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Spain - Women World Cup Champions - 1 week later. (How not to manage a crises)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,266 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    It can well constitute sexual assault if the person doing it is your boss and it's happening in your workplace (which is pretty much what happened here). Laws around sexual harassment and sexual assault are designed to try and prevent such things from occurring.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭DownByTheGarden


    Not really. I think that its the usual thing now of everyone being afraid to speak out against the mob. But being required to actually take a side as people are nowadays, the easier option is to jump on the sexual assault bandwagon than to argue against it. They cant even say they have no opinion.

    The man here is putting it up to everyone piling on, because they are all afraid of the mob too. Easier to be on the mobs side than take your chances against them. "Take me to court. Charge me with sexual assault. Lets see what an unbiased and uninfluenced court will say about it. Are you going to put me away for a few years for kissing a team member in celebration after winning the world cup." That where he is at now.

    To me this is the samne thing as someone who has a an accident and there is no harm done and its all sorted out amicably because there was no harm done and all is good. Then one person goes home, has their ear bent by a few people around them and suddenly they are back saying they have whiplash.

    Post edited by DownByTheGarden on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,811 ✭✭✭Sudden Valley


    Ha i see you left out my point of forcing the employee to back up the statement when they dont want to. That is the sackable offence for me. Not just inappropriate behaviou., So no Peps behaviour is unprofessional behaviour but it hasnt been compounded by bullying the employee to support him. Also a kiss is very different to berating someone.

    But if there was a way to prove Hermoso's account of not giving consent would you then support the sacking of Rubiales. Or would you need more?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,816 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    I didn't forget that. I already highlighted it on this thread.

    And even though you think it's moot, I'd still like to know - what do you think should happen to him?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Ha i see you left out my point of forcing the employee to back up the statement when they dont want to. That is the sackable offence for me

    We have no idea if that actually happened. Her and her brother came out and supported him afterwards apparently.

    IF it turns out everything he said was true he will be so long gone it won't matter, there will be no interest in it anyway.

    Anyway sacking is the least of his worries, the mob want him in jail.

    1 to 5 years, maybe 4 make an example of him.

    Lock him up!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,811 ✭✭✭Sudden Valley


    Seriously I have tried to answer every question you have posed to me.

    But you can't say if it turned out she didn't give consent, and then he forced the manager to put pressure on her to back him up and then threatened to sue her, you can't even say in that extremely hypothetical scenario he should be sacked?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,026 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    I asked the question last night, but no one has answered it.

    For any of the people saying Rubiales is being unfairly treated, if you're daughter or write or girlfriend was kissed by their coach in the manner in which Hermoso was, and she said that it was non-consensual. How would you react?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Is she alleging Vilda forced her to back him up?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    His mother has locked herself in a church and he is facing the real prospect of prison.

    What do I think should happen?

    Fúcked if I know.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,026 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    People can and have been fired for unacceptable behavior at Christmas parties. Link

    One of the partners of a leading Cork law firm has told local radio show C103 Cork Today that he knows of 20 cases where people were suspended for bad behaviour at Christmas work parties, and that three of those people were later dismissed.

    John Boylan of BDM Solicitors referenced a rise in the abuse of managers, physical fighting, drug use and 'sexual behaviour' as factors into the large number of suspensions, and stressed that when it comes to office Christmas parties "your behaviour is supposed to be the same as if you were in the office".

    But there is, and always have been looser standards for what happens on sports fields given the competitive element, adrenalin and probably because of what has been seen as being acceptable in that environment.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    It's not my comparison.

    You will have to take it up with the person who made it.

    But there is, and always have been looser standards for what happens on sports fields given the competitive element, adrenalin and probably because of what has been seen as being acceptable in that environment.

    It's nothing to do with standards.

    It's apples and oranges.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,811 ✭✭✭Sudden Valley


    She alleged she was put under pressure to make the statement. I thought this was by Vilda but I can find where I thought I read that, so I retract that. Now can you answer my question, as I continue to answer yours?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Ah so your issue is you struggle to differentiate between talking and kissing.

    Must lead to many weird situations.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,978 ✭✭✭growleaves


    August is what journalists refer to as 'the silly season' because parliaments are either on holiday or just back, so there typically are not enough serious news stories to fill the headlines.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    More dishonest low grade posting. It adds nothing.

    You are not getting the thanks you crave because even in a polarised debate people are not falling for your nonsense.

    Please stop.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    To be fair that was a fairly hefty claim on your behalf. Completely false though.

    Again it is probably worth knowing the actual facts before you try and get me to answer your questions.

    Her allegation is she didn't make the statement, she trusted those who did so let them at it, according to her a week later. To be fair she hasn't really been consistent in this either.

    A female Spanish sports journalist claimed her and her brother were fine with it and the whole thing was blown out of proportion, the mob turned on her and she soon recanted.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,811 ✭✭✭Sudden Valley


    So you cant even answer a hypothetical question. I dont think there is any scenario that you would believe Hermoso.


    This article has a different story if we are quoted unsourced stories.





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    I'm paraphrasing her.

    She basically said she never gives direct statements to AP after games she trusts the press officer at RFEF to do it on her behalf. So the narrative she was forced to sign a statement is false.

    The Spanish Sports Journalist formed her opinion that it was overblown because she believed Hermoso and her brother agreed.


    Untitled Image

    Ironically when the mob found out that wasn't her actual partner but her brother the outrage was swift.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Nah just pointing out your daft irrelevant takes as you try to excuse unwanted sexual advances.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,266 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    Main reason this has escalated is because Rubiales has acted so boorishly and arrogantly. If he'd issued a sincere apology to Hermoso and admitted he had made a serious error of judgement and deeply regretted spoiling her victory day, the affair would have been forgotten within 48 hours. Instead, he started going off in another direction and eventually even blaming Hermoso.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,811 ✭✭✭Sudden Valley


    So Hermoso is the victim of the mob now? So not of Rubiales who is threatening to sue her?

    She seems to have clarified her position now, you just dont want to believe her because it is inconvenient.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 877 ✭✭✭moonage


    If I was Hermoso's boyfriend, brother or father I think I'd be ok with that kiss under those circumstances. I'd probably think it was a little over the top but perfectly understandable given the excitement over the achievement.

    Regarding consensuality in such a spontaneous situation, what was he meant to do? Ask her if it's ok if he kisses her on the lips, wait for an answer and then act accordingly?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,811 ✭✭✭Sudden Valley


    Funnily enough Rubiale's defence is that he did ask for consent. So I think in the cold light of day I think he realised he should have.

    At the end of the day you have to decide if Rubiales or Hermoso is telling the truth.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    So Hermoso is the victim of the mob now?

    The photo is from before all this.

    The mob concluded there is no way a kiss on the lips can be anything other than sexual and she should stop kissing her brother immediately because it is very creepy. -sic

    An opinion she now seems to agree with ironically.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,266 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    For my money, his general behaviour was well off that day. He should have been completely anonymous during the presentation but instead effectively hijacked it and put himself front and centre - a bit of the John Delaney about him (perhaps a far more exaggerated version in fact).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    He did apologise the next day. Why are people ignoring that fact.

     "I was completely wrong, I have to admit it."

    2 government ministers then accused him of sexual assault, a few days later he is being investigated criminally for sexual assault.

    So the idea that if he just apologised it would have all been forgotten about is completely false.

    Again this is very little to with a kiss.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,933 Mod ✭✭✭✭Turner


    I watched the match live on the night. And before he kissed hermosa I had commented on how he had practically mauled each player with hugs and kisses to their necks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,410 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Or like Prince William - The FA president?

    image.png Untitled Image image.png


    That was the Euros in London, poor chap couldn't make it to Oz.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,548 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    That's pretty tame in contrast to what we're actually discussing...



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,266 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    Yes, he was acting boorishly and was OTT in his celebrations. It was their moment, but he was making it all about him (and this was even without the unwanted Hermoso kiss).



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