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Long term effect of Tesla Cars price drops on Tesla's Motors brand?

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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,578 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    The problem with a forced design change is the current design is one of the most efficient of any car in the world. Can it be improved? We are getting to a stage where most new cars, particularly EV’s are not lookers, we are accepting their quirky style and that goes for bmw, Porsche, Audi etc They do not look as good as ICE cars do, and nobody can say that without laughing.

    Imthink we are heading into a generation where car design will be dwindling. In the same way now, the current youth generations are happy on this granny eBikes that don’t look half as good as the Raleigh Activators that we had growing up!



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,672 ✭✭✭whippet


    once you think perfection has been achieved progress stops !!!

    There is always room for change and room for improvement. Tesla not changing the basic look of the car for years helps cut costs in tooling and production. As a long term play I'm not sure how buyers will take it ... would you upgrade your 5 year old Tesla for something that looks identical ? some will ... many won't



  • Registered Users Posts: 360 ✭✭Xidu


    I have M3 and I bought at higher price and I will stick w Tesla, unless Apple has a car.

    I just like the neat design of M3.

    I don’t even like S even S is way more expensive. Even if i can afford S, I still would choose M3. 😁



  • Registered Users Posts: 360 ✭✭Xidu


    As for share price, too many speculations

    you need to know in a bull market it doesn’t matter what is the company’ real value, it’s all about investors and big money playing games of the market.

    in a bear market it’s the same. Big money made a lot of profits by shorting Tesla.

    buffet always say invest in the value of the company, he is playing a loooooong term strategy.


    I still believe in short term there is always chances.


    BTW, I am still holding 130 shares of tsla bought at $140 😩


    be prepared it will go to $167 or $70 😱



  • Registered Users Posts: 360 ✭✭Xidu


    Don’t think Apple is a good example to compare in Telsa price drop case though.

    Apple has its own iOS, together w iPad, Mac, it’s their own unique design.

    phone is something everyone would use like 7/24. Car isn’t. Car is still luxury products believe or not especially in developing countries.

    thats why Apple has SE which is cheaper and designed for different markets.


    Apples’ design is like the best looking of all the phones. And they have the top 1 supply chain. If Apple can’t produce enough phones. Neither Samsung or xiaomi. So they have no worries at all.


    Tesla is different. Their adv is that they mass production EV few years ahead of others and they claim FSD and auto polit.

    other car companies like VW, Nissan, they are so smart they will catch up very quickly. Once their production line set up Tesla is in massive competition.


    while Apple is different. Plenty competition on market from day1



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,367 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    Lots of talk here about premium, but what does that even mean anymore? Premium seems to be still associated with legacy manufacturers in Europe who make and sell expensive cars with the latest features, cutting edge technologies and great performance with quality build and materials.

    Whatever about the price drop which has wiped thousands off the price of my recently collected M3, I am still driving what I consider to be a premium car, because it has the hallmarks listed above. I've owned most of the so called premium brands and aside from the fact they were ICE vehicles, the only notable differences worth mentioning were the amount of buttons in them and the enclosed driver feeling (especially in the BMW) which was very snug.

    Unless I have good reason not to, I will stick with the Tesla brand. A new car price drop affects used car prices, but sticking with the same brand this drop just means that getting a second Tesla for the household just became way more affordable.

    Stay Free



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭carsfan2


    Tesla never really produced a “premium” product in terms of quality compared to mainstream manufacturers. The model S and X were very high price cars but you were paying for batteries and tech not material or build quality. Therefore I think their image was one of an expensive product which shouldn’t be confused with a premium product. Now they have obviously improved their building of the cars and the interior materials they put into them that give a more upmarket feel over the years, but mainstream premium manufacturers have this in their electric cars too.

    I think Tesla if they survive on their own will be the new Volkswagen of the car market.

    They may offer what VW used to in the golf etc., a quality product that was classless yet aspired to by the general car buying public.



  • Registered Users Posts: 808 ✭✭✭podge1979


    😂 Define perfection, when you stop trying to improve that's when competitive advantage is lost. There is a whole philosophy around it "Kaizen" coming from Japanese Kai = change zen = good.



  • Registered Users Posts: 808 ✭✭✭podge1979


    Sorry don't buy that at all phone market is just a bigger market and more players. You can buy a cheap phone with pretty much the same capabilities as an iPhone but spend 5 times as much on an iPhone (which has massive margin).

    An iPhone is a luxury product and one of the reasons people buy an iPhones is because of the brand and prestige not just design. They built that from the first mover advantage they had on iPods and iPhones (similar to Tesla's first mover advantage).

    Also other great lessons learned from phone industry two brands who had first mover advantage Nokia and Blackberry they didn't strive to move and improve went low end and look where that got them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,433 ✭✭✭eagerv


    Interesting about car design and evolution, yes we are all used to most traditional manufacturers updating their models every 4 years or more, often just a few cosmetic tweaks to make us feel as though we need to change and get the latest and greatest. Even when they fully update the model, it is only a few mm added here or there so they can market the huge increase in interior space..😊.

    I welcome what Tesla have been doing, cars are being continuously updated even if you do not feel the need to change. If we didn't have our silly number plates would be difficult to tell the year of a Tesla.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭carsfan2


    This is it though. The car market is not quite the same but similar to phones.

    manufacturers don’t make money updating your software for free ina car they’ve already sold you. They need to get you in a new car to keep their production lines running.

    They need to make new product sufficiently different from what you have every few years that has you wanting to change to it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 978 ✭✭✭bf


    Tesla is now a more mainstream brand than it ever was, with lots of cars on the road. This price drop May have come to a shock to many recent new to EV/Tesla, but for those who have been Tesla owners or followers for longer, this isn’t anything out of the ordinary - the profit margin they have in cars is way bigger than any other manufacturer, so they can be flexible.

    It’s just as probable that there could be a decent price rise again in next 12/18 months as another price cut



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,433 ✭✭✭eagerv


    Yes, but Tesla do change the cars, not just software. ie new battery tech, motors, features etc. But they still look the same😊



  • Registered Users Posts: 808 ✭✭✭podge1979


    Cars these days are like mobile phones on wheels and for me very similar in how first mover advantage was gained.

    Apple first mover on smart phones many followers but the went high end big margins.

    Tesla first real mover on EV looked to be taking a similar strategy to Apple higher end and big margins but they flipped really now pursuing lower margins mass market.

    Nowadays car companies do make money off after market SW updates, Tesla being the prime example and this is how the overall car market will continue to evolve. Other players like BMW exploring this also.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,063 ✭✭✭joe1303l


    If the legacy makers hold their prices and don’t go after Tesla, they are bound to put prices up again. They will want to be seen as upmarket of the inevitable glut of chinese cars that will come to Europe.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,367 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    "manufacturers don’t make money updating your software for free ina car they’ve already sold you"

    I'd have to disagree there. One of the biggest reasons I chose a Tesla was because they regularly update and improve the cars with software updates. I bet that alone is a distinct reason many lean toward Tesla purchases and that in itself increases Tesla sales revenue and profit. The idea that an issue can be fixed over the air without having to go to the dealer is a huge plus.

    My top reasons in order of importance were:

    Safety

    Range

    OTA updates

    Desirability

    Access to public charging network

    Stay Free



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,578 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Remote servicing too.

    A sensor failed in my interior cabin a few months back.

    Open app. Explained the dash warning. Even included a photo.

    Got text saying part ordered.

    3 days later, ranger at my door fixing it.

    Theres a lot to be said about that service.

    Imagine trying to do that with BMW or any of the other legacy mainstream brands.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,367 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    Apple have always been about innovation and style at a high price. They have never made this a secret. However, Musk has been saying for the last decade what the plan with Tesla was. In essence; make a really desirable and expensive electric sports car for the rich...Roadster. Use this money to make a really desirable high end saloon/family car to sell at lower prices in larger numbers to the upper middle class....Model S. They added Model X in there too moreso as a higher end vehicle with more bells and whistles. Finally, use the profits to grow and produce a main stream EV for the masses to afford...Model 3. Later adding Model Y for those looking for a roomier hatch.

    Tesla had first mover advantage (more or less), but they haven't flipped at all. It was always the plan to get as many affordable EVs out there as possible while still creating an desirable and efficient product. I would say they are well within the original goals set.

    Stay Free



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I’m in the market for our first electric car and took a Tesla for a test drive. I couldn’t get over how cheap and plasticky the interior was - miles away from premium.

    It might be a personal thing, but I also think they are an extremely ugly car overall - like when you see one at lights I just can’t help but internally comment about how bland and uninspiring they look - especially that low front profile. Again, it’s probably down to mass market appeal and aerodynamics, but it certainly does not give off premium vibes.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,433 ✭✭✭eagerv


    All they need now is the Tesla ID.3/Born😁 and they are well set up. The competition surely see this now as Disruptive Technology..



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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,578 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Sounds like it’s not the car for you.

    And that’s ok too.

    You could buy a prettier Porsche or a bland VW or maybe even a self charging car, I believe Toyota sell them 🤣



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,367 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    That description doesn't sound anything like any Tesla I've sat in. In any case, I wouldn't take a test drive in a car I considered to be ugly, but maybe that's just most people. It's probably why I didn't take a test drive in the apparently premium BMW i4. Those beaver teeth on the front end accompanied by the hugely over inflated price and the "rent your heat" options just wouldn't suit me. Maybe it might be the car for you if you prefer that sort of premium.

    Stay Free



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,367 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    Amazing the way some people who have never actually sat in a Tesla can comment about premium 😉

    Stay Free



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,913 ✭✭✭Pintman Paddy Losty


    Whatever about the premiumness of plastic interiors, I really think it is hard to drive a Tesla now as its akin to making a political statement that I'm not comfortable with.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I decided to test drive it anyway as a sort of benchmark so I could compare it to other electric cars. As I said, I found the interior to feel cheap when compared to the likes of the Hyundai and the Peugeot 2008. The carpet isn’t as plush, the moulded plastic feels cheap, and I personally don’t like all the controls being accessed via the screen (which is beautiful btw and extremely bright).

    I suppose Tesla had a lot of first mover advantage and Musk had an aura around him for a while, but I’m just not seeing Tesla as a premium brand. I think the design ethos looks dated and other more established manufacturers are producing cars that I believe are better built, better to look at, and comparable in price.



  • Registered Users Posts: 808 ✭✭✭podge1979


    Well he said that but his Muskness never changes his mind. So he's dropped his prices now to give affordable cars to the masses?

    Give me a break its only because they have not hit sales targets. Tesla have been making big margins on cars for a couple of years now also were pretty immune to chip shortage and prices due to their inventory of chips and also SW not being chip dependant yet making high margins making massive profits lead to increased prices in cars!!!

    The driver for this is response to the china incumbents and dropping sales, Apple also had that but chose not to take them on directly. Tesla have but maybe not the best course of action.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,774 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Tesla is not a car company

    My stuff for sale on Adverts inc. outdoor furniture, roof box and EDDI

    My Active Ads (adverts.ie)



  • Registered Users Posts: 808 ✭✭✭podge1979


    He said he took a Tesla for a test drive, so he's entitled to his opinion based on that. I was buying one I would have counted it as premium bit too minimalist but was premium based on what I came from (Audi A3).



  • Registered Users Posts: 808 ✭✭✭podge1979


    Ok let's say Tesla Motors then, I won't get to drive a space rocket or solar roof, or mass storage battery or live in a tunnel. I'll ask the same question in other parts of the forum 😜

    I changed the title of the thread just for you 😉



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭carsfan2




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