Russia - threadbanned users in OP

xxxxxxl · 10-01-2023 01:55AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088026#Comment_120088026

I wonder will they be going after these folks like they are far right groups in the EU as recent news mentions support for crimes is a crime. OFC the EU has no jurisdiction I know that but the Hague. Non of this should be Swept under the carpet.

eoinbn · 10-01-2023 08:38AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088238#Comment_120088238

Supply routes reported to have been cut off. Usually means a withdrawal is issued soon after.

Fall of Soledar will likely mean a withdrawal from Bakhmut in the near future.

eoinbn · 10-01-2023 08:46AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087918#Comment_120087918

Dunkirk was a defeat for the Allies but the withdrawal was a huge success. Kherson is something similar but on a smaller scale.

Listening to people on this board would make you think the war is effectively. Far from it I am afraid.

Jinglejangle69 · 10-01-2023 08:57AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088521#Comment_120088521

Yeah UK Ministry of defence says this is likely.

Canon fodder pays off occasionally.

dennis72 · 10-01-2023 09:31AM

Quantity has it own quality

They are throwing cannon fodder ahead of regular forces

If Ukraine dosent win they will be fodder for Poland

Give them tanks & f16 ffs.

rogber · 10-01-2023 10:03AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088026#Comment_120088026

I'll bet any amount you want that there will never be a Nuremberg style trial for the architects of this war. More often than not tyrants and their henchmen get away with this stuff

timmyntc · 10-01-2023 10:05AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087211#Comment_120087211

Just because you dont like what he's been sayig as of late does not make it any less true. All his posts & conflict maps are based on geolocated videos, mostly Ukrainian ones. Or are the Ukrainian army discredited too?

rogber · 10-01-2023 10:15AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088708#Comment_120088708

I'd be fine with that option too. We'll see what happens

Igotadose · 10-01-2023 10:16AM

Opinion piece on what supplying Bradley's and potentially Abrams to Ukraine means. In my view, they're for ferreting out dug-in rats, and indicate a shift in tactics.

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/ukraine-russia-war-sees-bradley-non-tanks-enter-fray-rcna64963

Danzy · 10-01-2023 10:17AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088521#Comment_120088521

Russia still have a chance of holding the territory that they have and gaining more in Donbas.

At eye watering cost though and only held by putting some conscripted bollox in every house with WW2 surplus rifles, permanent trench warfare.

That could go on for years at a low level of conflict. A victory of sorts but a running wound that they would have to keep pouring money and men in to.

They are just as likely to be routed again in other parts but the longer it goes on the more chance that they have of holding what they have.

It's why Europe needs to become serious about supporting Ukraine.

Across Western Europe we are already past 1 trillion in Energy price supports, nevermind the damage to the wider economy, never mind the additional costs to rebuild Ukraine.

Puts the lethargy of Europe in to context.

timmyntc · 10-01-2023 10:21AM

Some volunteers in Bakhmut warning people to get out of Soledar, and also to avoid the bridge in Krasna Hora.

Additionally Russians are claiming to have taken Krasna Hora, although this is unlikely yet. More likely they are attacking it from one side and shelling the town.

Ukraine may destroy these 3 bridges over the Bakhmutska to slow the Russians down near Bakhmut, would mean the next nearest crossing is by Soledar and would be a pinch point for Russian forces to attack.

Podge_irl · 10-01-2023 10:26AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088295#Comment_120088295

Absolutely a plausible scenario (the only really plausible scenario for his downfall alas).

But there isn't going to be mass courts for propagandists, enablers and underlings. If Putin is deposed it will be by those underlings after all. I'd settle for just him meeting a sticky end.

TheValeyard · 10-01-2023 10:35AM

Not a good morning for the UAF

But holy fcuk the amount of lives the Russians have thrown at this. Could well be a pyrrhic victory.

accensi0n · 10-01-2023 10:48AM

Is there a primary reason for the drip feeding of weapons to Ukraine?

Why don't the US and EU just send absolute **** loads and let Ukraine annihilate all the invaders and every military installation in Russia within reach of missiles?

Podge_irl · 10-01-2023 10:53AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088815#Comment_120088815

Genuine fears of escalation into open conflict with Russia. It was, and is somewhat still, a valid concern - you can't take anything that has the potential of ratcheting up into nuclear conflict lightly! However, I think a historical view of the period will suggest that we were too cautious about this.

This MBT discussion is particularly ridiculous. They are going to do it sooner or later and there is clearly growing pressure. Just bloody do it now.

Jinglejangle69 · 10-01-2023 11:01AM

It would make you question why with the drips off gear how many Ukrainian lives are been lost that might have been saved.

Its just prolonging the war.

Wibbs · 10-01-2023 11:05AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088600#Comment_120088600

F16's would be utterly pointless and wasteful in this war. Russian aircraft are staying well back and we don't see the pics of downed jets the way we did at the start. In that sense Ukraine already has "air superiority". Why? Ukrainian anti aircraft weaponry makes it too risky. That weaponry costs far less, requires far less training, infrastructure and support than jets. Fighter jets are very effective for a fully integrated and wealthy military like the US for example, more of a pain in the arse for militaries like Ukraine. For actual results a couple of HIMARS are worth more on the ground than a couple of dozen F16's in the air. Official Russian spin and scuttlebutt on Telegram rarely if ever mention the Ukrainian airforce, they froth at the mouth trying to tell the world about how HIMARS and the like don't matter. That should tell us all we need to know about which weapon platform is more effective. A fw dozen modern battle tanks would be welcome alright.

Both Russia and Ukraine have already "lost". The question remains how much of a loss both will end up with. Unless something changes radically, Russia has pretty much no hope of moving much beyond the gains they've made so far. Look how long Russia has taken to get even close to taking Bakhmut. Look how many men they've lost and up against a much smaller force. On the other hand what Russia has already taken looks pretty secure for them for the moment. They just have to keep piling bodies into that area to shore it up. As you say quantity has its own quality. That will make it very hard for Ukraine to drive to the south coast for example. Unless again something shifts radically, on and off the battlefield.

Off the battlefield both have lost, but Russia's losses are so much higher and more longterm. Ukraine has the support of the world, especially the places in the world that actually matter.

macraignil · 10-01-2023 11:07AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088781#Comment_120088781

Found a some way positive report from Soledar:

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1612733577372000257?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1612733577372000257%7Ctwgr%5E3e154a972e8f58c74214a98ea85fd96f56c6c7a1%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.redditmedia.com%2Fmediaembed%2F1085lk8%3Fresponsive%3Dtrueis_nightmode%3Dfalse

Francie Barrett · 10-01-2023 11:16AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088521#Comment_120088521

Lots of comments like this on Twitter but I don't think that is the case.

The situation at Bakhmut is weakening, albeit slowly. I don't think it is in danger of falling in the near future, certainly not in the next few days or weeks.

If Soledar falls, then Ukraine will fall back behind the Bakhmut river. The river isn't that wide, but it will be difficult for the Russians to get across given how militarized the entire area is. My guess is that the northern part of the Bakhmut front will stabilize behind the river.

In all the noise over Soledar, not many people are talking about the attempted Russian advance in the south of Bakhmut. It looks like the Russians are trying to cut off the village of Klishchiivka which has been an important strongpoint protecting a major highway that you can see in the map. It remains to be seen how effective this advance will be.

Danzy · 10-01-2023 11:17AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088843#Comment_120088843

Think it is more than that, it's the economic effect more than a fear of the bomb.

They are looking at the world after the war, when trade with Russia will be resumed. A bear beaten senseless might not be able to function and export.

Also the importance of Russian resources, Gas sales to Europe are only a tiny part of Russian GDP, yet the cost to European economies is incredible, oil is Russia's big earner, restrictions on that now but other sources available.

What about things like Aluminium, wheat, nickel, fertilizer, wood etc.

Russian blocks on exports could hit Europe very hard. A Russia in chaos and unable to export oil across the world would leave the global economy on the floor.

There is also an undeniable reluctance to challenge them m, based on liking status quo, residual socialist solidarity with Russia, corporate interests wanting to maintain cheap resources etc etc.

10-01-2023 11:22AM

BOILING FROG/BOILING PUTIN

I get why the west were tentative at the beginning, but we're now at the stage of Russia proper being hit by Ukraine. There is no reason not to now supply Ukraine with MBT's (plus training)... why do all these countries want MBT's - to ward off Russia. What's actually better than using them to actually weaken/defeat Russia. From a strategic POV - Western Europe should supply the kit and training needed to send Russia back to its borders and keep the sanctions to weaken Russia further.

As long as Russia* is not invaded then they will not risk being fully destroyed by attacking the west with nukes.

timmyntc · 10-01-2023 11:32AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088967#Comment_120088967

To be fair countries have been supplying Ukraine with 100s of tanks - warsaw pact stuff. T72s, T80s mostly. These were some of the most useful seeing as Ukrainian operators already had vast experience with the soviet weaponry

zv2 · 10-01-2023 11:42AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088549#Comment_120088549

Quantity is a kind of quality.

zv2 · 10-01-2023 11:51AM

Soladar-

https://twitter.com/DrollySvea/status/1612761598330011649?s=20&t=aWh_sRvikLwzLhxgrg-2Fw

zv2 · 10-01-2023 11:56AM

...

Dohnjoe · 10-01-2023 11:57AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088949#Comment_120088949

Russia had the GDP of Italy pre-war, it's even lower now. In terms of natural resources, it was a bigger global supplier in the 80's, then collapsed (in the form of the USSR). Industries have a habit of continuing.

Danzy · 10-01-2023 12:02PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120089125#Comment_120089125

It's a regionally important economy. It does however sell vast quantities of very important items for the global economy, small though it is now.

markodaly · 10-01-2023 12:12PM

To me, the new equipment and especially armour that Ukraine is getting makes me think they are going to prep for a new large offensive later in the Spring or Summer. Slowly but surely they are getting better equipment, and more of it. The Russians are limited in just reusing crap old stock, while they may have a lot of it, pound for pound its not really a match for what Western Forces can give to Ukraine.

I guess that is why Putin is just throwing men at the problem and I guess they have been successful at that in a way, even though they are poorly trained, and equipped and their morale is at rock bottom.

As I said before, Russia has lost this war, it just remains to be seen can Ukraine win it.

Gatling · 10-01-2023 12:38PM

What use would F16s be in Ukraine,

A highly menuverable agile multirole aircraft can't can carry several thousand pounds of guide munitions including guided bombs ,

Vs the su25 while it's primary role is CAS ground attack it can't carry the payload that the US and Nato use , which could be a Big deal when dealing with troops and vehicles on the ground

Furze99 · 10-01-2023 12:42PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120089150#Comment_120089150

There's a price to be paid Danzy, we are all paying already for it and may well pay more yet. But Europe broadly has decided that this price will be paid and the Russian economy will be brought down. In time when peace is returned, then commerce will return. We all know what is needed for an end to this conflict.

Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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