Speeding Q&A superthread

Hi Folks,

I recently got caught by a GoSafe van doing 109kph in a 100kph zone. This was on a 3 lane dual carriageway and I was pretty much just keeping up with the general flow of traffic. I couldn't see it as I was obscured by a truck in the middle lane as I was overtaking him. 3 points and €160....Ka-ching.

My question is, should I leave this go to court given that the speed was less than 10% over the limit and there should be some margin of error taken into account? The risk is that if they do prosecute, I get 5 points and the fine doubles to €360...Ka-ching x 2. It is indeed a thriving business.

Some experience and opinions on this would be most appreciated. I base my question/defence on the below cases earlier this year (published in the Limerick Leader);

Several prosecutions for speeding offences were struck out or dismissed after Judge Colm Roberts expressed

concern that the alleged speeds were “within the margin of error” all of which related to the privately-operated fleet

of GoSafe vans.

 One case involved the offending vehicle detected travelling at 110km/h in a 100km/h on the N18 dual

carriageway, just outside Limerick city.

 Another case, related to an alleged offence at Rosmadda West, Parteen was also struck out with the judge

commenting it was a “little bit too close for my liking” In that case, the operator of a GoSafe van had given

evidence that a vehicle was detected travelling at 70km/h in a 60km/h zone.

 Another case which was also stuck out related to a detection which was made on the R527 (Ballysimon

Road). After hearing evidence that a vehicle was clocked travelling at 59km/h in a 50km/h zone, Judge

Roberts said: “I can’t accept that, it’s too close to the margin of error.”

 In another incident, a Go-Safe operator told the court that a female driver was detected driving at 109kph in

a 100kph zone at Coolrahnee, Askeaton. The Go-Safe operator was unable to provide Judge Colm Roberts

with the margin of error.

 Evidence was also given at this time that a male driver was caught speeding at 60kph in a 50kph zone at

Abbeyfeale. Asked by the judge about the margin of error, the Go-Safe operator said: “I don’t think I am

supposed to say.”

The local rag reports on cases that have been successfully defended, but also consider how many have been lost that never get reported on. Either way if you are considering contesting this you should be getting legal advice to determine what your chances are, based on the your particular circumstances. A solictor would have a far better view on what your chances. Personally I would never front the court without representation as it can often just serve to frustrate the judge, whom may want to make an example of you.

You need to way up the cost of wining vs losing. I think the system is unfair whereby you get a higher penalty if you lose, especially if you have a genuine case. But I suspect the system is designed to stop everyman and his dog from contesting fines and clogging up the court system.

Thanks Wassie, fair points 👍️

Thanks for that FishOnABike. I guess I can only comment on where the speedo was at at the moment I looked at it and that was between 100 and 110 but I didn't think I was going any faster.

Anyway, lots to ponder before I decide to take it on the chin or challenge it.

Bottom line and especially when it comes to dual carriageways, it's not the motorists who are doing just 9% over the limit who are a danger, it's those ripping it up 20%+ over the limit and/or with dangerous lane changes, erratic behaviour, sudden braking or worse again, those going down the wrong carriageway against the oncoming traffic!!!...2 separate instances of which I've seen on video in recent times. I wonder did they get caught?! Probably not.

Thanks for the condescending pontification, but that wasn't helpful and you missed my actual query.

I specifically sought insights from boards members into the potential for legal precedence being established from the list I posted of actual cases getting struck out in court that fell into this "margin of error" category. Is there any consistency or could it just be down to the personality or mood of the judge?

AFAIK district court proceedings don't set precedence.

109km/h is over the speed limit. If you don't accept the fixed penalty notice then it goes to court. There it really depends on the judge on the day.

Is it worth the risk of an increased fine and points? How sure can you be which judge it will appear in front of and how sure can you be of the consistency of the judge's decisions on motorists slightly over the speed limit?

It depends on who and what you are pinged by.

I've never ticketed anyone going less than 25km over but I know other lads that would do you for 5km.

But ultimately the legislation doesn't have any leeway and 1km over the limit is over, full stop.

Again, the only way that ticket revenue can be generated is if someone is speeding, it's not the GoSafe operator, the Garda or the Average Speed Camera to blame. And that nots me being high or mighty or backing my own team, I've been done for a heavy foot myself at only 10km over but I recognised' that the fault was mine. If you're sore (not you you but the royal you) about giving money to revenue then you can prevent it easily.

Cheers folks and of course I'm not trying to deny I was marginally over the speed limit.

It's not about the fine or points either. I guess it's the clear lack of consistency in issuing fines that frustrates the most, and particularly how surprised I was that the ticket even got issued in the first place at only 9% over the limit (coming from a UK standpoint where it needs to be over 10% over the limit to issue a ticket). Similar guidelines across Europe too. Also the frequent striking out of cases in this category that go to court.

Anyway, it is what it is and I'll have to accept it, but I certainly don't respect it.

8km over and you can be issued with a ticket from a GoSafe. (Last time I checked)

Anyone that says otherwise can't provide a pic of the ticket that shows a ticket issued for less.

50 - 58

60 - 68

80 - 88

100 - 108

120 - 128

Go to your local district court,on a day when they are hearing GoSafe cases are being heard, and you won't hear a single case where the alleged offence is for less than 8km over

Hopefully. Might dissuade you from speeding (or not, you didn't say what speed you thought you were doing), and standing on the brakes at the sight of a speed van 🙄

No

They have a dynamic speed dial that is right infront of you and can be changed to the relevant speed by using just the pressure of your foot!

That's the cheapest and best solution, otherwise you need to fit a cruise control/speed limiter module, which may or may not be available depending on the car in question.

They've never 'had to' pull you over, but it's best practice as they can them get details of actual driver as opposed to registered owner.

GENERALLY if you are not pulled by the patrol car then you are in the clear.

Lucky there was no one walking across the road you suddenly turned into…if this even happened. Sounds like the tripe of our regular dreamer/wind up merchant.

If it's a go safe van AFAIK the camera is only at the back, but it can capture both approaching and receding vehicles.

I passed one in the process of being set up yesterday, with traffic cones behind it and the operator carrying a 'metre' stick. If that was any indication of the operational zone it is quite close to the go safe van.