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You've been looking in the wrong direction, the dangers are coming from the Left - read OP

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,401 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    Wow. You came back with the same clip that you admitted wasn't actually from a kids show?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Ok but you never show any tolerance at all of people you disagree with; you're very intolerant of "the left", "the far left", so called trans rights activists and even Marcus Rashford.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I'm tolerant of the left.

    The left have a reputable and historic tradition, standing up for gay rights, women's rights, and worker's rights (and being gay myself, why wouldn't I back that?)

    But the far-left of today are an altogether different creature: largely well-to-do, middle class types who hate those workers (calling them racist), dislike many of those women (calling them TERFs), and undermine gay rights (by arguing for same-gender, rather than same-sex attracted etc.).

    Everything the left stood for, historically, was right up my street.

    What has happened in recent years is a total reversal, with the far left activists undermining absolutely everything the old left stood for.

    Don't mind me, but even Noam Chomsky and Barack Obama criticize them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Exactly. You claim tolerance must be extended to those with whom we disagree but refuse to extend it to people you disagree with.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I'm consistent with the old left.

    I agree with them on gay rights, women's rights, and worker's rights.

    And yes, I'm not tolerant of those who today wish to undermine gay rights, women's rights, and those who seek to denigrate those workers who the old left previously defended.

    They can speak "their truth", but I do not have to accept it.

    If anything, undermining gay rights, women's rights, and those workers I speak of, puts the far-left more in alignment with the far-right than anything else.

    Both extremes want their version of reality imposed on the middle ground, on everyone else.

    Well, we want neither.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    "I tolerate the people I agree with"

    That's not tolerance.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Folks, here's what I actually said:

    And yes, I'm not tolerant of those who today wish to undermine gay rights, women's rights, and those who seek to denigrate those workers who the old left previously defended.

    They can speak "their truth", but I do not have to accept it.

    And I don't accept it. I won't accept it.

    They can speak their right to undermine those rights, to be intolerant.

    And I will tolerate their right to speak their truth, but I will not tolerate their demand that I submit to their view of the world.

    That's when things cross the line, when the far-left seeks to impose their view on the world on everyone else.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Yeah we know what you said.

    Just pointing out the inconsistencies of what you are saying.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    If you don't tolerate those who wish to undermine gay rights, women's rights, and worker's rights, then we're in complete alignment.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Indeed. Thats exactly what you often do. Seek to impose your world view onto everyone else.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Exactly. You are intolerant of people you disagree with while pretending your world view is tolerance of those you disagree with. Inconsistent and hypocrytical.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I have no political power, nor am I a member of any activist group.

    I merely ventilate my opinions on a random online forum. I don't seek to impact legislation.

    But far-left activists are organized primarily to impact legislation, that's the difference.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,401 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    In Ireland?

    Who do you class as the far-left? (I'm sure I asked you already)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Kinda hilarious too that your intolerance of everyone you disagree with gets them all shoehorned and branded into 1 label.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I answered this question a short time ago.

    The old left were a reputable left - the left that argued, defended, and ultimately helped achieve women's rights, gay rights, and worker's rights - going right back to the start of the last century.

    The far-left are those who today seek to undermine absolutely everything the old left achieved - suppression of free speech; cancel culture; calling women TERFs; saying gay people are transphobic for not subscribing to the view of being same-gender attracted rather than same-sex attracted; Woke culture that seeks to reignite divisions between white people and black people. I could go on and on and on.

    In other words, those who are far-left relish in causing as much division in society as possible whilst at the same time claiming to be the nicest and most moral in society.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,401 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    Well, no. You say the far-left activists are organized primarily to impact legislation. Who? There must be some organisations or people? Can you name them?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Before I name names, do you accept the parameters of my analysis - i.e. the traditions of the old left versus the far left of today.

    Because if you don't accept that, we're talking on shifting sands.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 728 ✭✭✭Hungry Burger


    Coming from yourself of all people, that is pretty rich.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Seems the Starbucks transgender employee was sacked for what happened - i.e. confronting a female customer aggressively, and then launching an assault on a man who was filming the footage.




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,401 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien


    I did you a disservice. I didn't actually acknowledge your post.

    Let's break it down. (and forgive me, I'm going to revert back to the US for examples, as I do feel most of this hoo-ha about the "far left" is coming from their shores) People you don't like:

    Suppression of free speech: Like the book banning in Florida's school. I assume you don't like that the authors have been silenced.

    Cancel-culture: Ha! Yeah, remember the time those crazy far-left types shot up their cans of bud-light and swore never to drink it because a trans lady drank one?

    Calling women TERFs:

    Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminist. Honestly, they should just own the label. Which word in particular do they have an issue with?

    Saying gay people are transphobic etc:

    I'm not gay, and I'm not completely educated on the history, but LGB&T has gone back for a long time together. That doesn't make it right or wrong that they're still connected, but I think you should at least recognise what the Trans community have brought to the table. For example, there'd be no Gay Pride without Trans people. (I'm thinking of the Stonewall Riots which led to Pride) Many trans people fought the same fight.

    Woke culture that seeks to reignite etc:

    Careful, your privilege is showing 😂 You use the word "reignite". That's the thing, the flame was never put out! There's nothing to "re"ignite. Black people still fare worse than white people. Reparations absolutely should be paid to the descendants of those who were enslaved. There are far too many black men and women in prison and not educated.


    I'll probably be blamed for misinterpreting you or something.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    No, you didn't misinterpret me at all.

    But you proven my point that the far-left today are only interested in causing as much division in society as they can possibly get away with, at exactly the same time claiming to be societies' greatest victims.

    The old left are turning in their graves' at how the far-left of today are mutilating their once lauded reputation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    How did 1 post by 1 person prove such a broad sweeping claim?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,336 ✭✭✭✭martingriff


    Wait you think only the far left are the only one trying to enact legislation. What did you call the sides trying to enact legislation on gay marriage, abortion or divorce



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,945 ✭✭✭✭Snake Plisken



    If that was you or I we would have been arrested and charged with assault.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    Deleted

    Post edited by Princess Consuela Bananahammock on

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    As far as the 'old left' went, some weren't so great, either. Rioting away and violence to end the Vietnam war (in addition to a massive amount of peaceful protest.)

    As for legislation, Texas routinely passing easing of gun regulations after mass shootings comes to mind. Florida's 'middle of the night' abortion bans. And on, and on.


    image.png




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,925 ✭✭✭ArthurDayne


    To be honest, from the way you're going on here, it sounds more to me like you were all for the "old Left" back when the lefties were flying the flag for the minority or "othered" group that you were part of — that being gay people.

    What I find interesting is that you don't seem to be willing to acknowledge the parallels. The fearmongering back then that gay people were dangerous both to the moral fabric and physical wellbeing (i.e. HIV) of society, not to to mention the view back then which still persists in many quarters today that they are more pre-disposed to sexualising children — do you not recognise the echoes of that moral panic with what we see today towards trans people (bearing in mind that trans people are an even smaller and more vulnerable minority)?

    You say you like the "Old Left" but you're displaying the attitudes of generalisation, moral panic and fearmongering that characterised the Old Right (during the time of the assertion of gay rights) . If anything, if you liked the Old Left (to use your terminology) you should be celebrating the fact that they paved the way to give the most vulnerable minorities the confidence and sense of self-worth to actually assert themselves as human beings due equal respect — rather than cowering in the shadows of society and suppressing themselves as they have done for many years.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I cannot support an ideology that undermines gay rights, women's rights, and tars the working class as racists.

    And no, I don't accept your equivalence on gay people because LGB are sexualities and sexual rights were what the old left rightly fought for.

    Identity rights is what's being argued today and that directly undermines gay rights and women's rights (take a look at how the far left want to literally destroy women's sport without a care in the world).

    Take a look at how lesbians are being banned from dating apps if they dare to say to someone on the app that they are not interested in dating a biological male who may be trying to chat them up.

    The list is endless.

    Far left identity politics has done more damage to gay rights and women's rights than any far right group could hope to achieve.



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