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Buying a house - No certificate of compliance with building regulations

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,853 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Homebond wasn’t much use for those who found that their homes had been built with pyrite rocks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    I did not misunderstand your questions.

    You stated as follows:-

    • 1. Even if there was no visible signs of subsidence when the survey was done?
    • 2. You misunderstood the question, there were no visible signs for the surveyor to see when the survey was done.
    • 3. They may not have appeared for a year or so subsequent to buying the house.

    You described a hypothetical scenario that a CP Surveys a house in good condition and furnished a Structural Survey Report which does not report any structural damage to the house.

    You indicate that they were no signs of Subsidence on the day the CP carried out the Survey, and that signs of Subsidence appeared subsequently after approximately 1 year.

    This confirms that there was no Subsidence to the Building on the day the survey was conducted. No visible signs of subsidence means no subsidence.

    I described what an experienced CP would do.

    The CP will have many high resolution photos of each elevation and window/door opes etc. This will be indisputable photographic proof that there were no visible cracks in the house and no evidence of Subsidence on the day of the Survey.

    The CP will have many photos of the water level in the manholes of the drains, which include his wrist watch to show the time intervals. Therefore the drains are not leaking on the day of the Survey.

    The CP will be able to prove that there was no visible signs or possible cause of subsidence, by leaking drains, on the date of the Survey.

    The CP is not negligent and can prove same.

    A CP must protect himself by taking photographic proof of the building at the time of the Survey. The CP is legally obliged by the PI Insurance company to retain all the photos etc for at least 6 years.

    You never describe what caused the Hypothetical Subsidence subsequent to the Survey of the house which had no visible signs of cracking and watertight drains etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    Homebond was not responsible for faulty pyrite materials used in the Construction.

    The High Court held the supplier of construction material was liable for damage caused by pyrite rather than the developer. This was upheld in 2014 by a subsequent Supreme Court decision.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,987 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    @mickdw had explained it succinctly enough in plain English, but thank you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,853 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Indeed, I was just pointing out the limitations of Homebond.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    mickdw succinct explanation never identified the most important fact of all - “the cause of the rapid Subsidence”.

    Perhaps your good self or mickdw can now explain to me - what caused a mature house in a good structural condition, and with watertight drains to end up with subsidence within 12 months.

    What caused the hypothetical subsidence????

    Please inform me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,987 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    Nah, you'd only respond with your usual repetitious, over-explaining, mostly irrelevant waffle that you clog up every thread with.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,592 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    A hypothetical scenario could perhaps be a major water main burst adjacent to house, washing out foundations.

    My point was that for such damage to occur in a short period of time would almost certainly require external event and that this event would be known and documented and therefore not a case of negligence on behalf of the surveyor.

    You are slightly preoccupied with watertight drains I feel.



  • Subscribers Posts: 41,995 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    ive seen something similar happen previously.

    an established estate had a new development commence on the adjoining filled. the developers piped all the existing drains, drains which had been allowed to become blocked, overgrown, filled in etc. which had kept the lands artificially wet.

    when the drains were piped and the lands dried out there was substantial subsidence / movement within the established estate, all pretty much became apparent within 6 months.


    edit: isnt "watertight drain" an oxymoron ?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    What caused the hypothetical subsidence????

    Thats what you get for asking ridiculous questions, and as usual cannot handle the truth.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    All new drains should be checked with a Hydrostatic Test to ensure that the drains are watertight.

    The term Watertight means that the drains are capable of being filled with water with a certain water pressure without any of the water escaping.

    The term Moran refers to the CP’s that do not carry out Hydrostatic tests on drains, and provide Certification for same.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    A Watermain is not a Drain

    They are totally different water pipe



  • Subscribers Posts: 41,995 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Oh you mean sewer rather than drain?

    A 'drain' drains land, therefore cannot be water tight



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    You stated above:-

    “You are slightly preoccupied with watertight drains I feel.”

    That would be a brilliant reply in the High Court to a Senior Counsel. It’s so funny.

    Most claims for negligence against incompetent house Survey Reports are against incompetent Surveyors because of unreported leaking drains.

    Most subsidence of buildings are caused by escape of water from leaking drains.

    Expert Experienced Surveyors always carry out a hydrostatic test on all the drains.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    Are you going to explain to me what caused a perfect mature house to suffer subsidence in a very short period of time.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    A Foul water drain and a Surface water drain are Drains.



  • Subscribers Posts: 41,995 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Let's put it down to a difference of semantics. I've only ever used "sewer" to describe a closed watertight pipe network, and drain as an open system designed to drain lands etc.

    But if it's used differently in different sectors so be it, no point in getting into sematic arguments.

    I guess the point mickdw was making is that sometimes things happen liked I described above



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,592 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    It's only you who has locked in on drainage leaks.

    I presented a hypothetical situation of a burst water main (yes I know this is not a drain) adjacent to a house causing wash out of soil at or below foundation level resulting in rapidly developing subsidence.

    That's an example just for **** and giggles. We were actually arguing the same side but you seem to have gone off on a tangent about water tight drains.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭C. Eastwood


    And there is me thinking we are supposed to provide proper advice to the OP Gurteen who poster a question on 27 Jan 2023 at 5.13 pm, but momentarily I forgot about the clique.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,592 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    I think you will find I gave a pretty comprehensive direct response to that question from my own 1st hand experience of issuing such certs retrospectively.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,783 ✭✭✭C3PO


    I suspect that you are probably very knowledgeable but the tedious nature and the superior attitude you display make your posts hard to read. I used to enjoy this forum but you have managed to make most of the threads really hard work now! You would be a lot more helpful if you loosened up a bit!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 833 ✭✭✭SupaCat95


    Had this problem 2 years ago when I bought. The garage was converted into a 2nd living room, for probably a cash in hand job at the time of construction. There was never a certificate of completion done. Luckily our solicitor caught it.

    It's not a big delay, maybe about a week if all parties are working at the same speed. It's a quick job that an architect/engineer/QS usually comes in checked the building has been completed to the correct standard and writes a report. Cost circa e500. An expense for the seller. It's one of those jobs you should get checked off asap because the day you want it, it will be annoying to get.

    Our estate agent was an a-hole, blamed it on me and wanted to know what it had to do with him. The ludder should have spotted it first and advised the seller to get it sorted before it went on the market.

    It's not a big job but it's a pain if everyone wants a smooth transaction.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,592 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    To be honest, estate agents typically won't get into any of this stuff. Their job is to go sale agreed and don't want to know about the detail whatsoever.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3 gr222


    Hi ,

    Was reading through this post and I'm wondering if you could offer any advice on an issue I've come across while purchasing a house. We engaged the services of a surveyor to give us a certificate of compliance as the vendors solicitor insisted this was not needed. However the surveyor was only able to give us an Opinion on Compliance as there were a number of additions to the house ( extension, conservatory, some sheds in the garden) that did not have planning permission and in total exceeded the allowed 23m2. Will this be an issue when attempting to draw down a mortgage? Also is this a situation where it is reasonable to ask to renegotiate price as we will have to either demolish some of these or apply for retention.? Any advice appreciated! Thanks



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,783 ✭✭✭C3PO


    The only way to find out whether you will get mortgage approval is to engage with a provider or broker! With regard to renegotiating the price … you can always ask but it seems unlikely given the vendors attitude to the certificate of compliance! It is still a seller’s market!



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