The main thing is keeping the main thing, the main thing

diego_b · 27-10-2022 2:19pm

Feck, that's a right sickener now...very sorry to hear that.

Laineyfrecks · 27-10-2022 2:45pm

Really sorry to hear this A, hope you get sorted🤗

Unknownability · 27-10-2022 3:08pm

Sorry to hear that, hope you're doing OK.

I was following your training closely.

babacool · 27-10-2022 6:16pm

I hear ya! Onwards and upwards! The training will stand to you! And I know how you feel! I’m an 85% drop out at the moment. Only a miracle healing will get me to run Sunday.

Dubh Geannain · 27-10-2022 7:46pm

Awful luck. The closer to the day this stuff happens the worse it is. Get yourself better anyway.

Kellygirl · 27-10-2022 7:55pm

Oh no. I’m gutted for you. That is awful news. Are you totally ruled out or do you think you might possibly be ok to run?

Wubble Wubble · 28-10-2022 11:19am

Ah man that's cruel. Very sorry to hear! Best of luck with the recovery.

MisterDrak · 28-10-2022 4:20pm

Really sorry to hear that Alan. Very tough to take with the consistant quality and volume of your training...

Lazare · 28-10-2022 8:42pm

Can't believe I've read that. Really really gutted. The work you've put in.

As others have asked, are you totally ruling things out?

Mr. Guappa · 28-10-2022 9:40pm

Balls. Sorry to read that.

healy1835 · 28-10-2022 10:15pm

I come back on here only to be met with this disappointing news 😭 in all seriousness though, you're in a great space head-wise about it. Onwards and upwards pal.

coogy · 28-10-2022 11:48pm

Ah no! Very sorry to read this, hope all goes ok!

29-10-2022 1:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119799781#Comment_119799781

I know exactly how you feel, I got an abscess like that on Christmas day. I ended up on two really strong antibiotics at the same time because

the inflammation was so bad. You could actually heat your hand from my cheek without even touching it, it was a mad infection. Then I got it drained but didn't get the tooth out or get the root canal straight away.

What happened? I ended up in the same scenario a month later except this time the dentist wanted to send me to St James hospital it was so bad.

Whatever you do, get the tooth itself treated as soon as possible.

It would be possible to run the marathon but you may still be on antibiotics and not sure if you got the tooth itself treated yet?

There's probably a chance of causing it to come back with a vengeance if you run with the tooth not treated.

All the energy required to run the marathon will be stopping the healing and you could end up in a very bad way.

scotindublin · 30-10-2022 5:12pm

Gutted to read this, get yourself on the mend and hopefully see you at Jingle Bells

AuldManKing · 11-11-2022 11:55am

On DCM Day as I was relaying all the difficult runs (aka Carnage) that I had seen on Strava to my family - my daughter asked me was I secretly relieved not to have done it.

The answer was NO - I would have loved it to have ran it and tested myself against the course and the conditions. Anyway - I didn't and we move on.

Just some easy runs around end Oct/early Nov - still a bit 'meh' - Not running DCM was the correct decision for my health.

On Thursday 3rd Nov - I had a 35min moderate run + 5x30 secs strides - this went very well - I was doing 7 min/miles and feeling amazing.

Sat 5th Nov: 12.1 miles at 7.20 per mile ave

I took a rest day on Friday and due to some work stuff - I done my long run on Sat - this was a 60min Moderate run - I ran 15min to the PP (7.45 pace) then a lap of the park and upto Myo's - 60 mins - about 8 miles at 7.05 pace ave - Legs felt good - got a bit tough on the uphill 2nd half but seen it out. 15 mins easy to finish.

Sun 6th: Easy few miles recovery - 4.5m at 8.05 pace.

Monday 7th: 20x1min on/off

Getting back into it - found this tough as it went along - the float recoveries got slower but the 'On' rep was always quality.

9.5m / 7.09 ave

Tuesday 8th/Wed 9th: Work event - I took ownership for arranging a group of 30 coming from far & wide to Dublin.

Plenty of work, food and drink - intermingled with a fantastic 3 hour walking tour of Dublin and a trip to the Jameson Tour in Smithfield.

Thursday 10th: 5 mile easy run - very tired after the 2 days.

Time to look at some goals for 2023:

Right now, MOJO is a bit 'meh' - a large training block with no 'meaningful' reward has left me a bit flat.

3 goals for me in 2023 - Sub 36 / Sub 80 / Sub 2.50 - I've been talking about these for a few years - so time to attempt it!!

Currently thinking that my main Marathon will be Valencia in Dec '23. I'll do DCM '23 - but this will be a similar run to my 40km run in preparation for DCM this year - it would be satisfying to get a DCM PB in a training run - but this is a long way away.

Upcoming races:

Jingle Bells - Bit of Fun

Raheny - Not a goal race.

Trim - Under 61 should be an indication of Sub 80 shape - 5-6 weeks out from Bohermeen.

Bohermeen HM - Goal Race: Sub 80 attempt 1

Dunboyne 10k - Goal Race: Sub 36 attempt 1 (2 weeks after Bohermeen)

Swashbuckler · 11-11-2022 5:15pm

Decent looking plan there and rightly the marathon plan is way out there so its a bit tentative....

Enjoy some low pressure racing in the short term although knowing you you'll still put pressure on yourself!

babacool · 12-11-2022 12:16am

I was wondering if I would see you at the masters indoors (nationals and/or Leinster) next year. Doesn’t seem like.

an honest approach in trim. Depending on how training goes and if it doesn’t clash with anything I am always happy to pace 🙂. Just putting that out there. 😉

Taxes · 12-11-2022 1:33pm

Mate, I think you made a mistake by doing the 40km ‘training run’ it was out of kilter from the rest of your training and you paid the price.

You began to encounter all of your issues shortly thereafter.

babacool · 12-11-2022 5:12pm

Looking forward to AMK’s response to that 😁.

personally I’d say there was nothing wrong with that 40k run. Could have done with a bit slower but overall not really. And the build up to it was there (from what I can tell). Think there is a debate out there that says “runners get their best marathon race 6 weeks after a failed marathon race”. Seeing the 40k run was 6 weeks out, I’d say I see why it’s been on the plan.

interesting debate though (perhaps) 😁

AuldManKing · 14-11-2022 10:17am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119864999#Comment_119864999

I'm always interested in others opinions and generally don't get defensive - so I'm all ears on this.

In fairness - you aren't wrong - I got a bad headcold soon afterwards, driven primarily by my wife and 2 daughters all being on antibiotics for similar. I didn't go down the antibiotic route as it would have knocked my training.

The abscess came as a result of a chipped tooth 6-7 weeks previously, I didn't act on it and bacteria built up, causing infection.

So for my illnesses, there's context. I accept that my immune system may have been lower as a result of the 40k run.

The 'thing' with the 40k run is that it is used by all my coaches' athletes with good success. He follows a Canova type approach, modified for hobby joggers like myself.

I'm very interested to hear your approach to Marathon training - your posts on my log prior to DCM certainly perked my interest.

Swashbuckler · 14-11-2022 4:27pm

And he/she did commit to coming back after DCM to engage on this very subject...let's have it!

healy1835 · 14-11-2022 8:52pm

Maybe g00gLe (or whoever that guy was) has made a comeback too 😛😂 it is the fashionable thing to do on this forum these days you know...

babacool · 14-11-2022 10:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119873370#Comment_119873370

In Fairness @Taxes said he/she will give feedback after AMK completed dcm. Since he didn’t, he can’t give feedback 😉

Taxes · 14-11-2022 11:45pm

Lads, I have a full-time job and I need to thoroughly review AMKs training logs over the last 3 months with a critical -eye so I have data to substantiate my points. I’ll post before the week is out.

I remember reading AMKs post on here at the time and thinking that the 40km was overkill and not aligned with his overall training program.

I have no doubt that your coaches may use 40km runs for many of the athletes that they coach. But how did they build up to this run? Canova has said a good training program should be structured like a series of interconnected steps which are small. I agree with this approach. it’s my view that you took a large step with this run and that tipped you over the thin red-line we all walk as athletes.

I also just want to say that I admire runners like AMK who manage to fit a good training regime in and around their work and family life . I don’t want to come across as disrespectful.

AuldManKing · 16-11-2022 12:48pm

Re-Setting here.

Had a bit of a break last week - 2 sessions in amongst 2x2days of not running - a grand total of 23 miles done last week.

My plan is to train for HM and tick off the 5m & 10m along the way - no expectation of PB's in these but do expect a PB in the HM in March and hopefully will have enough for the 10k 2 weeks after that.

A Canova approach again for this with a smidgin of Tom Scwartz. I've never trained specifically for a HM previously, so excited by this.

Monday: Legs were tired from a 2 day trip to London (thankfully No shopping) - easy enough 45min loop today.

5.7m / 8.04 pace

Tuesday: Session - 6x90sec @5.40 / 6x30sec @ 5.30/ 4x10sec FAST

Ran 2.5m WU to the path on C'Field in PP - connecting the Aras to CK Gate. Somewhat lit here, but I was lit up like a C'Mas tree.

The 90sec reps were faster than I've done in a while - typically I've been at 6's or 5.50's - and the 10 second difference to 5.40 were felt! Recovery here was 7.30-7.45 pace.

Prior to the session, I was wondering why only 6 reps - but was glad it was only 6 (I could have done more, but would have been sorer).

The 6x30 secs - I really focused on form - run tall and good arm swing - again, trying to keep recoveries under 8's.

4x10 secs is a fast sprint but controlled - difficult to monitor pace as its over so quick - but they were fast :) - not too focused on quicker floats here.

2.5m CD home.

8.8m total with tired legs that evening.

babacool · 16-11-2022 3:26pm

What I find interesting with you or swashbuckler is that you seem to try all those books, methods, approaches etc but neither gives that kipchoge build up a go (adjusted to own pace and at the end of good base builder that probably requires 6months of continuous and controlled training).

why is that?

AuldManKing · 16-11-2022 3:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119881747#Comment_119881747

I wouldn't dare approach a program designed for an elite without the guidance of a very good coach.

Even with a coach - if you strip down a program where 120m per week are the norm - the sessions would look totally different.

I'm quite ok with Jack Daniels - which I know is very effective for me - especially at shorter distances. I've used this extensively for past 3-4 years with a couple of deviations where I had 2 different coaches. If I wasn't being coached now - I'd be following a JD plan more than likely.

My current coach follows a Canova/Tinman approach, adapted for us mortal's that has shown success with his crop of Athletes.

babacool · 16-11-2022 4:58pm

oh I wouldn’t dare doing the elite plan on elite mileage. I would probably bring it down to time rather than distance. As in if the elite spends 10hrs running covering 150miles I would probably still spend 10hrs but cover a lot less distance. Not sure if the benefit is the same though but definitely something that’s in the back of my mind: one day I will go through that plan and see how a mortal can cope 😂. But for that day to come the little one needs to be a bit older

Swashbuckler · 16-11-2022 10:36pm

You've pigeon holed me completely there 🤣...I had a coach for 4 years, one Daniels plan and the rest self coached but same principles that luke applied. I read books but haven't applied any of the plans.

Murph_D · 17-11-2022 2:02am

To be fair the question seemed... underdeveloped? Maybe @babacool can phrase it in a different way?

babacool · 17-11-2022 7:17am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119884245#Comment_119884245

Nope. Question was well build up and developed. Like a good sprinters workout. Long warm up, short and sharp session and no warm down 😁. Question was answered by both to my satisfaction as in I understand why that is.

Taxes · 17-11-2022 2:49pm

An elite such as Kipchoge has his aerobic house built a long time ago.

He was building that house since he could jog to the well to help fetch water for his family. While he was building his aerobic house, we were watching television and playing the odd game of football.

It makes sense then that because his aerobic house is already built, that a much greater % of overall training volume will be allocated to ‘quality’ based training runs compared to a recreational runner. He is physiologically and structurally equipped to handle this workload.

Therein lays the main problem with taking an elites training schedule and scaling it back to suit. You will soon find yourself overtrained/injured(probably both) as you are not equipped to handle the workload.

AuldManKing · 18-11-2022 12:40pm

Wednesday: Legs were a little sore - amazing what a few seconds faster will do to you - I can do a 15 mile interval run at MP and be fine'ish next day. But 13 mins of 5k & faster running leaves me sore!

5.5m/ 8.30 pace.

Thursday: 6mile Progressive run - Starting at 7.10 working down to 6.20 (10sec faster each mile).

Was really looking forward to this - love these longer uninterrupted runs.

1 mile warm up - planned 2m but hit pace after 1st mile. (7.45).

Mile 1: felt very easy - came in at 7.05.

Mile 2: Still around the suburbs of Carpenterstown - meant to be 7 - beeped at 6.52 - a tad fast.

Mile 3: Around the Park in Laurel Lodge - fighting the urge to speed up to 6.30's - amazing how the body remembers. 6.47.

Mile 4: Up to CK Tennis Club - was at 6.20's at one stage - needed to slow down. 6.35

Mile 5: Down Auburn Ave and into the park - 6.28

Mile 6: Down to 1st Roundabout and turned back to Farmleigh - finished probably 1/3 of the way up Whites Road - opened the legs a bit on this mile and felt good to do so. (6.07)

CD: 1.6m to home

8.6m total.

AuldManKing · 20-11-2022 8:39pm

Friday: Typically I take a rest day on Friday - but felt the urge to get out today - just over 4miles at a recovery pace.

Nice to see the track taking shape in Porterstown for MSB use. (I may rejoin this year!)

4.1/8.28 pace.

Saturday: 45mins Moderate + 5x30sec Hill Sprints

A slight variation that I've introduced to these runs - typically I do a moderate run the some strides - changed these to some hill work - still at the appropriate effort but good to get the hills in.

Done a 5min WU then was on pace - so hit the 45 mod, keeping it to 7.15's/7.20's for 45 mins. Had it planned to perfection as the 45mins ended just before the uphill started - really enjoyed these.

8m / 7.30 ave pace.

Sunday: Plan today was for 90 mins moderate effort (7.20 pace) - I was out Sat night for a few and didn't sleep very well, up early and felt like I had 10 pints (I didn't even have half that).

Was mildly surprised as my 1st mile came in at 7.35 despite the legs feeling like dead wood thats been at the bottom of the sea for 100 years. Added to that, those few hills on Sat had caused my calfs & glutes to be a tad sore.

A few interruptions as my phone (which had updated Software recently) continued to beep throughout my podcasts which was annoying - I stopped to try fix it.

Really enjoyed Scott Fauble on Citius Mag (he's always a great listen) + Sinead Diver on 'Inside Running' was very good - again - always a good listen. Both those respective pod's have said that their listenership increases when these 2 are on - for good reason.

Anyway - the legs were tired and as I turned around during mile 7, the wind was in my face for the uphill home, the rain started to fall in a horizontal position - that stingy rain!

Finished the 90mins on 11.85m - 7.30 pace.

52.5m for the week - highest week since early October. - apparently, I'm in a race for mileage with Swashbuckler (he told me so) although I think he can cheat as he's not showing his workings on Strava :) - this dude typically causes my bank balance to reduce around this time of year with the Black Friday deals that he keeps informing me of :) :)

babacool · 20-11-2022 9:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119898787#Comment_119898787

if He finds some very good deals on hoka Clifton (or tecton x 😂), I hope he remembers to send a reminder to the hoka guy 😁

Swashbuckler · 20-11-2022 10:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119898787#Comment_119898787

Text message sent 🤣

AuldManKing · 20-11-2022 10:18pm

& gratefully accepted! Very tempted!!

Swashbuckler · 22-11-2022 3:29pm

it's on

E.coli · 22-11-2022 3:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119907138#Comment_119907138

Presumably there is no weighting of the mileage to elevation ratio? 😅

Swashbuckler · 22-11-2022 5:01pm

I'm offsetting that with time on feet

Laineyfrecks · 22-11-2022 5:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119907138#Comment_119907138

Image of yis😜🤣

AuldManKing · 23-11-2022 11:55am

43 mile's differentiation in the next month - not going to happen!! - Sure distance is a meaningless metric anyway :)

Maybe the metric should be;

2298.8 miles in 17290 mins= 7.52 (AMK)

V

2342.3 miles in 18182mins= 7.76. (Swash "I make up the rules to suit me" Buckler)

So I win??

Plus I need an age grading as I'm now 50!!

Murph_D · 23-11-2022 12:49pm

NOW he wants the AG. 😉

Plus, maybe 7.76 is better than 7.52? 😇

Good numbers both of ye - I'd call it a draw!

Swashbuckler · 23-11-2022 2:28pm

There's time yet. I feel a slump coming

AuldManKing · 23-11-2022 4:42pm

There's a pretty infamous story in athletic circles about Swash Buckler going training on Christmas Day in 2022. That winter was particularly harsh in the Limerick, think Angelas Ashes on Carbon plated shoes (bought with a discount code), but, despite the nasty weather, he got up and did a hard 12-mile run early in the morning before sitting down to enjoy the Buckler family’s turkey dinner.

In the afternoon Swash sat around relaxing with the family but, after a while, he noticed he was beginning to feel a bit uneasy.

Eventually he realised that the source of his growing discontent was not the amount of sprouts he’d eaten, but the fact he was pretty sure his rival AMK was out doing his second run of the day whilst he was just slobbing out on the sofa!

So, he got kitted up again and went and did some hill reps in the ice and snow to make sure he wasn't being outdone by his nemesis.

Many years later, Swash and AMK met for dinner and Swash told Amk about what he’d done all those Christmases a go.

AMK was highly amused and quipped back ‘Did you only go out twice that day?!’

(Note: Heavily Plagiarized)

Duanington · 23-11-2022 4:50pm

ha ha ha ha ha - brilliantly done

Laineyfrecks · 23-11-2022 8:37pm

Love it, with our imaginations we should get together and write a book🤣🤣

babacool · 23-11-2022 9:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119910408#Comment_119910408

shouldnt it be:

distance / time x elevation / runs x (no of races x 2) / (365-total days of running) x max(1,(number of kudos given during the year - number of kudos received during the year)) = we are competitive

Kellygirl · 23-11-2022 9:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119911787#Comment_119911787

Brilliant! 😂😂

Swashbuckler · 23-11-2022 9:48pm

Brilliant. Although I'm sure I heard that story somewhere before 🤣

By the way it's only a 34 mile difference and I potentially have a taper on my hands next week. 😉

The main thing is keeping the main thing, the main thing

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