Home charge points (purchase/problems/questions) (See mod note post#1)

Thanks for the response but I don't have solar. You may have confused me with another poster.....good info though!

I'm not seeing an actual reason here. We're talking about the power of an average fan heater or kettle, except without the other issues associated with heating elements whether or not combined with water.

Along with the fact that manufacturer provided granny chargers are well built, expensive items with thermal monitoring of the plug.

But again, I'm not seeing what the potential issue is. Yes it will run at a sustained level for longer than a heater or kettle, but annually will probably be about the same (assuming your use case means you're only using it once every few days like the poster who said they'd do on average 120km a week).

If it's connected to a properly protected outdoor socket (you can get these with an RCD built in) connected to a low use circuit like a bedroom or hall that's unlikely to reach even half its rated capacity, I can't see a problem other than the unit eventually giving up the ghost.

I'm not by any means suggesting that they are the be all and end all. But if your use case means a dedicated home charger (to continue the analogy) is the equivalent of buying a burco boiler to make your tea because once in a blue moon you'll need to make tea for 50 people and the rest of the time you're barely covering the bottom with water, then you're probably better off with a normal kettle and worry about the 50 people when it's actually a concrete prospect.

If you don't need to add to your costs to the tune of €1,000 plus, then I would advise you not to until it's absolutely necessary.

You might not see an issue, but there are plenty of examples of granny chargers literally melting or going on fire when charging a vehicle. We can't necessarily blame the granny charger alone, but that's what was drawing the power and where the commonality exists. If the external socket degrades (they do, trust me) from regular use/abise, then the potential for fire is heightened due to higher resistance.

The potential issues are:

#The outdoor socket is connected to an existing circuit which could be overloaded, because it might be easier running the circuit from the kitchen than the hallway.

#The sensor in the granny charger malfunctions or stops working, but the granny still operates because not all heat sensors cause the charger to stop functioning, causing melting and fire.

I picked up a Leaf yesterday. Came with a non OEM charger the previous owner used exclusively to charge the car. My electrics were only tested and upgraded CU in the past fortnight, so all is good there. The granny caused my charger to trip 3 times before I unplugged it and stopped using it. I got lucky there (sort of) but there are plenty of examples of granny chargers causing electrical faults, melting, or burning the whole unit. I can't find many examples of burnt dedicated chargers with few exceptions of the first EV dumb chargers and where improper installs occurred. I picked up the missing type 2 public charger today from Lidl. Needles to say I will be getting an OEM granny charger for the very rare times it will be used.

The reason is that sockets wear over time and that wear means the contact between the plug and socket isnt as good as it was when new. Reduced contact means more heat. Yes, there's a temp sensor in the granny cable but if the heat is dissipating the other direction it can have serious consequences. Plenty pics online of sockets melting.

Also, a socket tends not to be on a dedicated circuit and so if its drawing the max and then you have something else on the circuit that starts up it could also cause a fire hazard depending on quality of the wiring.

You can negate that by ensuring its a good quality socket and regularly checking for heat yourself and successfully use a granny charger for years without issue but as a general rule its just safer to use a proper charge point and let the granny cable for emergency use. It is also what the car manufacturers even say in their literature about granny cables.

Oh thank God for that 🥵

I don't even have a granny charger, thank ****… actually I don't have a 3 pin outdoor socket either, win win.

The separate isolator is required.

As far as I know, 4mm cable is fine, but in your case, at least 6mm would be advisable for the 20M run. If they can run 10mm cable, all the better. The cost shouldn't be much more. The electrician will be the one with the knowledge. The 10mm cable will have a lower resistance and will save on electricity compared to a 6mm cable over that distance, hopefully paying for itself over time as well as being safer.

The difference in resistance on an AC circuit would be absolutely tiny if even measurable, it certainly wouldn't save any money. 10mm cable is quite difficult to work with compared to 6mm the electrician might not be that happy.

And hate you for it at the same time 🤣

Are you allowed to tap into the cable? I didn't think you were. I was thinking of getting an outdoor socket in addition to the CP, wiring it from the isolator would be the easiest place to connect it.

I'm not sure if this is the right place so Mods feel free to move but I got the Circontol eHome charger installed 4 years ago and it has stopped working (red light flashing). I rang Electric Ireland (whoi I arranged the original purchase / install with) and the company they used for the installs (Smartzone) went into administration. I am struggling to find someone to come out and have a look at the charger and potentially advise on a repair and I don't want to have to replace. Has anyone got any contacts etc. that I could reach out to? I am in Meath.

When the house tails need to be upgraded to 16sq in order to install a charge point, is that a job any reci electrician can do or is an ESBN job? If ESBN Is there a fixed price for the upgrade?

Getting a Zappi v2 installed soon.

CU is the other side of our bungalow to where I want the charger mounted on the Garage wall. 25m max from point to point (including slack) through the attics of house and unfinished garage. Will run 2 x Cat6 from charger to my comms cabinet. Zappi already wired with ethernet to cabinet and Eddi connects to Harvi wirelessly in ESB enclosure. Eddie in middle of house in hotpress.

These questions have probably been asked and answered multiple times, so apologies.

Q1 - As the run is over 20m, should it be best to run 10sqm Twin and earth? No need for SWA I would think as its all internal wiring. I want cable to go through the wall to rear grommet of charger so no cable is exposed etc. Charging will be done between 2am - 5am and probably overrun into 6am sometimes which is fine. EV BG Smart Plan.

Q2 - 32A RCBO at CU ? What should my Electrician use?

Q3 - Does the zappi need an AC cutoff switch mounted right beside the charger (New regs I hear)? If so, I would prefer it to be placed inside the garage <2m away through sliding door access. The cable will come down from the garage rafters down the wall anyway before going through the wall to the charger. Plan is to renovate garage in near future to home office. I'm conscious of insulation and heat of cable etc.

Have I missed anything?

Thanks in advance.

1. Best to run 10mm. Internal, so T&E is fine.
2. 32A Yes
3. CP needs isolator. I don't know if it would be OK to have this inside the garage if the CP is outside. If the Isolator is outside, you should not have any exposed cable externally unless it's armoured cable at a minimum. I have seen some nice installs where the isolator is a black/grey colour and is butted up to the CP, so no cables visible.

so the reci will run the new cables to the meter and the consumer unit, but ESBN will connect the new tails into their meter? And then the reci swaps the cables at the consumer unit? So they’d need to be coordinated and be there together?