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Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

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    #8192
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,386 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120292305#Comment_120292305

    Or maybe it's substances other than alcohol providing more bang per buck...

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #8193
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,719 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120296663#Comment_120296663

    That’s still a very long way off from saying that they are prohibitionists.



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    #8194
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,814 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120297076#Comment_120297076

    Being against alcohol consumption is just another way of saying your for prohibition. Do you think if given the choice AAI would choose a hypothetical law that legally reduced alcohol purchases to say half the current consumption rate or no alcohol purchasable at all?



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    #8195
    BlueSkyDreams
    Registered Users Posts: 3,340 ✭✭✭BlueSkyDreams


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120295174#Comment_120295174

    But its still only 1.70 a can.

    its still cheap. In the pub it would be maybe 6 or 7 euro?

    Dont get me wrong, it is a large % increase, but MUP doesnt really impact anyone that goes out for a beer once in a while. Which judging by how busy the pubs are in Dublin is a LOT of people.

    Unless MUP got within say 40 or 50% of a pint for the same volume, I dont see any significant opposition to it emerging.



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    #8196
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,648 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120298216#Comment_120298216

    Only one of the most expensive countries in Europe to buy a can of beer.

    Being a minimum price it's intention is to set a false floor to the market ie. make cheaper drink more expensive.

    Publicans supported it because they don't want us being able to buy cheaper drink.

    I don't anticipate any significant opposition either.



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    #8197
    BlueSkyDreams
    Registered Users Posts: 3,340 ✭✭✭BlueSkyDreams


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120298840#Comment_120298840

    Yep. Unless the MUP floor rises significantly.



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    #8198
    dxhound2005
    Registered Users Posts: 20,832 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120298892#Comment_120298892

    The earliest date it can be increased is 3 years after the start of legislation. Plenty of time for people to get on to their politicians to stop that happening. But any increase will have to be based on research. Another thing which could happen to annoy the can drinkers, is a deposit fee. Scotland is going to implement a 20 pence per can deposit later this year. That would be a good thing, if it stops so many cans being dumped around the country.

    11. (1) The minimum price per gram of alcohol for the purposes of this Act shall be €0.10.

    (2) The minimum price of an alcohol product shall be calculated using the following formula:

    A x B = C

    where—

    A is the minimum price per gram of alcohol,

    B is the quantity in grams of alcohol contained in the alcohol product, and

    C is the minimum price of the alcohol product expressed in euro and cent.

    (3) Subject to subsection (4), the Minister may, from time to time, by order increase the minimum price per gram of alcohol for the purposes of this Act.

    (4) The Minister shall not make an order under subsection (3) earlier than—

    (a) in the case of the first such order, 3 years after the commencement of this section, or

    (b) in the case of a second or subsequent such order, 18 months after the previous order made under subsection (3).

    (5) When making an order under subsection (3), the Minister shall take into account any expert research available to him or her on the effectiveness of the introduction of the minimum price per gram of alcohol for the purposes of this Act, and shall have regard to—

    (a) the rate of alcohol consumption,

    (b) patterns of alcohol consumption,

    (c) health-related risks caused by alcohol consumption,

    (d) data from health services relating to alcohol related presentations at health facilities,

    (e) other societal harm caused by alcohol consumption,

    (f) the price and affordability of alcohol products, and

    (g) such other matters he or she considers appropriate.



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    #8199
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,386 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    PITA if you already recycle at home though

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #8200
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,719 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120298114#Comment_120298114

    I’d like to see lower levels of alcohol consumption in Ireland. I wouldn’t like to see alcohol prohibited in Ireland. It’s not the same thing.

    At a guess, I’d say that AAI know the problems with prohibition driving consumption underground.

    The bigger question though, is why we attribute views based on guesses, rather than on what people have actually said.



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    #8201
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,814 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299218#Comment_120299218

    You say AAI know that prohibition drives consumption underground yet theres plenty of evidence that MUP would and has done the same, cross border alcohol sales have increased which drives statistical consumption downwards and black market spirits are on the rise which again does the same. The dogs in the street knew this would happen but AAI only care about the stats and "winning" to justify their ridiculous NGO funding instead of the health and well being of those actually affected by alcohol addiction and their families.



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    #8202
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,719 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299276#Comment_120299276

    None of which suggests that they are actually prohibitionists.

    Look, you don't like them. I get it.

    But you don't have to make up reasons for not liking them.



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    #8203
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 28,596 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299284#Comment_120299284

    None of which suggests they are not.

    It is an entirely reasonable and valid suspicion of such an organisation based on what they have said. It is reasonable to draw conclusions in politics etc based on what is not said.

    Nothing you have said on the thread refutes that as a general point or its specific application here.

    The best you could up with was nonsense about Putin and AAI whose irrelevence only served to prove the point.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #8204
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,719 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299310#Comment_120299310

    If you want to base your political analysis on speculation and guesses, work away. It's not conducive to sensible discussion though.



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    #8205
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 28,596 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299563#Comment_120299563

    As noted above... It is an entirely reasonable and valid suspicion of such an organisation based on what they have said.

    So of course it can be conducive to 'sensible discussion'. You havent even tried to justify such a pronouncenent or what is 'insensible' about raising it as a concern as to the ultimate end goal of a declared anti alcohol organisation.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #8206
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,719 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299604#Comment_120299604

    It’s an assumption you’ve jumped to because you don’t like AAI. It has no basis, outside of your imagination.



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    #8207
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 28,596 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299626#Comment_120299626

    Nope. No hop skip or jump involved.

    I have explained above why it is an entirely reasonable concern to raise as to the agenda of a declared anti alcohol organisation.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #8208
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,719 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299643#Comment_120299643

    You didn’t “raise a concern” though.

    You put words into their mouth.



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    #8209
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 28,596 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299716#Comment_120299716

    Have I? Or just words they want to speak but wont slash darent as they dont think the time is right yet?

    You dont know what their ultimate agenda is - by your own admission. I have explained my reasoning as to why I think it plausible their anti alcohol agenda could involve prohobition.

    So by your own admission you dont know if I am wrong or putting words in their mouth that incorrectly reflect their views.

    I may be wrong but as explained above it is a reasonsble, defensible and plausible position to take based on what they have declared so far of their anti alcohol agenda.

    Post edited by odyssey06 on

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #8210
    Thelonious Monk
    Registered Users Posts: 13,929 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    Why can I buy a can of 6% Zubr at 4am here in London for a pound but in Dublin I'm treated with kid gloves?



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    #8211
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,648 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120301323#Comment_120301323

    Because our government hasn't got the message that it's not when you buy drink or how much you pay that does the damage.

    It's how you drink it.



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    #8212
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,834 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299284#Comment_120299284

    Your one of those people who think Ireland have the most consumption in Europe and drink is increasing despite all of the stats showing the complete opposite.

    People let their personal issues blur the truth. AAI are a fine example of that.



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    #8213
    dxhound2005
    Registered Users Posts: 20,832 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120303144#Comment_120303144

    What do you mean by "does the damage"?



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    #8214
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,648 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299170#Comment_120299170

    Yes, it's definitely not the home drinkers cans that are causing litter problems around the country, just another little inconvenience we will have to put up with.



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    #8215
    dxhound2005
    Registered Users Posts: 20,832 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    Except the home drinkers who put dozens of empties into plastic bags and dump them in the hedges near me.



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    #8216
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,648 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120303467#Comment_120303467

    Blackguards who are too mean to pay for bins or too stupid to find their way to a bottle bank.



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    #8217
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,719 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120299782#Comment_120299782

    Grand so, work away with mixing facts and supposition in your future posts, with no distinction between the two. It can only detract from the merit of your posts, but obviously that doesn't matter much to you.



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    #8218
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,648 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120303398#Comment_120303398

    Buying a can for £1 at 4am doesn't do any damage if you just drink it and mind your own business.



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    #8219
    MEGA BRO WOLF 5000
    Registered Users Posts: 17,438 ✭✭✭✭MEGA BRO WOLF 5000


    Goddamn had to pay my bar tab tonight. I owed 8 pints to my publican, not that I've a problem, he doesn't take card, all cash so half the time I'm here it's on a tab due to convince.

    Pre "pandemic" it would have been 4.10 x 8 = 32.80.

    Now it's 5.20 x 8 = 41.60.

    "Pandemic" aside and the global shortage nonsense etc.

    I was watching a pathè film on YouTube today where a pint went up by 4c and the uproar that caused in a budget. We've literally witnessed the pint jumping by almost 1/3 in two years and everyone seems absolutely fine with that.

    Purely fuelled by the dipshits that are the VFI, we're getting absolutely roasted at the pub and the offie. And all is ok.



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    #8220
    fritzelly
    Registered Users Posts: 17,369 ✭✭✭✭fritzelly


    I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.
    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120303921#Comment_120303921


    We have to save the rural pub trade tho - FG manifesto



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    #8221
    dxhound2005
    Registered Users Posts: 20,832 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    They were selling at well below the average price before the pandemic. Figures from the CSO.

    "the average Guinness cost €4.65 and a pint of beer would cost €5.04 prior to the pandemic in May 2019"



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