and some of the much-publicized arms donated by its allies have been so decrepit that they were deemed fit only to be cannibalized for spare parts.

    Ukrainian government documents show that as of the end of last year, Kyiv had paid arms suppliers more than $800 million since the Russian invasion in February 2022 for contracts that went completely or partly unfulfilled.

    Two people involved in Ukraine’s arms purchasing said that some of the missing weapons had eventually been delivered, and that in other cases brokers had refunded the money. But as of early this spring, hundreds of millions of dollars had been paid — including to state-owned companies — for arms never materialized, one of these people said.

    “We did have cases where we paid money and we didn’t receive,” Volodymyr Havrylov, a deputy defense minister working on arms procurement, said in a recent interview. He said the government this year had begun analyzing its past purchases and excluding problematic contractors."

    TIP OF THE ICEBERG



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,854 ✭✭✭zv2


    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,184 ✭✭✭Hoop66


    "Ho Chi Minh had no communist leanings before the war."

    That'd be "One of the founders of the French Communist Party (1920) & founded the Communist Party of Vietnam (1930)" Ho Chi Minh?


    Wherever you're getting your ideas from, it seems a bit light on historical fact.

    Post edited by Hoop66 on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,809 ✭✭✭threeball


    How would the mans own words suffice? He knew nothing of communism and was only drawn to the party after the Russian revolution as a means to secure Vietnams independence from colonialism. He used communism that same way as the Irish used help from outside sources and ideas to try to secure our own independence. He was primarily a nationalist who saw a movement which could help him further his ideals.

    https://challenge-magazine.org/2020/05/19/ho-chi-minh-how-i-became-a-communist/



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,351 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    Because bigger picture; the "garbage" did hold them back. What had been a Russian flying column lightning war to take Kiev and install their own government fell on its arse, not least due to clear failures on the Russian logistical side. Spun up at first as the now memory holed "feint" then and much later the whole "Boris Johnson told Kiev to keep fighting" because that sounds better. Yes indeed… Never mind the later losses of Kherson and Kharkiv within weeks of the Kremlin declaring them Forever Russia©. Never mind the also memory holed coup that wasn't from their own private military unit that rattled the Kremlin into blocking roads with buses and lashing together lightly armed checkpoints on the outskirts of Moscow.

    Two years in even with the shortages of AA and no Ukrainian air force to speak of Russia still doesn't have air superiority and if the Russian navy were any more eastwards it would be landlocked. Russia has been forced by strategic and tactical failures to resort to at distance attacks on infrastructure and WW1 trench warfare going hedgerow to hedgerow using some of the only advantages it has; more artillery, more manpower & the willingness to sacrifice that manpower. And even with those advantages in numbers against a far smaller adversary using garbage it's still extremely slow going.

    And that's just the war to gain territory. Whatever peace follows is when the going gets tougher. It always does. The US suffered the vast majority of its casualties after they won the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Russia hasn't passed the first stage yet.

    Even if they kill or drive all Ukraine sympathisers from the parts they hold or even if they take all the way to the Dnieper Russia's still fooked. They'll inherit a cratered mess that they'll have to rebuild. Rebuild with resources they can ill afford. Take sanctions. The mistake often made regarding sanctions is people expect them to have an immediate effect. That's actually not their purpose. What sanctions do is heavily curtail growth and it gets worse over time. The death of a thousand cuts. Now Russia is a major producer of energy and food, so it won't go cold or hungry any time soon and beyond the cities lifestyles have changed little enough in decades, but whatever wider economic growth that happened in Russia since 2000(which peaked circa 2009) that's not looking great at all. Turning large parts of your industrial base to war production makes this worse again.

    Note too; BRICS or more to the point, the lack of Russian spin/chatter about it now. Well, within months of this invasion the BRICS bank cut funding to Russian projects. Oops… Sure, no doubt China gives Russia some backdoor tech, but China has her own fish to fry. India is doing what they wisely did during Cold War 1; largely keeping out of it. Brazil is too far away, South Africa is a crisis away from being utterly fecked. For me the more "interesting" stuff around BRICS is actually newbie members in the Middle East. Russia's actual allies? Iran and North Korea. Whatever about the former, that Russia needed to cosy up to the latter speaks volumes, little of it good.

    They've also created an independent Ukraine in the mind of Ukrainians and the wider world that didn't exist before. Imperialist mindsets tend to do that. Not least here in Ireland. New nations are born from that kinda thing. Russia is also facing a much expanded NATO and a more belligerent Europe with it. Doh! It's not exactly a great sign when long standing neutral nations like Finland and Sweden drop that overnight and take a side against you and are confident enough to do so.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭zerosquared


    Great post

    https://web.archive.org/web/20240413203658/https%3A//www.economist.com/by-invitation/2024/04/11/russia-is-sure-to-lose-in-ukraine-reckons-a-chinese-expert-on-russia

    Shrewd observers note that China’s stance towards Russia has reverted from the “no limits” stance of early 2022, before the war, to the traditional principles of “non-alignment, non-confrontation and non-targeting of third parties”.



This discussion has been closed.
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