Dublin Metrolink - future routes for next Metrolink

But they aren’t in a dense urban setting, the talk here is to use them to make a dense urban setting.

That’s different to the putting green. It seems to get very little use very short and Astro greens. Think it’s a push to put it in with proper courses just to make the list look longer

Nope.

What is a push is ignoring that the Grange and Castle don’t just have 18 course golf clubs. The Grange has 24 and the Castle 6 extra Par 3 length holes. And that just off the M50 you have Stackstown, Rathfarnham etc.

It is also a push to claim that manufactured parkland courses are good for wildlife.

Both Foxrock and Kllliney both manage perfectly well with 9 hole clubs.

I play in Woodbrook where we have a leasehold agreement the envy of many and managed to swindle extra holes out of the recent land swaps. That’s more golf holes right beside a brand new DART station.

I’d say there’s very few countries that allow the number of golf courses we have so close to the city.

In terms of the south west, if one of them has to be “sacrificed” to help build a Metrolink and create a new urban area then it’s a cost the city can very much bear. Dún Laoghaire moved courses and we got good dense housing in its place.

Golf definitely serves an important purpose in Ireland Inc’s IP.

The number of courses (and the size of them) are clearly out of whack with reality. I concentrate on the South West because that’s an area that desperately needs to density and get some hooks of light or heavy rail is to be a thing.

Tbh the worse thing here is if you have somewhere like the Castle selling off a bit of their lands for housing.

These are huge sites with strategic value for the State.

I suppose killininy road, ballyboden way direction isn’t densified enough for you to justify a luas or metro out that direction?

The issue isn't just the density in an area, but also the density along the entire route.

I live quite near Ballyboden Way, so a Luas or Metro would be ideal for me. I remember a leaflet coming around from Francis Noel Duffy a few years ago, with "plans" for a Metro which would have a stop under the roundabout at Scholarstown Road/Templeroan Road/Ballyboden Way. That would be absolutely ideal for me, less than a 10 minute walk to a Metro station...but it's completely impractical.

What route would a Metro from that roundabout take?

It could either go up through Knocklyon and Firhouse to get to Tallaght, and then run from Tallaght into town (so that way it would link up some relatively dense residential areas), or it could go more directly via Rathfarnham, Terenure, Harold's Cross.

If you go on a big swing to Tallaght, it would make the journey slower (by virtue of the distance). How long would that journey take? It probably wouldn't be dissimilar to existing bus services, which could surely be improved with far cheaper changes. If you go more directly, you're talking about primarily servicing low density residential areas. How many dense apartment schemes are there in the vicinity of Rathfarnham Village or Terenure Village to warrant spending billions of Euro building a Metro line?

While we have individual pockets of relatively dense residential development in Dublin SW, there isn't a line or path of sufficiently dense development. While the area around Ballyboden Way might warrant a Luas/Metro (particularly if the developments at Augustine's and Stocking Lane (planning overturned) were to go ahead), there isn't a path from the city centre to that area which makes any economic sense.

No absolutely I agree- it’s just I honestly can’t see bus connects addressing the issue and there’s just no space for a LUAS on large parts of the route I’ve highlighted.

Indeed they are, but mostly at weekends when numbers are down, and certainly not for months on end.

Again, this is rather more complicated than the TfL style operation. You are talking months here with an already congested road alternative.

It would be one hell of an operation.

Again, there haven't been LU closures for months on end - a week or two perhaps generally during school holidays. Most of London have alternative rail lines that the buses operate to/from - we don't have that luxury in this case.

I still think you're being very ambitious.

I don't see the original closure plan being modified significantly - the same work would have to happen from south of Beechwood, assuming that's where the portal would be, and that will require a complete line closure for 9 months between Sandyford and the tunnel portal. That's not straightforward no matter how anyone tries to paint it, in an area where congestion is as dreadful as it is.

I'm not saying that it cannot be done, but let's not kid ourselves. The disruption would be massive.

It's not on the same scale to be honest as would be required in this situation.